Amid anger over Israel, Harris courts Arab and Muslim voters. Will it work?

[Lion of Shia]

 

Al Jazeera

 

Amid anger over Israel, Harris courts Arab and Muslim voters. Will it work?

Story by Ali Harb

 • 10h • 8 min read

 

 

Washington, DC – Despite touting her unwavering support for Israel as the country wages war in Gaza and Lebanon, Democratic presidential candidate Kamala Harris is trying to garner support in Arab and Muslim communities in the United States before elections next month.

In recent weeks, the US vice president and her team have held meetings with Arab and Muslim “community leaders” while receiving endorsements from Muslim individuals and groups aligned with her Democratic Party

 

 

But many advocates argue that as long as Harris maintains her pledge to continue to arm Israel and refuses to distance herself from President Joe Biden’s unconditional support for the US ally, nothing will help her standing with Arab and Muslim voters.

Moreover, critics have slammed the private meetings by Harris and her top national security adviser with handpicked attendees – whose identities are often not made public – as not representative of the communities her campaign says it is hoping to win over.

“Such groups and faceless individuals are mere tokens for the Democratic Party, paraded by Harris’s campaign to check off a box recommended by an algorithm — a strategy she maintained campaigning on trends and memes rather than impactful policy,” Laura Albast, a Palestinian American activist in the Washington, DC, area, told Al Jazeera.

She said the perception that voters would approve US-backed atrocities in Gaza and Lebanon because the person shaking Harris’s hand looked like them was “insanity”.

 

 

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Meetings

Harris’s push to reach out to Arab and Muslim voters comes as Israel’s military assaults on Gaza and Lebanon are escalating, heightening anger and anxiety in these communities just weeks before the November 5 elections.

For months, community members have urged the vice president to break from Biden and put conditions on US military aid to Israel to pressure the country to end its onslaught on the Gaza Strip.

But Harris has rebuffed those calls. In August, her campaign rejected pleas to allow a Palestinian American speaker at the Democratic National Convention in Chicago.

And this week, she joined Biden on a call with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu in which the US administration expressed “ironclad” support for Israel.

Harris met with Arab and Muslim advocates in Flint, north of Detroit, Michigan – a key battleground state with sizeable Arab communities – on Sunday. Days earlier, her top national security adviser held a similar meeting virtually.

 

 

 

 

Hussein Dabajeh, a Lebanese American political consultant in the Detroit area, decried the lack of transparency around such meetings.

He said the Harris campaign is “afraid” to have an open dialogue with representatives of the community, so it is reverting to behind-closed-doors discussions to appear like it is listening to Arab and Muslim Americans.

He stressed that the main audience for these meetings is not Arabs and Muslims but the broader electorate as the Democratic Party is trying to portray its candidate as inclusive and caring.

“It’s a meeting just to check off the headline. There’s no actual substance behind it,” Dabajeh told Al Jazeera.

“It’s unfortunate that the people meeting with them believe after one year of our people getting massacred that these fake meetings are still going to do it.”

The Biden administration and campaign – before he dropped out of the presidential race – also held similar meetings that failed to improve his standing among Arab and Muslim Americans or quell the outrage over his support for the war on Gaza.

 

 

 

The US provides Israel at least $3.8bn in military aid annually, and the Biden administration has authorised $14bn in further assistance to its ally to help fund the ongoing war.

‘Critical times’

One group that did attend the Flint meeting is Emgage, a Muslim American political advocacy group.

“Emgage Action called on Vice President Harris to do everything in her power, should she win, to end the war and reset US policy in the region,” the group said in a statement.

“Emgage Action also reiterated the organization and the Muslim community’s disappointment in the handling of the crisis that has endangered the well being of our communities at home and is now widening to a broader regional war.”

Deputy Wayne County Executive Assad Turfe, who lost family members during Israel’s 2006 war in Lebanon, also attended the meeting.

“I met with Vice President Harris and shared this deeply personal loss. I emphasized that we need her leadership now to help bring an end to the violence,” he wrote in a social media post. “I hope that her administration will take this call seriously and act swiftly to bring the much-needed relief and action that we all hope for.”

 

He said he brought up the issues of displaced people in Lebanon, the need for evacuating US citizens trapped in the country and immediate humanitarian aid.

“In these critical times, we may not all agree on strategy, but we must still work together and advocate to end this war and provide relief to the people of Lebanon and Gaza NOW! We must push for action that not only saves lives but restores hope and dignity to those who are suffering,” Turfe said.

Harris endorsement

Emgage raised many eyebrows late last month when it announced it was endorsing Harris’s bid for the White House – days into Israel’s devastating bombing campaign in Lebanon, which has already destroyed large parts of the country.

