Are you going to take the vaccine?

[Syed.Dynasty]

15 minutes ago, Sirius_Bright said:

Yes that what you are implying that billionaire wants to cause disease, reduce population without any sort of proof. So, it is a conspiracy. 

I feel like the word you wanted to use was conspiracy theory. But I agree it does feel like a conspiracy. Bill gates pushing for everyone to be vaccinated, while at the same time wanting to block out sunlight. UV is used as a treatment for respiratory illnesses. Sunlight kills bacteria. Now the same people who stand to make potentially hundreds of billions of dollars off the vaccine also want to take away sunlight which naturally fights illnesses as such.

 

21 minutes ago, Sirius_Bright said:

Do you even know what you are talking about. Taking one hadith and moulding according to your whims. 

I’m just asking you a simple question dear brother. The Hadith in your signature says you should disassociate from the enemies of Ahlul Bayt. Bill gates has said religion is inefficient. These are the people you are blindly trusting to dose you with an experimental vaccine.

[Syed.Dynasty]

16 minutes ago, Sirius_Bright said:

Suppose: 180 people dies of vaccine out of 60 million inoculated. If those 60 million catch covid the number of people dying because of catching the disease would be 1.2 million (2%). 180 and 1.2 million don't even compare. It's not less, it's negligible. 

Exactly my point. Still you take those medicines. But for covid, you have special reservations. 

Those are the stats we have now. As sister FM said we have no idea of the long term side effects.

“He says that these vaccines have not been well studied and that if you choose to take it, you are now part of a real life study.

“You understand that you are volunteering to be a part of a great experiment with receiving the COVID-19 vaccine,” Dr. Don J. Tynes says.

Dr. Tynes who works at Benton Harbor Health Center and according to our reporting partners at the Herald Palladium also serves in a health care advisory role with the city. He has several warnings.”

https://www.wndu.com/2021/01/29/doctor-calls-covid-19-vaccines-an-experiment/
 

so I ask you again, are you willing to be part of this experiment of those who reject the Prophet Muhammad and the wilayah of Ali?

[Syed.Dynasty]

This is not necessarily about the covid vaccines but about vaccines in general. They comment on the vaccines that are widely used and their effect on the human brain.
 

“It seems the brain is always neglected when pharmacologists consider side effects of various drugs. The same is true for vaccinations. For a long time no one considered the effect of repeated vaccinations on the brain. This was based on a mistaken conclusion that the brain was protected from immune activation by its special protective gateway called the blood-brain barrier. More recent studies have shown that immune cells can enter the brain directly, and more importantly, the brain’s own special immune system can be activated by vaccination.

You see, the brain has a special immune system that operates through a unique type of cell called a microglia.

These tiny cells are scattered throughout the brain, lying dormant waiting to be activated. In fact, they are activated by many stimuli and are quite easy to activate. For our discussion, activation of the body’s immune system by vaccination is a most important stimuli for activation of brain microglia.

Numerous studies have shown that when the body’s immune system is activated, the brain’s immune cells are likewise activated. This occurs by several pathways, not important to this discussion. The more powerfully the body’s immune system is stimulated the more intense is the brain’s reaction. Prolonged activation of the body’s immune system likewise produces prolonged activation of the brain’s immune system.

Therein lies the danger of our present vaccine policy.

The American Academy of Pediatrics and the American Academy of Family Practice have both endorsed a growing list of vaccines for children, even newborns, as well as yearly flu shots for both children and adults. Children are receiving as many as 22 inoculations before attending school.

What Happens When the Brain’s Immune System is Activated?

The brain’s immune system cells, once activated, begin to move about the nervous system, secreting numerous immune chemicals (called cytokines and chemokines) and pouring out an enormous amount of free radicals in an effort to kill invading organisms. The problem is–there are no invading organisms. It has been tricked by the vaccine into believing there are.

Unlike the body’s immune system, the microglia also secrete two other chemicals that are very destructive of brain cells and their connecting processes. These chemicals, glutamate and quinolinic acid, are called excitotoxins. They also dramatically increase free radical generation in the brain. Studies of patients have shown that levels of these two excitotoxins can rise to very dangerous levels in the brain following viral and bacterial infections of the brain. High quinolinic acid levels in the brain are thought to be the cause of the dementia seen with HIV infection.

The problem with our present vaccine policy is that so many vaccines are being given so close together and over such a long period that the brain’s immune system is constantly activated. This has been shown experimentally in numerous studies. This means that the brain will be exposed to large amounts of the excitotoxins as well as the immune cytokines over the same period.

Studies on all of these disorders, even in autism, have shown high levels of immune cytokines and excitotoxins in the nervous system. These destructive chemicals, as well as the free radicals they generate, are diffused throughout the nervous system doing damage, a process called bystander injury. It’s sort of like throwing a bomb in a crowd. Not only will some be killed directly by the blast, but those far out into the radius of the explosion will be killed by shrapnel.

