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In the Name of God بسم الله

Domestic abuse

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Fizz786

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Asalamu Alaikum Sister. I applaud your decision to settling at a women's refuge.

If I were to give any advice it would be to not cut ties with people who retain potential assistance for you

Sometimes it's not the safest to depend on the system alone.

Also your family and relatives are the backbone of your rebound.

Don't forget you are in our prayers.

Good luck Wasalam :muslima:

 

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On 12/29/2020 at 6:54 PM, Fizz786 said:

salam alaikum 

inshaAllah you all are well. I have been through domestic abuse, so emotional psychological, emotional and physical abuse. Im getting some anxiety but came to a womans refuge with my 2 year old son. Any advice?

 

jazkaAllah

Fizz786 xx

There is always two sides of a story no man is mad enough to beat a woman without a reason especially when you already have a kid together. it is obvious 50 percent of issue is with you and rest 50 with him, try to talk and try to pin point the main cause of problem with him.

if he is drunk or drug addict then above advice wont help.

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19 minutes ago, starlight said:

Don't go back, can't stress enough. 

No matter how much he begs or pleads or threatens or pressurises you, don't go back. No matter how difficult life ahead seems don't even think of going back to him.

Pray to Allah asking for help, for the safety of your child and for protection of your honour and you will be fine. 

 

what is your qualification to give such stupid advice to a woman and incite her to break her house without even knowing the full story and hearing the other side of the story.

 

be ashamed to give such drastic advice especially when you are a senior member here.

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2 hours ago, Fizz786 said:

Any advice?

Salaam sister,

May Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) settle your affairs.

Go by order:

1. If their is any room for compromise or bringing your relationship back then do make an effort. Definitely don't go their or meet him alone now but rather through call or messages. Or if you meet then don't do it without a strong support with you.

2. If nothing can be done after all efforts, then divorce him. You can do it through a jurist who can file an irrevocable divorce on his behalf. Their are many good guys out their and moving on is the best option then.

May Allah bless you and protect you.

 

 

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Let's give the OP the right to some judgement free advice.

Sometimes we don't know the whole story. What we can do is give advice to someone who asks for it.

 

Btw speaking of reconciliation, the reality is that sometimes some situations are beyond the norm. I have known kids who were sodomized by their own biological father (who's hopefully booked for a nice spot in hell). Their families had an inkling of what was going on, but they chose to turn a blind eye. They are leading somewhat functional lives as adults, but they might never recover from this.

Sometimes, doing the right thing involves something other than reconciliation.

Edited by Sabrejet
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8 minutes ago, starlight said:

 So I get you think a marriage still stands a chance after the husband has hit his wife to the point that she had to escape to another place.

You believe something is left of the marriage after a woman feels unsafe with the one who was supposed to be love and protect her? 

The Messenger of Allah said: “What! Does one of you hit his wife, and then attempt to embrace her?"  Al-Kafi

 

If the islamic way is to be followed then the husband has to pay Diyyah(blood money) to teh wife for the physical violence but no one ever talks about this. 

 

This thread is a textbook example of how muslim communities deal with domestic violence - justify the violence, jump to make excuses for the man, tell the woman she to save her marriage, she is the one who has to think about the children.

You have a point and I agree. A man who hits his wife is accursed and we don't have a doubt on this. 

I agree that looking at the gravity of matter, the issue is more inclined towards separation. 

But 'compromise' doesn't mean that it should be done by a woman only. No, the meaning of reconciliation or compromise is that it should come from the side which is the root of the problem. It should be considered before any divorce so that the man has no chance whatsoever left to say that "He was not given a chance."

In this case, though it well appears that all is over but because we don't have the complete story and I will never insist her to tell it on a public thread. So, it is better to provide viable options. 

People tend to not advice divorce (including me) because divorce is the last and the least considered option. It is denounced to a great extent.

Defintely I don'TV disagree with you but I am just clearing up the incorrect assumpyions.

May Allah bless you.

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5 minutes ago, Fizz786 said:

yes there is a drug problem.

Then leave him. Drug problems cause abrupt anger. Either he should be counselled to stop those drugs because it might be the major cause of anger which would take ages for recovery and I don't think anyone should wait so long. Even after that their is no guarantee, he won't repeat.