The group, which almost exclusively endorses Democrats and is led by figures who have worked in Democratic administrations, argued that the endorsement is rooted in preventing the Republican candidate, former President Donald Trump, from winning.

 

“This endorsement is not an agreement with Vice President Harris on all issues, but rather, an honest guidance to our voters regarding the difficult choice they confront at the ballot box,” it said in a statement.

Emgage also praised the Biden-Harris administration for appointing Muslim Americans to federal jobs.

But as the war rages in Gaza and people flee southern Lebanon amid a relentless Israeli bombardment supported by the Biden-Harris administration, some advocates see the nod of support for the vice president not only as misguided but also insulting.

Suehaila Amen, a community advocate in Michigan, had a scathing message for Emgage: “I’m disgusted by the fact that none of you have any dignity or honour, that the mass slaughter of Muslims on a global scale isn’t enough for you to hold your head up high.”

Michigan is home to a large Lebanese American population, tens of thousands of whom hail from Lebanon’s southern villages and towns that have been largely depopulated and decimated by the Israeli offensive

 

Emgage and two of its representatives did not return Al Jazeera’s repeated requests for comment on the criticism of the group’s position.

Amer Zahr, a Palestinian American activist and comedian, called the Emgage endorsement of Harris a “spit in the face of our community”.

“Emgage has announced that, as far as they are concerned, no amount of massacred Arab children is enough to abandon the Biden-Harris administration,” Zahr told Al Jazeera.

“According to Emgage, genocide is excusable in order to stay loyal to the Democratic ticket. Their statement openly and proudly states that securing federal appointments trumps repeated vetoes of ceasefire resolutions, proud declarations of Zionism and tens of thousands of Arab bodies under the rubble.”

Harris’s position

Separately from the Emgage endorsement, 25 Muslim imams and community figures – mostly from Georgia and the Washington, DC, area – penned a joint statement last week backing the vice president.

In the endorsement – first reported by NBC News – they credited Harris for speaking out against “the devastating loss of life in Gaza and the unfolding humanitarian crisis” . But the authors avoided any mention of the vice president’s support for the Israeli offensive, which they described as a “genocide”.

 

“When the war in Gaza began, she traveled and met with regional leaders and made clear that the US would pursue a two-state solution, and what reconstruction of Gaza would look like, she also made clear that international humanitarian law must be respected,” the statement said.

Several Biden administration officials have decried the suffering in Gaza.

For example, Secretary of State Antony Blinken said he sees his “own children” in the eyes of Palestinian children enduring displacement and bombardment.

Still, according to recent US media reports, Blinken defied assessments by various US officials when he certified that Israel was not blocking humanitarian aid to Gaza – a decision that allowed the US to continue to transfer arms to its ally.

And like Blinken, when talking about Palestinian pain, Harris uses passive voice about the atrocities in Gaza and avoids assigning responsibility to Israel.

 

Moreover, Harris often stresses that her support for Israel is “unwavering”. She has been part of an administration that has overseen unconditional support for the brutal war on Gaza, and recently, she welcomed Israeli escalation in Lebanon.

When asked recently what she would have done differently from Biden, Harris said “not a thing that comes to mind”, stressing that she has been part of the decision-making process at the White House on most important issues.

The Biden-Harris administration has vetoed three proposals at the United Nations Security Council that would have called for a ceasefire in Gaza.

This week, Harris described Iran – not Russia or China – as America’s “greatest adversary”, a position that further aligns her with the Netanyahu government.

‘Political agenda’

Given Harris’s record and the equally staunch support for Israel of her Republican rival, former President Donald Trump, as well as his anti-immigrant rhetoric, many Arab and Muslim voters feel frustrated with the two-party political system in the US.

On Monday, the Abandon Harris campaign, a Michigan-based Muslim group that says it aims to hold the Democratic administration “accountable for the Gaza genocide”, endorsed Green Party candidate Jill Stein for president.

 

“Our movement remains dedicated to ensuring that the American people, especially the Muslim-American community, recognize the responsibility we share in standing up against oppression and using all our power to stop genocide — wherever it may arise,” the group said in a statement.

“On the precipice of the election, we endorse Jill Stein.”

Stein has virtually no chance of winning the presidency, but she has seen a surge of support in Arab and Muslim communities, according to recent polls, in part due to her advocacy for Palestinian rights.

Trump has also seen his numbers improve in Arab and Muslim communities, and last month, he was endorsed by the Yemeni American mayor of Hamtramck, a Muslim-majority city in southeast Michigan.

 

As the election nears, recent campaigning has sparked debates about the representation and priorities of Arab and Muslim communities in the US, whose members share similar cultures and religious practices but are not a monolith.

“We unequivocally condemn those from our community who continue to exploit the blood of Arab people for their political agenda,” the American-Arab Anti-Discrimination Committee said in a statement on Sunday.