Normally, the brain’s immune system, like the body’s, activates quickly and then promptly shuts off to minimize the bystander damage. Vaccination won’t let the microglia shut down. In the developing brain, this can lead to language problems, behavioral dysfunction, and even dementia. In the adult, it can lead to the Gulf War Syndrome or one of the more common neurodegenerative diseases, such as Parkinson’s disease, Alzheimer’s dementia, or Lou Gehrig’s disease.”  - Dr. Russell Blaylock

Dr. Blaylock is a man who wears many hats. He is a board certified neurosurgeon who owns a nutritional practice. Dr. Blaylock is a health practitioner, lecturer, and author. He practiced medicine for 25 years before pursuing his nutritional studies and research full time.

[Allah Seeker]

So now there is talk about there being a danger in being close to vaccinated people, as there are mounting claims that exposure to their mass production of spike proteins, causes all kinds of effects to women's periods, miscarriages, bruises, and even death of pets. 

Now these testamonies of nurses and random people are a disasters whether they are right or wrong. It is really sad. If they are right, then the plan of splitting society and creating a vaxed - unvaxed apartheid, and if they are wrong, then there will be further fear mongering and fitna based on misinformation. 

But let us see all sides of of the story, and eventually the truth will shine through. 

I think it is important to listen to both sides of any story and give both sides the benefit of the doubt. Both sides are possible, and everything could be a bad thing, hence a conspiracy from the devil. 

In my opinion the major problem and mental impediment of vaxxer fans is that they don't even consider the option or possibility that there could be people conspiring in this. Everything is possible and all sides of any argument should be equally considered. 

So let's keep our eyes open and my most important advice is to pray to God for forgiveness and protection. 

[F.M]

1 hour ago, Sirius_Bright said:

Suppose: 180 people dies of vaccine out of 60 million inoculated. If those 60 million catch covid the number of people dying because of catching the disease would be 1.2 million (2%). 180 and 1.2 million don't even compare. It's not less, it's negligible. 

3 hours ago, F.M said:

ok soo, whats youre point? same goes with death of corona (total infected are 145,431,383- and the death rate is 3087.807- death rate is less then 3procent->2.12 %) 

death rate suicide is even more than trough corona. 330,493Suicides.

death  rate caused by alcohol this year 770,829 

death rate caused by malaria 121,536

 

and last but not least a normal flu/influenza death is this, corona is nothing special with its 2% death roll.

and about people who died of vaccine, 225 people in my countrie aged 65 to79 died of corona, but lets not forget total people vaccinated from corona aged 65 to 79 is around 800,000. if obviously the total of vaccinated will raise then then logically death roll caused by vacine will also raise. 

Influenza and pneumonia deaths

• Number of deaths: 49,783
• Deaths per 100,000 population: 15.2
• Cause of death rank: 9

Sources and info::

• Suicide prevention (SUPRE) - World Health Organization (WHO
• Global Information System on Alcohol and Health (GISAH) - World Health Organization (WHO)
• Malaria - World Health Organization (WHO)
• https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/flu.htm

 

 

 

 

[F.M]

1 hour ago, Sirius_Bright said:

Exactly my point. Still you take those medicines. But for covid, you have special reservations. 

do you realise most people who die, is mostly because of the impact the treatment on himself has. the world doesnt want to bring up medicines that are fully recovering you because it will cause that all pharamcies,hospitals in this world will get bankrupted. 

about covid, we live in strange times and look at my previous post. why would all of a sudden the whole world push the world to take vaccines???. especially with what previously in history also happened to the world when a small flu came out and USA,UK gave to worldparts including africa,svenska and middle east free vaccines and it turned out the vaccines had disease in it like HIV,AIDS,Syphillis and many mny more ilnesses, and this caused lots people to die. 

HYSTRORY repeats itself nonstop especially with this hate and racism from the kuffar USA and UK towards the other parts of the world. how can they be trusted???? 

Edited April 23, 2021 by F.M

[Sirius_Bright]

7 hours ago, Syed.Dynasty said:

8 hours ago, Sirius_Bright said:

So, it is a conspiracy. 

I feel like the word you wanted to use was conspiracy theory. But I agree it does feel like a conspiracy. Bill gates pushing for everyone to be vaccinated, while at the same time wanting to block out sunlight. UV is used as a treatment for respiratory illnesses. Sunlight kills bacteria. Now the same people who stand to make potentially hundreds of billions of dollars off the vaccine also want to take away sunlight which naturally fights illnesses as such.

Sorry, I didn't mean conspiracy, I meant conspiracy theory. Changes meaning completely. People are pushing for such theories which they don't have any proof. Conspiracy theorist began to doubt everything - good and bad, can be dangerous. Please don't be one. 

7 hours ago, Syed.Dynasty said:

I’m just asking you a simple question dear brother. The Hadith in your signature says you should disassociate from the enemies of Ahlul Bayt. Bill gates has said religion is inefficient. These are the people you are blindly trusting to dose you with an experimental vaccine

Dissociating from enemies doesn't mean stop all the worldly transactions. Did prophet (sawa) not had any business relations with kuffars. We work for Kafir MNCs, consume their product. The application of the hadith is misplaced. 

Talking about Bill gates, I'm sure you don't use Microsoft office, teams, Windows, any other products. You don't know if they are tracking you and want to kill you in some way. Same applies for Facebook, Twitter, Google, Apple, etc. 

[Sirius_Bright]

7 hours ago, Syed.Dynasty said:

He says that these vaccines have not been well studied and that if you choose to take it, you are now part of a real life study.

