The fuzz of the angels amusing the children of the Imams

[In Gods Name]

Bismillah,

Salam.

In two authentic narrations in al-Kafi, the Imams are claimed to have said that angels descend on them, leave their fluff, and they use this fluff to amuse their children.

However, any particles of angels is still part of the angel, and is it not the case that angels are of the un-seen realm, and not the physical realm we see here - and that even so, nobody but a Prophet of God can see an angel? If an angels wind, or part of the wing, or fluff from a wing is broken this is still part of the angel is it not? How can such a matter of the unseen be visualised, as surely no part of an angel can be seen?

Is the difference between Imamah and Prophethood as per al-Kafi's and al-Kulayni's view not that Imams can hear and not see Prophets (as per his claim and compilation)?

Any argument or claim I make, I will reference with the Arabic, the English, and a reliable direct source you can verify 

 

2ـ مُحَمَّدُ بْنُ يَحْيَى عَنْ أَحْمَدَ بْنِ مُحَمَّدٍ عَنْ مُحَمَّدِ بْنِ خَالِدٍ عَنْ مُحَمَّدِ بْنِ الْقَاسِمِ عَنِ الْحُسَيْنِ بْنِ أَبِي الْعَلاءِ عَنْ أَبِي عَبْدِ الله (عَلَيْهِ السَّلام) قَالَ قَالَ يَا حُسَيْنُ وَضَرَبَ بِيَدِهِ إِلَى مَسَاوِرَ فِي الْبَيْتِ مَسَاوِرُ طَالَ مَا اتَّكَتْ عَلَيْهَا الْمَلائِكَةُ وَرُبَّمَا الْتَقَطْنَا مِنْ زَغَبِهَا.

2. Muhammad ibn Yahya has narrated from Ahmad ibn Muhammad from Muhammad ibn Khalid from Muhammad ibn al-Qasim from al-Husayn ibn abu al-‘Ala’ who has said the following. “Once Abu ‘Abdallah ((عليه السلام).) said, ‘O Husayn, tapping his hand on a cushion in the house, saying, ‘Cushions on which for a long time angels have been leaning and perhaps we pick up some of their fluff around.”

Al-Kāfi - Volume 1, The Angels come to the Houses of the Imams, Step on their Furnishings and Bring them News, Hadith #2

https://thaqalayn.net/hadith/1/4/97/2

 

3ـ مُحَمَّدٌ عَنْ أَحْمَدَ بْنِ مُحَمَّدٍ عَنْ عَلِيِّ بْنِ الْحَكَمِ قَالَ حَدَّثَنِي مَالِكُ بْنُ عَطِيَّةَ الاحْمَسِيُّ عَنْ أَبِي حَمْزَةَ الثُّمَالِيِّ قَالَ دَخَلْتُ عَلَى عَلِيِّ بن الحسين (عَلَيْهما السَّلام) فَاحْتُبِسْتُ فِي الدَّارِ سَاعَةً ثُمَّ دَخَلْتُ الْبَيْتَ وَهُوَ يَلْتَقِطُ شَيْئاً وَأَدْخَلَ يَدَهُ مِنْ وَرَاءِ السِّتْرِ فَنَاوَلَهُ مَنْ كَانَ فِي الْبَيْتِ فَقُلْتُ جُعِلْتُ فِدَاكَ هَذَا الَّذِي أَرَاكَ تَلْتَقِطُهُ أَيُّ شَيْ‏ءٍ هُوَ فَقَالَ فَضْلَةٌ مِنْ زَغَبِ الْمَلائِكَةِ نَجْمَعُهُ إِذَا خَلَّوْنَا نَجْعَلُهُ سَيْحاً لاوْلادِنَا فَقُلْتُ جُعِلْتُ فِدَاكَ وَإِنَّهُمْ لَيَأْتُونَكُمْ فَقَالَ يَا أَبَا حَمْزَةَ إِنَّهُمْ لَيُزَاحِمُونَّا عَلَى تُكَأَتِنَا.

3. Muhammad has narrated from Ahmad ibn Muhammad from Ali ibn al-Hakam who hassaaid that Malik ibn ‘Atiyya al-Ahmasi narrated to him from abu Hamza al-Thumali who has said the following. “Once I went to see Ali ibn al-Husayn ((عليه السلام).) and I became confounded in the room for an hour then I went inside the house while he was picking up things and would give to someone behind the curtain. I then said, may Allah take my soul in service for your cause, What was that thing that I saw you picking up?” The Imam ((عليه السلام).) said, “The fuzz from the angels when they come to meet us and we use it amuse our children.” I then said, may Allah take my soul in service for your cause, do they they come to you?” The Imam ((عليه السلام).) said, “O abu Hamza, they become crowded over our furnishings.”

Al-Kāfi - Volume 1, The Angels come to the Houses of the Imams, Step on their Furnishings and Bring them News, Hadith #3

https://thaqalayn.net/hadith/1/4/97/3

[In Gods Name]

5 minutes ago, In Gods Name said:

Muhammad ibn Khalid

If this is Muhammad ibn Khalid al-Barqi, despite him being a Thiqa narrator in himself as per many,  there are major question marks of this individual.

17 - محمد بن خالد، البرقي بن عبد الرحمان بن محمد بن علي، أبو عبد الله، مولى جرير بن عبد الله. حديثه يعرف وينكر. يروي عن الضعفاء كثيرا ويعتمد المراسيل. 

 Muḥammad b. Khālid al-Barqī b. ʿAbd al-Raḥmān b. Muḥammad b. ʿAlī, Abū ʿAbdillāh, client of Jarīr b. ʿAbdullāh.  His ḥadīth are recognized and denied.  He narrates a lot from the weak (narrators) and relies on the mursal traditions.

