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In the Name of God بسم الله

Are you a syyed?

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diracdeltafunc

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The Imams gave their daughters only to the Syeds

(salam)

Not because of their lineage, but because those were the only pious-enough men around. people mistakenly believe that imams gave their daughters to syeds because those men were syeds. this is incorrect. they gave their daughters to the men who were the most pious and faithful around (the only valid criterion for marriage), and those men just happened to be syeds also. i stand by my statement. may Allah have mercy on the ignorant who use syedness as a criterion for marriage. this is pure, blatant racism, totally opposite of the very brotherhood that is at the heart of islam.

So breaking it down logically:

imams did...

what: gave daughters to only syeds

why: those were the only pious-enough men around who also just happened to be syeds

people look at the what and try to follow that blindly without following the why, leading to blindness.

if i were to do that for using a computer:

imams did...

what: not use computers

why: they were not invented yet

if i were to look at only the what wihtout the why, i could conclude that it is haram to use the computer. so all u people who believe that syedas can only marry syed guys, get off the computer!!

-Syed of Mind and Heart Babybeaver

Edited by BabyBeaverIsAKit
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Not because of their lineage, but because those were the only pious-enough men around. people mistakenly believe that imams gave their daughters to syeds because those men were syeds. this is incorrect. they gave their daughters to the men who were the most pious and faithful around (the only valid criterion for marriage), and those men just happened to be syeds also. i stand by my statement. may Allah have mercy on the ignorant who use syedness as a criterion for marriage. this is pure, blatant racism, totally opposite of the very brotherhood that is at the heart of islam.

So breaking it down logically:

imams did...

what: gave daughters to only syeds

why: those were the only pious-enough men around who also just happened to be syeds

people look at the what and try to follow that blindly without following the why, leading to blindness.

if i were to do that for using a computer:

imams did...

what: not use computers

why: they were not invented yet

if i were to look at only the what wihtout the why, i could conclude that it is haram to use the computer. so all u people who believe that syedas can only marry syed guys, get off the computer!!

-Syed of Mind and Heart Babybeaver

u r sick

dont just hijake the thread now

the topic is tell us u r a syed or not??

this syed gals marryin non syeds has been beaten to death a zilllion times

and accordin to sharia u aint a syed

so plz

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u r sick

dont just hijake the thread now

the topic is tell us u r a syed or not??

this syed gals marryin non syeds has been beaten to death a zilllion times

and accordin to sharia u aint a syed

so plz

i'm not sick, my temperature is 98.6 degrees, thank you very much

if i recall correctly, i first responded to this thread describing my syed standing and some racists started attacking me...

why don't you respond to what i'm saying unless you don't knwo how...and why are you on the computer anyway?

islam is about brotherhood, not these silly racial divisions! intermarry girls, intermarry!

-Syed of Mind and Heart Babybeaver

Edited by BabyBeaverIsAKit
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i'm not sick, my temperature is 98.6 degrees, thank you very much

if i recall correctly, i first responded to this thread describing my syed standing and some racists started attacking me...

why don't you respond to what i'm saying unless you don't knwo how...and why are you on the computer anyway?

islam is about brotherhood, not these silly racial divisions! intermarry girls, intermarry!

-Syed of Mind and Heart Babybeaver

oh gr8 ur temp is 98.6

try to keep it here

if ya can

u r again talkin abt intermarryin i old ya to stop it

and wat do u mean by syed of mind???

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Not because of their lineage, but because those were the only pious-enough men around. people mistakenly believe that imams gave their daughters to syeds because those men were syeds. this is incorrect. they gave their daughters to the men who were the most pious and faithful around (the only valid criterion for marriage), and those men just happened to be syeds also. i stand by my statement. may Allah have mercy on the ignorant who use syedness as a criterion for marriage. this is pure, blatant racism, totally opposite of the very brotherhood that is at the heart of islam.

So breaking it down logically:

imams did...

what: gave daughters to only syeds

why: those were the only pious-enough men around who also just happened to be syeds

people look at the what and try to follow that blindly without following the why, leading to blindness.

if i were to do that for using a computer:

imams did...

what: not use computers

why: they were not invented yet

if i were to look at only the what wihtout the why, i could conclude that it is haram to use the computer. so all u people who believe that syedas can only marry syed guys, get off the computer!!

(salam)

I would like to see references supporting your argument.

Else, it will become an assumption; your very own.

leading to blindness

Fi-Amanillah

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(salam) Dear All

I have few questions for the respected members

What is Syed, is it an arabic word, is it a title or is it an identification of something. I believe that our Prophet was called Syed, and it was Allah who gave him the title of SYED through Quran, since SYED is a title given to Rasool (pbuh) and no one else, this title should'nt be used by anyone else, just to prove that he or she is related to Imams, please remember that one of the brothers of one of our Imam (10th or 11th), was a stern enemy of Imam, so lineage doesnt make you a better human, your deeds do.