“This includes individuals and organizations from our community that are in lock-step with the Democratic and Republican parties, putting party over community, politics over justice, and overlooking a genocide for access.”

[mahmood8726]

Hopefully not, may Allah(سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) curse her and put her in jahannam eternally. 

If she stops, I hope no one is stupid enough to forgive her, she commited a heinous crime. 

[Abu Hadi]

Question: Will it work ? 

Answer: No

She might get a few naive or completely assimilated to vote for her. The vast majority won't. 

[Abu Nur]

As long these Muslims are liberalist then it will work.

[Abu Hadi]

There are two states where we will be able to tell, Michigan and Minnesota. Both are swing states and could decide the election. Both have large Muslim populations which traditionally vote democrat, which is why Biden won in 2020, a large part of the reason. If Harris loses those states, that means it didn't work. If she wins those states, that means it did. I don't she will win either one. 

As Muslims in the US, we don't have enough votes to elect a president but I think we have enough votes to make a presidential candidate lose. 

There are alot of Muslims in California, New York, and Texas but these are not swing states. California and New York always go democrat and Texas always goes Republican. 

Edited October 12 by Abu Hadi

[Diaz]

If Muslims people in the us votes for this terrorist or the other terrorist orange, then they should be ashamed of themselves. 

[Diaz]

25 minutes ago, Abu Hadi said:

swing states

What is this? 

 

25 minutes ago, Abu Hadi said:

Both have large Muslim populations which traditionally vote democrat, which is why Biden won in 2020, a large part of the reason. If Harris loses those states, that means it didn't work. If she wins those states, that means it did. I don't she will win either one

In Michigan, out of 10 million people, only 250k are Muslims. So if the majority people of Michigan vote for her but Muslims don’t, then she will still win. 

[Abu Hadi]

4 hours ago, Diaz said:

What is this? 

 

In Michigan, out of 10 million people, only 250k are Muslims. So if the majority people of Michigan vote for her but Muslims don’t, then she will still win. 

Swing states means the state is divided about 50 / 50. approx 50% are republicans and 50% democrats. 

So in those states, even a small population can make a huge difference. In the US system, it is not the candidate who gets the most votes that wins. It is a stupid system called the electoral college where each state has a certain number of votes based on its population, the larger the population, the more electoral college votes the state has. So whichever candidates gets more votes in the state gets ALL the states electoral college votes. So Michigan has 15 electoral college votes and a population of 10 million people. So say Trump gets 5 million votes and harris gets 5,000,001 votes. Harris would get all 15 electoral college votes. You need 270 electoral college votes to win the presidency. Again, it's a stupid system that was made up 250 years ago when people had to ride on horses to vote. 

In a state with a 50/50 split, 270k votes can swing it one way or the other. Since in this election I think most will not vote, that means Trump gets the advantage since in a normal year those votes would have went to a democratic candidate. 

Also, Minnesota is also a 50/50 split and it has 10 electoral votes. So an extra 25 electoral votes for Trump could decide the election in his favor. 

Edited October 12 by Abu Hadi

[mahmood8726]

I hope the democrats win, so blue maga realise how naive they were, once america greenlights Israel to use a nuke under kamala admin. 

[Abu Hadi]

Also, this current election cycle and the genocide in Gaza completely changed the thinking of Muslims in Michigan and other states with regards to presidential elections. Before these events, Muslims in these states would generally use the principle of 'least harm' and most would vote based on this. The ulema also used to encourage us to do this. They encouraged the Muslims to vote and use the principle, i.e. vote for the one you think will do the least harm in general and the least harm to the Muslim Ummah. They said this and also that in a 'Democratic' system if you don't vote, you have not voice and as Muslims we should have a voice in shaping policy so therefore we should vote. I agree with them on this except that now we are put in an impossible situation. We don't know which candidate will do 'least harm' so we can't use this principle. 

Genocide Joe completely destroyed this calculation. Most Muslims voted for Biden in 2020 based on this principle because Trump was threatening to attack Iran and start WWIII. What ended up happening with Biden was much, much worse than any of us could have imagined or calculated based on this principle. Harris stood by his side and supported him and the genocide thru all of this and is up to this day supporting the genocide because she is even refusing to consider even a temporary ban on sending weapons to the Zionists. Again, many Muslims from Michigan who are active in the Democratic party (I don't know why tbh) have pleaded with her to support a temporary ban so that they could get her some votes. She refused to even discuss it which means she is the same as BIden on the issue. The Muslims in Michigan who supported the Democratic party wanted something, some kind of hope they could bring back to Michigan so that the people would vote. Harris gave them absolutely nothing. 