So, in anyway if drug problem is their then please sister, go for divorce. Don't sacrifice yourself for this man.

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Surah Nisa 34 (Q4:34) 

Technically Islam doesnt have a problem with beating women as wives are right hand property. Sure you will be punished in the grave and the here after but it falls into the rights of a Husband.

Though there's obviously some intelligent reason for all this. Nothing is problematic or immoral.

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3 hours ago, starlight said:

 

If the islamic way is to be followed then the husband has to pay Diyyah(blood money) to the wife for the physical violence but no one ever talks about this. 

Indeed this should be one of the steps of reconciliation. 

Of course if the man is not showing any remorse or regret and is likely to continue then I agree with you. 

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3 hours ago, Fizz786 said:

yes there is a drug problem. yes i have my mistakes without a doubt. but he has huge anger issues. 

If you think there are chances for a reconciliation then I think he needs an intervention to address the drug issue as well as the anger issue. 

He must commit to working on these if there is any chance for a future together. 

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2 hours ago, Guest Advice said:

Surah Nisa 34 (Q4:34) 

Technically Islam doesnt have a problem with beating women as wives are right hand property. Sure you will be punished in the grave and the here after but it falls into the rights of a Husband.

Though there's obviously some intelligent reason for all this. Nothing is problematic or immoral.

I think this verse must be examined, research what scholars and maraj explained as. It can be very easily misinterpreted. If this verse is going to be used, it must be used very carefully. It  should be analyzed carefully before it should be used. It should not be used to justify the beating of the women as it will leave a negative image of islam.

I don't support the beating of women or men at all regardless whether their faults or not

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Salams all,

As a rule of thumb, one must be mindful about not giving advice on issues they have no real experience in and especially with the little information provided by the OP.

Whilst I don't doubt the good intentions behind all the suggestions and advice, the wrong type of advice can have devastating consequences if followed. Just as reconciling with a domestic abuser can be akin to suicide; shifting the full blame onto the partner when both could be complicit in the abuse is also devastating to all involved, especially the child(ren).  

The fact is the OP hasn't disclosed much at all for anyone to be able to offer solid advice moving forward.

Let's also remember that It's not always the man who is the abuser in a relationship and just because a woman has moved to a refuge, it doesn't mean she's the actual or the only real victim. She could be the real and only victim, or she could be complicit in the abuse, or in some cases, she could even be a deceitful abuser who's playing the system and pretending to be the victim. 

I'm not at all insinuating anything about the OP here but merely stating real life scenarios and the dangers in offering advice on issues without being fully informed on the dynamics and details of the relationship or having experience in dealing with domestic abuse and couple conflict. It’s far from black and white.

OP- I’m sorry you are going through such testing times but some context would be helpful if you want productive advice.

You vaguely mentioned drug use which can be a spliff years ago, or daily crack injections; there needs to be context.

You’d mentioned in a previous thread explaining your mental health, that your husband was very supportive and cared for your well-being as well as did not pressure you on house work. You also mentioned that, at times you were verbally abusive and when unwell you turn into ‘a complete monster’, whilst your husband makes sure you take your meds regularly.

The disclosures you’d previously made in a separate thread offer some perspective to your situation but it goes to show that one cannot offer sound advice based on ‘I’m a victim of domestic abuse in a refuge, any advice?’

I would suggest you reflect upon your relationship and each partner’s role in the abuse. Your son’s well-being should be the utmost priority. He needs both parents in his life.

Since you’re now in a refuge, are you taking the position that your husband is a danger to you and the child, therefore cannot see his child? Only supervised? You will also probably face an ensuing custody battle; are you going to do what’s best for the child or try to paint your previously ‘very supportive’ husband into a druggie domestic abuser? Will you own up to your own part in the instability of the relationship and work on promoting a loving and stable environment for your child in the form of healthy co-parenting? Or will you try to shut out the father and keep the child all to yourself?       

My advice is to reflect upon the above and remember that children have been entrusted to us by Allah Ta’ala to keep safe, to love and to promote what’s best for them in this life and the afterlife.

