Hadith plagiarized from The Bible?

[Guest Brushstroke]

I found this website known as e-bacaan.com where a user named jonny_k wrote a 3 part article arguing about how the Hadith Books that both the Ahlus Sunnah and The Shias have are plagiarisms from the Christian Bible. This user even went so far to discredit the Shia concept of The Ahlul Bayt from Part 3 of his .

http://www.e-bacaan.com/artikeli_plagiarized1.htm

http://www.e-bacaan.com/artikeli_plagiarized2.htm

http://www.e-bacaan.com/artikeli_plagiarized3.htm

There are 3 parts to this user's article rebuking the legitimacy of hadiths from both the Ahlus Sunnah and The Shias being plagiarism of the Christian Bible.

I found it to be quite an interesting piece that I think it's worth sharing just so a discussion can ensue from this and see if anyone can debunk this article.

Me personally when skimming through this piece, this user is really living too hard on fringe theories on top of coming across way too Quranist with his stance when explaining his perspectives. Next thing he'll tell me Japanese are of Jewish descent (aka The Japanese-Jewish common ancestry theory) which is a real fringe theory by the way for those of you wondering.

To quote the purpose of the e-bacaan website here is there About Us section translated into English under Google Translate:

Quote

Greetings and welcome
One God One Book One People
Reading , or Qur'an in Arabic, is a book of translation of the Qur'an that is written honestly, by translating each word as it is understood in the Arabic dictionary, lexicon or concordance, and without the influence of any interpretation teaching (opinions) of Sunni and Shia scholars. In addition to Reading , this page displays the writings of its author and other writers, who agree or otherwise, in addition to some interesting columns as noted in the Contents. All of them are provided so that the surfers can be stimulated to read the Qur'an by understanding its content. Even so, do not read the writings on this website to deny or blame them, or believe them, but read them according to the real purpose they were written, which is only for consideration. If you feel unhappy with writing based on the teachings of the Qur'an, which may be found to be contrary to the teachings of some of your scholars, then just leave this page. There is no need to write or act to criticize, insult or betray because such actions only harm yourself. Allah's Word, " Indeed We know that it saddens you, what they say; however, it is not you they are denying, but the wrongdoers, it is the verses of God that they are denying." (6:33) This website will be updated from time to time. Please come again. Thank you. Write to Site Manager Launch Date: Monday, April 1, 2002 - 18 Muharram 1423

 

[Haji 2003]

From the first link you provided above:

Quote

But before I go any further it is important that we speak a little about the Quran. No one - not the Grand Ayatollahs in Iran, not the Chief Imam of the Grand Mosque in Mecca or any other chief priest of Ahlus Sunnah or Shiah knows the contents of the Quran from cover to cover. They recite the Quran like a sing song mantra book but they have no idea about its real contents.

 

In order to make the above claim, the person who wrote it (jonny_k) would need to know more than the people he mentions, more than that he'd need to know what they know or do not know.

It's a pretty ambitious, exaggerated and unnecessary claim.

And it signals clickbait rather than scholarship.

 

[Guest Brushstroke]

On 9/13/2022 at 2:53 AM, Haji 2003 said:

From the first link you provided above:

 

In order to make the above claim, the person who wrote it (jonny_k) would need to know more than the people he mentions, more than that he'd need to know what they know or do not know.

It's a pretty ambitious, exaggerated and unnecessary claim.

And it signals clickbait rather than scholarship.

 

Much obliged with your comment. I do agree with your understanding so I had to do some further research to find out the identity of this person.

Apparently he is a user from the free-minds.org website which I think is an Islamic Website but mostly aimed at Quranist Muslims and Skeptical Muslims being neither Sunni or Shia arguing the legitimacy of both Sunni and Shia sources and doing their best to rebuke them.

Here is the original thread to this https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9598105.0

Apparently the user (jonny_k) read a book known as "Hadith plagiarized from The Bible" from author Saim Bakar and quoting the book with some of his edits of his own to rebuke the Sunni and Shia sources respectively.

I do not know who this Saim Bakar is, but his name sounds Indonesian.

Here is also a book these people think it should be recommended as a read to all Muslims known as "THE OPPONENTS OF THE WRITING OF TRADITION IN EARLY ISLAM" written by Michael Cook http://www.hadith-studies.com/opponents-tradition-cook.pdf and the forum discussing it https://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9602374.0

As for the topic at hand, I do agree on one thing that Hadith Literatures are similar to The Christian Bible with the exception of chains and narrators who narrated certain narrations never being verified for the most part in terms of their authenticity especially in the Old Testament. But the way how the author wishes to come across is to acknowledge the legacy of the previous scriptures and their laws, however they must be thrown in the garbage because it is all abrogated by The Quran and The Quran alone. You can only imagine how this would lead to a rabbit hole of insanity.

My rule of thumb is pretty simple

Use the secondary or tertiary sources (aka Hadiths) to see if it confirms with the primary source (The Quran aka The Furqaan). Don't do it the other way around. Quoting Spock from Star Trek, "Most Illogical"

By the way, is free-minds.org a legit Islamic website? I think it is, but I have my doubts.

[Guest Time]

I never understood this argument, that Islam copied Christianity or Judaism. Islam claims to be the continuation of those religions, how can there be plagiarism? Did The Hobbit copy Lord of the Rings? I'm not playing dumb to emphasize a point, I really can't fathom what they mean.