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In the Name of God بسم الله

Praying behind a Sunni Imam

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Salaam,

I already know that it is permissible for us Shias to pray behind a Sunni Imam (at least according to Sayyid al-Sistani), as long as we recite the 2 surahs ourselves in a low voice.

However, there's a question that I've been thinking about for a long time. It is know that many times, when Sunnis pray, during the 1st rak'ah, they often stop reciting the 2nd surah before finishing it, proceed to ruku and sajdah, and then in the 2nd rak'ah they continue and finish the 2nd surah. From what I know, we Shias are not allowed to do that, we must recite the 2nd surah in its entirety before proceeding to ruku, otherwise the prayer is invalid.

So my question is: what if I'm praying behind a Sunni Imam and he does that ?

Like how am I even supposed to continue the prayer without finishing the 2nd surah ? What am I supposed to do:

Do I just "go with the flow" and later repeat my prayer (although this would be really annoying as I just simply shouldn't have prayed behind him if my prayer were to be invalidated like this in the first place) ?

Or do I continue with the surah and finish reciting it as fast as I can (although I may not know the rest of the surah, or the surah may be too long and I would be standing up alone like an idiot while everyone else is in ruku. And later, when the Imam continues reciting the 2nd surah in the 2nd rak'ah, what am I even supposed to recite) ?

What do you guys think ? Any reasonable explanations ? Thank you.

Edited by Mohamad Abdel-Hamid
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Posted (edited)

Was salam,

I don't think there's any harm in a little bit of delay. As long as you are able join the imam in the ruku before he rises up from ruku, it should be fine. You'll only be temporarily out of sync with the rest of the jama'h, hardly for a minute.

Tip- recite short surahs like al-Kawthar and al-Ikhlas.

Edited by AbdusSibtayn
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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, AbdusSibtayn said:

Was salam,

I don't think there's any harm in a little bit of delay. As long as you are able join the imam in the ruku before he rises up from ruku, it should be fine. You'll only be temporarily out of sync with the rest of the jama'h, hardly for a minute.

Tip- recite short surahs like al-Kawthar and al-Ikhlas.

So what you're saying is: I should continue and finish the surah, even with a little bit of delay ? But what if the surah is just too long, and I haven't even memorized the rest of the surah ? The Imam is 100% gonna finish with the ruku before I finish reciting the surah.

Or are you saying that behind a Sunni Imam I'm allowed to recite another surah on my own, different than the surah the Imam is reciting; say al-Kawthar for example, and I just wait standing still without reciting anything, waiting for the Imam to go to ruku ? Am I allowed to do that ?

Edited by Mohamad Abdel-Hamid
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Ruling 1433.

The imam of congregational prayers must be bāligh, sane (ʿāqil), a Twelver Shia, just (ʿādil), of legitimate birth, and a person who performs prayers correctly. Furthermore, if the follower is a man then the imam must also be a man. The validity of following a ten year old child, although it has some basis, is problematic [i.e. based on obligatory precaution, one must not follow a ten year old child]. Being ‘just’ means he does the things that are obligatory on him and refrains from doing the things that are unlawful for him. The sign of being just is that he appears to be a good person, [and this is sufficient] as long as one does not have information that contradicts it.

https://www.sistani.org/english/book/48/2253/

If condition isn't met, how is prayer behind such an imam valid?

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1 minute ago, Syed Ali Mehdi Shah Naqvi said:

Ruling 1433.

The imam of congregational prayers must be bāligh, sane (ʿāqil), a Twelver Shia, just (ʿādil), of legitimate birth, and a person who performs prayers correctly. Furthermore, if the follower is a man then the imam must also be a man. The validity of following a ten year old child, although it has some basis, is problematic [i.e. based on obligatory precaution, one must not follow a ten year old child]. Being ‘just’ means he does the things that are obligatory on him and refrains from doing the things that are unlawful for him. The sign of being just is that he appears to be a good person, [and this is sufficient] as long as one does not have information that contradicts it.

https://www.sistani.org/english/book/48/2253/

If condition isn't met, how is prayer behind such an imam valid?

Sayyid al-Sistani allows us Shias to pray behind a Sunni Imam, as long as we recite the 2 surahs ourselves:

Question: Can I say congregational prayer with my Sunni brothers? And can I lead prayers when I pray with them?

