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In the Name of God بسم الله

Sikhism - What's wrong with it?


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  • Advanced Member

Peace be upon you all,

         I am new on this board, and have a request. Having visited many Islamic web-sites, I have noticed that in their Dawah sections they never have guides to persuading Sikhs to Islam. My friend is one such unfortunate who was born into a Sikh family

         Trying to persuade him into Islam, I looked at the Sikh's beliefs which all seem pretty logical and similar to Islam (daily prayers, no alcohol etc.) I wish not to offend him and call the Gurus bonkers, so could ye all try find a catalyst in bringing him to embrace THE faith.

                  Yours Truly,

                       Mohammad of the Resistance

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Salaamalaikum,

From what i know, Sikhs deviated from Islam.

there symbol which is alot like the Iranian one can be read as Allah if it is spread from one angle.

There is evidence [i:post_uid0]i'll try getitng it for you[/i:post_uid0] that their leader, Guru Nanak was infact a Shia. One of the Ziarats in Syria or Iraq bear his visit and state that he paid condolences on the Martyrs of Karbala.

Allah knows best

Wa'salaam

Asad Ali.

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Aslamo 3alikum,

Yeah I've also heard this...that their rituals and culture is very much similar to us....One of my friend who lives in canada has a sikh friend..and she has learned some [b:post_uid1][i:post_uid1]poetic verses[/b:post_uid1][/i:post_uid1] written by [b:post_uid1][i:post_uid1]Guru Nanak[/b:post_uid1][/i:post_uid1] in the praise of [i:post_uid1]Imam Hussain (as)[/i:post_uid1] and [i:post_uid1]Ahlul-Bayt[/i:post_uid1]..

and as far as his claim is concerned that he had recieved some revelation from God..

It may be false..just like MOSES was true,but jews are Ehh....Jesus was true but christians dont actually follow his teachings ...

ma salama..

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According to the Sikh belief, God is all omnipotent, omnipresent and omniscient. The sun, moon/s, wind, fire, water, vegetation and all other things which exist are His witnesses. A Sikh must worship only the abstract form of God. The worship of images or any other object is strictly forbidden.

God is both the creator and the destroyer. He is beyond birth and death. He is both merciful and compassionate. He is beyond fear and enmity. He is self illuminated. He is the Master of all the treasures. All our possessions are a result of His grace.

The Sikhs call God as Waheguru, meaning the most wonderful Master.

The belief of the Sikhs in Waheguru is similar to that of Judaism, Christianity and Islam i.e., God is the greatest power, He is supreme, He is the king of kings, He pervades everywhere, He knows the inner thoughts of everyone, He is the giver, He existed before the start of the time, He existed when the time was started, He exists now and He will exist forever.

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There is evidence i'll try getitng it for you that their leader, Guru Nanak was infact a Shia. One of the Ziarats in Syria or Iraq bear his visit and state that he paid condolences on the Martyrs of Karbala.

this is so not true....Guru Nanak was born in Kshatriya family(2nd biggest cast of hinduism)....Guru Nanak was born in 1469 at Rai Bhoeki Talwandi now nown as Nankana Sahib situated in Punjab province of West Pakistan....His father, Mehta Kalu was a Patwari- an accountant of land revenue in the government. Guru's mother was Mata Tripta and he had one older sister, Bibi Nanki. From the very childhood, Bibi Nanki saw in him the Light of God but she did not reveal this secret to anyone. She is known as the first disciple of Guru Nanak.

