Knowledge of Umar al-Khattab

[Cool]

I came across a hadith which is mentioning the merits of Caliph Umar al-Khattab:

 عَنِ ابْنِ مَسْعُوْدٍ قَالَ : لَوْ أَنَّ عِلْمَ عُمَرَ وُضِعَ فِي کِفَّةِ الْمِيْزَانِ، وَوُضِعَ عِلْمُ أهْلِ الْأرْضِ فِي کِفَّةٍ لَرَجَحَ عِلْمُهُ بِعِلْمِهِمْ. قَالَ وَکِيْعٌ، قَالَ الْأعْمَشُ : فَأنْکَرْتُ ذَلِکَ فَأتَيْتُ إِبْرَاهِيْمَ فَذَکَرْتُهُ لَهُ فَقَالَ وَمَا أَنْکَرْتُ مِنْ ذَلِکَ؟ فَوَاﷲِ لَقَدْ قَالَ عَبْدُاللّٰهِ أَفْضَلُ مِنْ ذَلِکَ قَالَ : إِنِّيْ لَأحْسِبُ تِسْعَةَ أَعْشَارِ الْعِلْمِ ذَهَبَ يَوْمَ ذَهْبَ عُمَرَ.

رَوَاهُ الطَّبْرَانِيُّ فِي الْمُعَجَمِ الْکَبِيْرِ.

(If the knowledge of Umar were placed in the balance, and the knowledge of the people of the earth were placed in the balance, his knowledge would outweigh their knowledge.  Waki` said: Al-A'mash said: I denied that, so I went to Ibrahim and mentioned it to him, so he said: Why do I deny that?  By God, Abdullah said something better than that. He said: I reckon nine-tenths of knowledge was gone on the day Omar went.)

After reading this hadith I thought what would be the status of knowledge of the person for whom Umar himself said this:

لو لا علي لهلك عمر

&

اللهم لا تبقني لمعضلة ليس لها ابن أبي طالب

 

[Cool]

15 minutes ago, Cool said:

 

 عَنِ ابْنِ مَسْعُوْدٍ قَالَ : لَوْ أَنَّ عِلْمَ عُمَرَ وُضِعَ فِي کِفَّةِ الْمِيْزَانِ، وَوُضِعَ عِلْمُ أهْلِ الْأرْضِ فِي کِفَّةٍ لَرَجَحَ عِلْمُهُ بِعِلْمِهِمْ. قَالَ وَکِيْعٌ، قَالَ الْأعْمَشُ : فَأنْکَرْتُ ذَلِکَ فَأتَيْتُ إِبْرَاهِيْمَ فَذَکَرْتُهُ لَهُ فَقَالَ وَمَا أَنْکَرْتُ مِنْ ذَلِکَ؟ فَوَاﷲِ لَقَدْ قَالَ عَبْدُاللّٰهِ أَفْضَلُ مِنْ ذَلِکَ قَالَ : إِنِّيْ لَأحْسِبُ تِسْعَةَ أَعْشَارِ الْعِلْمِ ذَهَبَ يَوْمَ ذَهْبَ عُمَرَ.

رَوَاهُ الطَّبْرَانِيُّ فِي الْمُعَجَمِ الْکَبِيْرِ

الحديث رقم 63 : أخرجه الطبراني في المعجم الکبير، 9 / 163، الحديث رقم : 8809، والهيثمي في مجمع الزوائد، 9 / 69، وابن عبدالبر في التمهيد، 3 / 198، و ابن سعد في الطبقات الکبریٰ، 2 / 

[Cool]

17 hours ago, Cool said:

If the knowledge of Umar were placed in the balance, and the knowledge of the people of the earth were placed in the balance, his knowledge would outweigh their knowledge

Apparently, this is not a hadith rather it is the opinion of ibn Masood (رضي الله عنه) 

And it seems a forged opinion of Abdullah ibn Masood. These sort of opinions are being forged to undermine the mutawatir hadith "I am the city of knowledge & Ali is its door" which is declared as fabricated, daeef, mowdu' etc by the scholars of Ahlul Sunnah but this forged report pleases them lol. 

Ridiculously, it mentions this:

17 hours ago, Cool said:

I reckon nine-tenths of knowledge was gone on the day Omar went.)

So Umar kept nine-tenth of knowledge with himself, never taught anything to anyone, not even to his own son Abdullah ibn Umar . 

 

[Muslim2010]

23 hours ago, Cool said:

Apparently, this is not a hadith rather it is the opinion of ibn Masood (رضي الله عنه) 

And it seems a forged opinion of Abdullah ibn Masood. These sort of opinions are being forged to undermine the mutawatir hadith "I am the city of knowledge & Ali is its door" which is declared as fabricated, daeef, mowdu' etc by the scholars of Ahlul Sunnah but this forged report pleases them lol. 