As Norman Finkelstein said in his latest interview, 'She is a laughing cow' and nothing else. She is a prop for those who support settler colonialism. I believe Finkelstein is one of the most significant and brave intellectual voices of our time. 

 

Now, in 2024, Muslims in the US (the vast majority) are not using this principle anymore because it didn't work last time. I think the vast majority will not vote and the ones who vote will probably vote for Jill Stein of the Green Party. 

I am not saying none will vote for Harris, but I have talked to many brothers and sisters who live in Michigan about this issue. Not one of them said they would vote for Harris or Trump. 

Edited October 13 by Abu Hadi

[mahmood8726]

@Abu Hadi A lot of these scholars need to rethink their mentality, I have even met some scholars like this in real life and it's the same argument.

 

this argument is flawed to begin with. Choosing a lesser of two evils during an election is enabling evil. Let me ask people this question, if you had to vote between yazid(la) and saddam hussein, who would you vote for? None, because if you voted for one of them, Allah(سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) will not be pleased with you. So why is it when you have to vote between the democrats or Republicans, who both are guilty of butchering hundreds of thousands of children for decades, it suddenly becomes a thing of lesser than two evils? Is it because the democrats are politicians who are promising you things and you beleived them? Are the democrats who push the lgbt agenda down your childrens throats that better? They're that better than Republicans who are racist and rude to you? 

 

Even if they were better for muslims in america, let's say they're 10x better for muslims in america, so what? What about the muslims in the world? What about the children muslim or non muslim in the world? What are you guys going to tell them? Genuine question for all the democrats here, when the dead child tells you what wrong he or she commited what are you going to tell them in yawm al qiyamah? Voting for biden is like giving bay3a for saddam hussein, I want people to understand how serious this is.

 

A system, where the government can be this evil, without having to be overthrown, is a flawed system that you should not participate in. The American system has allowed psychopaths to rule for decades, it's a flawed system, don't enable it.

Edited October 13 by mahmood8726

[AbdusSibtayn]

1 hour ago, Abu Hadi said:

I don't know why tbh)

Because loaves and fishes. 

Or their 'Islam' is only skin-deep. 

10 minutes ago, mahmood8726 said:

Genuine question for all the democrats here,

They are not going to respond. 

[Diaz]

10 hours ago, mahmood8726 said:

I hope the democrats win, so blue maga realise how naive they were, once america greenlights Israel to use a nuke under kamala admin. 

Did you see the prediction made by ME spectator? I do believe trump might win in this election. 
 

 

34 minutes ago, mahmood8726 said:

@Abu Hadi A lot of these scholars need to rethink their mentality, I have even met some scholars like this in real life and it's the same argument.

 

this argument is flawed to begin with. Choosing a lesser of two evils during an election is enabling evil. Let me ask people this question, if you had to vote between yazid(la) and saddam hussein, who would you vote for? None, because if you voted for one of them, Allah(سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) will not be pleased with you. So why is it when you have to vote between the democrats or Republicans, who both are guilty of butchering hundreds of thousands of children for decades, it suddenly becomes a thing of lesser than two evils? Is it because the democrats are politicians who are promising you things and you beleived them? Are the democrats who push the lgbt agenda down your childrens throats that better? They're that better than Republicans who are racist and rude to you? 

 

Even if they were better for muslims in america, let's say they're 10x better for muslims in america, so what? What about the muslims in the world? What about the children muslim or non muslim in the world? What are you guys going to tell them? Genuine question for all the democrats here, when the dead child tells you what wrong he or she commited what are you going to tell them in yawm al qiyamah? Voting for biden is like giving bay3a for saddam hussein, I want people to understand how serious this is.

 

A system, where the government can be this evil, without having to be overthrown, is a flawed system that you should not participate in. The American system has allowed psychopaths to rule for decades, it's a flawed system, don't enable it.

That’s what I told to some of my friends and my relatives who lives in usa to think about. If I was American I will vote for Jill stein even if she will not win because next election we can prove to the Americans that a change can happen, we must have courage to do it. But keep on voting for terrorist because we believe one of them is lesser evil than the other? Everyone thought Biden is less evil than trump but now look what that terrorist Biden did. 

[Abu Hadi]

1 hour ago, mahmood8726 said:

@Abu Hadi A lot of these scholars need to rethink their mentality, I have even met some scholars like this in real life and it's the same argument.

 

 

Even if they were better for muslims in america, let's say they're 10x better for muslims in america, so what? What about the muslims in the world? What about the children muslim or non muslim in the world? What are you guys going to tell them? Genuine question for all the democrats here, when the dead child tells you what wrong he or she commited what are you going to tell them in yawm al qiyamah? Voting for biden is like giving bay3a for saddam hussein, I want people to understand how serious this is.