Answer: There is no objection in standing in a Sunni congregational prayer. However, the person should recite Hamd and Surah on his own in the first two ‘Rak’ats’ – even if it has to be in low voice though. Also, it is permissible for him to lead them in prayer.

Question: Can one say one’s congregational prayer behind a Sunni Imam with the intention of Jama'at (congregation)? And should one recite al-hamd on his own?

Answer: it is permissible to offer prayer in their congregational prayers, in areas where Taqiyah (dissimulation) is required. However, it is obligatory upon you to recite al-Hamd and the second chapter yourself – be the recitation in low voice though.

Question: Is it permissible to offer congregational prayers behind a Sunni prayer leader during the pilgrimage in Haram of Mecca and Medina?

Answer: It is permissible but you must recite Surah al-Fatiha (al-Hamd) and the other Surah yourself even though the recitation may be in low voice.

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7 hours ago, Mohamad Abdel-Hamid said:

Sayyid al-Sistani allows us Shias to pray behind a Sunni Imam, as long as we recite the 2 surahs ourselves:

Question: Can I say congregational prayer with my Sunni brothers? And can I lead prayers when I pray with them?

Answer: There is no objection in standing in a Sunni congregational prayer. However, the person should recite Hamd and Surah on his own in the first two ‘Rak’ats’ – even if it has to be in low voice though. Also, it is permissible for him to lead them in prayer.

Question: Can one say one’s congregational prayer behind a Sunni Imam with the intention of Jama'at (congregation)? And should one recite al-hamd on his own?

Answer: it is permissible to offer prayer in their congregational prayers, in areas where Taqiyah (dissimulation) is required. However, it is obligatory upon you to recite al-Hamd and the second chapter yourself – be the recitation in low voice though.

Question: Is it permissible to offer congregational prayers behind a Sunni prayer leader during the pilgrimage in Haram of Mecca and Medina?

Answer: It is permissible but you must recite Surah al-Fatiha (al-Hamd) and the other Surah yourself even though the recitation may be in low voice.

Your conclusion based on these rulings is entirely different from what Sistani is saying here. Bro be careful with your words.

He clearly doesn't allow praying behind them with Niyah of congragational prayer except for taqqiyah which is entirely different thing. It is like you have to hide you are a shia due to threats and you got to pray with them.

As for standing behind, it refers to just standing behind them and praying by yourself.

But سیستانی puts condition of twelver shia on imam of salat if condition isn't true, offering prayer is batil behind non shias.

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5 hours ago, Syed Ali Mehdi Shah Naqvi said:

He clearly doesn't allow praying behind them with Niyah of congragational prayer except for taqqiyah which is entirely different thing. It is like you have to hide you are a shia due to threats and you got to pray with them.

The principle of permissibility applies to both taqiyyah and general situations, brother. The first question and its response mean general permissibility. The second reply is talking specifically about taqiyyah.

As in, even without taqiyyah you are allowed to pray in Sunni congregations given that you observe the given conditions.

 

14 hours ago, Mohamad Abdel-Hamid said:

Or are you saying that behind a Sunni Imam I'm allowed to recite another surah on my own, different than the surah the Imam is reciting; say al-Kawthar for example, and I just wait standing still without reciting anything, waiting for the Imam to go to ruku ? Am I allowed to do that ?

I always thought that being allowed to do one's own qira'ah implied that, akhi. But it would be better if you could mail the Sayyid's (ha) office and ask,  won't it? If you don't mind, could you please also post the response here for us?

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7 hours ago, Syed Ali Mehdi Shah Naqvi said:

But سیستانی puts condition of twelver shia on imam of salat if condition isn't true, offering prayer is batil behind non shias.

Salam , This is just your conclusion  which offering prayer behind non shias always is valid except that we pray behind a Nasibi or new versions of liberal/sufi prayer which whose Imam is woman (for both of men & women ) or two Imams which woman & man Imams pray beside each other.

