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In the Name of God بسم الله

Mahsa Amini, 22-year old Iranian, dies after morality police arrest

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1 hour ago, Hasani Samnani said:

Make you doubt your own religion,  or God's dictates, or Shia beliefs,  that's the waswasey of Shaytan, and his henchmen.

I don’t doubt my religion. I doubt people.

1 hour ago, Hasani Samnani said:

If someone feels that strongly against enforcement of Islamic laws, feel free to buy some property in Iran, get long-term visa, get voting rights and or find a nice spouse  and go ahead and vote against.

Except, as already pointed out to Abu Hadi, that’s disingenuous advice because the Iranian government doesn’t let anyone whose opinions stray too far outside the status quo even run for office. 

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2 hours ago, kadhim said:

Oh, hey bud. Did Daddy let you go back online to play with your friends again? That’s awesome bud. You go git ‘em

I don't think he was cyber bullying,  but it was a tongue in cheek acid dripping teasing, a little cruelly put, Kadhim does enjoy that sarcastic back and forth banter, it's ok most of us are rarely damaged by such feeble volleys( bring it on brother :brucelee::respect:)

Although I think personal attacks on each others is what would be even more joyous to shaytan and all the lurking salafies.

Honestly though,  I think @Ashvazdanghe is one of the most earnest and prolific posters , his heart is definitely in the right place, but his approach as a staunch defender of the IRI, along with the long cut and paste (ocassionly quite enlightening) can turn others off...hence the touchè by Kadhim.

Remember divide and conquer is a old satanic trick from the time of Habeel and Qabeel, don't fall for it and stay strong. 

We can all agree to disagree at times and not let things descend into personal vendettas.

I came back from Arbaeen with new and invigorated hope in our ummah and Imam E Zamane's guidance,  even behind the clouds, he is still our shining Noor e Elahi and we need to stay committed to his message and the message of Imam Husain.

The Hospitality of Iraqi siblings, the comraderie and immediate friendship with people from every major and minor language,  the moving speeches, the amazing personalities, the united feeling in the Harrums of our Illustrious leaders, the soul inspiring chants, latmiya, nohas, Naseem etc,  it was like a stem cell infusion  for my soul and heart.

2 hours ago, kadhim said:

You two are hands down the biggest bullies on this site. Don’t even start with me with that sort of cynical nonsense. 

Let's be honest Layla is a throw them gloves down and fight for justice Sister,  who is never afraid. I wouldn't call her a bully,  but I would not want to be in between Her and a Yazeedi, he would get slaughtered.

As far as cynicism...that's another ploy of Shaytan, we become jaded or bitter or God forbid ...hopeless.

We are being pulled to the siratul mustaqueem and Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) is so gracious and Kareem to keep giving us vivid signs of the zahoor.

Tell me you guys don't  feel the pull away  from Shaytan and Yazeed and Sufiani forces, towards the forces of Light, Noor, and justice.

Whether it comes thru the Yemeni brothers or Lebanese,  or Palestinian,  Iraqi, Irani, Indopak, there are Celestial forces at work, and Makr wa Makrullah, Inallah Khairul Makeyreen.

The kuffar are being constantly rebuffed,  refuted,  defeated in their devilish schemes...and while we are in small minority of the worlds population,  when 21 million of us get together ( I think it was closer to 30 million since at the end many borders were fully opened without visas even) ....there is no force on earth that can deal with our potential energy.

Edited by Hasani Samnani
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8 minutes ago, Hasani Samnani said:

I don't think he was cyber bullying,  but it was a tongue in cheek acid dripping teasing, a little cruelly put, Kadhim does enjoy that sarcastic back and forth banter, it's ok most of us are rarely damaged by such feeble volleys( bring it on brother :brucelee::respect:)

Although I think personal attacks on each others is what would be even more joyous to shaytan and all the lurking salafies.

Honestly though,  I think @Ashvazdanghe is one of the most earnest and prolific posters , his heart is definitely in the right place, but his approach as a staunch defender of the IRI, along with the long cut and paste (ocassionly quite enlightening) can turn others off...hence the touchè by Kadhim.

Remember divide and conquer is a old satanic trick from the time of Habeel and Qabeel, don't fall for it and stay strong. 

