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In the Name of God بسم الله

Something keeps trying to get me to switchfrom Shia!!!

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Lion of Shia

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On 12/2/2021 at 6:06 PM, Lion of Shia said:

Eveytime i go to Shia something create confusion in my mind, It makes me want to try Malik fiqh and Sufism, is this thi whispers of shaytan? I try to stay shia but something trys to convince meothersiwse, what should i do?

If you have any doubts, ask us or even better than that, ask a sheikh or a marja.^

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Don't give into the guys that want to convert you to Sunnism. Tell them that I am fine being a Shia. You don't want to risk giving up being a Shia of Mahdi.

Don't fall for it. Keep your imaan strong.

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My faith used to be shaky like that until I researched more and more and I am convinced with certainty I will not turn from ahl al bayt. My advice keep researching bro 

salam

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My problem when I was sunni, nobody could answer this verse

وإذ ابتلى إبراهيم ربه بكلمات فأتمهن قال إني جاعلك للناس إماما قال ومن ذريتي قال لا ينال عهدي الظالمين

People are always asking "show me a verse of the 12 imams". I don't get it, show me a verse that says I need to pray 5 times a day. Then they bring out Hadith.

صـلـّوا كـمـا رأيـتـمـونـي أصـلـّي،
 
I said "No brazar, no no no,  you naughty naughty, only Quran, only Quran"
 
Then we can debate if aqidah ONLY comes fro the Quran or not.
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Guest Barazar
On 12/3/2021 at 1:12 PM, 145_turbo_16V said:

My problem when I was sunni, nobody could answer this verse

وإذ ابتلى إبراهيم ربه بكلمات فأتمهن قال إني جاعلك للناس إماما قال ومن ذريتي قال لا ينال عهدي الظالمين

People are always asking "show me a verse of the 12 imams". I don't get it, show me a verse that says I need to pray 5 times a day. Then they bring out Hadith.

صـلـّوا كـمـا رأيـتـمـونـي أصـلـّي،
 
I said "No brazar, no no no,  you naughty naughty, only Quran, only Quran"
 
Then we can debate if aqidah ONLY comes fro the Quran or not.
 

I don’t think you understand it’s a simple formulae by using simple logic……here I will make it easy for you braza……just keep it simple and no need to look or search for something that is not there in the first place.

The commands to offer Salah are 700 times mentioned in the Quran. The word Salah appears 67 times in the Quran. The Salah and Zakat 32 times come together in the Quran.

The five times of Prayer are not explicitly written in the Quran, although they're certainly implied.

For example, the Surah 11 Hud, Ayat 114-114 reads, "And establish the Prayer at the two ends of the day and in the first hours of the night. Indeed the good deeds drive away the evil deeds. This is a Reminder to those who are mindful of Allah."

This seems to refer to Salat al-fajr, Salat al-maghriband Salat al-'isha.

Surah 50 Qaf Ayat 39 goes, "Therefore, O Prophet (saws), bear with patience whatever they say, and keep up glorifying your Lord with his praise, before sunrise and before sunset. And glorify Him again in the night and also when are free from prostrations."

This seems to refer to Salat al-fajr, Salat al-asr and Salat al-'isha.

Surah 30 Rum Ayat 17-18 states, "So, glorify Allah in the evening and in the morning; all praise is for Him in the heavens and the earth- as well as in the afternoon and at noon."

This seems to refer to Salat al-fajr, Salat al-zuhr, Salat al-asr and Salat al-magrib.

If you take them together, they point to the Salat needing to be prayed five times a day.

I believe your problem stems from not understanding simplicity of Quran which is clear and easily understood and clear in commands especially if you aren’t looking for hidden meanings.

Now brazar if you can start divine Imamate of 12 as easy as salah as above clearly explained from Quran then yes you was a smart Sunni who made the right decision to go shia……If you can’t……Then brazar your not as smart as you think you are.

No offence brazar.

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The fact that you admit confusion, I hope you can consider your confusion. 
 

Many of us are confused throughout life, that is okay. Whoever doesn’t accept your confusion is usually the stubborn. Because they always believe they are right. 
 

with that said, I will try to help clear some confusion you may have. 
 