At the age of seven, Guru Nanak was sent to school, which was run by teacher, Pandit Gopal Das, at his village. As usual the teacher started the lesson with an alphabet but the teacher was wonder-stuck when the Guru asked him to explain the meanings of the letters of the alphabet. However at the helplessness of his teacher, the Guru wrote the meanings of each and every letter of the alphabet. This was the first Divine Message delivered by Guru Nanak. This was an explanation of deeper truth about human beings and God and the way to realize God in terms of the alphabet. The teacher stood abashed before the Divine Master and bowed to him. He then took him back to his father and said, "Mehtaji, your son is an Avtar (prophet) and has come to redeem the victims of Kalyug (the age of Falsehood). He is destined to be a world Teacher, there is nothing that I can teach him."......He attended muslim school, where he was taught elementary arabic and persian....one day he disaapeared. when he reappeared he said that he had aa vision of God. AFter this vision, he said, "there is neither hindu nor muslim, so whose path shall i choose? shall i follow god's path. god is neither hindu nor musulman and the path which i follow is God's"

In the vision God told him, "There is but one God whose name is True, the creator,devoid of fear and enmity, immortal, unborn, self-existent, great and bountiful, the True one was in the beginning, the True one was in the primal age. the true one is, was. O nanak and the true one shall be."

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Salam alaikum wa rahmatullah wa barakatuh

he claims to have received a revelation from God, saying that there is 'no Muslim, no Hindu.'

Subhan Allah!!!

[i:post_uid0]This day have those who reject faith given up all hope of your religion: yet fear them not but fear Me. This day have I perfected your religion for you, completed My favour upon you, and have chosen for you Islam as your religion. [/i:post_uid0]

Nothing new as i see in the claim of the chalb arafat who sad once, he is not muslim, nor christian...

From these baatil claims of this guru, its clearly seen he is NOT muslim, whatever he did in his life.

As i learnt, we must have the kailma in our hearts to make our deeds accepted, as "La ilaha illa Allah, Muhammad rasool Allah"

The hadith says, once nabi Isa (as) saw a yahoodi who was day and night prayed to Allah, so when the angels told him (as), that this yahoodi's deeds are in vain he was surprised. Then Allah subhanah wa taala told him, they are in vain, because the yahoodi didnt accept Isa (as) as nabi.

I think, its very clear.

Sikhs are not muslims. They may have some common things with us, as also the mushrik Christians have, but in this case, actually Judaism is more closer to Islam, even in its teachings and even in the fact that Jews are killing muslims, just as a lot of sikhs are against muslims in India and were in the past.

Imam Ali (as) sad:

[i:post_uid0]"The same piety is shelter for you in this world, and will be a source of prosperity and salvation in the Hereafter."

[/i:post_uid0]

Salam alaikum wa rahmatullah wa barakatuh

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Asalaamu Alaikum!! :)

This is very interesting...! I have a sikh friend and have always wanted to learn more about her religion, just out of curiousity.

Why are Sikh men not allowed to cut their hair?

Also, There are Hindus who every Ashura commemorate the death of Imam Husayn (as), as Shi'as do. How amazing is that... Not all Muslims (Sunnis) know about Ashura, yet there are Hindus who do... Now that is interesting :)

Take care, Salaam!

~Sarah~

Edited By Zuljenah on 1030577416

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Salam alaikum,

I have never heard of hindus remembering Hussain's (as) death.  If they do, what is their reason for that?  I thought they don't believe in Islam...

Guru Nanak is a shia?  how do you guys know?  who is he anyways? lol

he said that he had aa vision of God. AFter this vision, he said, "there is neither hindu nor muslim, so whose path shall i choose? shall i follow god's path. god is neither hindu nor musulman and the path which i follow is God's"

God is not a person to belong to a religion.  God is the Creator of the universe.  So this doesn't make sense.

Bro baatil ka kaatil

there symbol which is alot like the Iranian one can be read as Allah if it is spread from one angle.

I take that as an insult, the Sikh symbol has nothing to do with the Iranian flag's symbol.  It does not look alot alike either!

Here's the sikh symbol:

imageimageimage

The sikh symbol is totally different.  It has two swords, and a circle.  The Iranian flag symbol is a fancy arabic symbol.  It reads Allah and La illaha illallah.

Edited By Mujahid on 1030581258

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Salaamalaikum,

Br i didn't mean to insult or offend, for that i apologise :(.

Alterations have been made to their symbol and it has varied from time to time.

The history that Miss Hyder has given is the history that the Sikhs give of him. Indeed they do respect the Muslims and Islam but we cannot follow their version of history.

