Can I start my own mosque?

[musa shakr]

There is no mosque in my town can I hold prayer service out of my home. Some here suggested I start my own If I can't move where one is.

[Mark Enlightment]

You can do so whether there was one or not, but for a place to be considered a mosque is has to be designed for that, and not be merely a room used for praying.

[Ali bin Hussein]

Go for it brother. Start a funding scheme to help build the mosque. Many of us can spread the word.

[musa shakr]

2 hours ago, Ali bin Hussein said:

Go for it brother. Start a funding scheme to help build the mosque. Many of us can spread the word.

I need to find some Muslims to make the congregation first. That may not be possible.

[Ali bin Hussein]

4 minutes ago, musa shakr said:

I need to find some Muslims to make the congregation first. That may not be possible.

Why are you asking about building a Mosque when you have no congregation ?

[musa shakr]

4 minutes ago, Ali bin Hussein said:

Why are you asking about building a Mosque when you have no congregation ?

I used to have one I was the eldest in a convert community that fell apart I was voted to lead it, I thought I may try again. My family owns some property I can put a large tent on maybe if i can find 4 or five people I could do it. I just want a place for congregational prayer.

[Ali bin Hussein]

2 minutes ago, musa shakr said:

I used to have one I was the eldest in a convert community that fell apart I was voted to lead it, I thought I may try again. My family owns some property I can put a large tent on maybe if i can find 4 or five people I could do it. I just want a place for congregational prayer.

Ok so start the project. Put up a tent for now. Start an online fundraising program for building a mosque. I will help and I'm sure others will. 

PM me and we can get working. 

Inshallah

[musa shakr]

17 minutes ago, Ali bin Hussein said:

Ok so start the project. Put up a tent for now. Start an online fundraising program for building a mosque. I will help and I'm sure others will. 

PM me and we can get working. 

Inshallah

I just told my parents i could get funding and they backed out of letting me use the property the second I told them I could get funding. They're afraid of me being attacked again. they originally said I could. the guy that owns the property next door is a gun nut and they're afraid. Thank you no ones offered to help fund anything before It was always out of my pocket.

Edited July 13, 2021 by musa shakr

[Ali bin Hussein]

15 hours ago, musa shakr said:

I just told my parents i could get funding and they backed out of letting me use the property the second I told them I could get funding. They're afraid of me being attacked again. they originally said I could. the guy that owns the property next door is a gun nut and they're afraid. Thank you no ones offered to help fund anything before It was always out of my pocket.

Be careful with your words. I didn't say I would  fund you. I said start a fundraising charity appeal. That's all above board and you would be in control.

We can help spread the word and help set up an appeal etc but if your life is in danger then just work on personal Islam. And give dawa through actions and simple personal conversation with people you trust.

[musa shakr]

15 hours ago, Ali bin Hussein said:

Be careful with your words. I didn't say I would  fund you. I said start a fundraising charity appeal. That's all above board and you would be in control.

We can help spread the word and help set up an appeal etc but if your life is in danger then just work on personal Islam. And give dawa through actions and simple personal conversation with people you trust.

I'm sorry i misspoke that's still more then I've ever been offered thank you very very much just for that.

[Ali bin Hussein]

Just now, musa shakr said:

I'm sorry i misspoke that's still more then I've ever been offered thank you very very much just for that.

Any time brother. Any help you need the ummah is here to help. 

[Abu Hadi]

If there is no community where you live, there is no need to build a masjid. If you just need a place to do Salat, you can do that anywhere. 

Edited July 13, 2021 by Abu Hadi

[musa shakr]

1 minute ago, Abu Hadi said:

If there is no community where you live, there is no need to build a masjid. 

there are muslims but they all practice in there homes or are nation of Islam

[Abu Hadi]

NOI is it's own religion, it is not Islam, so these people are not Muslims. If there are actual Muslims there, try to get some data on this, i.e. how many families in which areas, etc. You need good data to do any project like this. Once you have the data, we can advise you on the next steps.

