I admire the Islamic attitude on dogs

[Daran]

Americans, especially white Americans are dog crazy. They let dogs in the house, they let them in their beds, they let them lick their faces. My neighbors have 3 dogs that go crazy every time I step outside my house. I complained to them about this. They told me "the dogs wouldn't bark if you weren't in the driveway". My own driveway. I later learned that one of the dog had bitten multiple people and was going to be put down until they "saved" it. There are many cases in America of dogs mauling people and even killing them, and people try to save the dog. I am sure a lot of muslims like dogs, but I don't think the culture allows the dog worship you see in the US and elsewhere. 

Just look at this. Imagine letting a dog tear up your house and thinking it's cute.Insanity. https://youtu.be/-bueUljGJ2M

I understand cats are well regarded in islamic societies. I like that.

[Quran313]

I'm surprised when I see how people are crazy about dogs in US. One american said:" I give organic food to my dog". I asked her:" Do you eat organic grocery yourself?". She said:" No".

I have a headache every time I want to rent an apt/house just to make sure it's pet free housing. Islamic reason on purity is one thing, and lots of bacteria and filthy germs is another thing.

[Diaz]

3 hours ago, Quran313 said:

One american said:" I give organic food to my dog". I asked her:" Do you eat organic grocery yourself?". She said:" No".

Sorry but this made me laugh 

[Daran]

3 hours ago, Quran313 said:

I'm surprised when I see how people are crazy about dogs in US. One american said:" I give organic food to my dog". I asked her:" Do you eat organic grocery yourself?". She said:" No".

I have a headache every time I want to rent an apt/house just to make sure it's pet free housing. Islamic reason on purity is one thing, and lots of bacteria and filthy germs is another thing.

Exactly. They're gross and aggressive and LOUD. The barking is the worst sound on earth. Rentals often have trouble banning animals because "emotional support animals" are protected federally. People will buy violent thug breeds like pitbulls and have them even where they are banned and they get to keep them because they got a letter from a psychologist saying it's for emotional support

[AbdusSibtayn]

This dog craze, to the point that they are eating out of the same vessels as their dogs and sleeping in the same beds with them, is a relatively recent thing. 

If you look far enough back in time the dogs used to have their separate kennels, or atleast live outside the living space. Notice how in Tom and Jerry, the dog Spike has his own kennel outside the house in the lawn. 

Islam allows dogs for guarding and herding purposes (provided one takes care of the purity issues); make no mistake, I love dogs a lot  and have raised two dogs myself, but what the OP has described above is criminal neglect and a disaster waiting to happen. As with all domestic animals, dogs need discipline. They are pack animals. They crave leadership. If you are not firm with the dog, it'll assume the dominant/ leadership role and then there's no going back. 

Particularly with large breeds like the bullies, the rotts, dobermans and gsd, you need firm handling. It is the height of ignorance to say 'aLL dOgS aRe tHe sAmE'; no! They are NOT the same! The dogs bred to be guard dogs, like Pitbulls, Rottweilers, German Shepherds and Dobermans,for example, in particular have a more aggressive temperament and need special training and upbringing geared to their nature. They are NOT the same as poodles, Labradors or Golden Retrievers. This is another reason why there are so many mauling cases these days- irresponsible owners who bring home puppies but have no idea how to raise them right. The resul is such tragedies taking place. If you have one of these animals on your property, it's practically the same as a loaded firearm at the end of your leash. I believe that owning a dog should be licensed/regulated just like owning weapons. 

[Son of Placid]

Dogs are taking the place of children in the west. People spend hours of their day taking dogs for walks. Imagine clipping your dog so it can wear a coat and booties. 
I remember seeing a news clip, someone selling Halloween costumes for dogs because; "Dogs are people too". A dogs life is worth more than a human these days.
I know a lady had a business called "The pampered pooch", a dog clothing store. I'd never even go in to such a store.
Most ridiculous thing I've seen is a Chihuahua in a stroller wearing Harley Davidson black leather everything. People spend thousands on puppies and thousands more making them fur babies for life.
God's plan for dogs was to serve, not be served.

[Daran]

Yeah. I am listening to my neighbors dogs bark and screech as I type this. It is worth saying an American from like 1970 would be disgusted with this as well

[PureExistence1]

Salaam everyone,

Im about a month back from a trip to iran. Was there for 33 days...stayed at 2 very nice hotel/apartments. Had never stayed in such a type of place before.

