Coffin Innovation? (Maybe)

[ILuvMuhammadSAW]

Ive seen these videos of Shias carrying Coffins based off, at least what it looks like, the 12 imams, and I'm worried this could be a Bid'a, any explanation? I'm doubtful this is rooted in Quran or reliable hadith.

[Abu Nur]

Yes it is innovation. 

[Abu Hassanain]

4 hours ago, Abu Nur said:

Yes it is innovation. 

Salam

@Abu Nur @ILuvMuhammadSAW

most of the scholars and when I say, Skylar, you, I mean the scholars of the world wide taqlid era being post the writing of methodology of the sincere and contemplation of laws written by the top scholars in Iran in Iraq and the Lady have a easy access to a massive sound of basic every day rollings where a lot more issues could be asked for a wider audience being the 50s and 60s

sayyid Muihsan Hakam Ra was asked about replica shrines, coffins flags ways of morning that seems musical and a number of other issues you responding with a very concise answer 

However, people mourn for Imam Hussayn as according to their culture is permissible

Now there are a handful of scholars who think this type of methodology is dangerous or I am not saying, but they have said, foolish or lack wisdom, but they are in the minority at this point

Now touching the cough in the replicas the flag for blessings holding them and saying oh Allah, give me by the right of such and such in of itself is not forbidden, but what the scholars have ruled is that if a person believes that is the actual coffin or that he is speaking to  Imam as specifically through the coffin or flag, and not in general speech in a session, then they consider this deviated or idolatry

I personally have kept keep the flag in my house if she’s a shirt and a stick it’s black for the morning days and green for the holidays
 

I have had a small box that was supposed to be a coffin for the 68 days before I touched the coffin and put my face on it out of respect at the morning gatherings 

When I go to, usually it’s indoor Indian or Pakistani centers where they have the large replica of the shrines I generally if I have it, we’ll leave something in charity and recite Ziyarah there and the food was rough will take some

The very interesting things is the gender rules. They do the coffins that represents males and the male side and the coffins represents females on a female side. There’s nothing wrong with it, but it’s just an interesting phenomenon. I had someone get very mad at me because I touched the coffin of. Sayyidana Fatimah as they started shouting you’re not related forbidden forbidden then I said no brother. I said my wife is from the holy family. She’s my mother-in-law. I can touch her coughing anytime I want and then he got shocked. He went to the two or three scholars that were there and started fighting them with.in Urdu Urdu, but they explained that all my position was right they didn’t like it though very interesting

The scholars that specifically and it’s a small group, extremely promote and encourage this, and even consider it a recommended act they based off the verse … respect the signs of Allah it is pity of hearts …. Difference instance consider you shouldn’t cast tell jokes horseplay in an area of the center of your house where these things are hosted.
 

I know at a certain center in Toronto known as Hussaynia passmore Eye, in many others have seen miracles in regards to these rooms

Once I was sleeping, my son was an infant. I heard crying so naturally I assumed he woke up. I went and I looked. My son was sleeping, but I went into the coffin room which randomly was connected to the apartment you caught through there to the women’s side to the men’s side in the morning, I was there a lecture for like five weeks anyway I go in the coffee room and the crying have been coming from the direction of the infant son of Imam Hussayn as replica coffin another night I had heard latimiyah in Arabic Farsi and Urdu and how loud chess meeting so I figured they’re having a morning gathering in the middle of the night next to my apartment wouldn’t surprise me in that location so I get up. I said I’m up. I might as well join them. I got up nobody was there.

Allah knows best but some of these matters they were not done by the 14 of themselves, but they’re not un permissible

For example, during the last month, none of the 14 gave a nightly speech and actually and that’s a long discussion about the history of the morning season, but we can piece together from several sources the exact way the fourth guide ram the programs he was continuously warning from the battle through the desert in the dungeon under house rest on the way back home and at home until the heads of the commanders were brought to him six years and 58 days later that’s a long discussion but my point here is we know he organized the programs a certain way and the programs were organized in a certain way after the midday prayers there were no warning or eulogy services in the evening. That is something we have done that was never done by the 14

We have some narrations that the eighth guide approved poetry if it was religious however we didn’t have specific gatherings for two or three hours of poetry are red then a speech

They’re also more of a problem with admirations that no poetry should be decided in the last month but we see a lot of poetry in the 19th 20th and 21

The Friday sermons of the holy prophet be some blessings on them. We’re about 10 to 20 minutes. Where is our Friday? Sermons tend to be 30 to 90 minutes

The list goes on, so in light of these kind of things, it gives a new appreciation understanding of the scope of culture and just allowable ie maurf and mubah 

wallahu Alam 

[ILuvMuhammadSAW]

10 hours ago, Abu Hassanain said:

Salam

@Abu Nur @ILuvMuhammadSAW

most of the scholars and when I say, Skylar, you, I mean the scholars of the world wide taqlid era being post the writing of methodology of the sincere and contemplation of laws written by the top scholars in Iran in Iraq and the Lady have a easy access to a massive sound of basic every day rollings where a lot more issues could be asked for a wider audience being the 50s and 60s

sayyid Muihsan Hakam Ra was asked about replica shrines, coffins flags ways of morning that seems musical and a number of other issues you responding with a very concise answer 

However, people mourn for Imam Hussayn as according to their culture is permissible