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عَلِيُّ بْنُ إِبْرَاهِيمَ عَنْ أَبِيهِ عَنِ ابْنِ أَبِي عُمَيْرٍ عَنْ حَمَّادٍ عَنِ الْحَلَبِيِّ عَنْ أَبِي عَبْدِ اللَّهِ ع قَالَ: مَنْ‏ صَلَّى‏ مَعَهُمْ‏ فِي‏ الصَّفِ‏ الْأَوَّلِ كَانَ كَمَنْ صَلَّى خَلْفَ رَسُولِ اللَّهِ ص‏

‘Alī bin Ibrāhīm from his father, from Ibn Abī ‘Umayr from Ḥammād from al-Ḥalabī from Abī ‘Abdillah (a) who said: Whoever prays behind them in the first row, is like the one who prayed behind the Messenger of Allah (p).[iii]

وَ قَالَ الصَّادِقُ ع‏ إِذَا صَلَّيْتَ‏ مَعَهُمْ‏ غُفِرَ لَكَ‏ بِعَدَدِ مَنْ خَالَفَك‏

Imām al-Ṣādiq (a) said: If you pray alongside them, an amount will be forgiven for you that equals the number of people who oppose you.[iv]

وَ صَلَّى حَسَنٌ وَ حُسَيْنٌ وَرَاءَ مَرْوَانَ وَ نَحْنُ نُصَلِّي مَعَهُم‏

Imām al-Kāẓim (a) to his brother ‘Alī bin Ja’far: And Ḥasan and Ḥusayn would pray behind Marwān (bin al-Ḥakam) and we pray behind them (as well).[v]

In the aforementioned traditions, we find the Imāms encouraging some of their companions to pray alongside those who were not considered Imāmī Shī’a. In other words, such individuals would be considered Sunnīs – who make up the majority of the Muslims today

الَ: وَ سَأَلْتُهُ أَنَ‏ لِي‏ جِيرَاناً بَعْضُهُمْ‏ يَعْرِفُ‏ هَذَا الْأَمْرَ وَ بَعْضُهُمْ لَا يَعْرِفُ وَ قَدْ سَأَلُونِي أُؤَذِّنُ لَهُمْ وَ أُصَلِّي بِهِمْ فَخِفْتُ أَنْ لَا يَكُونَ ذَلِكَ مُوَسَّعاً لِي فَقَالَ أَذِّنْ لَهُمْ وَ صَلِّ بِهِمْ وَ تَحَرَّ الْأَوْقَات‏

Jābir al-Ju’fī said: I told him (al-Bāqir) that I have neighbours, some of whom know about this affair[i], while some of them don’t. They ask me to recite the call to prayers for them and expect me to pray with them, but I am afraid that it may not be feasible for me. So, he (a) responded: Recite the call to prayers for them, lead them in it, and find the times to do so.[ii]

http://ijtihadnet.com/shia-ruling-on-congregational-prayer-behind-a-sunni-imam/

Quote

In one tradition [attributed to Imam Sadiq], participating in congregational prayers in Masjid al-Haram has been equated to saying one’s prayers led by the Holy Prophet ((صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم).a.). What is the meaning of this tradition? Obviously, Imam Sadiq would not have compared the prayers led by an ordinary prayer leader with the prayers led by the Prophet (s.w.a.). What is the meaning of this tradition then? It highlights the importance of unity. You should show unity in practice.

https://hadana.ir/en/significance-of-unity-in-imam-sadeqs-view-praying-behind-sunnis-in-masjid-al-haram-is-like-praying-behind-prophet/

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On 2/27/2021 at 12:46 AM, Mohamad Abdel-Hamid said:

Salaam,

I already know that it is permissible for us Shias to pray behind a Sunni Imam (at least according to Sayyid al-Sistani), as long as we recite the 2 surahs ourselves in a low voice.

However, there's a question that I've been thinking about for a long time. It is know that many times, when Sunnis pray, during the 1st rak'ah, they often stop reciting the 2nd surah before finishing it, proceed to ruku and sajdah, and then in the 2nd rak'ah they continue and finish the 2nd surah. From what I know, we Shias are not allowed to do that, we must recite the 2nd surah in its entirety before proceeding to ruku, otherwise the prayer is invalid.

So my question is: what if I'm praying behind a Sunni Imam and he does that ?

Like how am I even supposed to continue the prayer without finishing the 2nd surah ? What am I supposed to do:

Do I just "go with the flow" and later repeat my prayer (although this would be really annoying as I just simply shouldn't have prayed behind him if my prayer were to be invalidated like this in the first place) ?

Or do I continue with the surah and finish reciting it as fast as I can (although I may not know the rest of the surah, or the surah may be too long and I would be standing up alone like an idiot while everyone else is in ruku. And later, when the Imam continues reciting the 2nd surah in the 2nd rak'ah, what am I even supposed to recite) ?