I have not denied that. I already said everyone got the less time. So if you are going to criticize the vaccine, criticize everyone. Atleast be consistent. Western vaccine is bad, Russian and Chinese is good is a all nonsense. What we have as a vaccine now is the best thing in short time frame. 

[Syed.Dynasty]

4 hours ago, Sirius_Bright said:

Sorry, I didn't mean conspiracy, I meant conspiracy theory. Changes meaning completely. People are pushing for such theories which they don't have any proof. Conspiracy theorist began to doubt everything - good and bad, can be dangerous. Please don't be one. 

Dissociating from enemies doesn't mean stop all the worldly transactions. Did prophet (sawa) not had any business relations with kuffars. We work for Kafir MNCs, consume their product. The application of the hadith is misplaced. 

Talking about Bill gates, I'm sure you don't use Microsoft office, teams, Windows, any other products. You don't know if they are tracking you and want to kill you in some way. Same applies for Facebook, Twitter, Google, Apple, etc. 

Bro there’s a huge difference in them surveilling us and them using us in a biology experiment. There are ways to combat them tracking you, but as soon as you let them stick you we have no idea what the effects could have on us for generations.

4 hours ago, Sirius_Bright said:

I have not denied that. I already said everyone got the less time. So if you are going to criticize the vaccine, criticize everyone. Atleast be consistent. Western vaccine is bad, Russian and Chinese is good is a all nonsense. What we have as a vaccine now is the best thing in short time frame. 

I agree with this entirely. I won’t take any vaccine when there are natural remedies and other medications readily available that actually fight covid. 

[BlueInk]

5 hours ago, Sirius_Bright said:

Sorry, I didn't mean conspiracy, I meant conspiracy theory. Changes meaning completely. People are pushing for such theories which they don't have any proof. Conspiracy theorist began to doubt everything - good and bad, can be dangerous. Please don't be one. 

Dissociating from enemies doesn't mean stop all the worldly transactions. Did prophet (sawa) not had any business relations with kuffars. We work for Kafir MNCs, consume their product. The application of the hadith is misplaced. 

Talking about Bill gates, I'm sure you don't use Microsoft office, teams, Windows, any other products. You don't know if they are tracking you and want to kill you in some way. Same applies for Facebook, Twitter, Google, Apple, etc. 

Did kuffar have dominion over the world? No.

Your comparison to our Nabi as is incorrect. He DID have relations with unbelievers, but were they his masters? No. He did not depend on them. Further, he created a state that led to our deen becoming dominant over the religions.

 

 

Now, you will say we are dependent on kuffar. That is correct. They DO have global dominion, except over the Imam as.

You're incorrectly identifying our calling out of the mass hysteria and the near-enforcement of the Ibleesi drug as a conspiracy theory, when it actually a conspiracy against the Imam (عليه السلام). A long continuation of their war against Allah.

 

[justAnothermuslim]

14 hours ago, Sirius_Bright said:

Suppose: 180 people dies of vaccine out of 60 million inoculated. If those 60 million catch covid the number of people dying because of catching the disease would be 1.2 million (2%). 180 and 1.2 million don't even compare. It's not less, it's negligible. 

Exactly my point. Still you take those medicines. But for covid, you have special reservations. 

Not sure if that 2% represent CaseFatalityRate or InfectionFatalityRate. Anyhow it is 8 times higher than the latest IFR figure (0.15%) in a study done below:

https://off-guardian.org/2021/04/21/covids-ifr-just-keeps-dropping/

With every new study, with every new paper, the “deadly” pandemic gets less and less, well, deadly. The most recent data review, published in late March, puts the infection fatality ratio (IFR) at 0.15%.

That is, once again, pretty much the same as a normal flu season.

Edited April 23, 2021 by justAnothermuslim

[justAnothermuslim]

If you find yourself still undecided, the following may help : 18 reasons why Christian Elliot won't be getting corona vaccine

https://childrenshealthdefense.org/defender/reasons-not-getting-covid-vaccine/

AND it's point-by-point rebuttal, at

https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/christian-elliots-18-reasons-i-wont-be-getting-a-covid-vaccine-viral-antivaccine-misinformation/

 

 

 

[Allah Seeker]

24 minutes ago, justAnothermuslim said:

Not sure if that 2% represent CaseFatalityRate or InfectionFatalityRate. Anyhow it is 8 times higher than the latest IFR figure (0.15%) in a study done below:

https://off-guardian.org/2021/04/21/covids-ifr-just-keeps-dropping/

With every new study, with every new paper, the “deadly” pandemic gets less and less, well, deadly. The most recent data review, published in late March, puts the infection fatality ratio (IFR) at 0.15%.

That is, once again, pretty much the same as a normal flu season.

A year ago people on this forum were mocking me for saying deaths aren't exponential, as if I dont understand basic mathematics. 

Turns out I was right after all! Alhamdulilah

If it was truly exponential, by now not a single person would be alive now. A bunch of lies and scare tactics. 

