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Gypsy

Abu Lulu Killed Umar ...but why?

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8 Years on and this thread it still going on :o

Yeah. I don't know why this is such a mystery. The Sunnis dismisses Abu Lulu as a fire worshiper kafir. So they kind of expect him to be a murderer. But being a fire worshiper doesn't make one a murderer. We almost don't hear of fire worshipers going around stabbing people. And we don't have a single proof that Abu Lulu was even a fire worshiper living in Medina.

The killing of the third caliph, Uthman, was kinda expected considering how corrupt his government was.

As for the killing of Umar, I am leaning towards personal grudge being the cause. Abu Lulu stabbed Umar because of discrimination faced by him being a non-Arab (Ajami).

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Yeah. I don't know why this is such a mystery. The Sunnis dismisses Abu Lulu as a fire worshiper kafir. So they kind of expect him to be a murderer. But being a fire worshiper doesn't make one a murderer. We almost don't hear of fire worshipers going around stabbing people. And we don't have a single proof that Abu Lulu was even a fire worshiper living in Medina.

The killing of the third caliph, Uthman, was kinda expected considering how corrupt his government was.

As for the killing of Umar, I am leaning towards personal grudge being the cause. Abu Lulu stabbed Umar because of discrimination faced by him being a non-Arab (Ajami).

The father and grandfather of Imaam Abu Hanifa were fire worshipers as well. You don't see the Ahle Sunnah talking about them or shedding any light on their background. So your right that being a fire worshiper doesn't make one a murderer. You don't see the Ahle Sunnah talk or even mention Muhammad bin Abu Bakar either or any of the other leading companions. So it's all about favouritism i guess.

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Abu Lulu Killed Umar ...but why?

To checkout how a dying Umer looks :shaytan:

hehehehehehehhehehehehehehheheheheheheheheheee

but did he strike him on heart or stomach with the dagger ? and i wanted to know mr al-irshad who is he sunni or shia ? i see his comments some times its against shias n some time its with shia ? his confusing me ?

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Hz. Abu Lulu Feroz may Allah be pleased with him stabbed Umer for number of mentioned reasons in this thread. Whatever was the reason, he did a great job but bit late. I wish he had done this before Umer giving power to clan of bani Umayyah lanatullahs.

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Hz. Abu Lulu Feroz may Allah be pleased with him stabbed Umer for number of mentioned reasons in this thread. Whatever was the reason, he did a great job but bit late. I wish he had done this before Umer giving power to clan of bani Umayyah lanatullahs.

Abu lulua was a believer and praised in somme narrations:

Its a disgrace that his maqam is closed nowadays. Many scholars are also burried there.

ثم الحظ ثانيا أنه (رحمة الله عليه) من المبشّرين بالجنة على لسان أمير المؤمنين (صلوات الله وسلامه عليه) حينما قال لعمر عليه لعائن الله: "غير أني أراك في الدنيا قتيلا بجراحة ابن عبد أم معمَّر؛ تحكم عليه جورا فيقتلك توفيقا يدخل به والله الجنان على رغمٍ منك". (الهداية الكبرى للخصيبي ص162)

According to this one he iseven guaranteed paradise by Imam Ali (as). :)

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Abu Lulu sounds like a good man. He disposed of umar who was a murderer and a tyrant. I would definitely high five him.

And who knows, maybe umar tried to proposition Abu Lulu as well. Unwanted homosexual attention can make a man angry.

Edited by Aliaabbas

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Abu Lulu sounds like a good man. He disposed of umar who was a murderer and a tyrant. I would definitely high five him.

And who knows, maybe umar tried to proposition Abu Lulu as well. Unwanted homosexual attention can make a man angry.

This is the Shia Alim I asked you to consult lol. Truly I think you lost the key to the gate of knowledge lol

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I've heard that Umar's own slave, Aflah, was behind the murder and knew Abu Lulu. Someone else said that Abu Lulu's real name was Aflah, they were the same person. Any way it is rather mysterious despite what popular history tells us. What it tells us doesn't really justify such rage that ends in murder.

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I've heard that Umar's own slave, Aflah, was behind the murder and knew Abu Lulu. Someone else said that Abu Lulu's real name was Aflah, they were the same person. Any way

it is rather mysterious despite what popular history tells us. What it tells us doesn't really

justify such rage that ends in murder.

There could be a connection between Afflah and Abu Lulu, or maybe Abu Lulu witnessed umar doing something terrible to a young boy. It must have been something really bad to make Abu Lulu do it.

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There could be a connection between Afflah and Abu Lulu, or maybe Abu Lulu witnessed umar doing something terrible to a young boy. It must have been something really bad to make Abu Lulu do it.

Oh Look conjecture guess work and falsehood. I thought you said you was Shia-e-Ahlebait.