What do you guys think ? Any reasonable explanations ? Thank you.

its better not to pray behind them imo. if u have the choice to pray on your own than why not

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4 hours ago, 3wliya_maryam said:

its better not to pray behind them imo. if u have the choice to pray on your own than why not

I know that it's better not to pray behind them. But when you prayed on your own your entire life, it really gets kinda... boring and lonely. Besides, there are no Shia Imams where I live, so I thought it would be better to learn the rules of praying behind a Sunni Imam, since I'm allowed to.

7 hours ago, AbdusSibtayn said:

I always thought that being allowed to do one's own qira'ah implied that, akhi. But it would be better if you could mail the Sayyid's (ha) office and ask,  won't it? If you don't mind, could you please also post the response here for us?

 I just sent the question my Marja'. I'll send the answer as soon as he replies.

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14 minutes ago, Mohamad Abdel-Hamid said:

boring and lonely

the reason u feel this way is because you don't understand the implications of the expressions you used here.

About Imam Ali ibn Hussain ((عليه السلام)): “When he stood to perform the ritual prayer, his skin would turn yellow, and he shook all over because of fear of Allah. He stood during his prayer as the abased slave who stood before a great king. He prayed with the prayer of the one who would leave (the world). He thought that he would never pray again.”

I am not implying that myself or other people will ever reach such a level, but I suggest you reconsider the descriptions you ascribed to praying "alone".

 

21 minutes ago, Mohamad Abdel-Hamid said:

I know that it's better not to pray behind them.

This is wrong. It is completely wrong to do so unless you are compelled, not just "it's better not to pray behind them".

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You can stand in the congregation, but you must make a niyyah (intention) to pray on your own since the conditions of leading prayer are not fulfilled.

In such situations I sometimes pray the nawafil while standing with the congregation and then the wajib prayers just after. 

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On 3/3/2021 at 11:44 AM, AbdusSibtayn said:

As in, even without taqiyyah you are allowed to pray in Sunni congregations given that you observe the given conditions

Given conditions that you have to recite everything by yourself equal to praying by yourself just standing with jamaat as per Sistani's fatawa.

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On 3/3/2021 at 1:51 PM, Ashvazdanghe said:

عَلِيُّ بْنُ إِبْرَاهِيمَ عَنْ أَبِيهِ عَنِ ابْنِ أَبِي عُمَيْرٍ عَنْ حَمَّادٍ عَنِ الْحَلَبِيِّ عَنْ أَبِي عَبْدِ اللَّهِ ع قَالَ: مَنْ‏ صَلَّى‏ مَعَهُمْ‏ فِي‏ الصَّفِ‏ الْأَوَّلِ كَانَ كَمَنْ صَلَّى خَلْفَ رَسُولِ اللَّهِ ص‏

‘Alī bin Ibrāhīm from his father, from Ibn Abī ‘Umayr from Ḥammād from al-Ḥalabī from Abī ‘Abdillah (a) who said: Whoever prays behind them in the first row, is like the one who prayed behind the Messenger of Allah (p).[iii]

وَ قَالَ الصَّادِقُ ع‏ إِذَا صَلَّيْتَ‏ مَعَهُمْ‏ غُفِرَ لَكَ‏ بِعَدَدِ مَنْ خَالَفَك‏

Imām al-Ṣādiq (a) said: If you pray alongside them, an amount will be forgiven for you that equals the number of people who oppose you.[iv]

These hadiths are to be observed under Taqqiyah and there is always a reward for obeying Imam.

Companions like ibn abi Umair etc and others had a hard time just because they were shias and shias had to hide themselves and these hadiths applicable in those situations.

On 3/3/2021 at 1:51 PM, Ashvazdanghe said:

صَلَّى حَسَنٌ وَ حُسَيْنٌ وَرَاءَ مَرْوَانَ وَ نَحْنُ نُصَلِّي مَعَهُم‏

Imām al-Kāẓim (a) to his brother ‘Alī bin Ja’far: And Ḥasan and Ḥusayn would pray behind Marwān (bin al-Ḥakam) and we pray behind them (as well).[v]

This hadith is just like Hadith of Imam Ali (عليه السلام) where he stood behind Abu Bakr and *PRAYED BY HIMSELF* (Tafseer Al Qummi) to which everyone agrees. I myself offer prayer with sunnis but not following their imam as it would invalidate prayer right away. I Just stand with them and offer my Salah normally. This is something on which no one dis agrees.