Anyhow, i was floored when i came down to breakfast and saw that the hotel not only allowed peole to stay there with their dogs, but that they allowed the person to bring their dog to breakfast with them and let them sit on their lap at the table, with their head able to reach their plate.

 Businesses and people in iran are in bad hardship due to sanctions so maybe some places are making exceptions just to get the business, but seriously? The sag/dog should stay in the room-not be allowed in the food/eating area.

I just hope they have alotted specific rooms to pets and that they dont just let guests with dogs in every and any room...wont be staying there again if that is the case.

The main issue here i think is the dark hole people fall into where they believe everything the west does is MoDeRn and therefore progressive and good, where if someone uses their aql just a little, they will arrive at the fallacy of that thinking.

This dog situation is WAAAAY outta control..especially the way some people give their dogs higher standing and importance to the dogs than to humans...try dealing with one of these dog owners who insists their dog is "under voice command" when youre on a hiking trail, yet the dog comes running right up to you and you have no clue whether it is friendly or not...the owners get all bent out of shape when you say anything to them about it...as if its ok their dog (and them by virtue of being the owner) have basically assaulted you.

Legal definition of assault in US law:

What is the legal definition of an assault?

 

Assault is generally defined as an intentional act that puts another person in reasonable apprehension of imminent harmful or offensive contact.

 

Its an act of negligence to allow a dog to run loose off leash when the owner darn well knows it doesnt listen to them. Negligence is a legal term. If the dog is known to have bitten before, it turns into recklessness which is a much more severe offense.

 

La illaha illah lah....

[Daran]

2 hours ago, PureExistence1 said:

Salaam everyone,

Im about a month back from a trip to iran. Was there for 33 days...stayed at 2 very nice hotel/apartments. Had never stayed in such a type of place before.

Anyhow, i was floored when i came down to breakfast and saw that the hotel not only allowed peole to stay there with their dogs, but that they allowed the person to bring their dog to breakfast with them and let them sit on their lap at the table, with their head able to reach their plate.

That is unbelievable. I never would have imagined that in iran

[Abu Nur]

On 3/28/2023 at 10:19 PM, Daran said:

Americans, especially white Americans are dog crazy. They let dogs in the house, they let them in their beds, they let them lick their faces. My neighbors have 3 dogs that go crazy every time I step outside my house. I complained to them about this. They told me "the dogs wouldn't bark if you weren't in the driveway". My own driveway. I later learned that one of the dog had bitten multiple people and was going to be put down until they "saved" it. There are many cases in America of dogs mauling people and even killing them, and people try to save the dog. I am sure a lot of muslims like dogs, but I don't think the culture allows the dog worship you see in the US and elsewhere. 

Just look at this. Imagine letting a dog tear up your house and thinking it's cute.Insanity. https://youtu.be/-bueUljGJ2M

I understand cats are well regarded in islamic societies. I like that.

I don't mind the dogs being loved and taking care for those who live with western values, but my concern is really the public area, specially in our living area where majority have dogs and you will find their pee and poop everywhere in the streets (they do have their own place in forest to do these things). It is disgusting in the winter where you can clearly see them shining. The owner of the block of flats have actually complained about it, this means many people complain about it, but still the dog owners don't listen and care.

Edited March 29 by Abu Nur

[rkazmi33]

What is the Islamic rule about people, who are labeled as dogs? That incident from Rajab khayat, in which he was riding a bus and he could see that most people in the bus were indeed animals. My community is inspired by that incident and they have labeled people as dogs or cats. That's why they don't want to keep me in their houses although I am offering to pay rent. Some people are labeled as cats and they get more respect than me but even they are told to stay out of house. I think they just feel angry about the special treatment of dogs and they thought they will take out frustration by labeling people as dogs and mistreating them. 

Edited March 30 by rkazmi33

[Quran313]

6 hours ago, Daran said:

That is unbelievable. I never would have imagined that in iran

It is illegal to bring dogs in public areas in Iran, but some people don't care. It's upsetting. In the hotel example that the other user mentioned, such hotel owners think they have high hotel standards just because they allow dogs in their hotels like some hotels in western countries. I hate this mentality.

I would have called police and report the hotel to the police. They close such places for a while (making them to lose money as punishment).

[PureExistence1]

On 3/29/2023 at 11:16 PM, Quran313 said:

I would have called police and report the hotel to the police. They close such places for a while (making them to lose money as punishment).

Wow, i had no idea it was illegal! 

