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In the Name of God بسم الله

Pride Month 2022

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Salamualaikum. It's June. You know what that means. The LGBTQRSTABCDEFG+++++++++++++++++++++ community are given all the attention. Exactly what Shaytan wants. Might as well call it "Shaytan's Month", since Shaytan couldn't be happier; not only were Allah's laws ignored and broken, but the fact that Allah's laws are broken is paraded in the streets, and given attention in the media, etc. 

I'm fed up with this. So much so that I actually want to get into an argument about 'why I don't support LGBTQ+++' or 'why I am so homophobic (or transphobic or biphobic or interphobic...)' just so I can prove the wokists wrong. Maybe one day.

Anyway, to the point. What are your thoughts about Shaytan's Month this year?

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, -Rejector- said:

I'm fed up with this. So much so that I actually want to get into an argument about 'why I don't support LGBTQ+++' or 'why I am so homophobic (or transphobic or biphobic or interphobic...)' just so I can prove the wokists wrong. Maybe one day.

Let's do it.  I'll play devils advocate.  

4 hours ago, -Rejector- said:

Anyway, to the point. What are your thoughts about Shaytan's Month this year?

It don't effect my life.  Why do you care so much? 

Edited by notme
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5 hours ago, Abu Hadi said:

Don't do that.  Balloons are fun but terrible for the environment.  

The rest are fine. Have fun.

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What are my thoughts? I think it is awfully strange that there exists a movement based on being proud of one's sexuality, romantic preferences, or gender or pronouns. Evidently, it exists to normalize and celebrate differences (which is not so terrible), but I don't understand why one needs to use 'pride' specifically to describe their sentiment about having any particular kind of orientation. 

What about gay/bi relationships or transgenderism in general? That's a more complicated and a far more loaded question. Bottom line, I think we need to look beyond our notions of "sin", widen our discourse to try and see the differences of opinions, and understand that as Muslims we are obligated to coexist and treat others with respect - no matter who or how they are. That's not called being woke. That's not some new, gen-z invention. It's simply a component of being a civilized human.

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On 6/2/2022 at 10:50 AM, notme said:

It don't effect my life.

You're lucky.

On 6/2/2022 at 10:50 AM, notme said:

Why do you care so much?

Because Allah's laws are broken and they feel proud about it. 

On 6/3/2022 at 4:29 AM, Ibn-e-Muhammad said:

as Muslims we are obligated to coexist and treat others with respect - no matter who or how they are.

Of course. We treat the people with respect. But no one ever said that we need to treat the ideology with respect - which is why I don't. But I do have to use (some form of) taqiyya sometimes with this topic because I'm worried someone will get worked up (more than they already do). 

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I'm a teacher in a public school.  Today a child confided in me that he is gay, and he is depressed because he can't let his parents know.

We don't have to celebrate sin, but we need to oppose the terrible abuses (like a child fearing that his parents will evict him, to the point that he becomes hopeless) that homosexual people suffer.  

I wish I knew a way to help this kid. 

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18 hours ago, -Rejector- said:

Because Allah's laws are broken and they feel proud about it. 

Do you feel just as strongly about heterosexual dating? 

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6 hours ago, notme said:

I'm a teacher in a public school.  Today a child confided in me that he is gay, and he is depressed because he can't let his parents know.

We don't have to celebrate sin, but we need to oppose the terrible abuses (like a child fearing that his parents will evict him, to the point that he becomes hopeless) that homosexual people suffer.  

I wish I knew a way to help this kid. 

Salam due that you can't  advise him to not have this wrong mindset but on the other hand you can find root cause  of his wrong conclusion  which certainly  he reached to this conclusion  under affection of his friends & pro gay environment  of schools & media in USA which a pushes  & encourages children to having this wrong  mindset  so it maybe you can help him to find new friends likewise encouraging him to play with your children in your house to reduce this affection  on him then you can give him true education  indirectly through  playing in a muslim house likewise  your house  to get rid of this wrong conclusion .

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20 hours ago, notme said:

Do you feel just as strongly about heterosexual dating? 

What do you mean? 

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11 minutes ago, -Rejector- said:

What do you mean? 

Exactly what I asked: are you as strongly opposed to heterosexual dating as you are to LGBT people existing? 