[pisceswolf96]

17 hours ago, F.M said:

 

 

first of all towards both of you!! islam is always connected to politics, either youre on the side of abu sufyan and his system or at the side of ahlalbayt

Did you just compare Khamenei to Ahl Al-bayt? If you understand that all of this is politics then you must understand that politicians can be both evil on both sides. After all when the Umayyad & Abbasids fought each other, neither of them was on the right side. So while the prohibition of the vaccine might be political it still a good decision because on the yet to be known disastrous side effects  

[BlueInk]

1 hour ago, pisceswolf96 said:

Did you just compare Khamenei to Ahl Al-bayt? If you understand that all of this is politics then you must understand that politicians can be both evil on both sides. After all when the Umayyad & Abbasids fought each other, neither of them was on the right side. So while the prohibition of the vaccine might be political it still a good decision because on the yet to be known disastrous side effects  

Did you just discredit Khamenei for leading the Iranian nation?

And did you just disregard his truthful statement regarding the separation of church and state?

and did you just say the vaccine is good? despite continuously increasing rates of mortalities, infections, side effects, RNA alterations, it’s relations with sadistic military black operations, and its use in literal bodily possession utility?

 

he who believes in that politics and faith should be separate understands neither.

there is no politics without faith. What affects your relationship with Allah is often society itself as the biggest cause.

please clarify your statement—what side effects of what exactly are you talking about?

[pisceswolf96]

1 hour ago, BlueInk said:

Did you just discredit Khamenei for leading the Iranian nation?

Leading it quite nicely into its eventual downfall

1 hour ago, BlueInk said:

And did you just disregard his truthful statement regarding the separation of church and state?

Not truthful. There is a reason why there must be a separation of church and state, and it took Europe more than 1200 years to learn this lesson and it is quite stupid for us to disregard their experience. Politics pollute religion and religion is used to advance oneself in politics and can be used by Evil men to control entire nations. If you disagree with this then you're disagreeing with Sistani (who called for a secular state) and most of the quietest Shia movement beliefs. There can never be a Religious state unless it was ran by an infallible and so while we are waiting for Mahdi we should separate religion from state unless you're fine with the destruction of Islam and encourage it.

1 hour ago, BlueInk said:

and did you just say the vaccine is good? despite continuously increasing rates of mortalities, infections, side effects, RNA alterations, it’s relations with sadistic military black operations, and its use in literal bodily possession utility?

Nope. My previous post was clear and I agree with Khamenei on this one.

1 hour ago, BlueInk said:

he who believes in that politics and faith should be separate understands neither.

So Sistani is quite ignorant on this one, right?

1 hour ago, BlueInk said:

please clarify your statement—what side effects of what exactly are you talking about?

There has been a lot of self reports from women about their irregular periods, unexplained bleeding and shedding, as well as, miscarriages. You can check most of these here.

[starlight]

1 hour ago, pisceswolf96 said:

You can check most of these here.

THIS is your reference??? The SUN? Verge??

 

 

 

[pisceswolf96]

43 minutes ago, starlight said:

THIS is your reference??? The SUN? Verge??

Yes, self reports are my source. If you truly still believe that researchers that are bought and paid by corporations have integrity and your interest in their mind then you're truly clueless. Such people tried to hide the adverse effects of things like smoking and porn for decades until they were caught and there's absolutely nothing stopping them from doing the same thing with the Vaxx

 

If you still want studies then you have to wait for a year or two (or even longer) and by that time most people would've taken the Vaxx. But there is one study that you should keep your eye on

 

Edited April 24, 2021 by pisceswolf96

[Ashvazdanghe]

On 4/23/2021 at 3:38 AM, Sirius_Bright said:

many shias living in western countries would not take the vaccine and risk their and loved ones life because of one statement. 

Salam he just has stated his opinion  & has not made a Fatwa which his statement  was based previous  vicious  plans of westerners  against  Iran like spreading  AIDS between Iranian hemophiliac through  contanimated blood products by France , also his statement  is about Iran not rest of shia world whih he also stated that if we find a reliable  source for vaccines  by expert then we buy it from these source before ending test trials of Iranian  vaccines so you are free to use any vaccine  for yourself  which safety is not guaranteed for these vaccines  .

On 4/22/2021 at 9:52 PM, Allah Seeker said:

I wonder why he trusts his own vaccines without having them tested medium or long term. I wonder who his scientific adviser is and what he is told exactly with the exact papers. 

From what I understand, Iran is also working on the new mrna technology? 

at least homegrown  vaccines  even with mrna technology  will be safe for Iranians also trials of all types of Iranian  vaccines on volunteers  had not any side effects .

[starlight]

33 minutes ago, pisceswolf96 said:

Yes, self reports are my source.

Nothing wrong with self reports but at least get it from a serious source. I have been over that Twitter page and it's a joke. 

The other page you linked, why I would take it with a grain of salt is 

a. Menstrual irregularities are very very common. A woman can have something a little as common cold or stress of an upcoming exam and her periods could get disturbed.

b. Since these are not medical studies, I don't know what if they were really menstrual irregularities. There is a criteria for that and any deviation from your usual cycle does not fall under menstrual irregularity.

And finally, I live in Pakistan. When we had the polio vaccination campaign here conspiracy theorists started the propaganda that this is a secret plan to make the great nation sterile and fertile, with the result that Pakistan remains a one of the very countries where polio still hasn't been eradicated. As for causing infertility we are one of the most highly populated countries!!! And children still have polio. Those 'scholars' who misled parents are indirectly responsible for a children now living with disability. 