Ridiculously, it mentions this:

So Umar kept nine-tenth of knowledge with himself, never taught anything to anyone, not even to his own son Abdullah ibn Umar . 

Look brother here comes another one for their defense from sunnah:

There is another hadith,that says, I AM THE CITY OF KNOWLEDGE, ABU BAKR IS ITS FOUNDATION, UMAR IT'S WALLS, UTHMAN ITS ROOF AND 'ALI  IS ITS DOOR!      

The Door to the Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) always remains open and it is still open to all presently. The detail can be seen in the light of the Quran and hadith at the following link:

wasalam

Edited March 28 by Muslim2010

[Cool]

Another example of the great knowledge of Umar which is so great that it can out weight the knowledge of "Ahl al-Ard", can be found here:

"We were with the Prophet, may God’s prayers and peace be upon him, and he was taking Omar Ibn Al-Khattab by the hand. Omar said to him: O Messenger of God, you are dearer to me than everything except my own self."

I haven't quoted the complete hadith. What I am wondering here is that till this point of time, he has no idea that Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) holds a greater right on his self then him. And Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) was needed to correct him by stating that I that is what you say, your emaan is not yet complete. The next dialogue is more interesting, but lets first see the hadith:

كُنَّا مع النَّبيِّ صَلَّى اللهُ عليه وسلَّمَ وهو آخِذٌ بيَدِ عُمَرَ بنِ الخَطَّابِ، فَقالَ له عُمَرُ: يا رَسولَ اللَّهِ، لَأَنْتَ أحَبُّ إلَيَّ مِن كُلِّ شَيْءٍ إلَّا مِن نَفْسِي، فَقالَ النَّبيُّ صَلَّى اللهُ عليه وسلَّمَ: لَا، والَّذي نَفْسِي بيَدِهِ، حتَّى أكُونَ أحَبَّ إلَيْكَ مِن نَفْسِكَ، فَقالَ له عُمَرُ: فإنَّه الآنَ، واللَّهِ، لَأَنْتَ أحَبُّ إلَيَّ مِن نَفْسِي، فَقالَ النَّبيُّ صَلَّى اللهُ عليه وسلَّمَ: الآنَ يا عُمَرُ.

الراوي : عبدالله بن هشام | المحدث : البخاري | المصدر : صحيح البخاري | الصفحة أو الرقم : 6632 | خلاصة حكم المحدث : [صحيح

Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) corrected him in these words:

"The Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) said: No, by the One in Whose hand is my soul, until I am dearer to you than your own self."

Umar then said this: 

"Now, by God, you are dearer to me than myself."

The Prophet s a.w responded to him in words:

"Now O Omar."

IF we just put a question mark after this response, the nature of Prophet's response becomes change:

"Now O Umar?" 

What I think is that this "Now O Umar" means that now your claim has a weight & it becomes correct.

More interestingly, the commentary of this hadith begins with the following statement:

لا يَكتمِلُ إيمانُ العَبدِ المُسلِمِ حتَّى يكونَ النَّبيُّ صلَّى اللهُ عليه وسلَّم أحَبَّ إليه مِن وَلدِه ومالِه ونفْسِه

So according to this hadith, the emaan of Umar becomes completed at this point of time when he accepted the Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) more dearer to him than his self. 

I am needed to edit my post to avoid violation of this site rules. 

If someone claim that I am more dearer to him that his self and then he left me alone in difficult situations, run away for saving his life while I am calling him for help, what would be the value of claim of such person? That's the point to ponder!

Edited March 29 by Cool

[Muslim2010]

1 hour ago, Cool said:

If someone claim that I am more dearer to him that his self and then he left me alone in difficult situations, run away for saving his life while I am calling him for help, what would be the value of claim of such person? That's the point to ponder!

وَمَا كَانَ لِمُؤْمِنٍ وَلَا مُؤْمِنَةٍ إِذَا قَضَى اللَّهُ وَرَسُولُهُ أَمْرًا أَن يَكُونَ لَهُمُ الْخِيَرَةُ مِنْ أَمْرِهِمْ ۗ وَمَن يَعْصِ اللَّهَ وَرَسُولَهُ فَقَدْ ضَلَّ ضَلَالًا مُّبِينًا

Shakir

And it behoves not a believing man and a believing woman that they should have any choice in their matter when Allah and His Messenger have decided a matter; and whoever disobeys Allah and His Messenger, he surely strays off a manifest straying. (33:36)

Edited March 29 by Muslim2010