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18 minutes ago, notme said:

Exactly what I asked: are you as strongly opposed to heterosexual dating as you are to LGBT people existing? 

Oh that makes sense, my bad :ko:

I'd say I am, yes. But the reason I don't think about it as much as LGBTQIABCDEFG++++++++ is because in my life, personally, I don't see as much attention being put on (heterosexual) dating as LGBT+++. 

But definitely yes. 

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Well where I live, there are hijabis marching together with atheists gays in the pride parades. Why? Because they are Queers4Palestine. They write free palestine on their social media. And that is enough for muslims in the west to support a movement that defiles everything that Islam stands for

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6 hours ago, Dubilex said:

Well where I live, there are hijabis marching together with atheists gays in the pride parades. Why? Because they are Queers4Palestine. They write free palestine on their social media. And that is enough for muslims in the west to support a movement that defiles everything that Islam stands for

Alliances. 

Yes.  

Proof that we don't have to agree to work together toward common goals. 

Take a lesson from it.  

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3 hours ago, notme said:

Alliances. 

Yes.  

Proof that we don't have to agree to work together toward common goals. 

Take a lesson from it.  

When they add P for pedophelia will you still march and ally with them? 

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4 hours ago, Guest Wonder said:

When they add P for pedophelia will you still march and ally with them? 

No, but I've seen a lot more "muslims" speak in favor of pedophilia than homosexual folks in favor of it, and yet somehow I'm not identifying all of Islam with pedophilia, just a few demented perverts. 

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39 minutes ago, notme said:

No, but I've seen a lot more "muslims" speak in favor of pedophilia than homosexual folks in favor of it, and yet somehow I'm not identifying all of Islam with pedophilia, just a few demented perverts. 

So you will ally with various types of sinful behaviors, but if and when it becomes distasteful to you, you stop there. You call the shots. You decide what is too much for you to ally with. 

Where does God fit in the picture?

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58 minutes ago, Guest Wonder said:

So you will ally with various types of sinful behaviors, but if and when it becomes distasteful to you, you stop there. You call the shots.

Yes.... you don't? 

I work for an employer too.  And if they became too distasteful for me to continue, I would leave, as I've done before.  

This is strange to you? 

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1 hour ago, Guest Wonder said:

So you will ally with various types of sinful behaviors, but if and when it becomes distasteful to you, you stop there. You call the shots. You decide what is too much for you to ally with. 

Where does God fit in the picture?

Are you trying to tell me I should renounce Islam because a shocking number of "muslims" use Islam to justify their support for pedophilia? 

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9 hours ago, notme said:

Yes.... you don't? 

I work for an employer too.  And if they became too distasteful for me to continue, I would leave, as I've done before.  

This is strange to you? 

My point was, as Muslims we don't decide what sins are okay to ally with and what sins are not okay, based on our own whims. Sins are sins, God has already drawn the line. We don't associate ourselves or ally ourselves with those who are celebrating sinful lifestyles. If they say #freepalestine that is great for them. But we don't owe them any support back. 

9 hours ago, notme said:

Are you trying to tell me I should renounce Islam because a shocking number of "muslims" use Islam to justify their support for pedophilia? 

I don't follow, maybe you could explain what you mean. Of course you should not renounce Islam. 

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Posted (edited)
On 6/8/2022 at 12:22 PM, Dubilex said:

Well where I live, there are hijabis marching together with atheists gays in the pride parades. Why? Because they are Queers4Palestine. They write free palestine on their social media. And that is enough for muslims in the west to support a movement that defiles everything that Islam stands for

These are all Dajjals movements and this is how he/they misguides Muslims in the name of equality, freedom and justice that goes according these ungodly people. There is no joining with these people in common goals. Let them join themselves with their common goals. Muslims should ignore them but at the same time follow the Islamic principles to resepect them and let them be in their decisions.

Principle of Conciliation of the Hearts (Ta’līf al-Qulūb): This principle dictates that we need to conciliate our hearts with the hearts of non-Muslims in order to build an affinity with them and not act with them aggressively so that they can be lenient towards us and in fact even convert to Islam. The opposite of this principle is Primacy of Aggressiveness (Aṣālah al-Shiddah) which is often proclaimed by the Salafis. The evidence for both of these principles was discussed, which included a very lengthy discussion on [9:60].