Now there are a handful of scholars who think this type of methodology is dangerous or I am not saying, but they have said, foolish or lack wisdom, but they are in the minority at this point

Now touching the cough in the replicas the flag for blessings holding them and saying oh Allah, give me by the right of such and such in of itself is not forbidden, but what the scholars have ruled is that if a person believes that is the actual coffin or that he is speaking to  Imam as specifically through the coffin or flag, and not in general speech in a session, then they consider this deviated or idolatry

I personally have kept keep the flag in my house if she’s a shirt and a stick it’s black for the morning days and green for the holidays
 

I have had a small box that was supposed to be a coffin for the 68 days before I touched the coffin and put my face on it out of respect at the morning gatherings 

When I go to, usually it’s indoor Indian or Pakistani centers where they have the large replica of the shrines I generally if I have it, we’ll leave something in charity and recite Ziyarah there and the food was rough will take some

The very interesting things is the gender rules. They do the coffins that represents males and the male side and the coffins represents females on a female side. There’s nothing wrong with it, but it’s just an interesting phenomenon. I had someone get very mad at me because I touched the coffin of. Sayyidana Fatimah as they started shouting you’re not related forbidden forbidden then I said no brother. I said my wife is from the holy family. She’s my mother-in-law. I can touch her coughing anytime I want and then he got shocked. He went to the two or three scholars that were there and started fighting them with.in Urdu Urdu, but they explained that all my position was right they didn’t like it though very interesting

The scholars that specifically and it’s a small group, extremely promote and encourage this, and even consider it a recommended act they based off the verse … respect the signs of Allah it is pity of hearts …. Difference instance consider you shouldn’t cast tell jokes horseplay in an area of the center of your house where these things are hosted.
 

I know at a certain center in Toronto known as Hussaynia passmore Eye, in many others have seen miracles in regards to these rooms

Once I was sleeping, my son was an infant. I heard crying so naturally I assumed he woke up. I went and I looked. My son was sleeping, but I went into the coffin room which randomly was connected to the apartment you caught through there to the women’s side to the men’s side in the morning, I was there a lecture for like five weeks anyway I go in the coffee room and the crying have been coming from the direction of the infant son of Imam Hussayn as replica coffin another night I had heard latimiyah in Arabic Farsi and Urdu and how loud chess meeting so I figured they’re having a morning gathering in the middle of the night next to my apartment wouldn’t surprise me in that location so I get up. I said I’m up. I might as well join them. I got up nobody was there.

Allah knows best but some of these matters they were not done by the 14 of themselves, but they’re not un permissible

For example, during the last month, none of the 14 gave a nightly speech and actually and that’s a long discussion about the history of the morning season, but we can piece together from several sources the exact way the fourth guide ram the programs he was continuously warning from the battle through the desert in the dungeon under house rest on the way back home and at home until the heads of the commanders were brought to him six years and 58 days later that’s a long discussion but my point here is we know he organized the programs a certain way and the programs were organized in a certain way after the midday prayers there were no warning or eulogy services in the evening. That is something we have done that was never done by the 14

We have some narrations that the eighth guide approved poetry if it was religious however we didn’t have specific gatherings for two or three hours of poetry are red then a speech

They’re also more of a problem with admirations that no poetry should be decided in the last month but we see a lot of poetry in the 19th 20th and 21

The Friday sermons of the holy prophet be some blessings on them. We’re about 10 to 20 minutes. Where is our Friday? Sermons tend to be 30 to 90 minutes

The list goes on, so in light of these kind of things, it gives a new appreciation understanding of the scope of culture and just allowable ie maurf and mubah 

wallahu Alam 

Respect for writing all that 

[Abu Nur]

17 hours ago, Abu Hassanain said:

However, people mourn for Imam Hussayn as according to their culture is permissible

Now there are a handful of scholars who think this type of methodology is dangerous or I am not saying, but they have said, foolish or lack wisdom, but they are in the minority at this point

 

Salaam Aleikum,

The only thing that came to my mind is that the act was never practiced by any Imams (عليه السلام) time till modern era, so it is innovation. It seems that it will go to same category of ways of mourning Imam Husain (عليه السلام) and then all kind of innovations can be introduced according to the person culture. But I understand that preventing this can be another innovation, because there is no limit or rule on how to mourn Imam Husain (عليه السلام).

Edited February 5 by Abu Nur

[Abu Hassanain]

8 hours ago, Abu Nur said:

Salaam Aleikum,

The only thing that came to my mind is that the act was never practiced by any Imams (عليه السلام) time till modern era, so it is innovation. It seems that it will go to same category of ways of mourning Imam Husain (عليه السلام) and then all kind of innovations can be introduced according to the person culture. But I understand that preventing this can be another innovation, because there is no limit or rule on how to mourn Imam Husain (عليه السلام).

salam

no your point is valid as well.

how should the night of ashura he spent? praying from maghraib til fajr, with amal than majalis after fajr. how many people will follow Imam Hussayn as and Abu Fadl Abbas as in that way other than tradtional ulama very few, same goes for what people do on the 15th of shaban and 23rd of Shahrul Ramadan. the promblem is the people can bare very little, so the ulama allow what keeps them on the bare minuimim deen, and busy away from nonsense and sin. 

wallahu alam