And youre right, there are actually parks in north tehran that are becoming known as "dog parks", one of them a few blocks off of one of the busiest streets..

This time we were there, there were 2 incidences where we had to avoid poop on the sidewalks...it was surprising to me cuz we had never encountered that before. Ive been there 3 times in last 6 years and I can see its getting worse with more dog owners walking their dogs, everything from foo foo dogs to golden retrievers and german shepherds..the one at the hotel was a little foo foo type dog that did a lot of barking when it was in the hotel room..

 I dont know how the situation can be dealt with. Its sad to see it turning more and more bi-haya and secular:(

[AbdusSibtayn]

13 hours ago, Daran said:

Yeah. I am listening to my neighbors dogs bark and screech as I type this. It is worth saying an American from like 1970 would be disgusted with this as well

 

12 hours ago, PureExistence1 said:

Salaam everyone,

Im about a month back from a trip to iran. Was there for 33 days...stayed at 2 very nice hotel/apartments. Had never stayed in such a type of place before.

Anyhow, i was floored when i came down to breakfast and saw that the hotel not only allowed peole to stay there with their dogs, but that they allowed the person to bring their dog to breakfast with them and let them sit on their lap at the table, with their head able to reach their plate.

 Businesses and people in iran are in bad hardship due to sanctions so maybe some places are making exceptions just to get the business, but seriously? The sag/dog should stay in the room-not be allowed in the food/eating area.

I just hope they have alotted specific rooms to pets and that they dont just let guests with dogs in every and any room...wont be staying there again if that is the case.

The main issue here i think is the dark hole people fall into where they believe everything the west does is MoDeRn and therefore progressive and good, where if someone uses their aql just a little, they will arrive at the fallacy of that thinking.

This dog situation is WAAAAY outta control..especially the way some people give their dogs higher standing and importance to the dogs than to humans...try dealing with one of these dog owners who insists their dog is "under voice command" when youre on a hiking trail, yet the dog comes running right up to you and you have no clue whether it is friendly or not...the owners get all bent out of shape when you say anything to them about it...as if its ok their dog (and them by virtue of being the owner) have basically assaulted you.

Legal definition of assault in US law:

What is the legal definition of an assault?

 

Assault is generally defined as an intentional act that puts another person in reasonable apprehension of imminent harmful or offensive contact.

 

Its an act of negligence to allow a dog to run loose off leash when the owner darn well knows it doesnt listen to them. Negligence is a legal term. If the dog is known to have bitten before, it turns into recklessness which is a much more severe offense.

 

La illaha illah lah....

 

10 hours ago, Abu Nur said:

I don't mind the dogs being loved and taking care for those who live with western values, but my concern is really the public area, specially in our living area where majority have dogs and you will find their pee and poop everywhere in the streets (they do have their own place in forest to do these things). It is disgusting in the winter where you can clearly see them shining. The owner of the block of flats have actually complained about it, this means many people complain about it, but still the dog owners don't listen and care.

If only people began sueing these loonies they'd listen more. Trust me. We need to engage good lawyers and once the mailman comes knocking at their door with the legal notice it'll hammer some sense into them. Someone has to bell the cat. 

Yeah, your dog might be your 'baby', but not everyone is comfortable around dogs. They have to be forced to take responsibility for their animals. 

Edited March 30 by AbdusSibtayn

[Mightyspunge]

Unpopular Opinion,

I love dogs first of all and second the only aspect of pet ownership islam is against is the fact that people take dogs instead of kids which is an issue. I often see people use Islam as some excuse to hate dogs, I have seen Muslims kill dogs for the sake of Islam supposedly, and personally know people who literally jump on stools when a dog enters a room. First this is ridiculous and dogs are a creation of Allah. Dogs are man’s best friend when raised correctly and really amazing animals. I would look into the Hadith where this hatred of dogs come from, the context that is occurred in anyway…unless you choose to believe these nonsensical things it’s fine.

[PureExistence1]

On 4/14/2023 at 2:33 PM, Mightyspunge said:

Unpopular Opinion,

I love dogs first of all and second the only aspect of pet ownership islam is against is the fact that people take dogs instead of kids which is an issue. I often see people use Islam as some excuse to hate dogs, I have seen Muslims kill dogs for the sake of Islam supposedly, and personally know people who literally jump on stools when a dog enters a room. First this is ridiculous and dogs are a creation of Allah. Dogs are man’s best friend when raised correctly and really amazing animals. I would look into the Hadith where this hatred of dogs come from, the context that is occurred in anyway…unless you choose to believe these nonsensical things it’s fine.