In their history, Mohammed SAW was not a prophet. It is totally contradictory.

It is best to ask someone who knows about this topic. I am still working on the sources from where i got this information. Watch this space. :P.

Peer Sahib, i have heard a very famous couplet about Hussain AS, stating that Guru Nanak said without the sacrifice of Hussain AS, there would be no 'Nanak'.

Once again i am working on the sources. By the way, they are Sikh ones. [i:post_uid0] i think they are[/i:post_uid0]

Allah knows best.

Wa'salaam

Edited By Baatil Ka Kaatil on 1030609501

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Why are Sikh men not allowed to cut their hair

This is one of the five fold oth of the Khalsa(saint Soldiers)....that they are not allowed to cut their hair....during the time of Mughal empire....the tenth Guru, Govind Singh led the struggle against the Moghul Empire founded the Khalsa a militaristic community of the pur, the Guru Panth...He gave the first five Khalsa a two edged dagger and declared that they were henceforth to be known as "lions-Singh" women were given the title "kaur-Princess"

These are the duties of Khalsa

I. The Khalsa is to worship one God and read Nitname (Five Banis) and daily meditate on the Name.

II. He is to keep the symbols (Panj Kakar) and to lead his life according to the Guru's teaching. Gurmantra is Waheguru and the Basic creed is Mool-manlra.

III. He has no caste after joining the brother-hood ; he has to repudiate non-Sikh rites and ceremonies, and follow only Sikh practices.

IV. He is not to commit 'any of the four misdeeds (Kurahat) namely, the shaving or cutting of hair, eating Halal meat, adultery and the use of tobacco or any other intoxi-cant.

V. He is not to commit any of the social offences (Tankhah), such as giving dowry, using liquors and intoxicants, raising monuments over graves and associating with apostates.

VI He must contribulc one-tenth {daswand) of his income for religious purposes.

VII He is to serve the sangat in all ways

VIII He must practice arms and be ready defend the weak.

Khalsa Sikhs keep five emblems of their faith intact on their bodies at all times. These collectively form a uniform for members of the community of "Pure Ones."

1. Kesh - Uncut hair. Historically, unshorn hair was a sign of spirituality and sainthood; this is consistent with the concept of saint-soldier in Sikhism. Also, keeping one's hair intact indicates resignation to the Will of God.

2. Kangha - A small wooden comb used to keep the hair tidy at all times. Typically worn underneath a turban, this represents cleanliness; and as such, is a practical way to look neat and pure at all times.

3. Kach - Long undershorts typically worn by soldiers to ensure freedom of movement.

4. Kara - A steel bracelet worn around the wrist as a reminder of one's faith.

5. Kirpan - A saber to be used as a last measure of protection in case the need to defend oneself, or another, arises.

Sikhs who have taken Amrit vow never to take intoxicants, cut their hair, commit adultery, or eat meat prepared in the Muslim fashion. Sikh men take as one of their names, Singh (lion); women take the name, Kaur (princess). Sikh men are also required to wear a turban over their uncut hair. Once considered a sign of royalty, the turban is an article of distinction which should be worn with pride, as it was given to Sikhs by their Guru.

Khalsa is one who fights in the front ranks.

Khalsa is one who conquers the five evils [lust, anger, pride, greed, ego];

Khalsa is one who destroys doubt.

Khalsa is one who gives up ego;

Khalsa is one who does not stray from his spouse;

Khalsa is one who looks upon all as his own;

Khalsa is one who attunes himself with God.

The spirit of Guru Gobind Singh, creator of the Khalsa, which resides in the collective spirit of the Pure Ones, and the devotion to God which binds these faithful saint-soldiers, are the common denominators of the Khalsa tradition.

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Guru Nanak is a shia?  how do you guys know?  who is he anyways? lol

Guru Nanak was born in Kshatriya family(2nd biggest cast of hindusim) he is not shia...he found sikhism during the period of mughul emperior...