Wasalam     

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3 hours ago, Guest Advice said:

Surah Nisa 34 (Q4:34) 

Technically Islam doesnt have a problem with beating women as wives are right hand property. Sure you will be punished in the grave and the here after but it falls into the rights of a Husband.

Though there's obviously some intelligent reason for all this. Nothing is problematic or immoral.

Astaghfirullah rabbi. 

No, no. This verse doesn't mean to beat her. Please mention the entire verse. 

Their is a whole chapter on divorce and much extreme matters than the issue mentioned in this verse. 

Study the lives of The Holy Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم). Did the Holy Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) beat Aisha. Or did Imam Muhammad Taqi (عليه السلام) beat Ummul Fazl? You have to remember Ummul Fazl poisoned Imam Al Jawad. 

The verse is about admonishing and not beating or any kind of physical punishment.

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11 hours ago, shoelace said:

There is always two sides of a story no man is mad enough to beat a woman without a reason especially when you already have a kid together. it is obvious 50 percent of issue is with you and rest 50 with him, try to talk and try to pin point the main cause of problem with him.

 

if he is drunk or drug addict then above advice wont help.

There is always two sides of the story, but also don't assume things. If there are two sides of the story, we don't know either one. OP never gave details so how do we know what the two sides are. 

To the OP:

If you feel like your life, or the life or your children or safety is in danger, then definitely you should take yourself out of the situation. Whether reconciliation can happen or not depends on the specifics of your situation. I highly recommend you bring in a trusted alim and / or family member and let them negotiate on your behalf, either mutually agreed separation (divorce) or reconciliation, depending on what the advice is from the trusted person who knows all the details. 

To the others on this thread, please don't superimpose your own experience and judgements based on that experience on the OPs situation. Her situation may be totally different (or it may be the same), but we don't have enough information to know. 

Edited by Abu Hadi
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11 hours ago, shoelace said:

what is your qualification to give such stupid advice to a woman and incite her to break her house without even knowing the full story and hearing the other side of the story.

 

be ashamed to give such drastic advice especially when you are a senior member here.

If her advice is stupid, then yours is also stupid. Why would you recommend she reconcile with someone who may do physical harm to her and her children ? I am not saying this will happen, but Please don't give advice without knowing the facts. That is the point. 

Edited by Abu Hadi
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4 hours ago, Meedy said:

I think this verse must be examined, research what scholars and maraj explained as. It can be very easily misinterpreted. If this verse is going to be used, it must be used very carefully. It  should be analyzed carefully before it should be used. It should not be used to justify the beating of the women as it will leave a negative image of islam.

I don't support the beating of women or men at all regardless whether their faults or not

 

3 hours ago, Zainuu said:

Astaghfirullah rabbi. 

No, no. This verse doesn't mean to beat her. Please mention the entire verse. 

Their is a whole chapter on divorce and much extreme matters than the issue mentioned in this verse. 

Study the lives of The Holy Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم). Did the Holy Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) beat Aisha. Or did Imam Muhammad Taqi (عليه السلام) beat Ummul Fazl? You have to remember Ummul Fazl poisoned Imam Al Jawad. 

The verse is about admonishing and not beating or any kind of physical punishment.

Salam Brothers. I dont support even looking at a spouse whether a male or a female with anger even much less raising a hand from either side. But I was sharing something that falls into the "problematic" category in the 21st century. The verse is interpreted differently by scholars and the translators as well with some translators such as Usmani replaces "admonish" with "strike them" and Sahih also uses "strike them" and Sharafat says "beat" and Yusuf Ali says "Beat lightly". 

These are some of the most popular translations which the general masses use. Not everyone can speak arabic or bothers to check the context of something or goes into the lives of the Masoomeen. So they take these verses as is. 

May Allah<(سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى)> help this sister in the OP post. 

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24 minutes ago, Guest Advice said:

These are some of the most popular translations which the general masses use. Not everyone can speak arabic or bothers to check the context of something or goes into the lives of the Masoomeen. So they take these verses as is. 

This I agree with brother.

Actually, what should I say.

The cancer of dominance and lashing and abusing is so bad in some muslims that they pronounce this verse and make it a basis of their madness. 