I'm not trying to criticize you brother, but the way you're going about this, you have the steps backward. You are trying to figure out a location before you have even established that there is a need. You need to first establish that there is a need, then we can talk about the specifics. The first step to establishing a need is gathering some basic demographic data on the Muslim population in your area. Unfortunately in the US, official US census data does not include religion, otherwise you would have been able to use this free source. 

You will probably have to make a guess as to where the families are, then go and knock on doors and ask them. Make sure you keep good, detailed records about each household and where it is. If people don't want to give their name, specifics, then don't ask for this. Many people are suspicious of people who come knocking on their door in America. I know that. Just ask if they are muslim and would they be interested in supporting a project to establish a masjid in the area. If they say 'Yes', then just get as much information as they are willing to share and record it, and keep it in a secure source, like a notebook or a spreadsheet on a computer. 

Once you have completed that step, then we can have a discussion on the next step. Rome wasn't buillt in a day. These things take time, but you are rewarded by Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) for every step you take fe Sibilillah. 

Edited July 13, 2021 by Abu Hadi

[notme]

You can invite Muslims into your home to pray communally with you, or if there are too many for your home, you can rent a pubic space. If there is enough community to support it, you can start collecting funds to build an Islamic center. 

There are special rules for an actual mosque, but people can gather and pray anywhere, so an Islamic center is easier and probably more convenient. 

When you get to that point in a few years, send me a message and I can advise and possibly assist your group with land use aspects such as access, parking, and zoning. 

[realizm]

Why not leave the brother do his thing ? First time I hear people advising someone not to do a good deed. 

You all associate a mosque with a congregation, that's so typically western.

Ever been in Islamic countries, sometimes you are in a remote place and think "wow thank God there is a mosque here" ? 

Well today it may be the same in our Western societies, especially with GPS locating features, many people one wouldn't expect to be living around might benefit from such a mosque. 

@Abu Hadi brother you leave in the epicenter of Islam in the US, but if I am correct, sister @notme does not live near a mosque. If I'm wrong I'm sorry, but anyway this forum is full of threads where somebody looks for a mosque around but finds none.

Even if it benefits one sincere person each month, it might turn out to be more rewarding than just building another husseiniya in a Muslim area where people will come on Muharram to cry, fill their stomachs and then disappear until next Laylat ul Qadr.

[notme]

11 minutes ago, realizm said:

but if I am correct, sister @notme does not live near a mosque.

There is a sunni organization within short driving distance from my house. I've never visited them. It is small and I don't know anyone there. I never never lived near a shia center in my entire 17-year Muslim life - as far as I know. Clannishness is a real problem in small Muslim communities. I understand fear of strangers, but still .... 

[Abu Hadi]

12 hours ago, realizm said:

Why not leave the brother do his thing ? First time I hear people advising someone not to do a good deed. 

You all associate a mosque with a congregation, that's so typically western.

Ever been in Islamic countries, sometimes you are in a remote place and think "wow thank God there is a mosque here" ? 

Well today it may be the same in our Western societies, especially with GPS locating features, many people one wouldn't expect to be living around might benefit from such a mosque. 

@Abu Hadi brother you leave in the epicenter of Islam in the US, but if I am correct, sister @notme does not live near a mosque. If I'm wrong I'm sorry, but anyway this forum is full of threads where somebody looks for a mosque around but finds none.

Even if it benefits one sincere person each month, it might turn out to be more rewarding than just building another husseiniya in a Muslim area where people will come on Muharram to cry, fill their stomachs and then disappear until next Laylat ul Qadr.

If u want to build a mosque in the US this takes lots of money, dealing with zoning laws, city ordinances, city government and sometimes state government. Its not like other places where you can just erect a structure and invite people in. If it were that easy there would be a masjid on every street corner.

Im saying it because i want him to succeed not discourage him. In order to succeed you need a plan and sufficient support to navigate the process.