Also I dont understand people wearing black Amama, wasnt the color black a symbol of Banu Abbas who slaughtered millions of shias, and that black Amama is used to give an impression that you are a SYED, where as the color of our IMAMs is GREEN, so if you are a true SYED, you should'nt be wearing BLACK but GREEN.

And to all those who claim themselves to be the descendents of IMAMs, please be careful with your deeds, you dont want to embarass the 12th IMAM

regards

mizas

Most of Pakistan's sayyids are fake.

Are you a Moderator of this forum, you should'nt generalise a particular nation by writing such comments, until and unless you are 100% sure

ARE YOU ?

regards

mizas

Edited by mizas
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(salam)

It is very interesting to know if you are a syyed. In this way, we can all know each other.

As for me, yes I am a syyed Razvi by the grace of Allah s.w.t. Infact, both my parents are Razvi's so iam as they say in urdu 'Najeebul-Tarafaain'.

:)

Yes. Kazmi.

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isnt that a big assumption to make? especialy when made without any basis?

i am not doubting that fake syed's exist, but proportionally speaking this occurs everywhere...so why are there so many more syed's from the sub-continent (pakistan & india) compared to everywhere else?

hasn't it ever occured to anyone that pakistan and india make up the largest population of shias on this whole planet?

there are more SHIAS in pakistan alone then there are PEOPLE (total population) in iraq & lebanon put together! Infact if you take the total shia population from every single arab-speaking nation in the world (saudi, yemen, bahrain, iraq, syria, kuwait, oman, egypt, lebanon and all the rest...etc etc) it would not even drop close to the total shia population of the subcontinent.

34million shias in pakistan (total population 170million)

31million shias in india (total population 1.1 billion)

61 million shias in iran (total population 68 million)

18 million shias in iraq (total population 28 million)

2.2 million shias in lebanon (total population 3.9million)

2.5 million shias in saudi (total population 26 million)

whats are the reasons for this? the simple fact is that the growth rate in Asia is vastly higher compared to any other parts of the world.

People in pakistan & india tend to have more children compared to countries outside asia, this is a well-known fact.

Bearing this in mind, the fact that as early as imam hussein (as), when he declared to his enemies in karbala to let him proceed to hind (now known as india & pakistan) because the people there would welcome him, shows how early it was in the mind of the prophets descendants to travel there.

Imam zain-ul-abidin(as) married a woman from hind in the province of sindh (in today's geographical area of south pakistan) who became the the mother of the great shaheed hazrat zaid ibn ali.

the imams had many many children between them & obviously even more grand children & great grand children. many of these seeked refuge from oppression inflicted on shias & especially syed's, in areas such as iraq.

When they migrated to environments such as the subcontinent, they are effected by the change in environment, especially their children who would have been born there & the commonality of large families would have been adopted.

The fact that that their are 12 times more mulsims in pakistan & india then their are in iraq is proof of this (considering islam was first spread to iraq before it was spread to the subcontinent), so how can you be suprised if there are more syed's in india or pakistan then compared to the arab world?

it is infact more logical to assume that there would be more shias & syed's in pakistan and india then the arab world...which is the case.

while the syed families in the subcintinent where living peacfully, porspering, increasing the size of the families by every generation, adopting the large growth rate......shia families in the arab world, especially iraq were being greatly oppressed, millions killed, practicing taqiyya, migrating etc.

the first muslims ever to set foot in the subcontonent (india & pakistan) were not sunni's, but actually syed shia families who where fleeing oppression..this fact is recorded and recognised by both shia & sunni.

i am not doubting fake syed's exist, i know they do, but i believe this trend is proportionally equal everywhere...so u should be careful when accusing most pakistani syeds of being fake with no basis or reasoning to your argument.

maybe its jealousy :P

anyway...ma fingers hurt

salaam

(salam)

Yes...jealousy, naturally... :D

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(salam)

I would like to see references supporting your argument.

Else, it will become an assumption; your very own.