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Hz. Abu Lulu Feroz may Allah be pleased with him stabbed Umer for number of mentioned reasons in this thread. Whatever was the reason, he did a great job but bit late. I wish he

had done this before Umer giving power to clan

of bani Umayyah lanatullahs.

I agree with this - Abu Lulu did everyone a favour. I hope he is rewarded in the afterlife

Edited by Aliaabbas

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You Quote as to people of persian Origion taken in as slaves ...

A few points to prove this is wrong .

1 .The prophet never encouraged slavery .

2. Slaves were freed under all rashidudin caliphs

3. People who are slaves are not paid a salary

4. Slaves do not have rights to address there complains.

5.Abu lulu was brought as a crafts man and paid a salary on which a tax was levied .

6 .The notion that children were taken as slaves is false .

7. Why abu lulu killed Hazrat Umer is still open for debate. Do not talk like you know it .

sallam

After the battle of Nihawand, many Persians, men, women, and children were taken as captives by the Muslims. The captives were sold as slaves. One of these slaves was Firoz alias Abu Lulu. He was purchased by Mughirah Shu'bah the Governor of Basra. This Firoz was a craftsman, a carpenter, an iron smith and a painter. Umar did not allow non-Muslim adult captives to reside in Madina. Mughirah sought special permission for the residence of Firoz in Madina on the ground that as he was a skilled craftsman, he would be of service to the people. Umar gave the permission as a special case.

One day, Firoz waited on Umar and complained that the tax which his master Mughirah was exacting from him was too high. He wanted the Caliph to reduce the levy. Umar enquired what work did he do. He said that he worked as a carpenter, painter, and an ironsmith. He added that he could make windmills as well. Umar next enquired as to the amount of the tax that he was required to pay to his master. He said that he had to pay two dirhams a day. Umar said that keeping in view the lucrative nature of the jobs done by him, the levy of two dirhams a day was prima facie not excessive. Umar said that he would, however, write to Mughirah, and examine the question further in the light of what Mughirah said. That did not satisfy Firoz, and he went away sulking.

Umar wrote to Mughirah, and in reply Mughirah quoted facts and figures to establish that what he took from his slave was by no means excessive. When Firoz called on Umar again, Umar explained to him that as the levy was not excessive, no reduction therein was called for that made Firoz angry. In order to humor Firoz, Umar said, "I understand you make windmills; make one for me as well." In a sullen mood, Firoz said, "Verily I will make such a mill for you, that the world would talk about it." As Firoz went away, the Caliph told the people around him that the Persian slave had threatened him.

There were Persian children slaves in Madina. Seeing them, Firoz would say, "You have been enslaved at such a tender age. This Umar sees eaten my heart. I will take his heart out". He made for himself a dagger with a very sharp edge and smeared it with poison.

On the 1st of November 644 A.D. at the time of the morning prayer, Firoz went with his dagger to the Prophet's mosque and hid himself in a corner in one of the recesses of the mosque. When the faithful stood for prayer after straightening the lines, and Umar took up his position as the Imam to lead the prayer, Firoz emerged from his place of hiding and rushed at Umar. Firoz struck Umar six consecutive blows with his dagger, and Umar fell on the floor profusely bleeding.

Other persons rushed at Firoz, but he had the fury and frenzy of a desperate man about him. He struck right and left, and thirteen Muslims were wounded, some of them fatally, before Firoz could be overpowered. At last realizing that he could not escape, Firoz stabbed himself to death with his own dagger.

sallam

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You guys seem to quote the same stuff. I can understansd if the shias have a grudge against Umer .. But quoting wrong things like Child slaves and slavery was rampent iat that time is wrong .. The prophet never promoted taking of slaves .... And slaves my friend are never paid remunuration .. the fact that they were paid saleries proves it .. how do we know they were paid saleries .. simple . how else were they taxed .. so do not spread the wrong word .

omar had a rule that non-Arabs were not allowed to enter Madina. However, he relaxed the rule for one man only at the request of his friend Mughira bin Sho'iba, the governor of Kufa. The man in question was named Feroz nicknamed "Abu Lulua". He was not an Arab, but he was a good carpenter, blacksmith and engraver.

Abu Lulua was heavily taxed for the privilege of residing in Madina and asked omar to increase his allowance. omar refused and instead commissioned him to build a windmill for grinding grain.

Abu Lulua promised him that he would build him such a windmill that people would always talk about it. The way he said it made omar wonder whether he was being threatened and his fears proved correct.

A few days later Abu Lulua ambushed omar in the early hours of the morning and stabbed him in the stomach three times with a double-bladed dagger. One of these wounds was fatal and omar died three days.

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What rubbish ... Shias didnt exist during the prophets time .. so dont bulll [Edited Out].