Salaam, maliciously killing or abusing any animal is wrong and is a condemned act. Those people are clearly in the wrong and something is wrong in their heart and soul to engage in such a behavior.

As far as people jumping on stools, i dont know about others, but i will do whatever i can to avoid my clothes being licked by a dog cuz that means I now need to de-najisify my clothes before i can pray in them, which creates a WHOOOOOLE fiasco i don't want to have to deal with...it isnt the dog per say, it is getting contaminated in a way that makes life harder for me...going home to change is not always an option, neither is washing the area that was licked.

And my family has a dog-hes a golden retriever named Charlie.. he doesn't come in my detached building, doesn't lick me, and knows to stay down and dont jump on me. I love Charlie and hes a lot of fun...fun when im out on the farm and under circumstances where the sharia isnt violated or overlooked. And i wash appropriately after playing or engaging with him.

There are clean ways to interact with dogs and then there are the ways most secular people interact. Islam wants us to be clean.

[Ashvazdanghe]

On 3/30/2023 at 3:44 AM, rkazmi33 said:

What is the Islamic rule about people, who are labeled as dogs? That incident from Rajab khayat, in which he was riding a bus and he could see that most people in the bus were indeed animals. My community is inspired by that incident and they have labeled people as dogs or cats. That's why they don't want to keep me in their houses although I am offering to pay rent. Some people are labeled as cats and they get more respect than me but even they are told to stay out of house. I think they just feel angry about the special treatment of dogs and they thought they will take out frustration by labeling people as dogs and mistreating them. 

Salam at first it's a false story about him which such labeling of people is not Islamic at all although people likewise Rajab Ali khayat (رضي الله عنه) has this ability but he has not mentioned it publicly also he never labeled anyone as dog or cat or etc .

Quote

His head and ears shake a lot. I say Rajab Ali's cousin, she fell in love with her cousin . He is in love with the young cousin of  who was a simple worker in a tailor's shop and had little income and little beauty and little reputation among the people. She had fallen in love with him badly. As she was willing to give everything and reach herlove.
Rajab Ali, a believer and one who observes halal and haram, didn't like this daughter of his aunt much, but he didn't crazy in his love over her either.
The lover daughter's aunt was seeking for an an opportunity to reach his taste and make Rajab Ali guilty and finally reach his connection. And this opportunity was provided!
On the day when Rajab Ali's mother had cooked Nazri food and put some of the Nazri in a dish and gave it to Rajab Ali to take to his aunt. Rajab Ali arrived at his aunt's house and knocked on the door. daughter's Aunt's voice was raised: "Who?" And he said: "I am, Rajab Ali" and he heard the voice of his daughter's aunt saying: "Come inside Rajab Ali, your aunt is there too."

 

Rajab Ali entered and greeted his aunt and suddenly he realized that there was no news of his aunt and that the daughter's aunt was alone at home! When he came to himself, he saw that the door of the house was locked behind him and so was his daughter's aunt.

 

He said to himself: "Rajba Ali! Allah can test you many times, come try Allah  once! And for God's sake, give up this ready and enjoyable haram." So he meditated and offered before God: "Allah! I leave this sin because of your pleasure, you also educate me for yourself.
And he escaped from that house through the window and returned to his house to rest.
He woke up in the morning and went out of the house to go to the sewing shop, and to his surprise, he saw that the street was full of domestic and wild animals?!
Yes! Rajab Ali's purgatory eyes were opened as a result of renouncing a present and ready and apparently delicious sin, and this renouncing became the beginning of the spiritual ascent of "Sheikh Rajab Ali Khayat" until he attained the highest spiritual positions.

https://tabnakbato.ir/fa/news/133552/چشم-برزخی-شیخ-رجبعلی-خیاط-پس-از-فرار-از-شیطان-عکس