We can all agree to disagree at times and not let things descend into personal vendettas.

I came back from Arbaeen with new and invigorated hope in our ummah and Imam E Zamane's guidance,  even behind the clouds, he is still our shining Noor e Elahi and we need to stay committed to his message and the message of Imam Husain.

The Hospitality of Iraqi siblings, the comraderie and immediate friendship with people from every major and minor language,  the moving speeches, the amazing personalities, the united feeling in the Harrums of our Illustrious leaders, the soul inspiring chants, latmiya, nohas, Naseem etc,  it was like a stem cell infusion  for my soul and heart.

Let's be honest Layla is a throw them gloves down and fight for justice Sister,  who is never afraid. I wouldn't call her a bully,  but I would not want to be in between Her and a Yazeedi, he would get slaughtered.

As far as cynicism...that's another ploy of Shaytan, we become jaded or bitter or God forbid ...hopeless.

We are being pulled to the siratul mustaqueem and Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) is so gracious and Kareem to keep giving us vivid signs of the zahoor.

Tell me you guys don't  feel the pull away  from Shaytan and Yazeed and Sufiani forces, towards the forces of Light, Noor, and justice.

Whether it comes thru the Yemeni brothers or Lebanese,  or Palestinian,  Iraqi, Irani, Indopak, there are Celestial forces at work, and Makr wa Makrullah, Inallah Khairul Makeyreen.

The kuffar are being constantly rebuffed,  refuted,  defeated in their devilish schemes...and while we are in small minority of the worlds population,  when 21 million of us get together ( I think it was closer to 30 million since at the end many borders were fully opened without visas even) ....there is no force on earth that can deal with our potential energy.

“Blessed be the peacemakers.”

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7 minutes ago, kadhim said:

pure democracy

that's also been called the system where the biggest wolves get to vote on which sheep is for dinner.

Cmon it's overrated , we saw how well it worked after the prophet and in other iterations.

If one actually takes the time to read the Iranian constitution,  which I did for poli science paper, it's a copy and paste with some important Islamic changes,  from the US constitution and Declaration of Independence.

The Guidance of the Ulema is essential to give proper advice whether for domestic tranquility or National Governance. Keeping in mind they are fallible and not Masoom, so missteps can happen, that's why I firmly believe in the mulitple rawayat of Imam E Zamana stepping in to correct our ulema if they make a major misstep. 

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London Arba'een procession attacked by Amini supporters

I was at the procession yesterday. As in all previous years the police presence was hardly noticeable and the reaction from Londoners was curiousity more than anything else.

Anyway once the procession started getting back to Marble Arch, where it had started there was a flurry of police activity.

Apparently (according to my uncle who saw this) people in Hyde Park who were protesting about Amini had run over to the procession to cause trouble and were quickly stopped by the police.

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1 hour ago, Hasani Samnani said:

that's also been called the system where the biggest wolves get to vote on which sheep is for dinner.

Cmon it's overrated , we saw how well it worked after the prophet and in other iterations.

If one actually takes the time to read the Iranian constitution,  which I did for poli science paper, it's a copy and paste with some important Islamic changes,  from the US constitution and Declaration of Independence.

The Guidance of the Ulema is essential to give proper advice whether for domestic tranquility or National Governance. Keeping in mind they are fallible and not Masoom, so missteps can happen, that's why I firmly believe in the mulitple rawayat of Imam E Zamana stepping in to correct our ulema if they make a major misstep. 

I mean, you quoted two words out of that, but regarding the usefulness of the ulema as guides and advisors, I didn’t exactly say to take them out behind the woodshed, right? I did describe a role for them that has some precedent behind it. We could talk about that as a more nuanced discussion about it. 

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Seen below post on social media. Credits to the poster. Just copy pasting.

Here enjoy a dose of truth. After that maybe you can learn about actual shia islam :)

Hijab is indeed part of the iranian culture since the Safavid period in the 16th century. It’s also part of the religion. Or as you called it. Religious law.

• Article 638 of 5th book of Islamic Penal Code (called Sanctions and deterrent penalties) women who do not wear a hijab may be imprisoned from ten days to two months, and/or required to pay fines from Rls.50,000 to Rls.500,000.