I am not a democrat but I will argue for their case and I feel it is an argument that has some merit, although I don't agree with it 100%. 

Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) will hold us accountable for our actions based on the information we have at the time we act. What do I mean by that. This requires further explaination

In 2020, you had two men running for president. Trump, who was and is a genocidal racist and Islamophobe and he strait out said he was on many occasions. To see the occasions, you can look back at the threads from that time. Any Muslim with an ounce of self respect and dignity is not going to vote for him and will try their best to make sure he is not elected. Then there was Biden, as it turns out now a genocidal racist and Islamophobe BUT (and this is the big 'but') we didn't know that at the time. Prior to October 7, 2023 (after the election of 2020). Yes, he made statements in the past that he is a Zionist, but he was vice president to Obama and Obama was, I think, the least Zionist of all the recent US Presidents. Although Obama was still a Zionist in his policies, he wasn't 100% on board with the Zionist, settler - colonial agenda like Trump obviously was. He kept a little distance between himself and the Zionist lobby and this was well known in Washington. 

At the time, we (Muslims) didn't want Trump to win and Biden seemed like the only way to stop that from happening. We voted based on the information we had at the time. Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) does not hold us accountable for information or knowledge that we don't have. If anyone votes for Biden or Harris in 2024, based on the information that we have now, i.e. they are both genocidal racists and Islamophobes, then they are doing a major sin and will be held accountable before Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى). This was not the case in 2020. 

Yes, a case could be made that 'Well they're all the same and you(you all) should have known that and you were being naive in voting for Biden in 2020', yes, you could say that. I am not saying that argument has no merit but at the same time, there are a few politicians in Washington who are not genocidal racists, like Bernie Sanders and Rashida Tlaib. I think even there are some like Ocasio Cortez (AOC) who are not racists but they are opportunists trapped in the system and if the wind were to shift in the other direction they would go with it. I think if we saw someone like Sanders or Tlaib make it to the level of Presidential candidate (like Sanders did in 2016) then we should support them. If we don't support them then the system will never change and Muslims will be trapped under a genocidal racist government for a long, long time. I think we should vote based on the facts on the ground we have at the time of the election. If we cant determine with a fair amount of certainty that there is a candidate who will be good for Muslims and the Ummah or at least be less harmful than the other one, we should vote for them but only if we can build a case and be 'fairly certain'. 

That doesn't apply in this election and I think going forward the Muslims and the ulema will be alot more careful before they endorse a candidate based on the principle of 'least harm'. 

Edited October 13 by Abu Hadi

[mahmood8726]

1 hour ago, Abu Hadi said:

I am not a democrat but I will argue for their case and I feel it is an argument that has some merit, although I don't agree with it 100%. 

I know you're not, my arguments are only against the people who make such arguments.

1 hour ago, Abu Hadi said:

Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) will hold us accountable for our actions based on the information we have at the time we act. What do I mean by that. This requires further explaination

In 2020, you had two men running for president. Trump, who was and is a genocidal racist and Islamophobe and he strait out said he was on many occasions. To see the occasions, you can look back at the threads from that time. Any Muslim with an ounce of self respect and dignity is not going to vote for him and will try their best to make sure he is not elected. Then there was Biden, as it turns out now a genocidal racist and Islamophobe BUT (and this is the big 'but') we didn't know that at the time. Prior to October 7, 2023 (after the election of 2020). Yes, he made statements in the past that he is a Zionist, but he was vice president to Obama and Obama was, I think, the least Zionist of all the recent US Presidents. Although Obama was still a Zionist in his policies, he wasn't 100% on board with the Zionist, settler - colonial agenda like Trump obviously was. He kept a little distance between himself and the Zionist lobby and this was well known in Washington. 

Biden, the democrats, Obama, were known to be genocidal warhawks for decades now, how democrats could not see how genocidal the democrats were after their savage barbaric sanctions on poor countries, their brutal wars in lybia, Syria, etc... the continuation the policies of Bush in Iraq and Afghanistan, is beyond me. But now they know, it is what it is.

 

Obama was 100% a zionist, this is all political theatrics, Obama is the same guy who made sure the iron dome was in top shape, Obama was the same guy who made sure Israel received 3.8 billion$ a year. Obama was the same guy who supported Israel during it's genocidal war on Gaza in 2014. All these words of condemnation and America withholding 2000lbs bombs from israel for a month, means nothing. This means as much as the UN saying "bad Israel, bad". Democrats are just more subtle with their support to Israel, that's it. The democrats they fund terrorists in Syria and destabilize israels enemies, it all leads to the same path, Israel being more powerful and triumphant.

 

You need to understand something. You need to remeber what sayed hassan nassrallah said. He said America is controlled by a trinity: oil companies, millitary industrial complex and christian zionism. Now add a fourth one, tech companies.