God's grace to Sheikh Rajab Ali Khayat to save a starving dog that was dying

God's grace to Sheikh Rajab Ali Khayat to save a starving dog that was dying
In short, one of Sheikh Rajab Ali's friends used to tell  that while he was passing through an alley, he saw a dog lying down and several puppies clinging to her to drink milk, but the mother was so hungry that she did not have any milk. That person quickly takes a few kebab skewers and pours them in front of the animal, because of this action, Allah gives him special care. Apparently, that person was Mr. Sheikh.
The story of one of Sheikh Rajab Ali Khayat's friends relates that: One day the Sheikh said to this gentleman: A person was passing through one of the old alleys of Tehran, and suddenly his eyes fell on a dog with several cubs in the stream(aqueduct). The cubs attacked the mother's breast, but the mother was unable to breastfeed due to extreme hunger and suffered from this situation. He immediately went to the kebab shop in the same alley and bought some kebab skewers and poured it in front of dog... At dawn that night, Allah Almighty gave that person an unspeakable favor. The narrator of this story adds: Although the sheikh did not say who that person was, the evidence showed that it was him.
Messages 1. Sincerity in any action is acceptable to Allah, even if it is in the form of helping an animal.
2. Having mercy on Allah's creations, causes Allah'ss mercy to the person himself.
The source : love chemistry
Written by Mohammad Mohammadi Rishahri
Publisher of the publishing organization

http://pajuhesh.irc.ir/product/note/show/id/10479

[Diaz]

Is shooting at for fun animals haram? And what about hunters who shoot at birds? How can they sell it as halal if the way how they got killed is haram?

[Haji 2003]

2 hours ago, Diaz said:

Is shooting at for fun animals haram? And what about hunters who shoot at birds? How can they sell it as halal if the way how they got killed is haram?

In India, my relatives would go out to shoot (partly for sport) and bring the kill home to eat. And in Pakistan relatives who live in Lahore go out to shoot wild hogs (as a means of pest control).

[notme]

Killing animals that are directly dangerous or an infestation is allowed. Other than that, as I understand it, hunting is only allowed for food animals. 

I like dogs, and don't want to see them abused or neglected, but it's ridiculous when people take their dogs (or any pet or livestock) as the same as children. I'm glad hotels exist where pets are allowed, because sometimes people have to travel with their animals, but I'm glad there are also ones that don't allow animals. 

Everywhere that I've lived, it is illegal for a dog owner to leave the solid waste on the ground in public. They are required to bag it up and carry it away, under penalty of a fine.  

[realizm]

On 3/28/2023 at 2:19 PM, Daran said:

Just look at this. Imagine letting a dog tear up your house and thinking it's cute.Insanity. https://youtu.be/-bueUljGJ2M

First comment on YouTube : 'whoever dis this is a genius'. 

Average Shia : 'Guy is cooking breakfast and touched the dog's mouth, making his hand and the whole food and kitchen appliances najis'

[PureExistence1]

1 hour ago, realizm said:

First comment on YouTube : 'whoever dis this is a genius'. 

Average Shia : 'Guy is cooking breakfast and touched the dog's mouth, making his hand and the whole food and kitchen appliances najis'

 

Lol...its sad but people in general have no sense of cleanliness and cross contamination...even after 3 years of a pandemic and all the sanitizing and safety measures we all had to deal with...ugh.

And what makes matters worse is there seems to be a disconnect within the muslim ummah that its not shoes per say that are the problem, its the dirtiness of the bottom of the shoes, but what we VERY often see is, someone walks into the masjid and takes their shoes off, puts them in the shoe rack, and then walks all over the place they just walked in their shoes on, and then go into the prayer Hall where we all prostrate with their same dirty socks they just walked all over the entryway with...the same entryway that everyone was walking all over with with their shoes.... Shoes that have been all over the ground outside where there's been dog poop, bird poop, people spitting on the ground, pretty much every kind of najasat and bacteria exist....Like, they don't understand that they just walked into the entryway with their shoes on. They then took their shoes off, and walked all over the same entryway in their socks essentially mopping up the filth, and then walked into the prayer Hall in those same socks. And then let their kids run around all over outside in their socks and then come back in the masjid

Cleanliness is such a huge issue in islam. And our cleanliness or lack thereof affects our spirituality but i think most people dont know, dont care, or dont take it seriously.

[Diaz]

6 hours ago, Haji 2003 said:

my relatives would go out to shoot (partly for sport) and bring the kill home to eat

Is that haram? How can someone shoot an animal and then eat it? Doesn’t look like halal to me. 

 

6 hours ago, Haji 2003 said:

And in Pakistan relatives who live in Lahore go out to shoot wild hogs (as a means of pest control).

Never seen a hogs in my life. If they are dangerous to humans then I think that’s permissible. 

[realizm]

On 4/15/2023 at 5:37 PM, PureExistence1 said:

Lol...its sad but people in general have no sense of cleanliness and cross contamination...even after 3 years of a pandemic and all the sanitizing and safety measures we all had to deal with...ugh.