There you go. That’s first of all. Killing isn’t a punishment for not respecting the law. We don’t even know what happened because the investigation wasn’t even finished when that “revolution” started. Maybe she was beaten to death, maybe not. The facts are that there’s a cctv footage showing her collapsing by herself and her being rushed in an ambulance to the hospital.

I do need to point out that I am not condoning a protest. You can protest whatever you want as long as it’s done the right way. According to the islamic penal code of Iran; chapter 9; article 286. It was not done the right way. And for every actions there’s a reaction.

Chapter Nine- Baqŷ (Rebellion) and Efsad-e-fel-arz (Corruption on Earth)

Article 286- Any person, who extensively commits felony against the bodily entity of people, offenses against internal or international security of the state, spreading lies, disruption of the economic system of the state, arson and destruction of properties, distribution of poisonous and bacterial and dangerous materials, and establishment of, or aiding and abetting in, places of corruption and prostitution, [on a scale] that causes severe disruption in the public order of the state and insecurity, or causes harsh damage to the bodily entity of people or public or private properties, or causes distribution of corruption and prostitution on a large scale, shall be considered as mofsed-e-fel-arz [corrupt on earth] and shall be sentenced to death.

https://www.refworld.org/docid/518a19404.html

(Its gonna be at the end feel free to scroll down buddy)

Now, i don’t know if you have been watching the news. Kinda hard to miss it with all the propaganda being pushed left and right. But those protests were criminal in nature. There was a hundred ways to do it the right way and they failed to do so.

__

Please do note, i am not excusing the people who killed her if they did indeed killed her. But when an event like that happens, an investigation should occur before lies and misunderstandings happen. And let’s correct you on one thjng, hijab is indeed a beautiful culture. A gift from Allah(سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) to our ummah. That many sisters and mothers and daughters wear with pride and for the sake of Allah(سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى)

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11 hours ago, kadhim said:

“Blessed be the peacemakers.”

No justice, no peace bruh

See how easy you can use empty slogans?

And if you truly believe that biblical verse, then turn the other cheek. But nah, just words with no action.

You reek of liberalism and have nothing to do with religion whatsoever along with promoting the alphabet group lifestyle and so-called rights.

Over a decade ago, you weren't like this.

I wonder what happened to you, what life event occurred where you switched off your moral compass.

God keep us steadfast.

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9 hours ago, islamicmusic said:

Article 638 of 5th book of Islamic Penal Code (called Sanctions and deterrent penalties) women who do not wear a hijab may be imprisoned from ten days to two months, and/or required to pay fines from Rls.50,000 to Rls.500,000.

The ~ parking ticket sort of amount (translating rials to dollars and accounting for differences in GDP per capita) juxtaposed with ten days to two months imprisonment is jarring and bizarre. 
 

9 hours ago, islamicmusic said:

Article 286- Any person, who extensively commits felony against the bodily entity of people, offenses against internal or international security of the state, spreading lies, disruption of the economic system of the state, arson and destruction of properties, distribution of poisonous and bacterial and dangerous materials, and establishment of, or aiding and abetting in, places of corruption and prostitution, [on a scale] that causes severe disruption in the public order of the state and insecurity, or causes harsh damage to the bodily entity of people or public or private properties, or causes distribution of corruption and prostitution on a large scale, shall be considered as mofsed-e-fel-arz [corrupt on earth] and shall be sentenced to death.

Also a little perturbing how “spreading lies” is just thrown in there in the same list with acts of bioterrorism. 

I don’t understand how anyone reads this stuff and doesn’t doesn’t recoil in horror. 

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On 9/25/2022 at 12:48 AM, Guest 12345 said:

My issue is, as I understand your argument with respect to "ma'ruf" or "munkar", that once a “reasonable” limit has been placed/reached, is encouragement the only mechanism that can employed to move a populace towards the limits? As of right now, what keeps people from abandoning the limits? It can’t be solely encouragement, as even in a secular society there are varying limits to what can be worn in public, which are reinforced by punitive laws.

Essentially, assuming a minimum limit is reached or a line in the sand has been drawn, with regard to a level of dress, at what point would there be punitive laws/discouragement need to enforce said limit?

Well, what keeps people from committing murder?

What about human reason?

