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In the Name of God بسم الله

Worship (niyat, intention)

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Salamun alaykum wm wb.

Quite often I realize my worship is based more on fear rather than on love for Allah azwjl. For instance, when I commit a mistake or sin or I just sense a wrong pattern of thought arising, it is always the remembrance of Hell fire that I resort to as to quit the sin of tortuous pattern. Pure love for Allah and remembrance of His imense Rahma rarely comes to my mind honestly in these moments and in general. Which leads me to feel like I am not a lover of Him but rather I just fear hell, like the worship of 'a slave' in opposition to that of 'a lover', who recognizes their Lord is worthy of worship and who does so (worship Him) out of Love. 

Does anyone relate to that? Have u been in this place or are u there and what are your thoughts on this? 
How do you walk and stay firm AND balanced between  fear and hope in Allah azwjl???

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1 hour ago, tears_are_for_hussain said:

Salamun alaykum wm wb.

Quite often I realize my worship is based more on fear rather than on love for Allah azwjl. For instance, when I commit a mistake or sin or I just sense a wrong pattern of thought arising, it is always the remembrance of Hell fire that I resort to as to quit the sin of tortuous pattern. Pure love for Allah and remembrance of His imense Rahma rarely comes to my mind honestly in these moments and in general. Which leads me to feel like I am not a lover of Him but rather I just fear hell, like the worship of 'a slave' in opposition to that of 'a lover', who recognizes their Lord is worthy of worship and who does so (worship Him) out of Love. 

Does anyone relate to that? Have u been in this place or are u there and what are your thoughts on this? 
How do you walk and stay firm AND balanced between  fear and hope in Allah azwjl???

Salaam, 

It varies time to time. May be according to the level of spirituality. I see that when I am regular in prayers and fasting and abstain myself from sins, I start praying with the fear of Allah. 

When I even consistently do the recommended prayers like Salaat al Layl or munajaat and duas etc (mustahabbaat), I feel like a 'worship to gain proximity of Allah' (this happens quite less) 

When I am not consistent with prayers and deviate a bit and my faith crumbles, I experience a worship of a trader. Like, it feels I am just doing a formality so that Allah keeps my life in order. 

May Allah be your helper. May Allah accept your prayers and make your belief firm.

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21 hours ago, tears_are_for_hussain said:

Salamun alaykum wm wb.

Quite often I realize my worship is based more on fear rather than on love for Allah azwjl. For instance, when I commit a mistake or sin or I just sense a wrong pattern of thought arising, it is always the remembrance of Hell fire that I resort to as to quit the sin of tortuous pattern. Pure love for Allah and remembrance of His imense Rahma rarely comes to my mind honestly in these moments and in general. Which leads me to feel like I am not a lover of Him but rather I just fear hell, like the worship of 'a slave' in opposition to that of 'a lover', who recognizes their Lord is worthy of worship and who does so (worship Him) out of Love. 

Does anyone relate to that? Have u been in this place or are u there and what are your thoughts on this? 
How do you walk and stay firm AND balanced between  fear and hope in Allah azwjl???

Salam
 

in the context of committing a “compulsive” sin, it is expected to develop the fear of God.  The fear is needed in order so that you are discouraged from doing the sin again. The fear balances out the compulsive power of the nafs’ desires.  Developing love and hope for God’s mercy is also needed so that one does not fall into despair.  

Edited by eThErEaL
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On 11/23/2020 at 8:00 AM, tears_are_for_hussain said:

Salamun alaykum wm wb.

Quite often I realize my worship is based more on fear rather than on love for Allah azwjl. For instance, when I commit a mistake or sin or I just sense a wrong pattern of thought arising, it is always the remembrance of Hell fire that I resort to as to quit the sin of tortuous pattern. Pure love for Allah and remembrance of His imense Rahma rarely comes to my mind honestly in these moments and in general. Which leads me to feel like I am not a lover of Him but rather I just fear hell, like the worship of 'a slave' in opposition to that of 'a lover', who recognizes their Lord is worthy of worship and who does so (worship Him) out of Love. 

Does anyone relate to that? Have u been in this place or are u there and what are your thoughts on this? 
How do you walk and stay firm AND balanced between  fear and hope in Allah azwjl???

The goal of fear is to propel you towards the nearness of God (i.e. God's loving mercy).  If it doesn't help you seek out His mercy, then fear is destructive and unhealthy.  In other words, we should fear the distancing of ourselves from God's love and mercy.  We should also fear despair! 

Fear, therefore ought to culminate in hope.  

  

Edited by eThErEaL
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2 hours ago, eThErEaL said:

The goal of fear is to propel you towards the nearness of God (i.e. God's loving mercy).  If it doesn't help you seek out His mercy, then fear is destructive and unhealthy.  In other words, we should fear the distancing of ourselves from God's love and mercy.  We should also fear despair! 

Fear, therefore ought to culminate in hope.  