And what makes matters worse is there seems to be a disconnect within the muslim ummah that its not shoes per say that are the problem, its the dirtiness of the bottom of the shoes, but what we VERY often see is, someone walks into the masjid and takes their shoes off, puts them in the shoe rack, and then walks all over the place they just walked in their shoes on, and then go into the prayer Hall where we all prostrate with their same dirty socks they just walked all over the entryway with...the same entryway that everyone was walking all over with with their shoes.... Shoes that have been all over the ground outside where there's been dog poop, bird poop, people spitting on the ground, pretty much every kind of najasat and bacteria exist....Like, they don't understand that they just walked into the entryway with their shoes on. They then took their shoes off, and walked all over the same entryway in their socks essentially mopping up the filth, and then walked into the prayer Hall in those same socks. And then let their kids run around all over outside in their socks and then come back in the masjid

Cleanliness is such a huge issue in islam. And our cleanliness or lack thereof affects our spirituality but i think most people dont know, dont care, or dont take it seriously.

I even saw people wearing shalwar qamis barefoot in the toilet area make wudu, and then walk to the prayer hall. 

Since then, I stopped looking at where people step when I enter the mosque, otherwise I would not go back. 

[PureExistence1]

On 4/15/2023 at 11:01 PM, realizm said:

I even saw people wearing shalwar qamis barefoot in the toilet area make wudu, and then walk to the prayer hall. 

Since then, I stopped looking at where people step when I enter the mosque, otherwise I would not go back. 

My husbands seen this too..

-.-

I dont know why the molaunas dont make speeches about it or at least spend 15 minutes teaching people. 

My husband says if he had his way, he'd mention it in a few lectures and post rules, then tell everyone that if anyone is caught doing it,then theyre suspended from the masjid for 2 weeks. (Theres only 1 shia masjids in our area so its not like there are other options for them to go to)

[Quran313]

Speaking of the masjid, there are a lot of problems in the communities. Some people not doing Wudu right, some doing Sajdah without turbah when their kids take it and go(I asked Shaikh to teach people about it), etc.

One thing that makes me deeply sad is that I feel there's a competition among some community members for the stage and microphone to be seen. One told me come and see me on the stage. Some won't show up at regular masjid programs unless they come to the stage and talk. I mean do some people do those stuff for God or to be seen and attention from people? It makes me upset.

Edited April 16 by Quran313

[Ashvazdanghe]

15 hours ago, Diaz said:

Is shooting at for fun animals haram? And what about hunters who shoot at birds? How can they sell it as halal if the way how they got killed is haram?

Salam shooting animals for fun is Haram which if someone travels for fun hunting so therefore he must pays his Namaz/Salah in full  which only exception is fun fishing i anyway if he hunts halal meat animals so then he can eat halal meat which if they goes to hunting just for earning a living so therfore hunting will be Halal so therefore they can sell hunted Halal meat of animals which have Halal meat.

Quote

"Exclusive polling of Hadana site from the office of Grand Ayatollah Khamenei"

Question: Is it permissible to hunt birds and animals for entertainment? If it is not permissible, should the prayer be read in full or broken?

Answer: It is not permissible to hunt for fun.
When traveling to hunt animals for fun and entertainment, the traveler's prayer is complete.

 

Quote

Hazrat Ayatollah Makarem Shirazi
entertainment and illegal hunting:

If hunting is for fun and enjoyment (even if they eat its meat), then it is forbidden by Sharia law.

 

Lahvi and haram hunting [rules of hunting]
Question: What is meant by Shikar Lahavi?
Answer: It means that they go to hunt animals for fun and not for earning a living. This is a sin and traveling is forbidden. But hunting fish is not included in this ruling.

 

Quote

According to the opinion of Ayatollah Sistani

Question 2: What is the criterion for catching fish for fun? Is fishing for fun Lahvi or not?

Answer: It is recreational fishing that is done only for fun, but there is nothing wrong with it, the only specific ruling is that the prayer must be completed during the journey for which it is intended.

Question 5: What is the ruling on hunting if someone does not really need  meat?
Answer: It is permissible.

Source: Hedana site, taken from Ayatollah Grand Ayatollah Sistani's polls.