Symbols or outward signs are a mode of discipline. A person who enters the Panth (Khalsa Community) will gladly embrace all its tenets and symbols. Symbols test the disciple's firmness and strengh of faith. They indicate the type of character the wearer should have. He must be proud of being a Sikh, even though it may cost him his life. Secondly this common appearance and uniform ensures easy recognition One can easily spot a Khalsa in a crowd. Each symbol has its own use and psychological significance....this is the meaning of symbols in sikhism..

Hindus of course don't believe in Islam. Only a very small sect commemorate Imam Husayn's death.

This is true..only a very small sect commemorate Imam Husayn's death....in hyderabad i have seen hindu people painted their bodies with different colours  and came to the Ashur Khanas(Imam Bargha) reciting poems in praise of the martyrs of Karbala

its not just in city of Hyderabad that the non-muslims participated in Azadari but even in towns and villages of the other states was performed with equal zeal and enthusiasm. The alams were called "peers" and were raised in most villages as soon as teh Moon of the month of Muharram was sighted

During the period of qutub shahi....My dad said "The hindus of Guguodu village observed Muharram every year. it was the only occassion on which people of al the four castes were allowed to participate and caste difference so rigid among them was forgotten...they called it "deen Govind". they even practised the ceremony of becoming "faqir" like the muslims. on Fifth night, a procession was taken out which was caled "panjee ka pattar" in which everyone living in the village, actively took part. The babies born during the period, in the village were named as Faqir Appas, Hussain Das, etc...it was not in just one village...there were several others..

Many hindu poets wrote a number of poems describing Muharram. in one such poem poet Ramana writes

"Paddala Panduga Rawe"

"Peerla panduga rewe"

(come, the festival of the great men!

come, the festival of the peer)

it is interesting to note that even teh women of the villages wrote poems to pay theri homage to the Martyrs of Karbala....one of them wrote

"Satyam aina bee fatima deevona ichunu"

(if you speak truth, beebi fatima will bless you"

those poems are in telugu language...

I heard from somewhere....this hindus celebrating Moharrum started from the Qutub Shahi period.

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Sikhism is not a deviated form of Islam, and is nothing more then a Synthesis of Islam and Hinduism. I don’t know as much about Sikhism as Miss Hyder, however I concur with most of what she has written.

If one is in the position of trying to persuade someone of joining  the Islamic field…then I would recommend studying the Sikh faith, and appealing to those characteristics which both Sikhism, and Islam share.

By the way this is my first post, nice group you all have here.

Ya Ali Madad! :wee:

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Salaamalaikum,

[i:post_uid0]Baghdad, capital of Iraq, was visited by Guru Nanak Dev on his way back from Mecca and Madina. He stayed outside the city to the west of Dajala (Tigris) River, about two kilometres north of Baghdad West railway station. He held discourses with Sajjadanashins (caretaker) of the mausoleums of Abdul Qadir Gilani and Bahlol the Wise, who were greatly imp,ressed by his views on God and religion. After the Guru's departure, they raised a memorial in the form of a platform where the Guru had sat and discoursed. After some time when a room was constructed over the platform, a stone slab with the following inscription in Turki was installed in it.[/i:post_uid0]

Source : Click Here.

Wa'salaam

Asad Ali.

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Salaam alaikum,

During the time of Guru Nanak, the Muslims and Hindus were divided. (still are)  He wanted to unite them, so he made this new religion. It was like a mix between the two religions.  Guru Nanak visited a lot of Muslim Scholars and had dialogue with them.  This was all part of his plan to unite the two religions.  But it doesn't mean he was Muslim, he was Hindu.  His aide was Muslim, I don't remember though if he was Shia or Sunni.

WaSalaam, Hajar

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Salam

I'm not sure if these are rumors or what, but we have an X-Sikh (became muslim) family friend. She says it's haram from them to eat Halal food (like sister Miss_Hydar mentioned earlier) and also, they're not allowed to cut their hair until every muslim has died. From what this X-Sikh lady tells us, it seems sikhsm is built to be anti-islamic anti-hindu.