On 3/3/2021 at 1:51 PM, Ashvazdanghe said:

In one tradition [attributed to Imam Sadiq], participating in congregational prayers in Masjid al-Haram has been equated to saying one’s prayers led by the Holy Prophet ((صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم).a.). What is the meaning of this tradition? Obviously, Imam Sadiq would not have compared the prayers led by an ordinary prayer leader with the prayers led by the Prophet (s.w.a.). What is the meaning of this tradition then? It highlights the importance of unity. You should show unity in practice.

Its Fazeelat of Salah offered in Masjid al-haram and not unity with sunnis lol.

Sistani and other marjas say CONDTION TO BE AN IMAM FOR SALAT IS THAT IMAM MUST BE A TWELVER SHIA. This attempt to twist and mis interpret hadith even goes against your own marjas.

What i mean by praying behind sunnis was accepting sunni as Imam of salah (without taqqiyah) and offering prayer behind like you offer behind a twelver shia imam.

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On 3/3/2021 at 1:51 PM, Ashvazdanghe said:

In one tradition [attributed to Imam Sadiq], participating in congregational prayers in Masjid al-Haram has been equated to saying one’s prayers led by the Holy Prophet ((صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم).a.). What is the meaning of this tradition? Obviously, Imam Sadiq would not have compared the prayers led by an ordinary prayer leader with the prayers led by the Prophet (s.w.a.). What is the meaning of this tradition then? It highlights the importance of unity. You should show unity in practice.

 

In case if you dis-agree with my reply to this, then see:

عِدَّةٌ مِنْ أَصْحَابِنَا عَنْ سَهْلِ بْنِ زِيَادٍ عَنْ أَحْمَدَ بْنِ مُحَمَّدِ بْنِ أَبِي نَصْرٍ عَنْ أَبِي الْحَسَنِ (عَلَيْهِ السَّلاَم) قَالَ سَأَلْتُهُ عَنِ الرَّجُلِ يُصَلِّي فِي جَمَاعَةٍ فِي مَنْزِلِهِ بِمَكَّةَ أَفْضَلُ أَوْ وَحْدَهُ فِي الْمَسْجِدِ الْحَرَامِ فَقَالَ وَحْدَهُ.

11. A number of our people have narrated from Sahl ibn Ziyad Ahmad ibn Muhammad from ibn abu Nasr who has said the following: “I once asked abu al-Hassan, ‘Alayhi al-Salam, if a man performs Salat (prayer) in congregation in his home in Makkah is better or his performing Salat (prayer) in Masjid al-Haram alone. He (the Imam) said, ‘His performing Salat (prayer) in Masjid al-Haram alone is better.’”

If it was about unity, then praying salat alone in Masjid Al Haram wouldn't have been afzal then praying in congregation.

Name of Chapter of Al-Kafi:

Al-Kāfi - Volume 4 > Excellence of Performing Salat (Prayer) in Masjid al-Haram (the Sacred Masjid) and the Best Place Therein

Edited by Syed Ali Mehdi Shah Naqvi
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عَنْهُ عَنْ أَحْمَدَ عَنْ عَبْدِ الله بْنِ مُحَمَّدٍ الْحَجَّالِ عَنْ ثَعْلَبَةَ عَنْ زُرَارَةَ قَالَ سَأَلْتُ أَبَا جَعْفَرٍ (عَلَيْهِ الْسَّلام) عَنِ الصَّلاَةِ خَلْفَ الْمُخَالِفِينَ فَقَالَ مَا هُمْ عِنْدِي إِلاَّ بِمَنْزِلَةِ الْجُدُرِ.

2. It is a narration from him (narrator of previous Hadith) by Ahmad from ‘Abd Allah ibn Muhammad al-Hajjal from Tha’labah from Zurarah who has said the following: “I once asked abu Ja’far, ‘Alayhi al-Salam, about performing Salah (prayer) behind those who oppose our belief. He (the Imam) said, ‘To me they are but walls (scarecrows).”’