These 4 run America, not the democrats, not the Republicans. It's this 4 class of corporations/people.

1 hour ago, Abu Hadi said:

there are a few politicians in Washington who are not genocidal racists, like Bernie Sanders and Rashida Tlaib. I think even there are some like Ocasio Cortez (AOC) who are not racists but they are opportunists trapped in the system and if the wind were to shift in the other direction they would go with it. I think if we saw someone like Sanders or Tlaib make it to the level of Presidential candidate (like Sanders did in 2016) then we should support them. If we don't support them then the system will never change and Muslims will be trapped under a genocidal racist government for a long, long time. I think we should vote based on the facts on the ground we have at the time of the election. If we cant determine with a fair amount of certainty that there is a candidate who will be good for Muslims and the Ummah or at least be less harmful than the other one, we should vote for them but only if we can build a case and be 'fairly certain'. 

Beleive me my friend, Bernie is not as innocent as you think he is, he has pandered to warhawks before, just not with Iraq or Israel. As for the squad, they alternated with eachother to give Israel billions just like in 2021 for example. Other than AOC who danced and mocked anti war protestors, the rest of the squad I don't know if they are evil or just trapped in the system. Either way, their biggest mistake was thinking they could change the system.

In america you will never change the system from within, unless you get rid of these massive corporations who have a huge grip on America's policies. 

It's why Jill stein or Ron Paul, will never become president, it's impossible, it's like breaking the rules of physics, if they win, they will be smeared on TV, impeached, imprisoned or get a "heart attack". I hate to disappoint you, but you will never have an anti war president in America as long as these corporations have this much grip. You guys are being played with and fooled into thinking you have a choice with these pre selected lunatics.

Edited October 13 by mahmood8726

[Abu Hadi]

3 hours ago, mahmood8726 said:

I know you're not, my arguments are only against the people who make such arguments.

Biden, the democrats, Obama, were known to be genocidal warhawks for decades now, how democrats could not see how genocidal the democrats were after their savage barbaric sanctions on poor countries, their brutal wars in lybia, Syria, etc... the continuation the policies of Bush in Iraq and Afghanistan, is beyond me. But now they know, it is what it is.

 

Obama was 100% a zionist, this is all political theatrics, Obama is the same guy who made sure the iron dome was in top shape, Obama was the same guy who made sure Israel received 3.8 billion$ a year. Obama was the same guy who supported Israel during it's genocidal war on Gaza in 2014. All these words of condemnation and America withholding 2000lbs bombs from israel for a month, means nothing. This means as much as the UN saying "bad Israel, bad". Democrats are just more subtle with their support to Israel, that's it. The democrats they fund terrorists in Syria and destabilize israels enemies, it all leads to the same path, Israel being more powerful and triumphant.

 

You need to understand something. You need to remeber what sayed hassan nassrallah said. He said America is controlled by a trinity: oil companies, millitary industrial complex and christian zionism. Now add a fourth one, tech companies.

These 4 run America, not the democrats, not the Republicans. It's this 4 class of corporations/people.

Beleive me my friend, Bernie is not as innocent as you think he is, he has pandered to warhawks before, just not with Iraq or Israel. As for the squad, they alternated with eachother to give Israel billions just like in 2021 for example. Other than AOC who danced and mocked anti war protestors, the rest of the squad I don't know if they are evil or just trapped in the system. Either way, their biggest mistake was thinking they could change the system.

In america you will never change the system from within, unless you get rid of these massive corporations who have a huge grip on America's policies. 

It's why Jill stein or Ron Paul, will never become president, it's impossible, it's like breaking the rules of physics, if they win, they will be smeared on TV, impeached, imprisoned or get a "heart attack". I hate to disappoint you, but you will never have an anti war president in America as long as these corporations have this much grip. You guys are being played with and fooled into thinking you have a choice with these pre selected lunatics.

I would be interested in hearing your counter to the statement that 'We (as Muslims) need to vote and if we don't vote we are giving away our rights that were given to us under the system'. Obviously, as Muslims it is problematic to voluntarily give up your rights. If every choice is bad, the logical conclusion would be to not vote, but then we're giving up our rights. Quite a paradox. 

BTW, I want to vote. The only candidate running for president that I could vote for is Jill Stein. At the same time, here is her rally in the middle of Dearborn, which is 75% Muslim, in the middle of a genocide, right before the election. The rally has about 100 people. So ? Houston we have a problem. At the same time, I support the brothers who put this together and I'm glad they did it. 

 

Edited October 13 by Abu Hadi

[mahmood8726]

2 hours ago, Abu Hadi said:

I would be interested in hearing your counter to the statement that 'We (as Muslims) need to vote and if we don't vote we are giving away our rights that were given to us under the system'. Obviously, as Muslims it is problematic to voluntarily give up your rights. If every choice is bad, the logical conclusion would be to not vote, but then we're giving up our rights. Quite a paradox. 