You can’t convert to either party, you just correct your ideology of Islam. 
 

both parties are wrong to label yourself either one. A true Muslim will love both sides, understand both sides, and use logic. So figure out what confuses you, and we can help make it clearer for you. 
 

muhammad was a Muslim, ali was a Muslim, Jesus was a Muslim, musa was a Muslim, hussain was a Muslim, umar was a Muslim, abu bakr was a muslim. 

you just need more education on whatever subject it is that confuses you. But you should start by not having to claim a party. As anyone who does, even the SHIEKHS who label themselves, need more educating. NONE ARE PERFECT. Only the prophets, who were selected by Allah. 
 

not Ali, not abu bakr, not my gido. 

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10 hours ago, Guest Barazar said:

I don’t think you understand it’s a simple formulae by using simple logic……here I will make it easy for you braza……just keep it simple and no need to look or search for something that is not there in the first place.

The commands to offer Salah are 700 times mentioned in the Quran. The word Salah appears 67 times in the Quran. The Salah and Zakat 32 times come together in the Quran.

The five times of Prayer are not explicitly written in the Quran, although they're certainly implied.

For example, the Surah 11 Hud, Ayat 114-114 reads, "And establish the Prayer at the two ends of the day and in the first hours of the night. Indeed the good deeds drive away the evil deeds. This is a Reminder to those who are mindful of Allah."

This seems to refer to Salat al-fajr, Salat al-maghriband Salat al-'isha.

Surah 50 Qaf Ayat 39 goes, "Therefore, O Prophet (saws), bear with patience whatever they say, and keep up glorifying your Lord with his praise, before sunrise and before sunset. And glorify Him again in the night and also when are free from prostrations."

This seems to refer to Salat al-fajr, Salat al-asr and Salat al-'isha.

Surah 30 Rum Ayat 17-18 states, "So, glorify Allah in the evening and in the morning; all praise is for Him in the heavens and the earth- as well as in the afternoon and at noon."

This seems to refer to Salat al-fajr, Salat al-zuhr, Salat al-asr and Salat al-magrib.

If you take them together, they point to the Salat needing to be prayed five times a day.

I believe your problem stems from not understanding simplicity of Quran which is clear and easily understood and clear in commands especially if you aren’t looking for hidden meanings.

Now brazar if you can start divine Imamate of 12 as easy as salah as above clearly explained from Quran then yes you was a smart Sunni who made the right decision to go shia……If you can’t……Then brazar your not as smart as you think you are.

No offence brazar.

 

Who said that amount of imams need to be shown trough the Quran so that it will validate the 12 Imams? The prayer yes, because it is an daily practice that need to be appointed at fixed time, as God says it in Quran.

As for the concept of Imamate itself is in Quran and no one deny it. What people differ is with the definition of the Imamate, but both Sunnis and Shias do agree that there are twelves Imams after the Prophet by narrations that can not be denied. The appointed 12 khulafa are exactly the Imams who are choosed by God to guide the Ummah.

There is narrations where Prophet (saws) said that he is leaving among us two khulafa (but mostly two precious things), the Qur’an and his Ahlubayt, thus the Qur’an and members of Ahlubayt are the Imams/Khulafa of this Ummah who guide us and never bring us astray:

Narrated Jabir bin 'Abdullah:

"I saw the Messenger of Allah during his Hajj, on the Day of 'Arafah. He was upon his camel Al-Qaswa, giving a Khutbah, so he said: 'O people! Indeed, I have left among you, that which if you hold fast to it, you shall not go astray: The Book of Allah and my family, the people of my house.'"