What was concluded is that Islam encourages Islamic and Muslim identity by maintaining a difference between ourselves and non-Muslims, emphasizing that we are different than non-Muslims. At the same time, it is legally obligatory – as per the view of Shaykh Haider – to hate disbelief (kufr) and polytheism (shirk), but one can still maintain respect and act with fairness and goodness with the individual themselves. However, if they happen to be enemies then we are to act severely and harshly with them – and this enmity should be understood in a political context as the verses of the Qurān signify.

reference

Edited by Abu Nur
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49 minutes ago, Guest Wonder said:

I don't follow, maybe you could explain what you mean. Of course you should not renounce Islam

Sorry, I didn't realize you have difficulty reading English.  I should not assume everyone here is fluent.  

As I said, "muslims" are more likely to support pedophilia than homosexuals are.  You used pedophilia as a reason to not ally with LGBT people.  Do you mean we should not work with all groups who include members who support pedophilia, or just some of them? 

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2 hours ago, notme said:

Sorry, I didn't realize you have difficulty reading English.  I should not assume everyone here is fluent.  

As I said, "muslims" are more likely to support pedophilia than homosexuals are.  You used pedophilia as a reason to not ally with LGBT people.  Do you mean we should not work with all groups who include members who support pedophilia, or just some of them? 

I didn't use pedophilia as a reason not to ally with LGBT+++ people. I was asking a question, where do you draw the line? Is it based on something higher or is it based on the religion of notmeism? Based on your own likes/dislikes? If a student of yours told you they are in love with and have a relationship with a 5 year old, what would you do? If a student said they are in love with and have a relationship with their dog, what would you do? If a student told you they are in love with and have a relationship with their sibling, what would you do? Anyway, doesn't matter, I got the answer to my question. You base your support on how much you personally are affected or disgusted by something, not on what is allowed by the one who created us and knows us better than we know ourselves. Gotcha. 

What other Muslims do or support doesn't effect my support of Islam if that is what you are asking. 

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What´s there to say? it´s an absolutely despicable deed that goes contrary to every religion and human well-being 
I don´t give it much thought personally, thankfully it´s not shoved in my face 24 \ 7 where I live, no use wasting my energy on something I can´t change. 

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Posted (edited)
8 hours ago, Abu Nur said:

These are all Dajjals movements and this is how he/they misguides Muslims in the name of equality, freedom and justice that goes according these ungodly people. There is no joining with these people in common goals. Let them join themselves with their common goals. Muslims should ignore them but at the same time follow the Islamic principles to resepect them and let them be in their decisions.

Principle of Conciliation of the Hearts (Ta’līf al-Qulūb): This principle dictates that we need to conciliate our hearts with the hearts of non-Muslims in order to build an affinity with them and not act with them aggressively so that they can be lenient towards us and in fact even convert to Islam. The opposite of this principle is Primacy of Aggressiveness (Aṣālah al-Shiddah) which is often proclaimed by the Salafis. The evidence for both of these principles was discussed, which included a very lengthy discussion on [9:60].

What was concluded is that Islam encourages Islamic and Muslim identity by maintaining a difference between ourselves and non-Muslims, emphasizing that we are different than non-Muslims. At the same time, it is legally obligatory – as per the view of Shaykh Haider – to hate disbelief (kufr) and polytheism (shirk), but one can still maintain respect and act with fairness and goodness with the individual themselves. However, if they happen to be enemies then we are to act severely and harshly with them – and this enmity should be understood in a political context as the verses of the Qurān signify.

reference

The question is, how long can we afford to ignore the Pride movement? If you live in a muslim country, that's not much of an issue. But if you live in western countries and intend raise your kids and grandkids there, then I don't know how much we can afford to just stay out of it. Because, right now, the LGBT movement is penetrating every facet of society. They have drag shows in school, drag queen story hour and Pride flags in classrooms. They're trying to get kids to undergo hormone therapy. Every company, every movie and Netflix are pushing the Pride agenda

If muslims don't speak out now, eventually your kids and grandkids will become kuffar. They will stray away from the truth. They will engage in all sorts of haram behaviour.