 

I mean, it doesn't seem to me that discouragement laws are the essential driving factors keeping people from going butt naked to work - for example. I think a lot of it is due to culture, human reason, hygiene, public health concerns. Even just personal shame. This is what makes people throw on a set of clothes every day. Hypothetically, even if the government took the “discouragement” part out, you’re not going to find a sudden increase in nudity. Unless there’s a lurking variable that I’m not incorporating here, of course, but I wouldn’t imagine there is any in this case. 

On 9/25/2022 at 12:48 AM, Guest 12345 said:

I don’t think I provided the best example, but there is a culture associate with nude beaches. If, as a hypothetical, Islam begins to take hold in the area – at what point would we begin limiting the behavior, knowing full well that two cultures are going to collide? Which takes precedence?

I don’t believe Islam ever meant to collide with pre-existing cultures (at least not in the ways people popularly think) nor did it intend to craft a uniform culture of its own. The religion of Islam was never given to a cultural vacuum, either. It always acknowledged different practices, called out and outlawed what would have needed to be eliminated (practices such as raiding, or killing an infant - for example), and worked with the tendencies of societies that had existed for thousands of years. So I am fundamentally different in the way I would go about answering this question.

I think that if Islam ever took hold in American society, and “what normally appears” (24:31) in this particular society is arms, legs, shoulders, hair, etc - then an Islamic government would (ideally) not be apprehensive about that. I know people are going to read this and say, “you’re blaspheming against Islam, trying to make it comply with people’s cultures”. I’m not, I’m saying that Islam recognizes that sensitivities differ from country to country. In this hypothetical situation, though, Islam would take "superiority" in the marketplace of religions, so if a Muslim ‘alim believes that a woman must not show her legs, then it is his duty to preach that message and let things fall into place by themselves. So this is the point where Islamic ideas would most likely outweigh other ideas due to sheer democracy.

On 9/25/2022 at 12:48 AM, Guest 12345 said:

If it turns out that there is an absolute net positive for a society to adopt a certain behavior and disregarding it would be detrimental, would you be okay with “enforcing” the behavior? Or, are you against any type of enforcement?

If it compromises someone’s security, rides roughshod over someone’s rights, or if it excesses with respect to life, property, or honor - then yes, I would like the government to step in to enforce as needed. Otherwise, no. What is detrimental to society or an individual with regards to morality/religiosity is something that needs to be made clear by the ‘ulema. This is what the pulpit is for. And the dawah mission should be taken up a notch. In an Islamic state, there is also the expectation that the haakim gives the Friday khutba to advise his fellow citizens. That’s it. That’s where the authority of the government should and must end. 

On 9/25/2022 at 12:48 AM, Guest 12345 said:

Unfortunately, the issue will persist even under an Islamic system. However, objectivity with respect to morals – which modesty can be said to be a subset - is unlimitedly given by God.

If one’s actions go against God, there is a potential for far worse consequences that what man-made limit/punishment can inflict.

Fair enough. But I just don’t see how this sort of fixed Godly objectivity can be implemented properly in the most humane way possible, without opening up avenues of corruption (of both people and religion), and without societies throwing a fit every 30 years. 

Edited by khizarr
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Source taken from finnish news site:

Crown Prince Reza Pahlavi called to take the protests to the next level by starting a nationwide strike.  In a television interview with Iran International, Pahlavi urged that "the army must join in supporting the protests and maintain its loyalty to the masses against the internal enemy."

Lol. 

Edited by Abu Nur
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20 hours ago, -Rejector- said:

This is just secularism. (And I'm sure you know Imam Khamenei's (ha) views on secularism). If Iran were to implement this suggestion, it would no longer be the Islamic Republic of Iran. It would just be another secular state where religion is kept in the mosques/churches/synagogues and no one will care about it outside of these places. This isn't what Imam Khomeini (ha) started the revolution for, nor is it what the millions of revolutionaries back in 1979 voted for. 

Why wouldn't they care?

Do you not think mosques and 'ulema are capable enough of spreading the message and reminding people about the goodness of Islam? Or do you just fundamentally believe that Islam is a religion that must be enforced with a lash?

20 hours ago, -Rejector- said:

What not okay about it? If you're living in an Islamic state, why do you expect secular laws?