Kitāb al-Ḍuʿafāʾ, Muḥammad b. Khālid al-Barqī b. ʿAbd al-Raḥmān b. Muḥammad b. ʿAlī, Abū ʿAbdillāh, Hadith #1

https://thaqalayn.net/hadith/17/20/17/1

 

 

 

 

[Borntowitnesstruth]

5 hours ago, In Gods Name said:

Bismillah,

Salam.

In two authentic narrations in al-Kafi, the Imams are claimed to have said that angels descend on them, leave their fluff, and they use this fluff to amuse their children.

However, any particles of angels is still part of the angel, and is it not the case that angels are of the un-seen realm, and not the physical realm we see here - and that even so, nobody but a Prophet of God can see an angel? If an angels wind, or part of the wing, or fluff from a wing is broken this is still part of the angel is it not? How can such a matter of the unseen be visualised, as surely no part of an angel can be seen?

Is the difference between Imamah and Prophethood as per al-Kafi's and al-Kulayni's view not that Imams can hear and not see Prophets (as per his claim and compilation)?

Any argument or claim I make, I will reference with the Arabic, the English, and a reliable direct source you can verify 

 

2ـ مُحَمَّدُ بْنُ يَحْيَى عَنْ أَحْمَدَ بْنِ مُحَمَّدٍ عَنْ مُحَمَّدِ بْنِ خَالِدٍ عَنْ مُحَمَّدِ بْنِ الْقَاسِمِ عَنِ الْحُسَيْنِ بْنِ أَبِي الْعَلاءِ عَنْ أَبِي عَبْدِ الله (عَلَيْهِ السَّلام) قَالَ قَالَ يَا حُسَيْنُ وَضَرَبَ بِيَدِهِ إِلَى مَسَاوِرَ فِي الْبَيْتِ مَسَاوِرُ طَالَ مَا اتَّكَتْ عَلَيْهَا الْمَلائِكَةُ وَرُبَّمَا الْتَقَطْنَا مِنْ زَغَبِهَا.

2. Muhammad ibn Yahya has narrated from Ahmad ibn Muhammad from Muhammad ibn Khalid from Muhammad ibn al-Qasim from al-Husayn ibn abu al-‘Ala’ who has said the following. “Once Abu ‘Abdallah ((عليه السلام).) said, ‘O Husayn, tapping his hand on a cushion in the house, saying, ‘Cushions on which for a long time angels have been leaning and perhaps we pick up some of their fluff around.”

Al-Kāfi - Volume 1, The Angels come to the Houses of the Imams, Step on their Furnishings and Bring them News, Hadith #2

https://thaqalayn.net/hadith/1/4/97/2

 

3ـ مُحَمَّدٌ عَنْ أَحْمَدَ بْنِ مُحَمَّدٍ عَنْ عَلِيِّ بْنِ الْحَكَمِ قَالَ حَدَّثَنِي مَالِكُ بْنُ عَطِيَّةَ الاحْمَسِيُّ عَنْ أَبِي حَمْزَةَ الثُّمَالِيِّ قَالَ دَخَلْتُ عَلَى عَلِيِّ بن الحسين (عَلَيْهما السَّلام) فَاحْتُبِسْتُ فِي الدَّارِ سَاعَةً ثُمَّ دَخَلْتُ الْبَيْتَ وَهُوَ يَلْتَقِطُ شَيْئاً وَأَدْخَلَ يَدَهُ مِنْ وَرَاءِ السِّتْرِ فَنَاوَلَهُ مَنْ كَانَ فِي الْبَيْتِ فَقُلْتُ جُعِلْتُ فِدَاكَ هَذَا الَّذِي أَرَاكَ تَلْتَقِطُهُ أَيُّ شَيْ‏ءٍ هُوَ فَقَالَ فَضْلَةٌ مِنْ زَغَبِ الْمَلائِكَةِ نَجْمَعُهُ إِذَا خَلَّوْنَا نَجْعَلُهُ سَيْحاً لاوْلادِنَا فَقُلْتُ جُعِلْتُ فِدَاكَ وَإِنَّهُمْ لَيَأْتُونَكُمْ فَقَالَ يَا أَبَا حَمْزَةَ إِنَّهُمْ لَيُزَاحِمُونَّا عَلَى تُكَأَتِنَا.

3. Muhammad has narrated from Ahmad ibn Muhammad from Ali ibn al-Hakam who hassaaid that Malik ibn ‘Atiyya al-Ahmasi narrated to him from abu Hamza al-Thumali who has said the following. “Once I went to see Ali ibn al-Husayn ((عليه السلام).) and I became confounded in the room for an hour then I went inside the house while he was picking up things and would give to someone behind the curtain. I then said, may Allah take my soul in service for your cause, What was that thing that I saw you picking up?” The Imam ((عليه السلام).) said, “The fuzz from the angels when they come to meet us and we use it amuse our children.” I then said, may Allah take my soul in service for your cause, do they they come to you?” The Imam ((عليه السلام).) said, “O abu Hamza, they become crowded over our furnishings.”

Al-Kāfi - Volume 1, The Angels come to the Houses of the Imams, Step on their Furnishings and Bring them News, Hadith #3

https://thaqalayn.net/hadith/1/4/97/3

I bet there are narrations of both kind some of which say that imams can hear angels but not see it and other claiming that they can both see and hear them. 

Even so it is no that strange because there were people without being imam or Nabi to whom angels have met for example there is mention of angel giving good tidings to lady Maryam and mother of Prophet Musa (عليه السلام). Angels did not only communicated to only prophets.