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In the Name of God بسم الله

Shias believe in Incomplete quran.

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Iluv2XLR8

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I dont get it, how could u people call yerselfs muslims!

Allah says in the Quran that He has brought down this quran and He will protect it.

How do you deny that?

Shia claim : Present quran is 1/3 of the real one. Real one contains 18000+ ayats.

Whoa, thats worse than the Qadianis...

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there are sunni sahih hadith that talk about missing ayats, missing suras, etc. even pages of Qur'an being eaten by Aisha's goat, so they were not included in the Qur'an we have today. By accusing shias, you should also accuse sunnis, since they actually believe those hadith (to my knowledge most shias believe the Qur'an to be intact, complete, just out of order of revelation which ALL Muslims acknowledge as fact).

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Also xlr8, you acknowledge being salafi, and yet didn't deny AbdulHujjah's comments about salafis believing in the incompleteness of Qur'an... How can YOU call yourself a Muslim?

Beat me to it ^_^

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I want to ask you questions about this. Hope you will answer.

Have you ever heard a shia saying that the Quran is incomplete?

Have you ever seen a shia-website giving information that the Quran is incomplete?

Have you ever get your information about shi'sim from shia's, or do you get your information about shi'ism till now only from anti-shia's?

And who do you think knows more about shi'ism? Shia's themselfs, or anti-shia's?

I hope you will answer this questions.

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there are sunni sahih hadith that talk about missing ayats, missing suras, etc. even pages of Qur'an being eaten by Aisha's goat, so they were not included in the Qur'an we have today. By accusing shias, you should also accuse sunnis, since they actually believe those hadith (to my knowledge most shias believe the Qur'an to be intact, complete, just out of order of revelation which ALL Muslims acknowledge as fact

Wow again with the overwhelming proof (references).

Nah, take a look around, all shias believe the quran is incomplete.

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Wow your involved in this kufr too, at least mutah is not an article of faith, whether i do it or not doesnt matter, but deny the quran? ... tsk tsk

Are you on crack? (Mods, I meant that in a concerned way :))

They just said SUNNI Hadiths say Qur'an is incomplete.

Lay off the reefer, pal, it aint good for ya!

Wa Salaam,

Dhulfiqar

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Cihad, I think we ALL know the answer to that. especially since xlr8 (apologies if I'm mistaken on this, but I don't think I am) told me to check some link to that blasted kr-hcy website (which always reminds me of kfc for some reason :P ) which is NOTORIOUSLY anti-shia

Sorry bro poiuyt, couldn't pass up the opportunity to point it out... he's so quick to judge without looking in the mirror first.

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I dont get it, how could u people call yerselfs muslims!

Allah says in the Quran that He has brought down this quran and He will protect it.

How do you deny that?

Shia claim : Present quran is 1/3 of the real one. Real one contains 18000+ ayats.

Whoa, thats worse than the Qadianis...

(bismillah)

That's pure [Edited Out] and not true. Our imams all testified to the completeness and infallibility of the qur'an that we have today. The book that you are refering to which is 17 000 verses (not 18 000) is the Book of Fatima. The book of fatima is only a book of hadith about future events (calamities that will be fall on ahl ul bait etc..). They are hadith narrarated by Fatima (as) from what she heard of the prophet pbuh and Imam ali (as) wrote them down. It is a book which has been passed down from imam to imam and now it is imam mahdi (aj) that posesses it. This book has NOTHING to do with the qur'an!

Go repent to Allah(swt) for your slander and make duah that he accepts your repentence.

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That's pure [Edited Out] and not true. Our imams all testified to the completeness and infallibility of the qur'an that we have today. The book that you are refering to which is 17 000 verses (not 18 000) is the Book of Fatima. The book of fatima is only a book of hadith about the future and has nothing to do with the Qur'an.

Go repent to Allah(swt) for your slander and make duah that he accepts your repentence

No no, its the quran which is incomplete according to the shias, not the book of fatima.

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(bismillah)

Umar’s saying that the current Qur’an is incomplete:

In Sahih al Bukhari Volume 8, pages 209-210, we read this sermon delivered by Hadhrath Umar during his last Hajj as Khalifa:

"Certainly Allah sent Muhammad with the truth, and revealed to him the Book. One of the revelations which came to him was the verse of stoning. We read it and understood it”.

"The Messenger of God stoned and we stoned after him. I am concerned that if time goes on, someone may say, 'By God, we do not find the verse of stoning in the Book of God;' thus, the Muslims will deviate by neglecting a commandment the Almighty revealed.”

"Stoning is in the Book of God. It is the right punishment for a person who commits adultery if the required witnesses are available, or there was pregnancy without marriage or adultery is admitted."

Ayesha also testified to a ‘missing’ verse on stoning

“When the verses “Rajm” [stoning] and ayah “Rezah Kabir” descended, they were written on a piece of paper and kept under my pillow. Following the demise of Prophet Muhammad (S) a goat ate the piece of paper while we were mourning."

1. Sunan Ibne Majah, Volume 2, Page 39, Published Karachi.

2. Musnad Imam Ahmad, Volume 6, Page 269, Published Beirut.

3. Taweel Mukhtalif Al hadees, Page 310, Published Beirut

Suyuti also records the following words of Abdullah ibne Umar:

“No one can proclaim that I have found the Qur’an complete because most of the Qur’an has been lost”.“

Tafseer Durre Manthur” as-Suyuti Volume 1 page 104

Here is proof and part of it is from Bukhari and that is saheeh in salafi perspective, so you guys believe in tahreef, now thats kufr!!!

Salaama

Edited by Abdulhujjah
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That's pure [Edited Out] and not true. Our imams all testified to the completeness and infallibility of the qur'an that we have today. The book that you are refering to which is 17 000 verses (not 18 000) is the Book of Fatima. The book of fatima is only a book of hadith about the future and has nothing to do with the Qur'an.

Go repent to Allah(swt) for your slander and make duah that he accepts your repentence

No no, its the quran which is incomplete according to the shias, not the book of fatima.

Who is speaking of incompleteness ? The qur'an is complete and that's all. The book of fatima has nothing to do with the qur'an so there is nothing 'incomplete' here.

By the way I added some more info on my previous post so go up and read it.

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No no, the shia belief is strictly that the quran is incomplete and the real one with 17000 ayats is with the Mehdi...!

(bismillah)

Thanks for teaching us about shiis and their ways if it wasnt for you we would never know, I was just wondering what happened to the missing verses umar and ayesha talk about, especially the one her pert goat ate.

Salaaama

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Thanks brother Abdul Hujjah.

As I said, MOST shias believe in the completeness of Qur'an, and that it is protected by Allah (SWT). Now xlrh8, why not address those sahih hadith? Instead of just coming in here making accusations without a shred of proof to back it up. What one person may or may not have said in this forum is NOT proof.... unless you're now takin lessons from Said... which I would hope even you are above doing.

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by the way that sermon of Umar (ra) is not there. on pages 209-210. know what hadith number it is?

until then...how can you believe the quran is incomplete?

thats truly absurd! can anyone be worse than the qadians?

(bismillah)

Which version do you have ??

What happened to the missing quran verses mentioned by umar and ayesha ? :rolleyes:

salaama

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