Because a state should not have a religion. And especially not when there is little consent of the governed involved. 

20 hours ago, -Rejector- said:

The IRI isn't like other countries.

Gosh, "IRI" makes it sound more rogue than it already is. Can we just say Iran or Islamic Republic for next time?

20 hours ago, -Rejector- said:

But if the Iranian 'regime' really was as evil as some think, surely there'd be more than one case of an uncovered woman being mistreated.

I'm sure there has been more than one case. Also, it's arguable that arresting a woman on those grounds to "discipline" her is a mistreatment in and of itself.

20 hours ago, -Rejector- said:

Anyway, what are you suggesting here? That if Iran could get away with it, they would? You sound like a Western politician. 

It'd give them a far bigger leeway, wouldn't it?

And, oh, do I? I should've gone into political science instead of chemistry. Grrr. Maybe I wouldn't have lost so much hair then.

20 hours ago, -Rejector- said:

Ok... If Muslims actually believe that the khimar isn't wajib... I've got nothing to say.

Yes, yes they do. It's not some new, afterschool club idea. People have had different views about this for a very, very long time.

Edited by khizarr
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8 hours ago, Laayla said:

No justice, no peace bruh

See how easy you can use empty slogans?

And if you truly believe that biblical verse, then turn the other cheek. But nah, just words with no action.

You reek of liberalism and have nothing to do with religion whatsoever along with promoting the alphabet group lifestyle and so-called rights.

Over a decade ago, you weren't like this.

I wonder what happened to you, what life event occurred where you switched off your moral compass.

God keep us steadfast.

It really a special type to take a nod of appreciation to Hassan’s diplomacy, and then use that as a launching point for hyper-personal vitriol. It’s a perverse sort of talent. 

And wow. Yeah. Someone got ten, fifteen years older and got mellower and less dogmatic about some things? Whoa. What a concept. 

And my approach is simply to take certain top-level principles of Islam seriously and consistently, using them as a light to re-examine old assumptions  that really don’t make sense rather than mindlessly clinging to them out of lazy inertia. If you have a problem with that, that’s your problem. 

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So I am going to try to attach the video of your very photogenic Mahsa Amini standing with her brother,  in what appears a phone camera filmed session in an Iranian forest area,  tearing apart the Holy Qur'an and then burning the pages while crumpled ripped pages fall at their feet, some of which they proceed to light on fire.

All the while cursing the Prophet Muhammad, Imam Husaain, Hadrat Fatema , Imame Zamana and other Masoomeen, along with the govt of Iran. 

Sorry file is too big to be attached , I will try a few screen shots and later get my tech son to see if we can attach.

 

Edited by Hasani Samnani
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https://mega.nz/file/G3QQ1bRL#hJE3roEuiJPFvdfxCDCN_CuuMiNxGJ_uLU-Db4JzGH0

I had to open an account with mega so it can be seen .

If still problems with viewing,  let me know.

Now I am not surprised at all how she fell, like her heart suddenly stopped.

May Allah have mercy on her soul.

To treat the word of Allah in this way is daring Our Khaliq to show his power.

Edited by Hasani Samnani
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1 minute ago, Hasani Samnani said:

https://mega.nz/file/G3QQ1bRL#hJE3roEuiJPFvdfxCDCN_CuuMiNxGJ_uLU-Db4JzGH0

I had to open an account with mega so it can be seen .

If still problems with viewing,  let me know.



"After the Sarasyns gyse,
Woth a whym wham,
Knyt with a trym tram,
Upon her brayne pan."

~The Tunnyng of Elynour Rummyug, . a 1529, Skelton, E. Rummyag 75 . 

 
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8 minutes ago, Hasani Samnani said:

https://mega.nz/file/G3QQ1bRL#hJE3roEuiJPFvdfxCDCN_CuuMiNxGJ_uLU-Db4JzGH0

I had to open an account with mega so it can be seen .

If still problems with viewing,  let me know.

Now I am not surprised at all how she fell, like her heart suddenly stopped.

May Allah have mercy on her soul.

To treat the word of Allah in this way is daring Our Khaliq to show his power.

She does not look like the same person to me. 