We had government subsidized cooking oil, yes cooking oil!!  and these self proclaimed conspiracy theorist disguised as Ulemas issued statements that since the funding came from west so it has some secret gene altering agents and using the cooking oil is going to affect people's faith. And yes, many people believed and followed them!! This was three decades ago, no one grew the horns of satan, religiosity didn't take any sharp turns either. I understand Iran being sceptical, but that still isn't a reason for the rest of us to panic. 

I haven't taken the vaccine, I still haven't decided if I will but I certainly am not running around creating unecessary panic, nor am I belittling the people who have taken it for their faith, like some people here. 

I believe one should be stronger both emotionally and in faith to not let every rumour,news story and turbulence shake him. Only one thing matters, we live on the love of Ahlulbayt and we die for Allah(عليه السلام). As long as these two conditions are fulfilled NOTHING else matters. 

Take a deep breath. I know these are troubling times but rest assured Allah is watching over us. Protect your faith( and like a said earlier, vaccines can't do a thing to your faith) and everything else is safe. 

[EDIT] and if your faith feels threatened by a drug then you need to question and work on your faith. 

Edited April 24, 2021 by starlight

[pisceswolf96]

24 minutes ago, starlight said:

Nothing wrong with self reports but at least get it from a serious source. I have been over that Twitter page and it's a joke. 

The other page you linked, why I would take it with a grain of salt is 

a. Menstrual irregularities are very very common. A woman can have something a little as common cold or stress of an upcoming exam and her periods could get disturbed.

How about shedding? Is that really common among women?

24 minutes ago, starlight said:

b. Since these are not medical studies, I don't know what if they were really menstrual irregularities. There is a criteria for that and any deviation from your usual cycle does not fall under menstrual irregularity.

Yes, but at the same time we should be careful about sticking untested poison in our veins.

24 minutes ago, starlight said:

And finally, I live in Pakistan. When we had the polio vaccination campaign here conspiracy theorists started the propaganda that this is a secret plan to make the great nation sterile and fertile, with the result that Pakistan remains a one of the very countries where polio still hasn't been eradicated. As for causing infertility we are one of the most highly populated countries!!! And children still have polio. Those 'scholars' who misled parents are indirectly responsible for a children now living with disability.

How long were the polio vaccines tested before they were considered safe? I mean you're comparing Corona (which is basically flu) to Polio, those are really different diseases with different amounts of damage.

24 minutes ago, starlight said:

We had government subsidized cooking oil, yes cooking oil!!  and these self proclaimed conspiracy theorist disguised as Ulemas issued statements that since the funding came from west so it has some secret gene altering agents and using the cooking oil is going to affect people's faith. And yes, many people believed and followed them!! This was three decades ago, no one grew the horns of satan, religiosity didn't take any sharp turns either. I understand Iran being sceptical, but that still isn't a reason for the rest of us to panic.

What kind of oil? Because cooking oils can be dangerous if they mess with your hormones, especially your Testosterone. If the west decided to subsidize Soy products for the middle east then I would agree that they are engaging in biological warfare.

And I really like that you're suggesting we shouldn't panic when this Virus was overblown. I don't mind people taking the Vax but Governments are now trying to force us into taking it without any compensation for side effects. If people get Sterile because of it then who's going to care of them when they get old?

24 minutes ago, starlight said:

I haven't taken the vaccine, I still haven't decided if I will but I certainly am not running around creating unecessary panic, nor am I belittling the people who have taken it for their faith, like some people here.

You should really take the Johnson & Johnson one. I heard great things about it, amazing side effects.

24 minutes ago, starlight said:

I believe one should be stronger both emotionally and in faith to not let every rumour,news story and turbulence shake him. Only one thing matters, we live on the love of Ahlulbayt and we die for Allah(عليه السلام). As long as these two conditions are fulfilled NOTHING else matters.

Really? If one truly loves Ahlulbayt then he should realize that Biological Warfare is here and it's here to stay. People should also start exercising, losing weight, and eating healthy. Injecting oneself with chemicals doesn't really show love of God or Ahlulbayt. Otherwise we should inject ourselves with Cocaine while smoking Marijuana in the name of Allah

24 minutes ago, starlight said:

Take a deep breath. I know these are troubling times but rest assured Allah is watching over us. Protect your faith( and like a said earlier, vaccines can't do a thing to your faith) and everything else is safe. 

[EDIT] and if your faith feels threatened by a drug then you need to question and work on your faith. 

Are you kidding me? If the Vax carries Nano bodies or affect your hormones then it can and will affect your faith. There is a reason why Islam prohibits drugs and alcohol, because those things affect your hormonal levels and control of your brain. If the Vax does the same thing then what's the difference?

[Syed.Dynasty]

53 minutes ago, starlight said:

We had government subsidized cooking oil, yes cooking oil!!  and these self proclaimed conspiracy theorist disguised as Ulemas issued statements that since the funding came from west so it has some secret gene altering agents and using the cooking oil is going to affect people's faith. And yes, many people believed and followed them!! This was three decades ago, no one grew the horns of satan, religiosity didn't take any sharp turns either. I understand Iran being sceptical, but that still isn't a reason for the rest of us to panic. 