Fi-Amanillah

1) 'O People! Verily We have created you from a man and woman and we made you into various tribes and creeds for the purpose of mutual recognition (not discrimination and racial pride). Verily the most prestigious and honoured amongst you is he who fears Allah Taãla most. Verily Allah Taãla is all Knowing. All Aware' (Surah 49 Vs. 13)

2) Do not marry unbelieving women (idolaters), until they believe: a slave woman who believes is better than an unbelieving woman, even though she allure you. Nor marry (your girls) to unbelievers until they believe: a man slave who believes is better then an unbeliever, even though he allure you. Unbelievers do (but) beckon you to the fire. But God beckons by His Grace to the Garden (of Bliss) and forgiveness, and makes His signs clear to mankind: that they may celebrate His praise. [Holy Quran: Baqara 2:221]

3) The Prophet (pbuh) said: If a courter proposes to marry your daughter and you are sure about his religiousness and trustworthiness, then provide the means for such a marriage. Prohibiting marriage of a well-matched couple may lead to sedition and great corruption on the Earth. [ibid]

In another tradition the Prophet (pbuh) said: Marry your daughter off to one whose morality and religiousness satisfies you. Should you prevent such a marriage, you have caused a great corruption and sedition on the Earth. [bihar al-Anwar, v.100, p.373]

From 1) we can conclude that all men are equal. From 2) we can conclude that the one who believes is a better partner than one who doesn’t. From 3) we can conclude that a father MUST give his daughter to a pious suitor. The criterion for marriage is faith and piety, NOT lineage. Now, we know the Imams would not contradict the Prophet, so therefore they must’ve given their daughters to faithful men or else if they had turned away the proposal, their daughters would’ve been corrupted. Now, unless the Imams were to contradict 1)-3) they would only give their daughters to the most pious, regardless of lineage, though by coincidence they also just happened to be syed.

-Syed of HEart and MInd BabyBeaver

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Syed of HEart and MInd BabyBeaver

who eva u r

u may syed by heart and mind and be khoja of legs

and be gujrati from face

or an african from hair

i told ya before plz dont pull ur socks on syed marraiges plz

plz tell us wat do ya "REALLY" mean by syed by heart and mind???

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1) 'O People! Verily We have created you from a man and woman and we made you into various tribes and creeds for the purpose of mutual recognition (not discrimination and racial pride). Verily the most prestigious and honoured amongst you is he who fears Allah Taãla most. Verily Allah Taãla is all Knowing. All Aware' (Surah 49 Vs. 13)

You can fight (compete) for 'fazl' of Allah and excel in piety by doing good deeds but you cannot do anything to claim His 'fazeelat' given to the ones He chooses. E.g Ibles vs Adam. The Almighty has said it Himself in the Quran, that ask for my fazl but do not ask for my fazeelat.

Read the following verse of Quran and its commentary ( Tafsir ) :

Al-Quran 3.033

YUSUFALI: Allah did choose Adam and Noah, the family of Abraham, and the family of 'Imran above all people,-

Tafsir: Imam Ridha was questioned if Allah has given 'fazeelat' to Itrat e Rasul over rest of the nations. Imam said , 'yes' and recited the above mentioned verse.

Tafsir ul Burhan vol 1

Tafsir ul Saqlain Vol 1

3) The Prophet (pbuh) said: If a courter proposes to marry your daughter and you are sure about his religiousness and trustworthiness, then provide the means for such a marriage. Prohibiting marriage of a well-matched couple may lead to sedition and great corruption on the Earth. [ibid]

In another tradition the Prophet (pbuh) said: Marry your daughter off to one whose morality and religiousness satisfies you. Should you prevent such a marriage, you have caused a great corruption and sedition on the Earth. [bihar al-Anwar, v.100, p.373]

Isa Bin Zaid Bin Ali Bin Hussain was a muhadith and companion of Imam Jafar Sadiq. Ayatullah AlSyed Abdur Razaq AlMusawi writes, " He was one of the most learned in his family and scholars of Rijal have copied narrations from him. "

Isa Bin Zaid kept his identity hidden for a long time and refused to give his daughter to his neighbour who was a Non-Syed. And later in life, He explained the reason to Yahya bin Hussain that he did this because non-Syed is not to be married with the Syeds.

- Maqatil ul Talbaen

From 1) we can conclude that all men are equal.

Their equal yet one gets sadiqa and the other gets Khums.

Love of 'Ahl-ul-Qurba' is Wajib on you. Syeds may not be one of the 14 Masumeen but they are certainly Ehl-e-Muhammad.

Focus on the difference within the equality.

Fi-Amanillah

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Salaam,

My responses are bolded. Enjoy!

You can fight (compete) for 'fazl' of Allah and excel in piety by doing good deeds but you cannot do anything to claim His 'fazeelat' given to the ones He chooses. E.g Ibles vs Adam. The Almighty has said it Himself in the Quran, that ask for my fazl but do not ask for my fazeelat.