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18 minutes ago, Hasani Samnani said:

So I am going to try to attach the video of your very photogenic Mahsa Amini standing with her brother,  in what appears a phone camera filmed session in an Iranian forest area,  tearing apart the Holy Qur'an and then burning the pages while crumpled ripped pages fall at their feet, some of which they proceed to light on fire.

All the while cursing the Prophet Muhammad, Imam Husaain, Hadrat Fatema and other Masoomeen, along with the govt of Iran. 

Um.

This video was uploaded on YouTube in 2019 on a channel by the name of 'Sara Salamt' and the two people are identified as Reza Khaksar and Somayye Salamat. Not Mahsa Amini or her brother.

Also, how do these two women even remotely look alike?
 

 

 

4E4F8533-6F63-4AFF-B41E-42681BFAB7C5.jpeg

Edited by khizarr
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6 minutes ago, AbdusSibtayn said:

Yes, this video seems to be older, looks like it's fake news. 

definitely could be, I don't dismiss this as possible  fake news especially circulating whatspp video.

But if there is the faint possibility this is her...then I am not surprised at her end.

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1 minute ago, Hasani Samnani said:

definitely could be, I don't dismiss this as possible  fake news especially circulating whatspp video.

But if there is the faint possibility this is her...then I am not surprised at her end.

But as some others have also pointed out, the two women look two different for them to be considered the same person. 

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14 minutes ago, khizarr said:

This video was uploaded on YouTube in 2019 on a channel by the name of 'Sara Salamt' and the two people are identified as Reza Khaksar and Somayye Salamat. Not Mahsa Amini or her brother.

please paste your link bro.

and not a link to misbar, or another prop site.

Edited by Hasani Samnani
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18 hours ago, kadhim said:

Well, if half of them are only observing it because agents of the state may harass them if they don’t, and all the while they hate it, and resent it, and resent the clerics behind it, and resent whatever makes the clerics force this on them—which the clerics insist is nothing but Islam—then how “Islamic” is that status quo? And how “Islamic” will it be going forward?

It’s really quite serious. A lot of the young people are coming to actually hate the religion over this sort of behavior. To you and I, the religion is about positive things; forming a relationship with the maker of the world, being aware of the wonder of creation and feeling thankful, etc. But if for another person Islam is just a boot on their face planted there by people, many of whom don’t seem too pious themselves, then what is that person going to think? 

I spend a good amount of time (at least online; my IRL Muslim friends are orthodox to conservative) in progressive Muslim circles. And I hear a lot of stories of people there who got burnt out by the rigidity of orthodox Islam, floated on the edges or even left, but then found another way back in. It happens a fair amount these days. 

Maybe the best thing is to stop worrying “what if” and just release the reins and let the chips fall where they will. In Iran, there is over a millennium of Islamic culture woven deep into the air of the place, and greater Persia was full of artists and poets and mystics and architects and philosophers. If the youth of Iran are burnt out and repulsed by the Islam of the fuqaha, there is still time for them to find one of these other roads back in. But if they just as a generation come to hate the faith, it becomes way harder.

This generation of youth—these are the people who will have to raise the next generation after. What do you want these future parents to say to their children about Islam? So if you continue to drive people away, then the whole project will die soon enough anyway. 

Obviously this situation (that you described) isn't ideal. But it's far more preferable than the alternative. You know what the alternative is? The clerics will start easing up on Islamic laws. If hijab is first, maybe music is next, then alcohol, etc. Iranian society will become more and more secular until it reaches the point where the West is today. Youth won't even know about religion, let alone be interested. Religion will be, as I described in an earlier post, only contained to the mosques. Whereas Islam wanted to build a society where religion is a part of everyday life. This is what Iran is striving for. 

And no, Iran isn't perfect. No one said it was. But when we find a fault, we should peacefully and academically address it, instead of burning people alive and burning Allah's Name. 

Anyway, if these people are so unhappy with Iran being an Islamic state, someone should tell them that the West exists. 

