Imam Ali (as) refusing to erase “messenger” from the hudaybia treaty

[zahralzu]

Sunnis always liken umar’s refusal to bring the prophet ((صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم)) pen and paper on Thursday and refused to allow him to write his will “out of love and respect for the prophet” to imam Ali’s (عليه السلام) refusal to remove “messenger of Allah” from the hudaybia peace treaty also out of love and respect for the prophet; how do you explain that this is not the same thing?

[Syed Ali Mehdi Shah Naqvi]

56 minutes ago, zahralzu said:

Sunnis always liken umar’s refusal to bring the prophet ((صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم)) pen and paper on Thursday and refused to allow him to write his will “out of love and respect for the prophet” to imam Ali’s (عليه السلام) refusal to remove “messenger of Allah” from the hudaybia peace treaty also out of love and respect for the prophet; how do you explain that this is not the same thing?

Where is love and respect in stopping a person in his last moments from writing a will? Lol

Also Rasool (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم). got angry and asked them to leave in anger.

While Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) showed no anger on Hudybiyah Treaty when Ali (عليه السلام) said I can't erase Rasool Allah.

Indeed later one was out of respect and firm belief.

[Syed Ali Mehdi Shah Naqvi]

Plus their hadith books hold no value for us. I think Our narrative of Huddybiyah doesn't have same words as sunni narrative.

[zahralzu]

2 hours ago, Syed Ali Mehdi Shah Naqvi said:

Where is love and respect in stopping a person in his last moments from writing a will? Lol

I suppose from seeing the prophet ((صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم)) in so much pain and physical fatigue on his death bed and thus umar’s insisting he should rest and not over-exert himself...

[zahralzu]

2 hours ago, Syed Ali Mehdi Shah Naqvi said:

Also Rasool (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم). got angry and asked them to leave in anger.

They argue his anger is due to his companions arguing in front of him and the prophet ((صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم)) didn’t wish to see that, as opposed to him being angry at getting told “the book of Allah is sufficient” 

[Zainuu]

2 hours ago, zahralzu said:

 

I suppose from seeing the prophet ((صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم)) in so much pain and physical fatigue on his death bed and thus umar’s insisting he should rest and not over-exert himself...

The words of both the narrations and the context can easily explain that one was out of respect while other was disrespectful.

In the treaty of Hudabiya, there were many objections by the some companions and Imam Ali (عليه السلام) didn't object or refuse. He simply stood quiet because it was difficult for him to remove the name of the Holy Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم).

And so the Holy Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) removed it himself:

 

Quote

 

Objection of Some of the Companions

Tolerance of the Prophet (s) made some Companions angry and criticizing and they were even heard saying inappropriate words and asking ironic questions about the Prophet (s). 'Umar b. al-Khattab was among them who objected to the Prophet (s). He thought that peace treaty was making Muslims humiliated and so much insisted on this that Abu 'Ubayda al-Jarrah told him, "Take refuge to God from the evil of Satan and consider your opinion wrong!" 'Umar himself later admitted that he doubted even about the prophethood of the Prophet (s) on that day and that said, "I rejected the Prophet's (s) opinion based on my personal judgment."

Content

After negotiations, the Prophet (s) called 'Ali (a) and told him, "Write 'Bism Allah al-Rahman al-Rahim'." Suhayl b. 'Amr said, "I do not take this name valid, and you should write the name we take valid "Bismik Allahumma" and 'Ali (a) followed the order of the Prophet (s) and wrote so.

Then, the Prophet (s) said, "Write 'this is what Muhammad, Rasul Allah agreed with Suhayl b. 'Amr.'" Suhayl said, "If we knew you as Rasul Allah [Messenger of God], we would not fight you this much! This title should also be omitted and 'Muhammad b. 'Abd Allah' should be written instead." The Prophet (s) accepted and when he (s) found that it was difficult for 'Ali b. Abi Talib (a) to omit the title of Rasul Allah following the name of the Prophet (s), the Prophet (s) himself stretched his finger and said, "O 'Ali, show me the place and let me omit this title myself."

 

So, if Hudabiya is the issue, what about the doubts of Umar on the day of this treaty?

Regarding the Hadith of pen n paper:

No one stops from writing a will out of love. No one says that "The book is sufficient in this case."

If he loved the Holy Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) so much he should have said that:

"You are ill so let me write it and you dictate it to me."

I mean, in any normal scenario, people don't refuse to someone who is ill but instead try to minimize there pain by helping them.