Just because some scholars are incorrect is no reason for anyone to let the elite experiment on themselves. Especially with you mentioning some of the capabilities of the mRNA. This is how disinformation campaigns and propaganda wars work. You can’t point to once instance and say oh they were wrong so therefore the other side must be right. That mentality is erroneous.

In the last three decades Pakistan has become more and more secular. Much less people are religious. I’m not saying this has anything to do with the vaccine, but for you to say religiosity hasn’t taken a sharp turn in Pakistan over the last 30 years is completely inaccurate.

25 minutes ago, pisceswolf96 said:

Really? If one truly loves Ahlulbayt then he should realize that Biological Warfare is here and it's here to stay. People should also start exercising, losing weight, and eating healthy. Injecting oneself with chemicals doesn't really show love of God or Ahlulbayt. Otherwise we should inject ourselves with Cocaine while smoking Marijuana in the name of Allah

Are you kidding me? If the Vax carries Nano bodies or affect your hormones then it can and will affect your faith. There is a reason why Islam prohibits drugs and alcohol, because those things affect your hormonal levels and control of your brain. If the Vax does the same thing then what's the difference?

Exactly if the mRNA can affect neural synapses it definitely can affect the belief centres in your brain which definitely can affect your faith. The mind, body and soul are connected. Letting those who deny the existence of Allah, force the population to get vaccinated is something that should make us all question the official narrative to say the least.

[pisceswolf96]

12 minutes ago, Syed.Dynasty said:

Just because some scholars are incorrect is no reason for anyone to let the elite experiment on themselves. Especially with you mentioning some of the capabilities of the mRNA. This is how disinformation campaigns and propaganda wars work. You can’t point to once instance and say oh they were wrong so therefore the other side must be right. That mentality is erroneous.

Shut up you ignorant bigot and take the Vax. Don't be like those stupid conspiracy theorists that claim that the western elites are trying to microchip us or that they are kidnapping children to use the andrechrome of their blood to remain youthful or are trying to create animal/human hybrids

 

Speaking of which... 

 

Quote

In the last three decades Pakistan has become more and more secular. Much less people are religious. I’m not saying this has anything to do with the vaccine, but for you to say religiosity hasn’t taken a sharp turn in Pakistan over the last 30 years is completely inaccurate.

Ernest Hemingway said:

“How did you go bankrupt?"
Two ways. Gradually, then suddenly.”

This is exactly the definition of the slippery slope. Conservatives have been warning of how degeneracy will destroy the western society since the 60s but everyone made fun of them and look how the west turned out

Quote

Exactly if the mRNA can affect neural synapses it definitely can affect the belief centres in your brain which definitely can affect your faith. The mind, body and soul are connected. Letting those who deny the existence of Allah, force the population to get vaccinated is something that should make us all question the official narrative to say the least.

Beautifully said. Modern beliefs led us to accept the false truth that we are nothing more but our minds when in fact even our hearts and stomachs have neurons (The human gut has 100 million nerve cells which is like a brain on its own).

That's why the prophet always told us that what we eats is what gets us sick and what cures us.

[starlight]

17 minutes ago, pisceswolf96 said:

How about shedding? Is that really common among women?

Sloughing off of the uterine lining is what constitutes menstruation. It happens in every single woman.

See this is the problem when people who have little knowledge or medicine or religion start issuing statements.

19 minutes ago, pisceswolf96 said:

but at the same time we should be careful about sticking untested poison in our veins.

I never said you should. One should weigh the pros and cons. Chemotherapeutic drugs are basically cytotoxic agents- chemicals that kill the body cells. Steroids suppress our immune system.Some antibiotics can lower the count of Immune cells. Aspirin can lead to bleeding disorders.

Now, you sitting in your home might not think taking the vaccine is a good idea but there are high risk groups-  frontline workers, people who already suffer from chronic lung diseases leading to compromised lung function, people who care for their parents or other relatives who suffer from serious illnesses, when these people weigh their pros and cons they might think taking a chance with a new vaccine is good idea. We had a mother who was vaccinated for COVID during pregnancy because she was scheduled to undergo a C section , she had her baby recently and her baby was also found to have antibodies against Corona Virus spike proteins so the immunity was transferred from the mother to the baby. I also personally know of more than one unvaccinated mothers who underwent emergency C sections, three new born babies are now COVID positive and in the ICU, two mothers have passed away and one is on the ventilator. By saying all this again, I am not implying the vaccine is a cure all but there are more than one sides to the picture and one should be able to look at it from all perspectives. While I haven't taken the vaccine but I am not going to mock my colleague for taking it who works in the COVID ICU and has two elderly parents and a pregnant wife and little son at home.

33 minutes ago, pisceswolf96 said:

How long were the polio vaccines tested before they were considered safe? I mean you're comparing Corona (which is basically flu) to Polio, those are really different diseases with different amounts of damage.

The only thing I am comparing is the damaging influence of medically and religiously illiterate conspiracy theorist. Polio vaccines were around for much longer than COVID but conspiracy theorist still did enough propaganda to deter people away from those.