I have seen it from my eyes and for once I was just struck that how can a maniac oppressor lash out at a woman and at the other breathe justify it from The Qur'an. Shame. 

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@OP:

My advice to you is to try your hardest to make a better life for yourself and your son. I dont know what it feels like to go through domestic abuse, but the fact that you've acknowledged the issue and taken steps to protect yourself means you're already 10 steps ahead. Just focus on building a life for yourself and your son. If you do go back to him youre giving him a huge indication of what you feel is your self worth. 

@those who blamed her: 

I hope one day God bestows you with an actual heart and brain to help you think rationally, and freely from all the hatred and misogyny that's blinding you. If you have nothing useful to say, keep it to yourself.

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At the end of the day, You are the one who would have to deal with the Real Life consequences if you listen to bad/emotional/knee jerk/ feel good progressive/assertive power women "sounding" slogans/venting(advice). 

 All the Advisors will disappear or disown you or will never ever admit they gave to wrong advice, Most just vent out their personal issues , some try to project power.  

Seek professional(Religious/Secular) advice so some one can determine what is abuse/maltreatment etc...because these are All subjective terms. Don't marry a spouse who is a flight risk if certain demands/social/personal/career goals are not met. Most don't understand the meaning and purpose of Marriage. Good to have conversation before you get into something and have clear goals. Ensure they are mutual. 

In the secular world, they talk a lot but no action or support in real terms. So, watch out for big words and terms and don't fall prey to the, there is no weight in most of them. Just fluff. Liberal/secular specialty. I consider the secular/liberals as teenagers not fully understanding the consequences of their actions. They usually, mess up more or cause other long term damage with their shortsighted liberal talk and suggestions. 

Most on the internet vent, this is the world of make belief (Internet). 

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On 12/29/2020 at 7:58 PM, shoelace said:

There is always two sides of a story no man is mad enough to beat a woman without a reason especially when you already have a kid together. it is obvious 50 percent of issue is with you and rest 50 with him, try to talk and try to pin point the main cause of problem with him.

 

if he is drunk or drug addict then above advice wont help.

The kind of men that have infiltrated our society. Sad reality.

Quote

it is obvious 50 percent of issue is with you and rest 50 with him, try to talk and try to pin point the main cause of problem with him.

Oh really? The last time I checked, Rasullulah (sawas) never laid a hand on any of his wives, not even Aisha or Hafsa, both whom made his life a living hell. It does not matter what the circumstance is, any form of physical abuse is haram on both parts. And not just physical, but any form of abuse is haram, but of course misogynistic and patriarchal men like you would say otherwise. May Allah guide you.

No woman should ever go back to a husband who is clearly abusive, and thats facts. It is indicative he has some form of mental disorder to which he needs to seek therapy.

Quote

no man is mad enough to beat a woman without a reason especially when you already have a kid together.

I can't even comprehend how ignorant this sounds. So if a man had a narcissistic personality disorder/anger management, he is not insane? Whilst I somewhat agree divorce of both parents can mentally affect the child/children, regardless they still do not deserve seeing their mother get abused everyday. Because statistically proven, if they continue to live in that kind of environment, they will pass it on to their future generations. They will end up abusing their own wives and children. It is far worse than divorce. 

On 12/29/2020 at 8:00 PM, shoelace said:

what is your qualification to give such stupid advice to a woman and incite her to break her house without even knowing the full story and hearing the other side of the story.

You're the one giving the most stupid advice from the very beginning, neither you or anyone here knows the full story; yet it is blatantly clear that domestic abuse should never be excused. Its literally caused by a mental illness, there are so many cases where most men turn into stalkers after the wife or partner tries to leave him; like I said mental disorders are the likely cause. Never encourage a woman to go back to her abusive husband after attempting to work things out with him from the very beginning; the guy needs therapy.

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Posted (edited)
On 12/30/2020 at 1:04 PM, Fizz786 said:

yes there is a drug problem. yes i have my mistakes without a doubt. but he has huge anger issues. 

in that case he is out of sync with the world and there is little chance of any change in him. talk with your parents and sort it out as soon as possible.

Edited by shoelace
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