Grading: 

Allamah Baqir al-Majlisi: صحيح - Mir‘at al ‘Uqul Fi Sharh Akhbar Al al Rasul (5/255)

Now see proofs that Salat if offered in imamate of non shia imam ( no taqqiyay ) is indeed invalid and imam (عليه السلام) never taught this to his students. Because imam said if you pray while following imam, you MUST NOT RECITE BY YOURSELF EVEN IF YOU HEAR IMAM OR NOT. This is case of praying while following imam of salat. While in case of sunni imam, IMAM (عليه السلام) SAID YOU MUST RECITE BY YOURSELF EVEN IF YOU HEAR SUNNI IMAM. It clearly proves you aren't allowed to follow sunni imam in prayers. Rather its just about standing with them and praying by your own self and here are proofs:

 عَلِيُّ بْنُ إِبْرَاهِيمَ عَنْ أَبِيهِ عَنِ ابْنِ أَبِي عُمَيْرٍ عَنْ حَمَّادِ بْنِ عُثْمَانَ عَنِ الْحَلَبِيِّ عَنْ أَبِي عَبْدِ الله (عَلَيْهِ الْسَّلام) قَالَ إِذَا صَلَّيْتَ خَلْفَ إِمَامٍ لاَ تَقْتَدِي بِهِ فَاقْرَأْ خَلْفَهُ سَمِعْتَ قِرَاءَتَهُ أَوْ لَمْ تَسْمَعْ.

4. Ali ibn Ibrahim has narrated from his father from ibn abu ‘Umayr from Hammad ibn ‘Uthaman from al-Halabiy who has said the following: “Abu ‘Abd Allah, ‘Alayhi al-Salam, has said, ‘When you perform Salah (prayer) behind an Imam who is not qualified, read behind him the recitation, regardless, you hear him or not.’”

Grading: 

Allamah Baqir al-Majlisi: حسن - Mir‘at al ‘Uqul Fi Sharh Akhbar Al al Rasul (15/255)

Hadiths says you got to recite behind non-shia imam regardless you hear him or not.

But in case of imam who is qualified to be imam of Salat, it is haram to recite behind him as mentioned in below hadiths which clearly proves imam never meant following sunnis imam in salat is valid :

 عَلِيُّ بْنُ إِبْرَاهِيمَ عَنْ أَبِيهِ عَنِ ابْنِ أَبِي عُمَيْرٍ عَنْ حَمَّادِ بْنِ عُثْمَانَ عَنِ الْحَلَبِيِّ عَنْ أَبِي عَبْدِ الله (عَلَيْهِ الْسَّلام) قَالَ إِذَا صَلَّيْتَ خَلْفَ إِمَامٍ تَأْتَمُّ بِهِ فَلاَ تَقْرَأْ خَلْفَهُ سَمِعْتَ قِرَاءَتَهُ أَوْ لَمْ تَسْمَعْ إِلاَّ أَنْ تَكُونَ صَلاَةً يُجْهَرُ فِيهَا وَلَمْ تَسْمَعْ فَاقْرَأْ.

2. Ali ibn Ibrahim has narrated from his father from ibn abu ‘Umayr from Hammad ibn ‘Uthaman from al-Halabiy who has said the following: “Abu ‘Abd Allah, ‘Alayhi al-Salam, has said, ‘If you perform Salah (prayer) behind one whom you follow, do not do the recitation behind him, regardless if you hear his recitation or not, except, when it is a Salah (prayer) in which recitation is done aloud and you do not hear then you are to recite.’”

Grading: 

Allamah Baqir al-Majlisi: حسن - Mir‘at al ‘Uqul Fi Sharh Akhbar Al al Rasul (15/265)

يٌّ عَنْ أَبِيهِ عَنْ حَمَّادٍ عَنْ حَرِيزٍ عَنْ زُرَارَةَ عَنْ أَحَدِهِمَا (عَلَيْهِما الْسَّلام) قَالَ إِذَا كُنْتَ خَلْفَ إِمَامٍ تَأْتَمُّ بِهِ فَأَنْصِتْ وَسَبِّحْ فِي نَفْسِكَ.

3. Ali has narrated from his father from Hammad from Hariz from Zurarah who has said the following: “One of the two Imam, ‘Alayhi al-Salam, has said, ‘If you perform Salah (prayer) behind an Imam whom you follow then remain silent and say Tasbih (Allah is free of all defects) to yourself only.’”