34 minutes ago, pisceswolf96 said:

And I really like that you're suggesting we shouldn't panic when this Virus was overblown

Don't put words in my mouth. I NEVER said the virus was overblown. All I am saying is don't panic. 

 

35 minutes ago, pisceswolf96 said:

You should really take the Johnson & Johnson one. I heard great things about it, amazing side effects.

If I need your advice and expert opinion I will ask for it.

 

37 minutes ago, pisceswolf96 said:

Are you kidding me? If the Vax carries Nano bodies or affect your hormones then it can and will affect your faith. There is a reason why Islam prohibits drugs and alcohol, because those things affect your hormonal levels and control of your brain. If the Vax does the same thing then what's the difference?

In Islam everything is halal until proven otherwise. In certain special circumstances even the Haram become permissible. Drugs and by this I understand you mean drug abuse is Haram, using drugs isn't . If you consume enough paracetamol knowing it will damage your liver that would be haram and a sign of weak faith. Until you can prove that the vaccine is harmful , and that doesn't mean Twitter pages or british tabloids you cannot put it in the same category as alcohol and cocaine.

 

[pisceswolf96]

7 minutes ago, starlight said:

Sloughing off of the uterine lining is what constitutes menstruation. It happens in every single woman.

See this is the problem when people who have little knowledge or medicine or religion start issuing statements.

I meant shedding pieces like these which some women reported happening

[starlight]

16 minutes ago, Syed.Dynasty said:

In the last three decades Pakistan has become more and more secular. Much less people are religious. I’m not saying this has anything to do with the vaccine, but for you to say religiosity hasn’t taken a sharp turn in Pakistan over the last 30 years is completely inaccurate.

Not going to waste time with the rest of your posts but that's a worldwide trend, not something unique to Pakistan. These trends have been seen throughout the history of mankind during the times when humanity was left without a divine guide, the most easily recognisable was the time of Jahiliyaah in Arab when people had almost completely abandoned the Abrahamic religion. Just a reminder, those people were not consuming goods or drugs spiked with religion altering bioweapons. 

[starlight]

3 minutes ago, pisceswolf96 said:

I meant shedding pieces like these which some women reported happening

A social media picture?? Is this what you are basing your 'research' on????? I can post a picture of a my chicken on social media and say look this is what a woman delivered after getting the vaccine.

Get me a source for this or you are wasting everyone's time. 

[pisceswolf96]

46 minutes ago, starlight said:

I never said you should. One should weigh the pros and cons. Chemotherapeutic drugs are basically cytotoxic agents- chemicals that kill the body cells. Steroids suppress our immune system.Some antibiotics can lower the count of Immune cells. Aspirin can lead to bleeding disorders.

I wasn't talking about that because no one is denying me service at a restaurant or a Government building because I have cancer or flu. But they want to do this with Covid. You might say that they do this to protect older and higher-risk people. But the flu do affect those groups badly if the catch but I don't see Influenza passports being passed around.

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Now, you sitting in your home might not think taking the vaccine is a good idea but there are high risk groups-  frontline workers, people who already suffer from chronic lung diseases leading to compromised lung function, people who care for their parents or other relatives who suffer from serious illnesses, when these people weigh their pros and cons they might think taking a chance with a new vaccine is good idea. We had a mother who was vaccinated for COVID during pregnancy because she was scheduled to undergo a C section , she had her baby recently and her baby was also found to have antibodies against Corona Virus spike proteins so the immunity was transferred from the mother to the baby. I also personally know of more than one unvaccinated mothers who underwent emergency C sections, three new born babies are now COVID positive and in the ICU, two mothers have passed away and one is on the ventilator. By saying all this again, I am not implying the vaccine is a cure all but there are more than one sides to the picture and one should be able to look at it from all perspectives. While I haven't taken the vaccine but I am not going to mock my colleague for taking it who works in the COVID ICU and has two elderly parents and a pregnant wife and little son at home.

So the kids also get the Vax to ensure that future generations are also damaged. We don't know the long term effects of the Vax but we are fine with experimenting with it on newly born children.

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The only thing I am comparing is the damaging influence of medically and religiously illiterate conspiracy theorist. Polio vaccines were around for much longer than COVID but conspiracy theorist still did enough propaganda to deter people away from those.

I've seen my share of conspiracy theories (especially ones made by Alex Jones) that turned out to be true. My motto is "Conspiracy Theories are true until proven otherwise".

And beside if you think that propaganda is bad then the same propaganda is being done with the Virus and the Vax. If they didn't want people to be panicky then they should've not make the people panic about the Virus in the first place.

 

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Don't put words in my mouth. I NEVER said the virus was overblown. All I am saying is don't panic. 

Never said that you did.

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If I need your advice and expert opinion I will ask for it.

Believe me. The experts told me that it was absolutely fine (until its use was discontinued). I also follow the advice of doctors from the 20s and smoke twice daily. And I watch porn and masturbate daily because sexologists told me it's absolutely fine and causes no psychological or physical damage whatsoever

 

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In Islam everything is halal until proven otherwise. In certain special circumstances even the Haram become permissible.

Wrong. I believe you meant Mubah (allowed).