15 hours ago, Guest Guest said:

Half the population isn't wearing hijab - the men. That's the point, isn't it? Something that is forced upon women is not being forced onto men. If allowing women the right to choose to wear hijab is "moving away" from Islam, then maybe Iran should adopt the more religiously conservative position of the Taliban in Afghanistan? Maybe in Iran women should be forced to wear burkas? Maybe women should not be allowed outside the home at all? After all, from a typical Taliban's perspective on a continuum of making women wear burkas and locking them up at home to the other end of allowing them to go unaccompanied to lie in the sand at a nudist beach, then Iran's less conservative policies of allowing women to study, work and not have to cover their faces in public is "moving away" from Islam. From the Taliban's perspective Iran is shockingly permissive. For the average Westerner Iran is living in the Middle Ages. The Taliban would argue if you allow women to shamelessly expose their face in public then it won't stop. That's what troubles them.

Do you really want to have common ground with the Taliban?

You do realise that Iran and the Taliban are from two different, completely separate schools of Islam, right? Because if you did know, you would know that Shi'ism doesn't command women to wear burqas. Nor does it force women to stay inside. I don't know where you're getting your knowledge from, but don't group all Muslims in the same bracket. 

And by the way, who cares what the Taliban thinks? We're trying to please Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى), not some barbaric group of thuggish Muslim posers. 

8 hours ago, kadhim said:

And you don’t govern grown adults like children.

The Apostle of Allah (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم):

"Whoever enjoins good and prohibits wrong is the khaleefa of Allah and the khaleefa of His Apostle on the Earth."

(Source: Mustadrak al-Wasaail, Vol. 12, P. 179)

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3 minutes ago, Hasani Samnani said:

But if there is the faint possibility this is her..

Why are you still going on and on? Just man up and admit that you attributed a lie to someone who just died - even if it was out of ignorance.

Smh, man.

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12 minutes ago, Hasani Samnani said:

please paste your link bro.

Sure. 
 

There you go. This video was uploaded approximately three years ago, on a channel by the title 'Sara Salamat', and is clearly not Mahsa Amini or her brother.

I think you can man up now, don't you think?

Edited by khizarr
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13 minutes ago, khizarr said:

Why are you still going on and on? Just man up and admit that you attributed a lie to someone who just died - even if it was out of ignorance.

Smh, man.

I  think I acknowledged that it could be fake news since it was sent as a whatspp video, but if you claim it's youtube video from 2019, man up and post the link. ( Uhhh he did :censored:

I forwarded it as received and let others to review and decide for themselves, unlike you I don't have the totalitarian viewpoint that I am alwys right and you must listen and obey....ironic your behavior...isn't that what you claim to be against.

I understand that there are billions of dollars being thrown around to PR agencies and Three letter agencies to keep a non story going , the cctv footage was clear she fell face first and bounced off a bunch of chairs.

Edited by Hasani Samnani
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8 minutes ago, khizarr said:

I think you can man up now, don't you think

well done bro, in record speed...:respect:

Edited by Hasani Samnani
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3 minutes ago, Hasani Samnani said:

I forwarded it as received and let others to review and decide for themselves

Yes, I just posted the link. Have fun.

Also, no, you did not just innocently let others "review" the video. Stop acting like a-

Anyway.
 

You attributed a lie to a dead Muslim, poked fun at them saying "this is your very photogenic Mahsa Amini" as if that's supposed to be something to laugh about? Shameful. This is where people need to stop talking about implementing shari'a, and start fixing their own behaviors. 

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7 hours ago, Hasani Samnani said:

Notice how the media has manipulated the discussion into a referendum on the Iranian Govt

Exactly. For God's sake, even Mahsa's father didn't want this. 

Quote

[T]he father of the deceased, Amjad Amini, confirmed that the gatherings and demonstrations held in a number of Iranian provinces, "have nothing" to do with the family, and "were not for our sake."

He then added that he and Mahsa's family "are disgruntled by them," according to the Iranian Tasnim agency. 

The father of Amini explained that the family's only desire was to deal with and "punish" anyone who could have been a reason for his daughter's death.

https://english.almayadeen.net/news/politics/mahsa-aminis-father-breaks-silence:-protest-not-for-our-sake

 

3 hours ago, khizarr said:

Why wouldn't they care?

Do you not think mosques and 'ulema are capable enough of spreading the message and reminding people about the goodness of Islam? Or do you just fundamentally believe that Islam is a religion that must be enforced with a lash?