Edited by Dubilex
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7 hours ago, Guest Wonder said:

If a student of yours told you they are in love with and have a relationship with a 5 year old, what would you do? If a student said they are in love with and have a relationship with their dog, what would you do? If a student told you they are in love with and have a relationship with their sibling, what would you do?

I'm a mandated reporter.  Any relationship not between consenting adults is considered abuse and I'd report it to the authorities, as is required as a condition of my employment.  

"Being gay" is not the same thing as having sex outside of marriage.  You would condemn a person, even a child, for their thoughts? 

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On 6/9/2022 at 9:38 AM, Qa'im said:

It hurts children who, by default, will lack a father or a mother if they are adopted by a same-sex couple.

It hurts boys who are being chemically-castrated by doctors.

It hurts teenage girls who think that removing their breasts ("top surgery") will solve their bodily insecurities.

It hurts people by promoting a lifestyle that has a greater risk of STDs.

It hurts people who are undergoing experimental hormone therapy with long-term consequences.

It hurts women who now have to share bathrooms with individuals with penises.

It hurts people who are now exposed to public nudity, not for an event, not for a day, but for a whole month every year, and sometimes longer.

It hurts people whose gender dysphoria is being affirmed and rationalized by the medical and educational industries.

It hurts expression by coercing people by law to use new pronouns and adjectives.

It hurts those who are now at a 40% risk of attempting suicide.

It hurts 21% of a generation that identify with it (21% of Gen Z now identify as LGBT. Why is it doubling every generation?)

It hurts a society through further identity politics and division.

It hurts. Stop saying that it doesn't.

The gentleman doth protest too much, methinks.

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On 6/9/2022 at 3:16 PM, Abu Nur said:

Principle of Conciliation of the Hearts (Ta’līf al-Qulūb): This principle dictates that we need to conciliate our hearts with the hearts of non-Muslims in order to build an affinity with them and not act with them aggressively so that they can be lenient towards us and in fact even convert to Islam. The opposite of this principle is Primacy of Aggressiveness (Aṣālah al-Shiddah) which is often proclaimed by the Salafis. The evidence for both of these principles was discussed, which included a very lengthy discussion on [9:60].

What was concluded is that Islam encourages Islamic and Muslim identity by maintaining a difference between ourselves and non-Muslims, emphasizing that we are different than non-Muslims. At the same time, it is legally obligatory – as per the view of Shaykh Haider – to hate disbelief (kufr) and polytheism (shirk), but one can still maintain respect and act with fairness and goodness with the individual themselves. However, if they happen to be enemies then we are to act severely and harshly with them – and this enmity should be understood in a political context as the verses of the Qurān signify.

Salam "Principle of Conciliation of the Hearts (Ta’līf al-Qulūb)" doesn't mean participating in & verifying sinful acts of non-muslims but on the other hand is for helping non-Muslim in finacial problems or solving problems of groups of them that want to have a religious lifestyle with dignity & modesty in order to their hearts becomes soft & clear  for accepting Islam but on the other hand marching besides gay under disguise of Ta’līf al-Qulūb is totally void & wrong which surly marching besides gays & participating in pride march by muslims especially Hijabi women doesn't cause that gays & hemosexuals to leave their sin & accept Islam but on the other hand causes shame & defame for muslims especially Hijabi women.

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5 hours ago, Ashvazdanghe said:

Salam "Principle of Conciliation of the Hearts (Ta’līf al-Qulūb)" doesn't mean participating in & verifying sinful acts of non-muslims but on the other hand is for helping non-Muslim in finacial problems or solving problems of groups of them that want to have a religious lifestyle with dignity & modesty in order to their hearts becomes soft & clear  for accepting Islam but on the other hand marching besides gay under disguise of Ta’līf al-Qulūb is totally void & wrong which surly marching besides gays & participating in pride march by muslims especially Hijabi women doesn't cause that gays & hemosexuals to leave their sin & accept Islam but on the other hand causes shame & defame for muslims especially Hijabi women.

I have never even indicated that this principle means we need to support and march besides them. 

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I won't share it, but there's videos around of Pride marches where there are adults exhibiting overtly sexual behaviour and children close by ...

one sad person posted that they support Pride but asked why it can't be done more 'decently'.

It can't.

Because the whole concept is about what you do in your bedroom owning the public space.

Relatedly, pride is one of the seven deadly sins.

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