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Drugs and by this I understand you mean drug abuse is Haram, using drugs isn't . If you consume enough paracetamol knowing it will damage your liver that would be haram and a sign of weak faith. Until you can prove that the vaccine is harmful , and that doesn't mean Twitter pages or british tabloids you cannot put it in the same category as alcohol and cocaine.

So Islam doesn't mind me smoking Marijuana since it doesn't really do anything to affect the body (at least science says so). This sort of reasoning is faulty. Because millions died as a result of smoking before smoking was proven to be harmful.

To drive this point home. The science community ignored the adverse effects of porn until online forums forced them to. And those communities (like the nofap subreddit and forums) actually developed their own language and terms (ex: PIED = Porn Induced Erectile Dysfunction).

So please spare me the worship of science. Science is not only slow to reach conclusions but also politicized beyond belief. I don't want to be one of the people who will suffer of a severe side effect and for science to come decades later to tell me "Oops I guess the Vax was bad after all."

Edited April 24, 2021 by pisceswolf96

[pisceswolf96]

15 minutes ago, starlight said:

A social media picture?? Is this what you are basing your 'research' on????? I can post a picture of a my chicken on social media and say look this is what a woman delivered after getting the vaccine.

Get me a source for this or you are wasting everyone's time. 

Good luck to you. I truly hope that my predictions turns to be false.

[Syed.Dynasty]

28 minutes ago, starlight said:

Not going to waste time with the rest of your posts but that's a worldwide trend, not something unique to Pakistan. These trends have been seen throughout the history of mankind during the times when humanity was left without a divine guide, the most easily recognisable was the time of Jahiliyaah in Arab when people had almost completely abandoned the Abrahamic religion. Just a reminder, those people were not consuming goods or drugs spiked with religion altering bioweapons. 

You claimed there hasn’t been a sharp turn in religiosity either way over the last thirty years. Now you admit there is. Oof. Thanks for clarifying sis.
 

Also your ignoring the point of these vaccines directly being able to effect your faith. You admitted it can affect neural synapses which can directly effect the belief parts of your brain. Which can directly effect your deen.  
 

Don’t worry about answering my other posts sis. if I was arguing in favour of being in an experiment by the western elite i would totally run away from those points as well.

[pisceswolf96]

23 minutes ago, starlight said:

Just a reminder, those people were not consuming goods or drugs spiked with religion altering bioweapons. 

Psychedelics, Alcohol, Pork?

[Syed.Dynasty]

51 minutes ago, starlight said:

By saying all this again, I am not implying the vaccine is a cure all but there are more than one sides to the picture and one should be able to look at it from all perspectives. While I haven't taken the vaccine but I am not going to mock my colleague for taking it who works in the COVID ICU and has two elderly parents and a pregnant wife and little son at home.

Of course all sides should be looked at in depth. That’s what we’re trying to do here. Most ppl will mock you for even questioning the vaccines or anything to do with the official narrative.

 

51 minutes ago, starlight said:

If you consume enough paracetamol knowing it will damage your liver that would be haram and a sign of weak faith. Until you can prove that the vaccine is harmful , and that doesn't mean Twitter pages or british tabloids you cannot put it in the same category as alcohol and cocaine.

I mean it might a signify a lack of knowledge regarding the drug you mentioned, not necessarily a lack of faith. What your misunderstanding is that vaccines trick the brain into activating the brains immune system. Which if you even read the posts I made on page 2 a neurosurgeon says that can be very harmful to the brain. Regardless there are other remedies and medications available the do unlike the vaccine candidates actually combat covid and it’s variants. Why as a doctor are you not talking about these? 

 

51 minutes ago, starlight said:

1 hour ago, pisceswolf96 said:

 

I never said you should. One should weigh the pros and cons. Chemotherapeutic drugs are basically cytotoxic agents- chemicals that kill the body cells. Steroids suppress our immune system.Some antibiotics can lower the count of Immune cells. Aspirin can lead to bleeding disorders.

 

That’s why they used to say check with your medical professional before using most of what you mentioned above. Now their saying you have to get our vaccines or your travel will be restricted or you’ll be publicly shamed and damage your reputation.

Edited April 24, 2021 by Syed.Dynasty

[Sirius_Bright]

People can literally see how covid is catching everyone and killing in millions. The Vaccine that can protect from covid infection and death is 'untrustworthy' and 'dangerous' just based on conjecture. 

[F.M]

28 minutes ago, Sirius_Bright said:

People can literally see how covid is catching everyone and killing in millions. The Vaccine that can protect from covid infection and death is 'untrustworthy' and 'dangerous' just based on conjecture. 

less than 2% death rate. a normal flu is even more harsh. the thing s only that is spread fast, but still death rate is less then 2%

millions of people are also dieying of other reasons, including suicide,depression, being poor, homeless.

its not untrustworthy because its straight from the government. 

Edited April 24, 2021 by F.M

[Syed.Dynasty]

59 minutes ago, Sirius_Bright said:

People can literally see how covid is catching everyone and killing in millions. The Vaccine that can protect from covid infection and death is 'untrustworthy' and 'dangerous' just based on conjecture. 

The vaccines only claim to protect against covid 19 infections and not any other variant. They don’t fight the infection and your gonna need a new one every time a new variant comes out. You not knowing the long term effects but claiming it’s the best option is all conjecture. Especially when there are multiple other remedies available.