حَدَّثَنَا نَصْرُ بْنُ عَبْدِ الرَّحْمَنِ الْكُوفِيُّ، قَالَ حَدَّثَنَا زَيْدُ بْنُ الْحَسَنِ، هُوَ الأَنْمَاطِيُّ عَنْ جَعْفَرِ بْنِ مُحَمَّدٍ، عَنْ أَبِيهِ، عَنْ جَابِرِ بْنِ عَبْدِ اللَّهِ، قَالَ رَأَيْتُ رَسُولَ اللَّهِ صلى الله عليه وسلم فِي حَجَّتِهِ يَوْمَ عَرَفَةَ وَهُوَ عَلَى نَاقَتِهِ الْقَصْوَاءِ يَخْطُبُ فَسَمِعْتُهُ يَقُولُ ‏ "‏ يَا أَيُّهَا النَّاسُ إِنِّي قَدْ تَرَكْتُ فِيكُمْ مَا إِنْ أَخَذْتُمْ بِهِ لَنْ تَضِلُّوا كِتَابَ اللَّهِ وَعِتْرَتِي أَهْلَ بَيْتِي ‏"‏ ‏.‏وَفِي الْبَابِ عَنْ أَبِي ذَرٍّ وَأَبِي سَعِيدٍ وَزَيْدِ بْنِ أَرْقَمَ وَحُذَيْفَةَ بْنِ أَسِيدٍ ‏.‏ وَهَذَا حَدِيثٌ حَسَنٌ غَرِيبٌ مِنْ هَذَا الْوَجْهِ ‏.‏ وَزَيْدُ بْنُ الْحَسَنِ قَدْ رَوَى عَنْهُ سَعِيدُ بْنُ سُلَيْمَانَ وَغَيْرُ وَاحِدٍ مِنْ أَهْلِ الْعِلْمِ ‏.‏

Grade: Sahih (Darussalam)

Sunnah.com reference : Book 49, Hadith 185

English translation : Vol. 1, Book 46, Hadith 3786

Arabic reference : Book 49, Hadith 4155

And these are the people of authority who God said that we should obey them:

O you who have believed, obey Allah and obey the Messenger and those in authority among you. And if you disagree over anything, refer it to Allah and the Messenger, if you should believe in Allah and the Last Day. That is the best [way] and best in result. Quran 4:59

This obedience is connected to same level as Prophet obedience by the verse itself. And they can not be those who are sinful and command to sinful things. And they are infallible by the Quranic verse 33:33

- what kind of muslims are those who are commanded to hold on to two things for guidance but they throw one and keep one. As how valuable you hold Quran, as how eager you recite it, as how eager you refer and study to it, you need to also do this to Ahlubayt. Those People who claim to follow them, but why dont they focus fully only on them, follow them as their companion, take the narrations and guidance only from Ahlubayt, as narration indicate, but rather they only do that for Quran, when both of them need equal obedience. 

Edited by Abu Nur
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My point was simple, if you use QURAN ONLY, can you point where it says "I need to pray 5 times a day"? Does it?  Go re-read my statement again in case you don't understand.

Let's look at your points

11:114 Sahih International: And establish prayer at the two ends of the day and at the approach of the night. Indeed, good deeds do away with misdeeds. That is a reminder for those who remember.

You claim 3 salats, fajr (at one end) and maghrib and isya (the other end).

But tell me, where does it explicitly  say "1 at one and and 2 at the other end" ?? Where? If you DID NOT HAVE HADITH, how would you conclude that? You can claim that because you can map the solutions you already have to the verses in the Quran. Suppose you didn't know what the salats were, now can you still tell me that there are 2 salats at one end of the day and 1 salat at the beginning of the day? 

50:39 Sahih International: So be patient, [O Muhammad], over what they say and exalt [Allah] with praise of your Lord before the rising of the sun and before its setting,

You claim "This seems to refer to Salat al-fajr, Salat al-asr and Salat al-'isha."

Again it says salat before the rising sun and before the setting sun, 2 salats, no 3. Again, WITHOUT HADITH, how would you know which salat is which is?

My point was simple, salat is in the Quran, Imamah is also in the Quran. Period. End of.

But when it comes to Imamah they say "no no no Quran only show me 12, show me 12 explicitly".

didn't say which one was more detailed and which one is less detailed. Go read my statement again, where did  I claim, as you seem to infer "Salat and Imamah both have very detailed evidences in the Quran, both equally presented"  Where did I say that?

 

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9 hours ago, Guest Samir said:

not Ali, not abu bakr, not my gido. 