Read the following verse of Quran and its commentary ( Tafsir ) :

Al-Quran 3.033

YUSUFALI: Allah did choose Adam and Noah, the family of Abraham, and the family of 'Imran above all people,-

Tafsir: Imam Ridha was questioned if Allah has given 'fazeelat' to Itrat e Rasul over rest of the nations. Imam said , 'yes' and recited the above mentioned verse.

Tafsir ul Burhan vol 1

Tafsir ul Saqlain Vol 1

---[[[Read the commentary:

[Pooya/Ali Commentary 3:33]

In this verse Adam and Nuh are mentioned by their names, whereas Ibrahim and Imran are mentioned with reference to their posterity. Al (the posterity) of Adam and Nuh have not been included in the category of the chosen ones, because there were several ungodly and wicked persons in their lineage, but in the al (immediate issues) of Ibrahim (Ismail and Is-haq) and Imran (Musa and Harun), holy men of God, were chosen as messengers of Allah.

The mention of Ibrahim and Imran, undisputedly amongst the holiest prophets of Allah, has been made in this verse with reference to their posterity, because according to the religious annotation, in the word al the spiritual quality of a posterity automatically includes the immediate ancestor or the founder of a family. Al or Ahl ul Bayt, commonly used to address the members of a family, is exclusively reserved, in the religious and spiritual act of referring, for the holiest members of the family of the Holy Prophet who are identical with each other in their personal purity and spiritual sanctity (Ahzab: 33).

The Holy Prophet and his Ahl ul Bayt are in the posterity of Ibrahim, therefore, in the light of this verse, they are chosen in preference to all the created beings. They are superior to every human being. (Tafsir Durr al Manthur; and Mawahib al Ladunniya).

It’s in reference to the Ahlul bayt. Not all people of the blood line of the prophet are ahlul bayt. If I recall correctly, there are only five Ahlul Bayt, and 14 masumeen not ten billion as the number of syeds there are. Unless you can claim equivalent spiritual piety as the ahlul bayt and 14 masumeen, you are not one of the chosen people. Sorry to disappoint you!

Tafsir: Imam Ridha was questioned if Allah has given 'fazeelat' to Itrat e Rasul over rest of the nations. Imam said , 'yes' and recited the above mentioned verse.

Again, “itrat” is used in reference to the 12 imams, not the ten billion syeds by blood who have or will ever live.

Isa Bin Zaid Bin Ali Bin Hussain was a muhadith and companion of Imam Jafar Sadiq. Ayatullah AlSyed Abdur Razaq AlMusawi writes, " He was one of the most learned in his family and scholars of Rijal have copied narrations from him. "

Isa Bin Zaid kept his identity hidden for a long time and refused to give his daughter to his neighbour who was a Non-Syed. And later in life, He explained the reason to Yahya bin Hussain that he did this because non-Syed is not to be married with the Syeds.

- Maqatil ul Talbaen

--He was not one of the imams or prophets so we cannot follow other people’s mistakes. He was a muhaddith which means he compiles hadith and thus he was essentially a historian. He was an expert on history basically, which does not equate to divine authority on religious matters. Since he was not a prophet or an imam, he is fallible and can make mistakes.

Their equal yet one gets sadiqa and the other gets Khums.

That in no way implies that syeds are above or below everyone else.

Love of 'Ahl-ul-Qurba' is Wajib on you. Syeds may not be one of the 14 Masumeen but they are certainly Ehl-e-Muhammad.

Ahle-muhammad is ahlul bayt. Unless a syed by blood has enough piety to equal that of the 12 imams, he is not of ahle-muhammad. Since the 12 imams have more piety than the syeds today seeing as they are above all human beings including the syeds (by blood) of today, the only logical thing to conclude is that they are the ones referred to in the Quran 3.033. It is presumptuous for everyone to love someone because they are of a particular lineage. Faith, not lineage is the principal factor that determines that.

Focus on the difference within the equality.

3=3. There’s nothing mathematically different between the two 3’s. There’s no such thing as “separate but equal”. Let’s get out of this caste system mentality, folks. Islam wants to unite us so let’s not have these prejudiced cultural systems obstruct the very brotherhood that is at the heart of Islam.

Fi-Amanillah

-Syed of Heart and Mind Babybeaver

-------------------

Salaams again,

I will be leaving shiachat for reasons unspecified, and returning at a later date inshallah. its bee nnice talkin to all of you. its been a good discussion, especially with you, bro inshallah and bro al-syed. keep on posting and inshallah ill come back and look at what has been posted in my absence if i remember inshallah when i return. just remember my last words:

intermarry girls, intermarry!

unite, muslims, unite!!

-sad that he must leave, syed of heart and mind babybeaver

Edited by BabyBeaverIsAKit
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