1

Hz. Abu Lulu Feroz may Allah be pleased with him stabbed Umer for number of mentioned reasons in this thread. Whatever was the reason, he did a great job but bit late. I wish he had done this before Umer giving power to clan of bani Umayyah lanatullahs.

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(salam)

(bismillah)

áÏáíá ÇáÞÇØÚ Úáì ÅÓáÇã ÃÈí áÄáÄÉ ÝíÑæÒ ÑÖí Çááå Úäå ÈÓäÏò ÕÍíÍ

CLICK HERE TO READ

It will be great if somebody translate these sahih narrations into english.

I don't understand how that is proof, so he prayed Salaat al-Fajr in jamaa`ah? I don't think that is proof for him being a great guy. The ex-priests and ex-Rabbis who converted to Islam to promote their Jewish and Christian beliefs used to pray as well.

We are too busy worrying about Sunni narrations to prove his "greatness", why isn't there any SaHeeH Shee`ah narrations that proves his greatness? Majority of the narrations are narrated by the ghulaat (i.e. Muhammad b. Sinaan).

(salam)

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(salam)

(bismillah)

I don't understand how that is proof, so he prayed Salaat al-Fajr in jamaa`ah? I don't think that is proof for him being a great guy. The ex-priests and ex-Rabbis who converted to Islam to promote their Jewish and Christian beliefs used to pray as well.

We are too busy worrying about Sunni narrations to prove his "greatness", why isn't there any SaHeeH Shee`ah narrations that proves his greatness? Majority of the narrations are narrated by the ghulaat (i.e. Muhammad b. Sinaan).

(salam)

Brother, what does sunni say about Abu Lulu? ABU LULU AL-MAJOOSI!!! Have you ever seen any sunni saying that Abu Lulu accepted Islam, but he was munafiq, his true religion is majoos.

These sunni hadiths are proof against sunnis that he was muslim. Munafiq or mumin, it is the second part of discussion.

If he is a munafiq, where is the proof for it according Quran and sahih hadiths?

If he is muslim, why do they say Abu Lulu al-Majoosi?

Edited by master_ier

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(salam)

(bismillah)

Yes, exactly. According to them he was a munaafiq. In order to be a munaafiq you have to be a Muslim, and put on this fascade of being religious.

I am mainly saying, before praising Abu Lu'lu' so much, we should see if our A'immah have said anything about him. If they are silent about him, then that should give you our view of him.

(wasalam)

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Really interesting thread - Abu Lulu (ra) has my respect.

thats why we muslims wiped you out all over the muslim world

and thats the reason why youll soon be crushed in syria and

lebanon just like bahrain.

Edited by musab33

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Tough talk coming from the people who are officially US and israels b****

All you lot do is terrorise people with your umar worshipping cult.

You are no muslim. Dirty salafis are nothing but filth.

Bring it.

Edited by Yoda1

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thats why we muslims wiped you out all over the muslim world

and thats the reason why youll soon be crushed in syria and

lebanon just like bahrain.

You've done a pretty bad job considering that we have one of the ballsiest country as our heads (Iran), and that you haven't been able to do anything about use for the past 1400 years for us to keep coming back, face up to the truth Akhee, Shi'a Rawafidh just don't die ;)

Also if you believe ending those countries will be a good idea nice, because they're like literally the only support left to Palestine, while your Sunni countries go kiss the butts of US and Israel..

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I am mainly saying, before praising Abu Lu'lu' so much, we should see if our A'immah have said anything about him. If they are silent about him, then that should give you our view of him.

Not true. Being silent about something doesn't make it as a viewpoint.

Perhaps the Imams were in taqiyyah and were not really in positions to praise the killer of Umar al-Khattab? Abu Lulu didn't really do anything that would have been condemned by the Imams did he?

As far as I remember, we do have narrations of Imams promoting the killing of apostates and other misguided/deviant folks.

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Yoda1

Tough talk coming from the people who are officially US and israels b****

All you lot do is terrorise people with your umar worshipping cult.

You are no muslim. Dirty salafis are nothing but filth.

Bring it.

Ok lil girl stop chatting bs thats all u seem to do?

BY THE WAY

HERE IS YOUR HIZBOLLAH BUDDIES

YOUR WARRIORS THE MEN WHO WILL PROTECT YOU SHIITES.....................FROM KIDS AND WOMEN!!!

Hizbullah's rockets were meant to be used against Israel. Instead, it appears they are now being fired at Arabs. Syrian opposition forces say Hizbullah has been firing hundreds of rockets into Syria on a daily basis, and is a full participant in the Syrian civil war.

Speaking to Asharq Al-Awsat, Syrian opposition Local Coordination Committee-member, Mohamed al-Homsi, accused Hizbullah of "intervening in the fighting alongside the Syrian regime with all of its power," adding "Hizbullah is firing its rockets – the same rockets that it claims are to fight Israel – into Syrian territory to kill Syrian people."