Sub7anallah, tomorrow i am supposed to go with my mother to a sikh organised gathering of ethnic minorities to discuss post-9/11. Many sikhs have been mistreated because people mistakened them for muslims (turban). She was asked to give a speech, and i come accross this thread...hehehe great timing guys. Hey, maybe it was supposed to start just for me  ;)  :uhh:  :P  :wacko: lol, does anybody get that feeling sometimes??? lol

wassalamz

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YA aba that family friend of yours does not have a clue about sikhism

sikhism IS NOT ANTI MUSLIM OR ANTI HINDU

sikhism was founded during moghul rule to give hindus of punjab a new way of thinking.  Hindus were too peaceful for their own good and they always tolerated opression because they thought that god was going to come and save them.  

Under guru nanak the hindus got new guidance which STILL EMPHASIZED ON PEACE but it demanded the people to save their own communities from the barbaric outsiders.  Well the result of all this was the we faught for our own lands and won them because we were right.  We also conquered all of pakistan, kashmir and a huge part of afghanistan under maharaja ranjit singh.

PS:  religous sikhs are required to carry a knife for protection and nothing more.  Yes most of our history was fighting the muslims but also the british.  The british only attacked sikhs when our greatest king maharaja ranjit singh died.  Further more we were too few in numbers and lost the war even though we won many huge battles.  However even after our loss we were the ONLY ONES to keep on fighting hte british rule and no hindus or muslims did anything.

dont listen to propaganda by pakistanis who are ruled by a man which is named BUSHARRAF  

:D    these pakistanis are only the puppets of america and always will be.  They never learn from history and ameirca will first use them and than throw them in garbage

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Sikhism is an outright motheistic religion liek Islam, yet they share karmic principles with Hinduism.

It has the simpleness of Islam and the philosophy of Hinduism without the ritualism and wide spread symbolism (not to say there isnt symbolism, as there is).

Historicall, Sikhs DID fight muslims, specifically the Moghals, then later on fought the British. They are know more as a warrior people.

Recently, in the 80's, SOME developed a more anti Hindu stance after the Golden Temple incident. But much of that has faded.

As far as the caste thing, from my perceptions Sikhs are more hung up on caste than Hindus, but that is just my opinion

Edited by adren@line
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Ya Ali Madad,

I havn't been on the site for a long long time, but im here now :P

As always if I say anything which offends or is disrespectful forgive me and let me know so I do not make the same mistake again.

Its intresting to see some of the views people have on sikhism, as I am a sikh some may remember me from the Imam Barga in Tooting as I was there to pay my respects to Imam Husain (as)

I am not an ex-sikh or anti islamic yet I carry a dagger and have long hair and all the rest. The dagger is for the protection of dharam (righteousness), it is for this same reason that those sikhs who know about Imam Husain (as) show the greatest of respect as he died for dharam. The long hair would not be cut no matter how many muslims die, it has more of a spiritual significance.

I would be intrested to see the quotes where Guru Nanak shows his respect to the ahul bayt, as I know from oral tradition (probably taken from sau sakhia -stories of Guru Nanaks life) that when asked about shias or sunnis being true muslims, he said that shias respect the ahul bayt and hence they are the true muslims. (im am typing from memory so I might not be correct word for word).

Sikhs are not hindu or muslim, we believe in one god the supreme god be he named Allah, vaheguru, god.. My personal opinion on sikhism is that we follow truth and the praise of god, be that a peer such as Baba Farid Ji, or a bhagat like ravidas.

The khalsa (warrior sikhs) fight for dharam against any opressor at the time of Guru Gobind Singh the opressors where the moghul kings, such as Aurangzeb. Due to our own ignorance in our communities it seems now that sikhs dislike muslims as they feel they are all like the moghuls.

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how uneducated can u get

1)the reason a sikh wears a turban is so he can look after what god has given him and not take it away as his body is gods

2)the reason a sikh wars kachera (undershorts) is so that he has a constant reminder with him at all times to resist lust

3)the reason a sikh wears a kirpan is so they can support others who are being oppressed and defend themselves

not kill muslims (one of Guru Gobind Singh Ji's best friends was a muslim)

4)the reason a sikh wears a kara (bangle) is so that it is a constant reminder that gods love is with them as it is in a round circle. and is worn on the strong hand to constantly show the strong ongoing love of god

5)finally the reason a sikh wears a kanga (comb) is so they can keep there hair which is given by god clean. this represents cleanliness.