He could put up a tent in his backyard, but inviting people you dont know well into your backyard in the US makes you legally and financially responsible for anything that happens to them on your property. That's why people don't open up masjids on their personal property or in their home. They are set up as a legal entity that is independent of any 1 person.

[musa shakr]

3 hours ago, Abu Hadi said:

If u want to build a mosque in the US this takes lots of money, dealing with zoning laws, city ordinances, city government and sometimes state government. Its not like other places where you can just erect a structure and invite people in. If it were that easy there would be a masjid on every street corner.

Im saying it because i want him to succeed not discourage him. In order to succeed you need a plan and sufficient support to navigate the process.

He could put up a tent in his backyard, but inviting people you dont know well into your backyard in the US makes you legally and financially responsible for anything that happens to them on your property. That's why people don't open up masjids on their personal property or in their home. They are set up as a legal entity that is independent of any 1 person.

Thanks for your response I didn't realize the complexity of what I was asking.

[MexicanVato]

14 hours ago, musa shakr said:

the guy that owns the property next door is a gun nut and they're afraid.

Have you or your family talked to the guy? I hate the liberal whiny phrase of gun nuts. Look if you’re a male and are oppose to guns you’re soft like a pin cushion. I know many Muslims that pack pistols and rifles. We mean no harm it’s for our protection. 

[Muhammed Ali]

59 minutes ago, MexicanVato said:

Look if you’re a male and are oppose to guns you’re soft like a pin cushion.

I would rather live in a country where school children are not in danger of being killed by a crazy person with a gun.

[MexicanVato]

37 minutes ago, Muhammed Ali said:

I would rather live in a country where school children are not in danger of being killed by a crazy person with a gun.

Yea do you have actual statistics to back that children are being murdered in school so prolifically? And to think some vatos here think jihad of a physical nature needs to be executed, yet most men of this ummah are soft like silk Victoria secret garments. 

[Patient Warrior]

2 hours ago, MexicanVato said:

Have you or your family talked to the guy? I hate the liberal whiny phrase of gun nuts. Look if you’re a male and are oppose to guns you’re soft like a pin cushion. I know many Muslims that pack pistols and rifles. We mean no harm it’s for our protection.

100% agree. The individual should have access to firearms/weapons of war and make the most out of it. Go to the range, educate yourself on bullets, caliber, cleaning-kits and on its usage with laws in states that have 'Stand your ground' implemented. It's literally the modern sword.

Tyranny is always around the corner when citizens are stripped of weapons. The people keep the government in check just as much as vice versa.

[Muhammed Ali]

1 hour ago, Patient Warrior said:

It's literally the modern sword.

What is the sword of the future? A WMD? A serious question.

Do you think there should be a limit to how powerful a personal weapon should be? If there is a limit then how will you defend against the state (your guns are useless compared to what the state has. It's almost a redundant argument.)? If there is no limit then how will you keep the people safe?

Edited July 14, 2021 by Muhammed Ali

[Muhammed Ali]

2 hours ago, MexicanVato said:

Yea do you have actual statistics to back that children are being murdered in school so prolifically?

The number has to be compared to how many your guns will help save against the state. So how many people will survive because your guns will keep you safe? If the US government decides to attack you, how many lives will you save with your guns?

Also elaborate upon why and how the state may attack you. This will help us understand how your guns may be used.

Edited July 14, 2021 by Muhammed Ali

[MexicanVato]

4 minutes ago, Muhammed Ali said:

The number has to be compared to how many your guns will help save against the state. So how many people will survive because your guns will keep you safe? If the US government decides to attack you, how many lives will you save with your guns?

So if an army came to enslave your family, you’d just accept it because you think it will allow more people to be alive. Imagine if the Nabi (sawa) or imam husayn (عليه السلام) thought like this or perhaps our current Imam the great Mahdi would think such negative thoughts. Smh defend your family akhi. 

[musa shakr]

5 hours ago, MexicanVato said:

Have you or your family talked to the guy? I hate the liberal whiny phrase of gun nuts. Look if you’re a male and are oppose to guns you’re soft like a pin cushion. I know many Muslims that pack pistols and rifles. We mean no harm it’s for our protection. 