Al-Homsi, who is a member of the Homs Local Coordination Committee, confirmed that "between 100 and 150 rockets and mortar shells are being fired by Hizbullah into the Syrian town of al-Qaseer and the surrounding villages on a daily basis, from the group"s military positions in Hermel [on the Syrian-Lebanese border]."

He told Asharq Al-Awsat "it has become clear that Hizbullah is taking part, with all of its strength, in this battle, which it considers itself to be a part of." He said the missile barrages were intensifying and that Iranian proxy militia has sent thousands of its troops into Syria to fight rebel forces.

The British Daily Telegraph has also published a report confirming that Hizbullah is launching rocket attacks into Syria. The report quoted a Lebanese resident of the border town of al-Qaa who said: "They are concentrating on hitting the villages where the Free Syrian Army are, to weaken them before launching a ground attack. I have seen the rockets firing they pass over your head.

There was an eyewitness account by a Telegraph reporter: "Driving across the Hermel plains of the northern Bekaa, 10 miles from the frontier with Syria, The Daily Telegraph could hear the sound of rocket fire. The salvoes came in waves – the dull thuds of the launchers shattering the stillness of the night air as they released their loads. Half an hour later, the tempo quickened to a near constant onslaught, filling the valley with the sounds of warfare until the early hours of the morning."

AND THEY TERRORISE AND KILL THEIR OWN MUSLIM BROTHERS I THOUGHT SHIA WERE THE ONES ALWAYS OPPRESSED???

LOL

Edited by Blacknight

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Mohammad-Ali E.

From Isfahan for CAIS

LONDON, (CAIS) -- The tomb of

Firuzan commonly known as Emāmādeh Abu-lolo (or Abu Lulu) in Kashahn, Isfahan province is being locked to visitors, it is announced there is a plan the shrine to be destroyed by the order of the Islamic Regime.

A large crowd of Iranians however, have gathered outside the governor's office on Tuesday, June 26
th
, to voice their objection regarding the closure and possible destruction of the Iranian heritage, and a shrine which was one of the symbols of Iranian resistance against the Arab invaders in 7
th
century CE, and to some, a Shia and a revered Sufi.

Umar al-Khattab, the second Moslem Caliph was put to death by Firuzan in 644 CE. It is said that Firuzan was a POW captured after the fall of Ctesiphon in what is today known as Iraq, and sold as a slave. A parvenu Arab leader called Mughira ibn Shu’ba bought him and took him to Medina in Arabia for slavery work.

Most probably Firuzan was a Zoroastrian (by some accounts he was a priest), as the majority of Iranian were at the time of Arab occupation of Iran in 7
th
century.

“His [Firuzan] action was in response to atrocities that were committed by Arab-Muslim invaders in Iran, which resulted in massacre, rape, looting of our country – we Iranians never forgot nor forgive their crimes against us”, said one of the protestors.

Some Arab, as well as committed Muslim historians, in order to undermine
’s bravery and heroism have claimed (ultimately all derived from Ibn Shihab account) that he murdered Umar after an argument over the tax levy.

During the Safavid era and the rise of Shia Islam to power, the dynasty named him Bābā Shojā ul-Din (
the one who is brave in the cause of religion
) and claimed that he was a devout Shia and a martyr.

Another angry protester said: "they say he is not buried here - or some say he wasn't Muslim at all - so what? - as far as we concern this edifice represents him, our faith and resistance against the uncivilised invaders" - and another one added: "if Abu Lolo was an Arab, they would have erect a golden dome on top of his shrine, rather than destroying it - but no, no - they destroy his shrine, just because he was an Iranian - a noble Iranian - this is an insult to Iranian nation".

Mohammad Salim Al'awa, the Secretary-General of the International Union for Muslim Scholars (IUMS), who believes God have "created women for pregnancy and childbirth" purposes speaking to Al-Arabiat New-agency said: "the request for its destruction was delivered to Iran by a group of Arab representatives a few months ago, after the Doha assembly at the beginning of the year. At the assembly a large number of Sunni scholars asked Iran for the total destruction of the tomb".

"Imagine the Germans asking Britain to destroy the graves of the brains behind the British plan to kill Hitler [Operation Foxley] during WWII, sine it is considered an insult to Protestants - would the British accept that? - the murder of Omar by Firuz[an] wasn't to do with religion, it was simply removing a despot and a tyrant from the face of the earth - as the British wanted to do the same with Hitler", said N. one of the protestors outside the governor's office in Kashan.

Firuzan mausoleum located on the road from Kashan to Fins, constructed in an eleventh century distinctive Persian-Khwarezmian dynastic architectural style, consisted of a courtyard, porch and conical dome decorated with turquoise coloured tiles, and painted ceilings. The Original date of it's construction is unknown, but in second-half of fourteen century it was fully restored and a new tombstone was placed over his grave.

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