No to both questions. I'm saying that if Islam is separated from society, society will forget about it. Look what happened in the West. See how Christianity is rapidly declining? And the sole reason Islam is rising is because of reproduction, not because of converts (or as we like to call them, reverts). People are becoming increasingly disinterested in religion, and that's clear for everyone to see. It's a sad reality, but still reality. 

Without the laws of the land enforcing religion, religion will be lost. This is why Iran is so strict on enforcing shari'a. Because if they stop, the people will stop practising. If they stop practising, they will stop believing. This leads to yet another "democratic", "westernized" country, and I'm sure no one wants that.

3 hours ago, khizarr said:

Because a state should not have a religion.

The Prophet's (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) state did. Ameer al-Momineen's (عليه السلام) state did.

3 hours ago, khizarr said:

Gosh, "IRI" makes it sound more rogue than it already is. Can we just say Iran or Islamic Republic for next time?

:dry:

3 hours ago, khizarr said:

I'm sure there has been more than one case. Also, it's arguable that arresting a woman on those grounds to "discipline" her is a mistreatment in and of itself.

I'm not saying it hasn't, I was just saying that surely the Iranian 'regime' could go a bit faster in their 'oppression' of women. 

And no, enjoining the good is not a 'mistreatment'. 

3 hours ago, khizarr said:

It'd give them a far bigger leeway, wouldn't it?

And, oh, do I? I should've gone into political science instead of chemistry. Grrr. Maybe I wouldn't have lost so much hair then.

Probably would've lost more hair as a politician :hahaha:

Seriously though, of course it would give them more leeway. But that doesn't mean they would go ahead and do it. 

Judging from Iran's public image, they don't care much about it. Notice how President Raeisi only wears his turban in meetings and international events? That doesn't look like someone trying to please the "modernised" West. 

What I'm saying is that Iran doesn't care for its public image. If it wanted to oppress women, nothing would stop it. It's already drowning with sanctions anyway.

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6 minutes ago, -Rejector- said:

The Prophet's (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) state did. Ameer al-Momineen's (عليه السلام) state did.

Salaam Brother !!

This isn't a good comparison as they (PBUTF) were infallibles and no state be it democratically elected or other form are infallible!!

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4 hours ago, khizarr said:

You attributed a lie to a dead Muslim, poked fun at them saying "this is your very photogenic Mahsa Amini" as if that's supposed to be something to laugh about? Shameful. This is where people need to stop talking about implementing shari'a, and start fixing their own behaviors

Brother, I acknowledge the fact that the video was mis attributed to mahsa amini  who the actual woman in the video will probably be discovered by internet sleuths.

4 hours ago, khizarr said:

Also, no, you did not just innocently let others "review" the video. Stop acting like a-

happy to accept your curses or other admonitions to fix my shameful behavior.

I formally accept the mea culpa...

However , my motivation in sharing the video is between me and my creator and he should punish my based on my niyyat and then actions. I will trust his judgment.

It was sent to me by a person I trust,  and I forwarded to the group, should have waited for the hive mind  neural network of the world wide internet to identify the video first and verify its authenticity.

I hope that will satisfy your blood lust for the blood of your brothers in faith or holier-than-thou feelings.

We all make mistakes, since we are not Masoom, and I'm more than happy to accept my faults.

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4 hours ago, Hasani Samnani said:

I hope that will satisfy your blood lust for the blood of your brothers in faith or holier-than-thou feelings.

Lol, what?

I called you out for the blatant misinformation that you shared. Plain and simple. You tried to defend it, but you were quick to realize that you wouldn't be able to. Then you admitted your mistake albeit with an egotistic undertone, but that's okay, since you'll be answerable to Allah - not me. But after all that, you want to make me look like I'm the one playing holier-than-thou here?

Man, seriously. Get a grip already. 

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4 hours ago, Hasani Samnani said:

It was sent to me by a person I trust,  and I forwarded to the group, should have waited for the hive mind  neural network of the world wide internet to identify the video first and verify its authenticity.

I hope that will satisfy your blood lust for the blood of your brothers in faith or holier-than-thou feelings.

We all make mistakes, since we are not Masoom, and I'm more than happy to accept my faults.

Salam,

I have found it to be more than annoying to act in good faith only to find that I have been misled (unintentionally or otherwise).

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