 

Quote

Question
292- Is it permissible to hunt birds and animals for fun? If it is not permissible, should the prayer be read in full or broken?
Response:
If he goes hunting to have fun, his prayer is complete and he must fasts, and if he goes hunting to earn a living, his journey is permissible and his prayer is broken, and if he goes to earn more money and increase wealth, he also breaks the prayer And read it full But he should not fast.
Source: Hedana website, taken from the Fatwas of Grand Ayatollah Shabiri Zanjani.

https://hadana.ir/حکم-شکار-تفریحی/

[rkazmi33]

Islam puts great emphasis on cleanliness but there's a difference between cleanliness and OCD. I have noticed that so many people have in fact OCD, but they are proud of their obsession instead of acknowledging they might have a disorder. They make Islam difficult for themselves and others. Islam is not the same as Japanese culture. Having an OCD is unhealthy behaviour, not something you can humble brag about. 

Secondly, we are all sinful people. Allah has given us some shortcuts like going to masjid or ziarat. I used to go to masjid a lot and I always felt spiritual benefit. People have forbidden me from going to masjid, not that they are standing with a gun outside masjid but people staring at me and scrutinizing my behavior. Gradually, I stopped going completely. I feel that people from corporate world, when they become religious, they take their bad habits to masjid. Just like in corporate world, people sabotage others to get ahead and they are rewarded with raises and promotions, they act like religion is also a competition and they can only get ahead by making other less religious. Please give some credit to Allah. He is not like your corporate bosses. He wants ALL of us to become religious. And He wants us to help others become more religious, not less religious. 

Third thing is that while doing amar bil maroof and nahi anil munkir, we have to protect the dignity of a person. There are conditions for doing amar bil maroof and nahi anil munkir and no one talks about these conditions. When you are recruiting your scholar to Shame people for their cleanliness in front of hundreds of people, you are NOT protecting their dignity. 

[Diaz]

6 hours ago, Ashvazdanghe said:

Salam shooting animals for fun is Haram which if someone travels for fun hunting so therefore he must pays his Namaz/Salah in full  which only exception is fun fishing i anyway if he hunts halal meat animals so then he can eat halal meat which if they goes to hunting just for earning a living so therfore hunting will be Halal so therefore they can sell hunted Halal meat of animals which have Halal meat.

So that means it’s permissible to shoot animals like cow and goat with a gun if we want to eat them? 

[Son of Placid]

5 hours ago, Ashvazdanghe said:

Salam shooting animals for fun is Haram which if someone travels for fun hunting so therefore he must pays his Namaz/Salah in full  which only exception is fun fishing i anyway if he hunts halal meat animals so then he can eat halal meat which if they goes to hunting just for earning a living so therfore hunting will be Halal so therefore they can sell hunted Halal meat of animals which have Halal meat.

Shooting animals for fun is basically killing for fun. When killing becomes fun, life loses value. Regardless mans law, that was not God's intent. Respect for all life.

I'm an avid fisherman but I won't fish for fun either. I mean, it's all fun but catch and release in my eyes is sadistic and many fish die anyway. I will not go to a catch and release lake. The celebration is in eating the fish God lets me catch. It is not uncommon for everyone on the lake to hear "Thank you Lord!" when I land one.
In Canada you are not allowed to sell wild meat or fish, it is personal use only. It is also illegal to waste the flesh of wild game.

I haven't shot anything in years now. Magpies poop on everything but I don't see them anymore if they see me first, they know not to hang around. Muskrats are dangerous for dogs as are porcupines. I have no problem shooting them on sight.

Skunks are a thing here.
Last year I set up a camera and watched a family of skunks ransack my bee shack. They destroyed some old honey frames I was going to throw out anyway but what stopped me from shooting them is they are great mousers. I had to scrape up bees wax from the floor and clean up everything but not a mouse in sight. I appreciated that. Last year my dogs were too old to bother them. As long as we can live in harmony, I see no reason to kill. I put up an electric fence around the garden because they also like corn. They will dig and chew the roots until the plant falls down. Then they shred one cob and cut down another.

That could change this year as I now have two pups that explore everything. 6 months old and 60-65 lbs each.
They are acreage dogs, they don't come in the house. They get pets and some cuddles as pups that need positive attention for training.
I also see no problem with holding them close and thanking God in prayer for them. They were God given and I treat them as a blessing although it doesn't always feel that way. Keeping them from roaming has become a challenge. 

[Son of Placid]

34 minutes ago, Diaz said:

So that means it’s permissible to shoot animals like cow and goat with a gun if we want to eat them? 

This would at least be a gray area. As I understand it, halal means slitting the throat and bleeding it out while conscious. In NA that is considered cruelty and illegal. A farm animal must be rendered unconscious before bleeding out. Shooting an animal means it bleeds internally before you get to it. 