  

This truly helped me think a little beyond or outside the curve. The realization that one is serving other than Allah azwj or that other interests hv been attached to ones heart other than that of serving Him alone is a difficult realization. Say u start a good deed for the sake of Allah but u see other reasons or motives emerging along the process dat do not connect to Him in essence but everything outwardly goes under the banner of "servitude". It's heavy when u ask urself what are u really doing out of love for Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى). Eventually ur not even moving out of fear either since as u put, fear should lead to hope in/love for Him. Like pure love has no second intentions. For a lover, even if trown in Hell, s/he would still declare their love for their Lord. Anyways, i diverged from the topic. I am sorry. 

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8 hours ago, tears_are_for_hussain said:

This truly helped me think a little beyond or outside the curve. The realization that one is serving other than Allah azwj or that other interests hv been attached to ones heart other than that of serving Him alone is a difficult realization. Say u start a good deed for the sake of Allah but u see other reasons or motives emerging along the process dat do not connect to Him in essence but everything outwardly goes under the banner of "servitude". It's heavy when u ask urself what are u really doing out of love for Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى). Eventually ur not even moving out of fear either since as u put, fear should lead to hope in/love for Him. Like pure love has no second intentions. For a lover, even if trown in Hell, s/he would still declare their love for their Lord. Anyways, i diverged from the topic. I am sorry. 

Instead of asking what you are doing out of love for God, be interested in finding God in the very things you already love.   
 

let us say you are truly scared of being tortured and going through the pain of punishment.  Let us say you are obsessed with this fear of God’s punishment.  This would be a good moment to inquire what you are after.  You are after protection.  You are after safety.  You are after ease and peace. These are all names of God!  So what you are after when you fear the punishment of Hell is in fact the very Being of God!  And if you remind yourself that God’s Being is accessible right here and right now since He is Absolute, then the only hindrance you have between you and His Presence is your belief (due to ignorance) of His absence.  

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On 11/24/2020 at 11:29 PM, hasanhh said:

Re-read Ayats 38:30-33. Shakir renders mashan as "slash" which l understand is the best meaning.


you understand as the best meaning?  Why?  Because you are psychotic?  You like  it if the prophet were to SLASH innocent horses?  
 

I find this disturbing.  

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@eThErEaL chill bro
(38:33) رُدّوها عَلَيَّ ۖ فَطَفِقَ مَسحًا بِالسّوقِ وَالأَعناقِ

TRANSLITERATION

ruddūhā ʿalayya fa-ṭafiqa masḥan bi-s-sūqi wa-l-ʾaʿnāqi

TRANSLATION

‘Bring it1 back for me!’ Then he [and others] began to wipe [their] legs and necks. 
  • Or ‘them.’ The pronoun may be taken as referring to the sun or to the horses. However, most exegetes have taken it as referring to the sun and its setting. While Solomon was engaged in viewing the horses, the sun set, and the time of the afternoon prayer (supererogatory or obligatory) elapsed. According to a tradition narrated from al-Imām al-Ṣādiq (ʿa), when Solomon noticed that the sun had set, he called out to the angels to bring it back so that he could offer the afternoon prayer. Also, according to this tradition, the wiping of legs and necks mentioned in the verse refers to the performance of ablution (wuḍūʾ) before the prayer by Solomon and his men as prescribed in their Law. (Biḥār, vol. 14, p. 101; vol. 82, p. 341).

But what about battle of Jamal and the camel on which Aisha rode?

Edited by 313_Waiter
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9 minutes ago, 313_Waiter said:
@eThErEaL chill bro
(38:33) رُدّوها عَلَيَّ ۖ فَطَفِقَ مَسحًا بِالسّوقِ وَالأَعناقِ

TRANSLITERATION

ruddūhā ʿalayya fa-ṭafiqa masḥan bi-s-sūqi wa-l-ʾaʿnāqi

TRANSLATION

‘Bring it1 back for me!’ Then he [and others] began to wipe [their] legs and necks. 
  • Or ‘them.’ The pronoun may be taken as referring to the sun or to the horses. However, most exegetes have taken it as referring to the sun and its setting. While Solomon was engaged in viewing the horses, the sun set, and the time of the afternoon prayer (supererogatory or obligatory) elapsed. According to a tradition narrated from al-Imām al-Ṣādiq (ʿa), when Solomon noticed that the sun had set, he called out to the angels to bring it back so that he could offer the afternoon prayer. Also, according to this tradition, the wiping of legs and necks mentioned in the verse refers to the performance of ablution (wuḍūʾ) before the prayer by Solomon and his men as prescribed in their Law. (Biḥār, vol. 14, p. 101; vol. 82, p. 341).

But what about battle of Jamal and the camel on which Aisha rode?