The caste system also does not apply in sikhism

Guru Nanak Dev Ji was the first person to ever pick up a chamaar child (poor untouchable child) in public to tell all those that all people are equal

turbans at that time were worn by kings

Guru Nanak Dev Ji said i want all of my people to be Kings and Queens i want them all to wear turbans like a king and be equal

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They believe in One God but if you look at their practices its very much based on culture. Ie wearing a bangle, wearing a turban etc. From what my friend told me she said their Gurus wanted to be different from the Hindus not follow hinduism because they thought Hinduism was not making any sense.

1) One God

God is the Creator of the Universe

God isn't born and will never die

God is present everywhere

2) Equality

All human beings are equal

People of all religions and races are welcome in Sikh Gurdwaras

Women have equal status with men in religious services and ceremonies

3) Birth and Death

After a person dies, his soul is born again in another body, human or animal

One's next life depends on his deeds in the past life

The human life is supreme and it is through this life that we can achieve oneness with God

Finding God takes us out of this life cycle

4) Non-Violence

Sikhs are a peace loving people and stand for Truth and Justice

Guru Gobind Singh Ji said, "It is right to use force as a last resort when all other peaceful means fail."

The message of every religion is Peace and Love. Islam starts with Saying Peace be with you so lets remember this when we talk to people who are Jews, Chirstians, Athiests etc Dont say YOUR WRONG etc everyone has a right to their belief and Religion is not a compulsion on ANYONE

Salam

Edited by asharp
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Ya Aba, you are grossly informed my friend. We do not cut our hair to adhere to the natural state that god has created us in and to keep discipline in taking care of it and have a specific identity. We cannot eat meat that was sacrificially slaughtered. Aamir that is so wrong to even suggest, the dagger, known as a kirpan, is carried by baptized Sikhs in case of extreme injustice or persecution one can defend himself, it was more relevant at the time of the mogul rule over India, predominantly Punjab, when Muslims were given bounty rewards for bringing baptized Sikh heads to the kings and came in handy during the Sikh genocides of 1984 by extremist Hindus. Guru Gobind is quoting as saying "when all means have failed it is righteous to raise the sword." Meaning, when all means of peace, equality, justice etc. have failed with all efforts put forth, then only is it acceptable to raise the sword, capturing in essence the concept of war, and that too only to fight for justice.

Sikhs and Muslims do not see eye to eye mainly because of the history in Punjab and the separation of Pakistan along with the treatment during the Mogul empire in India, religiously speaking there is no quarrel, in actuality there are many Muslim Sufi Saints mentioned in the Guru Granth Sahib, mainly that of Sant Kabir.

I am not a devout Sikh, I drink, eat all kinds of meat, cut my hair and have premarital sex but I believe in the philosophy and main ideas, and they parallel that of Islam in many ways, I am just not too firm on religious constructs of spirituality, although I firmly believe religion can attain it.

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Peace be upon you all,

         I am new on this board, and have a request. Having visited many Islamic web-sites, I have noticed that in their Dawah sections they never have guides to persuading Sikhs to Islam. My friend is one such unfortunate who was born into a Sikh family

         Trying to persuade him into Islam, I looked at the Sikh's beliefs which all seem pretty logical and similar to Islam (daily prayers, no alcohol etc.) I wish not to offend him and call the Gurus bonkers, so could ye all try find a catalyst in bringing him to embrace THE faith.

                  Yours Truly,

                       Mohammad of the Resistance</span>

As-Salamun Alaykum,

I don't understand why you think you need to convert your friend! God only know best, but it would seem your Sikh friend maybe more worthy in God's eyes than you just for the fact that you are trying to disturb the peace and satisfaction he finds with God through his religion. The fact of the matter is that there is nothing wrong with Sikhism, it is a beautiful religion and deserves to be respected.

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