Salam the person who has confused is you because It's clear that every muslim must choose Amir al mumin Imam Ali(عليه السلام) not anyone from his opponents , your example is likewise people who couldn't deciced to join Amir al mumin Imam Ali(عليه السلام) or army of Jamal in battle of camel which Amir al mumin Imam Ali(عليه السلام) has said to them your confusion is due not understanding truth/Haq by you , if you knew  truth/Haq then you would recognize who is right & who is wrong .

Quote

Doubt is named doubt (al-shubhah) because it resembles truth. As for lovers of Allah, their conviction serves them as light and the direction of the right path (itself) serves as their guide; while the enemies of Allah, in time of doubt call to misguidance in the darkness of doubt and their guide is blindness (of intelligence). One who fears death cannot escape it nor can one who loves eternal life secure it.

https://www.al-islam.org/nahjul-balagha-part-1-sermons/sermon-38-doubt-called-doubt-because

Quote

The right is not known by  characters. Know the truth itself so that you know its followers

Majma' al-bayan , v 1 , p211

امام علی(ع) در این باره می فرماید: «إِنَّ الْحَقَّ لا یعرَفُ بِالرِّجالِ، اِعرفِ الْحقَّ تَعرِف أهلَهُ؛ حق به شخصیت ها شناخته نمی شود. خودِ حق را بشناس تا پیروان آن را بشناسی» («مجمع البیان»، ج 1، ص 211).

https://en.wikishia.net/view/Majma'_al-bayan_fi_tafsir_al-Qur'an_(book)

https://hawzah.net/fa/Magazine/View/5864/5873/59485/گامی-به-سوی-نور-"نمونه-پرسش-و-پاسخ-های-واحد-پاسخگویی-به-پرسشهای-حدیثی"

Quote

Hadith n. 262
262- It is said that al-Harith ibn Hawt came to Amir al-mu'minin, and said: Do you believe I can ever imagine that the people of Jamal were in the wrong? Amir al-mu'minin, peace be upon him, said: O al-Harith! You have seen below yourself but not above yourself, and so you have been confused. Certainly, you have not known right, so that you can recognize the righteous. And you have not known wrong, so that you can recognize the people of wrong! Then al-Harith said: In that case, I shall withdraw along with Sa'd ibn Malik and 'Abdullah: ibn 'Umar; whereupon Amir al-mu'minin, peace be upon him, said: Verily, Sa'd and 'Umar have neither sided with Right nor forsaken Wrong. 66

262. وقيل: إنّ الحارث بن حَوْطٍ أتاه عليه السلام فقال: أتُراني أظنّ أصحابَ الجمل كانوا على ضلالة؟ فقال عليه السلام : يَا حَارثِ، إِنَّكَ نَظَرْتَ تَحْتَكَ وَلَمْ تَنْظُرْ فَوْقَكَ فَحِرْتَ إِنَّكَ لَمْ تَعْرِفِ الْحَقَّ فَتَعْرِفَ مَنْ أَتاهُ، وَلَمْ تَعْرِفِ الْبَاطِلَ فَتَعْرِفَ مَنْ أَتَاهُ. فقال الحارث: فإنّي أَعتزل مع سعيد بن مالك وعبد الله بن عمر. فقال عليه السلام : إِنَّ سَعِيداً وَعَبْدَ اللهِ بْنَ عُمَرَ لَمْ يَنْصُرَا الْحَقَّ، وَلَمْ يَخْذُلاَ الْبَاطِلَ.

https://www.al-islam.org/nahjul-balagha-part-2-letters-and-sayings/selections-sayings-and-preaching-amir-al-muminin-ali#hadith-n-262

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I think your hunch is right, these are the whispers of the shaitan. Why? Because you said you were considering being Maliki or Sufi.

How different are those two sects? One is nothing like the other. That means there isn't one thing in them that they BOTH have which Shiaism doesn't that can make you ask this question. This whisper is saying: "I don't care what sect you pick, just stop being Shia!"

Brother you've been through a lot and have come through obstacles a thousand times worse than this. I have confidence that you will remain Shia until the end, and will receive compensation for all that you've overcome.

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