Also:

 

(Then he said: "Bring them (horses) back to me.'' Then he began to pass his hand over their legs and their necks.) Al-Hasan Al-Basri said, "He said, `No, by Allah, you will not keep me from worshipping my Lord again,' then he ordered that they should be slaughtered.'' This was also the view of Qatadah. As-Suddi said, "Their necks and hamstrings were struck with swords.'' `Ali bin Abi Talhah reported that Ibn `Abbas, may Allah be pleased with him, said, "He began patting the horses' heads and legs out of love for them.'' This is the view that was favored by Ibn Jarir. He said, "Because he would not punish an animal by cutting its hamstrings or destroy his own wealth for no other reason than that he had been distracted from his prayer by looking at it, and it was not the animals' fault. '' This view which Ibn Jarir thought more correct is subject to further review, because such action may have been permissible according to their law, especially since he got angry for the sake of Allah for being distracted by these horses until the time for prayer had lapsed. Then, since he dispensed with them for the sake of Allah, Allah compensated him with something better, the wind which blew gently by his order wherever he willed. Its morning lasted a month's (journey), and its afternoon lasted a month's (journey). This was faster and better than horses. Imam Ahmad recorded that Abu Qatadah and Abu Ad-Dahma', who traveled a lot to the Ka`bah, said, "We met a man from among the bedouins who said to us: `The Messenger of Allah took my hand and started teaching me some of that which Allah had taught him. He said,

(You do not give up anything for the sake of Allah, but Allah will give you something better than it.)'''   [2] 

 

http://quransmessage.com/articles/did%20solomon%20really%20slaughter%20his%20horses%20FM3.htm

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3 minutes ago, eThErEaL said:

(Then he said: "Bring them (horses) back to me.'' Then he began to pass his hand over their legs and their necks.) Al-Hasan Al-Basri said, "He said, `No, by Allah, you will not keep me from worshipping my Lord again,' then he ordered that they should be slaughtered.''

This is the emphasis we had in mosque.

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4 minutes ago, hasanhh said:

This is the emphasis we had in mosque.

Alright, sorry.  
I found it very disturbing and didn’t want to entertain any discussion about it.  But who knows, maybe there was this kind of sacrificial practice done for God. 


 

 

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9 minutes ago, eThErEaL said:

Alright, sorry.  
I found it very disturbing and didn’t want to entertain any discussion about it.  But who knows, maybe there was this kind of sacrificial practice done for God. 

Depends on what religion from the Abrahamic faiths. The Jews were ordered to do it.

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@eThErEaL @hasanhh @Nightclaw

From The Study Quran by Seyyed Hossein Nasr:

Quote

Chapter 38 - Verses 31-33

 

It is reported that Solomon’s horses, which he had inherited from David or which he was assembling for a campaign, were displayed before him and that he was so engrossed with them that the sun had set and the time for performing the prescribed prayers had passed (IK, JJ, Ṭ, Ṭs). Until [the sun] was taken behind the veil could also be read, “until they were taken behind the veil,” meaning that Solomon was engrossed with the horses until they left his sight (Ṭs). Bring them back unto me takes the pronoun as a reference to the horses, but some understand the pronoun them (which can also mean “it”) as a reference to the sun, meaning that Solomon asked that the sun be brought back so that he could say his prayers during the proper time (Ṭs). Stroke translates masḥan, which can also mean “rub.” In the interpretation preferred by most commentators, masaḥan stands for the idiomatic expression “he stroked them with his sword,” meaning that, to atone for having been distracted from the remembrance of God, Solomon sacrificed the horses (IJ, IK, JJ, Ṭ, Ṭs) and then offered the meat to the poor as alms (IJ, JJ). Others understand it to mean that he stroked them with his hand out of love for them (IJ, Ṭ), as it would seem unjust for Solomon to slay the horses for his own slip (Ṭ). The most reasonable interpretation, though rarely cited, is that he branded their legs and necks and committed them to God (IJ).

 

The interpretations given above reflect those found in almost all commentaries, with slight variations. But al-Rāzī gives this story a different interpretation. He begins by understanding I have preferred the love of good things over the remembrance of my Lord to mean, “I have loved the love of good things on account of the remembrance of my Lord”; that is, his love of anything in this world is by the Command of God. He then understands the horses to be what were taken behind the veil, meaning that they passed by him until they were out of his sight. Then he ordered that they be returned and rubbed them to honor them and to be sure that they were fit for battle. Although such an interpretation may arise from al-Rāzī’s zealous defense of the infallibility of prophets, it also leads to a more internally consistent interpretation that is not based on accounts whose reliability is questionable.

 

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21 minutes ago, 313_Waiter said:

@eThErEaL @hasanhh @Nightclaw

From The Study Quran by Seyyed Hossein Nasr:

 

Thanks for sharing.  

 

21 minutes ago, 313_Waiter said:


This Interpretation of Razi reminds me of the Buddhist teaching of Witnessing the Formless in Form.  At first there is only Mountain (form).  Then one removes the mountain (by seeing only the Formless).  Then one brings back the mountain (form), but this time within Formlessness.  So one witnesses form in formlessness.

This is not just Buddhist teaching but In the Sufi (Tasawwuf) tradition of Fana and Baqa.  Or, the 3 Spiritual Journeys.  (Mulla Sadra makes it into 4, though)

1) there is a journey from creation to God.  

2) there is Journeying within God.  Fana Fi-Allah)

3) There is Journeying back to creation (Baqa)  but with God.  

4) and Mulla Sadra adds a fourth (but which is implied in the 3rd), namely that there is a journey within creation.  

 
 

Edited by eThErEaL
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