Grading: 

Allamah Baqir al-Majlisi: حسن - Mir‘at al ‘Uqul Fi Sharh Akhbar Al al Rasul (15/263)

عَلِيُّ بْنُ مُحَمَّدٍ عَنْ سَهْلِ بْنِ زِيَادٍ عَنْ عَلِيِّ بْنِ مَهْزِيَارَ عَنْ أَبِي عَلِيِّ بْنِ رَاشِدٍ قَالَ قُلْتُ لأَبِي جَعْفَرٍ (عَلَيْهِ الْسَّلام) إِنَّ مَوَالِيَكَ قَدِ اخْتَلَفُوا فَأُصَلِّي خَلْفَهُمْ جَمِيعاً فَقَالَ لاَ تُصَلِّ إِلاَّ خَلْفَ مَنْ تَثِقُ بِدِينِهِ

Ali ibn Muhammad has narrated from Sahl ibn Ziyad from Ali ibn Mahziyar from Ali ibn Rashid who has said the following: “I said to abu Ja‘far, ‘Alayhi al-Salam, ‘You have different friends, thus, I perform Salah (prayer) behind every one of them.’ The Imam said, ‘Do not perform Salah (prayer) behind anyone whom you cannot trust in matters of his religion.

Even companions of Imam (عليه السلام) used to pray behind non-shia imams but never followed them because they knew it isn't valid.

مَّدُ بْنُ إِسْمَاعِيلَ عَنِ الْفَضْلِ بْنِ شَاذَانَ عَنْ صَفْوَانَ عَنْ إِسْحَاقَ بْنِ عَمَّارٍ عَمَّنْ سَأَلَ أَبَا عَبْدِ الله (عَلَيْهِ الْسَّلام) قَالَ أُصَلِّي خَلْفَ مَنْ لاَ أَقْتَدِي بِهِ فَإِذَا فَرَغْتُ مِنْ قِرَاءَتِي وَلَمْ يَفْرُغْ هُوَ قَالَ فَسَبِّحْ حَتَّى يَفْرُغَ.

3. Muhammad ibn ’Isma‘il has narrated from Ishaq ibn ‘Ammar from the one who has asked abu ‘Abd Allah, ‘Alayhi al-Salam, has said the following: I once asked abu ‘Abd Allah, ‘Alayhi al-Salam, ‘Can I perform Salah (prayer) behind one whom I do not follow and complete recitation when he has not yet completed?’ He (the Imam) said, ‘Say Tasbih (Allah is free of all defects) until he completes.’”

Grading: 

Allamah Baqir al-Majlisi: مرسل - Mir‘at al ‘Uqul Fi Sharh Akhbar Al al Rasul (15/255)

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1 hour ago, Syed Ali Mehdi Shah Naqvi said:

Given conditions that you have to recite everything by yourself equal to praying by yourself just standing with jamaat as per Sistani's fatawa.

Niyyah is still of jama'ah and not furada.

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On 3/2/2021 at 10:44 PM, Syed Ali Mehdi Shah Naqvi said:

of legitimate birth,

How to prove this?

DNA testing.

On 3/2/2021 at 10:44 PM, Syed Ali Mehdi Shah Naqvi said:

Being ‘just’ means he does the things that are obligatory on him and refrains from doing the things that are unlawful for him. The sign of being just is that he appears to be a good person, [and this is sufficient] as long as one does not have information that contradicts it.

Where to find such a person ?

I did not find any imam behind whom i am praying fulfill this criteria.

On 3/2/2021 at 10:44 PM, Syed Ali Mehdi Shah Naqvi said:

condition isn't met, how is prayer behind such an imam valid?

No one in this world can decide my prayers are valid or invalid.

Only Allah.

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9 minutes ago, Shahrukh K said:

How to prove this?

DNA testing.

??

if a couple is married publicly for 3 years then suddenly the woman is pregnant, a woman known to be righteous and not filthy, what would make you suspect in such a scenario that it is illegitimate? why would you need a dna test?

11 minutes ago, Shahrukh K said:

Where to find such a person ?

I did not find any imam behind whom i am praying fulfill this criteria.

yikes, guess your living in pelican bay or something

11 minutes ago, Shahrukh K said:

No one in this world can decide my prayers are valid or invalid.

Only Allah.

Allah decides everything. And Allah has given various people the authority to judge by Allah's criteria. So you are wrong unfortunately one way or another.