I strongly support gun rights I was using my dads words to describe him. He's a middle class redneck the neighbor not my dad. I probably shouldn't have called him a "gun nut" your right I agree. I've considered a concealed weapons permit there easy to get where I live but my dad won't allow anyone but himself to have guns in the house and I respect that. I'm a conservative but anti-trump

Edited July 14, 2021 by musa shakr
add stuff

[Patient Warrior]

3 hours ago, Muhammed Ali said:

What is the sword of the future? A WMD? A serious question.

Since neither of us can predict the future this question is irrelevant. Just like the swordsman of old could never have predicted the gun slingers of today. But shoot, I’ll give it a try.

Ray guns. I’m calling it.

WMD aren’t just weapons. They’re more so deterrents to be used to intimidate nations. Not fit to be compared to guns.

Kinda interesting how the US is interested in making sure nobody else has access to nukes though, huh?

3 hours ago, Muhammed Ali said:

Do you think there should be a limit to how powerful a personal weapon should be? If there is a limit then how will you defend against the state (your guns are useless compared to what the state has. It's almost a redundant argument.)? If there is no limit then how will you keep the people safe?

No. The second amendment is meant to give individuals access to weapons of war. Not just for hunting or recreational shooting. The limit of this weapon’s power should be the same as an assigned soldier’s capabilities. But we already have restrictions on  certain bullet types and bans on military issued assault rifles. (I.E. M4 or M16) so whatever.

3 hours ago, Muhammed Ali said:

how will you keep the people safe?

What do you mean how will we keep the people safe? We have the means to fight back violently. Don’t be naive.

3 hours ago, Muhammed Ali said:

Also elaborate upon why and how the state may attack you.

Have you just never studied history? I seriously am baffled. Start with Kristallnacht or Katanagari. The governments of the world and history have track records of abusing and killing their own people for a plethora of agendas. I really hope your faith in the government doesn’t stem from you believing that because you pay taxes you’re entitled. If given a decree the police and soldiers of any state would massacre you like sheep. That goes for ANY country.

And before anyone raises the point that armed citizens won’t stand a chance. Terrence Popp who’s an ex US army delta special forces soldier had studied unconventional warfare for decades stated “It only takes 3% of a population to over throw an occupying military force.”

I believe you’re tremendously underestimating guerrilla war. Like I said the citizens must have the ability to keep their government in check as well. That can only be done by having access to the same weapons.

[notme]

All this gun discussion is off topic. Please return to the topic of building a mosque. 

https://www.shiachat.com/forum/topic/235071616-self-defence-in-non-muslim-lands/

Edited July 14, 2021 by notme

[Abu Hadi]

23 hours ago, notme said:

All this gun discussion is off topic. Please return to the topic of building a mosque. 

https://www.shiachat.com/forum/topic/235071616-self-defence-in-non-muslim-lands/

I agree, I'll clean up the thread and hide irrelevant / OT posts. 

[realizm]

On 7/14/2021 at 12:19 AM, Abu Hadi said:

If u want to build a mosque in the US this takes lots of money, dealing with zoning laws, city ordinances, city government and sometimes state government. Its not like other places where you can just erect a structure and invite people in. If it were that easy there would be a masjid on every street corner.

Im saying it because i want him to succeed not discourage him. In order to succeed you need a plan and sufficient support to navigate the process.

He could put up a tent in his backyard, but inviting people you dont know well into your backyard in the US makes you legally and financially responsible for anything that happens to them on your property. That's why people don't open up masjids on their personal property or in their home. They are set up as a legal entity that is independent of any 1 person.

That's what the brother wanted to do in the first place, I just don't get why you guys went on that supply and demand discussion first. 

On 7/14/2021 at 12:44 AM, musa shakr said:

Thanks for your response I didn't realize the complexity of what I was asking.

Well you sure hadn't considered the whole equation...