Democrats would remove our rights in other ways by pushing their lgbt indoctrination into our children. They even plan on making homeschooling illegal so your children grow up on this stuff. Republicans surprisingly aren't pushing anti hijab laws because they don't subscribe to the french secular system, however they still hate Islam and will still try and find some way to opress Muslims. Both parties will eventually cause Muslims to distance themselves from their religions.

 

In 2016 they said trump would cause muslims to loose their rights and nothing happened. I argue in the future both parties will be intrested in removing muslim rights.

 

But lets say hypothetically democrats love muslims and will even allow us to have our own islamic courts and sharia in dearbon and they will go against the constitution to give us extra rights. Theyre still treating muslims outside america like trash, they're butchering them. The islamic question would be, should you still vote for such a person? Is this islamic? 

2 hours ago, Abu Hadi said:

BTW, I want to vote. The only candidate running for president that I could vote for is Jill Stein. At the same time, here is her rally in the middle of Dearborn, which is 75% Muslim, in the middle of a genocide, right before the election. The rally has about 100 people. So ? Houston we have a problem. At the same time, I support the brothers who put this together and I'm glad they did it. 

 

I reckon most muslims are voting for no one, as in voting but leaving the papers white as a form of protest.

Voting for Jill stein is no diffirent, she will not become president, but by voting for Jill stein, you're saying "I don't support child killers", that's about it. As I said, America will never allow any president that goes against their 4 big that I mentionned. Even Trump, he's a genocidal pro Israeli, but on Syria he tried pulling out and it angered the people with intrest, so he got attcked on TV as a racist, etc... even though almost all american politicians are genocidal racists. Point is, even with people like Trump whom they have a 90% grip on, they still go crazy on him, imagine Jill stein who isn't under their control at all.

[Guest Psi]

I have a confession to make that I still regret even to this day. I voted for Biden during the Biden vs Trump election for President 2020.

I was too naive and relied on a false sense of hope thinking that voting for Biden would be the lesser of two evils compared to Trump who killed Qassem Soleimani that I’ve come to respect after traveling to Iran for the Umrah of Imam Ali Reza (عليه السلام).

I knew the situation was looking like I either vote/support for Muawiyah ibn Abu Sufyan or Yazid ibn Muawiyah as the Caliph/Leader of USA thinking that Biden could be persuaded like JFK to some extent for the people to not let US Tax Dollars go towards funding Israel and instead give the American People the option to invest their Tax Dollars on Healthcare, Infrastructure, and eliminating Poverty.

Just like how Biden is portrayed as having blood on his hands, so do the voters who voted for him.

I am no exception. I have the blood of children on my hands. Regret and Depression is my state of being. So I do what I can finding legit Charity Organizations that goes towards helping the children of Gaza. I do contribute donating at least a $100 on local Muslim store that has the charity box option to donate to Palestinian people where their family could use that money to send to their family in Gaza and The West Bank.

I don’t expect to be forgiven by Allah. So I don’t even pretend to believe that I’ll be forgiven by Allah. I deserve eternal hellfire. I deserve shame. I deserve regret.

I’m just asking and praying to Allah to grant me the death penalty of a Muslim Murtad for what have I done for my first time voting in the US.

I’ve learned my lesson though the way I’ve learned it is harsh and brutal. Voting/Choosing for the lesser of two evils no matter what the excuse is still evil. Hence I’m not wasting my time anymore voting in the US.

[mahmood8726]

https://t.me/warfareanalysis/94346

 

Can anyone confirm where this clip is from? I can't beleive I advocated for Jill stein as an anti zionist if that's what her real opinion is.

 

How old is this clip and what context is this?

[Lion of Shia]

Speaking of Jill Stein,there is new message going out from Harris Supporters saying a vote for stein is a vote for trump,and its rumored she cost  Hilary Clinton the election in 2016 because of votes for her.

[mahmood8726]

22 minutes ago, Lion of Shia said:

Speaking of Jill Stein,there is new message going out from Harris Supporters saying a vote for stein is a vote for trump,and its rumored she cost  Hilary Clinton the election in 2016 because of votes for her.

I should've stuck to telling people to leave the voting papers blank, instead of advocating for what's potentionally another zionist gatekeeper like Jill stein...

 

Also hillary? 

She's the worst of the worst, I hate her more than I even hate Trump, she's a horrible woman. She's responsible for so much mayhem and deaths in this world, I don't understand why people voted for her, is it because she was a woman? Is that how dumb people are? 

Hillary and her husband Bill "ah like them young" Clinton are some of the worst up there.