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Posted (edited)
45 minutes ago, dragonxx said:

Allah has given various people the authority to judge by Allah's criteri

What people ?

At present the authority is only Quran. 

Tell where is this mention in Quran....

On 3/2/2021 at 10:44 PM, Syed Ali Mehdi Shah Naqvi said:

imam of congregational prayers must be bāligh, sane (ʿāqil), a Twelver Shia, just (ʿādil), of legitimate birth, and a person who performs prayers correctly.

 

Edited by Shahrukh K
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42 minutes ago, dragonxx said:

guess your living in pelican bay or something

 

On 3/2/2021 at 10:44 PM, Syed Ali Mehdi Shah Naqvi said:

Being ‘just’ means he does the things that are obligatory on him and refrains from doing the things that are unlawful for him

Refrain from doing the things that are unlawful for him.....

Jaise sharabi na ho, jhoot na bolta ho, doosron ka maal na khata ho, gheebat na karta ho,

Jua na khelta ho, parayi aurton par nazar na rakhta ho etc. list bahut lambi hai

Kahan se laaoge aisa aadmi mil jaaye to mujhe bhi batana

(Cannot translate in english)

 

 

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2 hours ago, Shahrukh K said:

How to prove this?

DNA testing.

Where to find such a person ?

I did not find any imam behind whom i am praying fulfill this criteria.

DNA testing is not necessary. If one's parents say you are legitimate then you can consider yourself as legitimate.

The Imam being just can be determined by the person appearing to be good.

You do not have to think about these things so technically.

2 hours ago, Shahrukh K said:

No one in this world can decide my prayers are valid or invalid.

Only Allah.

Yes and Allah set those condition that are required for an Imam, so if the Imam does not have the necessary conditions then yes the prayer is invalid.

1 hour ago, Shahrukh K said:

At present the authority is only Quran.

Have you forgotten the ahadith of the Prophet and the Aimmah?

 

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2 hours ago, AbdusSibtayn said:

Niyyah is still of jama'ah and not furada.

Question :

If one is praying behind a Sunni imam for unity, and one recites the Surahs in the first two Rak'as, will he have the intention of praying in congregation or praying on an individual basis (furada)?

Answer :

His intention will not be offering congregational prayers.

http://alhakeem.com/en/questions/716/1

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Khalas, let's stop arguing about this topic, whe shifted away from the main point. I clearly asked about how I should deal in a specific situation while praying behind a Sunni Imam, not if I'm allowed to pray behind them. I have already sent my question to my Marja'. When he answers it, inshallah I'll post the response here.

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9 hours ago, Muhammad Al-Hurr said:
Question :

If one is praying behind a Sunni imam for unity, and one recites the Surahs in the first two Rak'as, will he have the intention of praying in congregation or praying on an individual basis (furada)?

Answer :

His intention will not be offering congregational prayers.

http://alhakeem.com/en/questions/716/1

Shukran, brother.

Is this Sayyid al-Sistani's (ha) verdict too?

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11 hours ago, AbdusSibtayn said:

Niyyah is still of jama'ah and not furada.

Its not. This is from your own self. If you don't follow imam, you can't do Niyah of Jamaat.

 

11 hours ago, Shahrukh K said:

No one in this world can decide my prayers are valid or invalid

We quoted hadiths and laws from well known scholars here. They decide if your prayers are valid or not. Neither me, nor you have any right to decide anything.

You are counter questioning conditions to be an Imam of Salat in Fiqh Jaffria. If you don't have your father name on your idenity card or your identity isn't confirmed, then please take me with you and try to go to a masjid and apply for being an imam of masjid.

These are all childish questions.

Imam of Masjid is always a well known recognized learned shia scholar from well know Madrassahs.

10 hours ago, Shahrukh K said:

What people ?

At present the authority is only Quran. 

Tell where is this mention in Quran...

I challenge you to make a seperate thread and prove to us that present authority is only Quran. For now, lets stick to topic of thread.

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3 hours ago, Syed Ali Mehdi Shah Naqvi said:

make a seperate thread and prove to us that present authority is only Quran.

There is a thread........

 

3 hours ago, Syed Ali Mehdi Shah Naqvi said:

challenge you

I am not here to challenge anyone. 

For last two years my knowledge about islam improved because of shiachat.

 

 

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