[PureExistence1]

@rkazmi33salasm, no one is saying to shame others infront of others. There is always an appropriate way to handle things, like pull the brother or sister aside privately and explain to them that it's been noticed that they have been walking in the restroom in their socks and then explain to them that the floor is full of urine and other najis substances that create an unsanitary and unhealthy environment for the masjid, both physically and spiritually and therefore until they rid themselves of this habit, they shouldn't be there doing these things because it is an Injustice to the other people there.

It seems the community in your area has some very bad aklaw as far as how you've been treated. I don't agree with that at all, and I'm sorry you've had to go through these situations.. those people are in the wrong.Someone who takes the appropriate measures to guide the community and to guide individuals wouldn't do things in the way that you have experienced.

Very sorry you've been through what you've been through.

At the end of the day, it is the molana's responsibility to educate people there. The reason why people spirituality dont improve is due to lack of guidance. If we let the general public in our communities dictate how things are done,  then we will always stay at a subpar level because there is a bell curve. The majority of people will behave in a subpar manner if not guided to behave correctly. So the first step starts with the Molana educating in general. And then if people still persist to wear their socks in the bathroom where there's urine and other stuff on the floor and then come back into the masjid, appropriate measures need to be taken.

Shaming someone would be absolutely inappropriate and against good akkaq.

[rkazmi33]

@PureExistence1 I agree that walking barefoot on bathroom floor is rude since it spreads najasat. You are right,  posts in this thread reminded me of how I was treated by my community and it triggered me. 

[ireallywannaknow]

53 minutes ago, rkazmi33 said:

@PureExistence1 I agree that walking barefoot on bathroom floor is rude since it spreads najasat. You are right,  posts in this thread reminded me of how I was treated by my community and it triggered me. 

@PureExistence1

The best path is the middle/moderate path and following Islamic guidelines, and not our own created guidelines. There is actually no problem with walking in the bathroom barefoot. Problems only arise if you see with your own eyes that something has been made najis, and it is still wet. If you just speculate that it is unclean and have never actually witnessed anything, then it's not in fact unclean spiritually/Islamically and if you act as if it's unclean you may cross over to having OCD or making what's Halal, Haram on yourself and creating undue hardship on yourself and others.

If you are talking about the spread of germs, which is different than najasah, that's a different topic and bathrooms can be sanitized and people have different levels of germ phobia so "spreading germs around the masjid" being a huge problem is debatable. What doesn't kill you makes you stronger ;)

Edited April 16 by ireallywannaknow

[PureExistence1]

1 hour ago, ireallywannaknow said:

Problems only arise if you see with your own eyes that something has been made najis, and it is still wet. If you just speculate that it is unclean and have never actually witnessed anything, then it's not in fact unclean spiritually/Islamically and if you act as if it's unclean you may cross over to having OCD or making what's Halal, Haram on yourself and creating undue hardship on yourself and others.

I get the point here and totally agree with you, however, let's focus on mens restrooms for a moment here. 

Most of us know that men overshoot, side spray, and thst little boys have a hard time aiming so let's not pretend that the area around a urinal in a mend restroom is clean. That we logically know from having little brothers, sons or from men themsrlves experiences. I don't think any man is going to deny that urine spray surrounds the floor surface of toilets. Those areas are sticky and the urine can be seen by casting a side glance at the surface as light hits it.

(As a sister, I just want to say i know this because I worked at a megachurch as a facilities personnel for a year before buying my first Quran and eventually converting to islam. There were 72 toilets in that church that I had to clean, and I don't remember how many urinals. But trust me, the floors in restrooms are not clean, esp mens restrooms )

But in all other matters, I totally agree with the Islamic ruling on needing to see that something is dirty (obtaining certainty).

As far as  what doesn't make you sick makes you stronger goes, there are a lot of people that are immune compromised, that's including infants, old people, people with autoimmune diseases, people that are on medications to lower their immune system such as cancer patients.. there's a pretty large swath of the population that has to be careful of not getting sick, and if some nasty persons behavior of walking in the men's restroom with no shoes on, and then walking back to the prayer rug gets someone sick with the germs on their feet, that actually puts that ignorant person in the responsible role for anything that happens to the other from their behavior, especially since it's pretty easy to help prevent or at the very least, minimiz--- Just wear the sandals/dampais to use the restroom

 

Edited April 16 by PureExistence1