Edited October 17 by mahmood8726

[mahmood8726]

By the way speaking of Harris, here is what she has to say about yehya sinwar:

 

[Diaz]

16 minutes ago, Lion of Shia said:

Speaking of Jill Stein,there is new message going out from Harris Supporters saying a vote for stein is a vote for trump,and its rumored she cost  Hilary Clinton the election in 2016 because of votes for her.

 

1 minute ago, mahmood8726 said:

should've stuck to telling people to leave the voting papers blank, instead of advocating for what's potentionally another zionist gatekeeper like Jill stein...

If this is real then I hope Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) curse her eternally. Like seriously I really did respect her and I didn’t feel she is a bad person. Just looking at Kamala or Hillary’s face, we can see the evilness in them, but for Jill, she look like a good person. 
 

3 minutes ago, mahmood8726 said:

don't understand why people voted for her, is it because she was a woman? Is that how dumb people are? 

Because she is democrat, look at Kamala, she is dump yet many people will vote for her. 

[Abu Nur]

USA will bring all to justice who threaten americans

And God will bring all Americans to Justice who killed and threatened innocent people.

[Abu Nur]

On 10/14/2024 at 3:12 AM, Guest Psi said:

I have a confession to make that I still regret even to this day. I voted for Biden during the Biden vs Trump election for President 2020.

I was too naive and relied on a false sense of hope thinking that voting for Biden would be the lesser of two evils compared to Trump who killed Qassem Soleimani that I’ve come to respect after traveling to Iran for the Umrah of Imam Ali Reza (عليه السلام).

I knew the situation was looking like I either vote/support for Muawiyah ibn Abu Sufyan or Yazid ibn Muawiyah as the Caliph/Leader of USA thinking that Biden could be persuaded like JFK to some extent for the people to not let US Tax Dollars go towards funding Israel and instead give the American People the option to invest their Tax Dollars on Healthcare, Infrastructure, and eliminating Poverty.

Just like how Biden is portrayed as having blood on his hands, so do the voters who voted for him.

I am no exception. I have the blood of children on my hands. Regret and Depression is my state of being. So I do what I can finding legit Charity Organizations that goes towards helping the children of Gaza. I do contribute donating at least a $100 on local Muslim store that has the charity box option to donate to Palestinian people where their family could use that money to send to their family in Gaza and The West Bank.

I don’t expect to be forgiven by Allah. So I don’t even pretend to believe that I’ll be forgiven by Allah. I deserve eternal hellfire. I deserve shame. I deserve regret.

I’m just asking and praying to Allah to grant me the death penalty of a Muslim Murtad for what have I done for my first time voting in the US.

I’ve learned my lesson though the way I’ve learned it is harsh and brutal. Voting/Choosing for the lesser of two evils no matter what the excuse is still evil. Hence I’m not wasting my time anymore voting in the US.

Repent and never vote for anyone anymore in US. Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) is Forbearance and Merciful and He (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) will forgive a sincere repenter.

[Diaz]

On 10/14/2024 at 3:12 AM, Guest Psi said:

have a confession to make that I still regret even to this day. I voted for Biden during the Biden vs Trump election for President 2020.

I understand brother/sisters, many people voted for Biden because they thought trump is more evil specially when he made Jerusalem the capital of israhell. So many Muslims votes for Biden becaus they wanted to get rid of trump. Now I’m sure many Muslims won’t vote for both of them because they are all evil.

[realizm]

Curse be on that masquerade democracy. They created letters for every sexual orientation but you only have two parties in the elections.

 

[ireallywannaknow]

9 hours ago, mahmood8726 said:

https://t.me/warfareanalysis/94346

 

Can anyone confirm where this clip is from? I can't beleive I advocated for Jill stein as an anti zionist if that's what her real opinion is.

 

How old is this clip and what context is this?

Not surprised. I knew there was a reason I just could not stomach backing or trusting her despite some in my circle who were really cheering for her. It's because there is no such thing as a true anti Zionist in American politics. They don't allow that kind of kink in the system. There are only liberal leftist Zionists or hardcore right-wing Zionists. I'm glad this clip is out now before the election so Muslims know some of her true face and can make a more informed decision. 

[Diaz]

2 hours ago, ireallywannaknow said:

Not surprised. I knew there was a reason I just could not stomach backing or trusting her despite some in my circle who were really cheering for her. It's because there is no such thing as a true anti Zionist in American politics. They don't allow that kind of kink in the system. There are only liberal leftist Zionists or hardcore right-wing Zionists. I'm glad this clip is out now before the election so Muslims know some of her true face and can make a more informed decision. 

No one is taking about this video except us and the people who saw the video. Still there are many people who didn’t see the video. I think it’s better if we start spreading it.