Jump to content
Guests can now reply in ALL forum topics (No registration required!) ×
Guests can now reply in ALL forum topics (No registration required!)
In the Name of God بسم الله

Prayers/Dua/A'amaal for shortening time till marriage after meeting

Rate this topic


Recommended Posts

  • Advanced Member

Salaam all, 

I have a typical situation here between two people. Who are real, just to clarify this is really happening right now. And it's a typical 2020 issue for young Muslim people. 

Don't launch an emotional attack on me! I'm just representing, any responses you give I will pass on to the couple then tell you what they say. 

A boy and girl have met, they are compatible, they have learnt a lot about each other, their parents are well informed about everything. Everyone is going well between the boy and the girl, they have matching energies and personalities, they are very happy with each other. They are really what you call a couple that has love, friendship and companionship, all 3 in abundance. Recently they fell in love and are now very realistic about their future and they plan to marry soon.

However this is where problems start they say. Firstly it is a long distance relationship so there is no physical contact, although the couple do have a very deep emotional and spiritual connection. They plan to marry in a few years but at the moment unfortunately it is hard for them to be apart like how they are now, if it was up to them then they would already be married now because that is what the Islamic thing would be they say. They wish that they met, got to know each other, they were compatible and they liked each other, the family background was good, they were overall a very suitable match for each other so then they got married. 

The reason why they cannot marry now is because their parents say they are too young (18+19) and they have studies. But the couple think that age is not relevant although they do respect their studies a lot and treat studies with a lot of importance, they think that they can be married and study at the same time. But their parents won't let them marry before they complete their studies. 

 

They bring forward this hadith about their young age:

Imam Ali ibn Musa al-Rida [a] said: 

"The archangel Gabriel descended to the Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) and told him, 'O Muhammad, verily your Lord extends salutations on you and says, 'Verily the virgins from among your women are as fruits on a tree, which when they ripen must be plucked otherwise the sun rots them and the wind alters them. So when young women reach marriageable age, they have no other recourse apart from husbands, otherwise they will not be safe from corruption.' The Prophet (SAWA) then climbed the pulpit, gathered the people and informed them of what Allah had commanded him.'"

Bihar al-Anwar, v. 16, p. 223, no. 22; Mizan ul Hikmah, page No. 595

And this hadith and Quran verse too:

The Holy Prophet [s] said: 

"When any young person gets married at the prime of his youth, his inner Satan cries out in rage, 'Woe unto him! Woe unto him! Two thirds of his faith have now been secured against me, and he has only to be careful of his duty to Allah in the remaining third."

Bihar al-Anwar, p. 221, no. 34; Mizan ul Hikmah, page No. 593

Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) said:

"...then do not prevent them from marrying their husbands when they agree among themselves in a lawful manner. 

Surah Baqarah 2:232

They are requesting any special Dua, prayer or A'amaal to help them marry as soon as possible because they aren't comfortable with having such intense feelings for each other and love for each other but not being married. They also have mentioned that since maturity age they have both suffered a lot "with private issues" and even now they are still suffering. After marriage the girl will go to the boy's country and live there with him. 

Something interesting is that the couple actually met through a Dua which a respected member on here taught me. I went on to teach the boy this after he told me the he wants to find someone. I still remember it and I'm writing it down here from memory. It was: "Rabi inni lima anzalta ilayah min kharin faqir". That member knows who they are and I highly commend them on their help (I have a new username now). I also met someone through this Dua actually after I met someone who turned out not to be for me. I will not mention the respected member as I do not know if they would be comfortable with that but they should know that they are very much appreciated and I would like to show this hadith to them:

Imam Sadiq (ع): 

"He who arranges for a single person to get married will be amongst those whom Allah will regard [with mercy] on the Day of Resurrection." 

al-Kafi, v. 5, p. 331, no. 2; Mizan ul Hikmah, page No. 594

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Moderators

There is no basis in Islam, that I know of, for 'years' long engagements. In fact, in Islam, there is no such as thing as 'engagement'. There is married / not married only. This 'engagement' period is a made up thing taken from other cultures. 

When the situation is as you stated above, there is absolutely no good reason to delay marriage for years. This is done, now days, but brothers and sisters reading need to understand that there is no basis in Islam for this, and in fact there are many, many hadith that encourage marriage not only young, but not to delay marriage when a spouse is found. This is a clear issue. Then why are these 'years long' , 'engagements' done ? They are done only for the benefit of the parents. Because there is some kind of a myth that has gained currency recently that is ascribed to Islam (but not actually part of it) that couples cannot get married until they have graduated from college / university and the man is well off financially, and they feel their 'reputation' or 'honor' will be diminished if they don't 'go along' with what the community expects. For a man to graduate from college  / university and then after that establish himself in his career takes more than a decade, in the usual case, and many times this never happens. So if the man is not the 'usual' case what should he do ? Remain celibate for the rest of his life ? This has resulted in many (I would say most) youth turning away from the religion because they see the religion as an impractical / unattainable thing due to myths like this gaining currency in the community. Once the 'hormones' have been activated, it is very improbable for a human being to go for years or decades without doing haram as a result of not being married. 

My opinion is that instead of the couple worrying so much what their parents / community will think, they should think about following the religion. The religion states that you should marry early and not delay marriage. When the parents talk about 'years long' 'engagement', the couple, both man and women should challenge them on this idea and should push, as much as possible, for marriage, not 'engagement'. 

Edited by Abu Hadi
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Development Team
5 hours ago, Abu Hadi said:

When the parents talk about 'years long' 'engagement', the couple, both man and women should challenge them on this idea and should push, as much as possible, for marriage, not 'engagement

I would just like to add that the reason why the parents are probably bringing up the "year-long engagement" is to discourage the couple from marrying without hurting their feelings and "protect" them, instead of explaining the reason for their objections and taking this seriously.

I just hope that the couple aren't rushing into marriage because of hormones and a need for release. 

6 hours ago, Vindemiatrix said:

They wish that they met, got to know each other, they were compatible and they liked each other, the family background was good, they were overall a very suitable match for each other so then they got married. 

Wait, I'm confused; Have they actually met in person or no?

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Advanced Member
5 hours ago, Abu Hadi said:

Once the 'hormones' have been activated, it is very improbable and in some cases impossible for a human being to go for years or decades without doing haram as a result of not being married

Yes but what does Islamic law say about this? Does the law accept that if someone is forced to remain unmarried for decades then it can become impossible for him to avoid sin? 

If the law accepts that it can be impossible, in that situation would it become permissible for the man to sin, because a man cannot be expected to do something which the law itself says is impossible?

What I understand is that the law states that no matter how long a person may be forced to remain celibate, he will not be allowed to sin, and that means the law doesn't believe that it can ever be impossible to avoid sin. 

Simply put, if it ever becomes really and actually impossible to avoid sin, then it would become permissible to sin in that situation. But we know that sexual sins never become permissible, and that indicates that avoiding sin can never be so difficult that it becomes an impossible target to achieve. 

Of course, early marriage is obligatory if there is danger of sin and Allah is the forgiver of all sins....but as far as Islamic law goes, it doesn't accept that it can ever be "impossible" to stay chaste , even if forced into a lifetime of celibacy. 

Moreover, suppose a person is facing a situation where he genuinely cannot get married for an extremely long time. For instance, a person who is incarcerated for decades. If this man is told that it is impossible to avoid sin for this long, he might feel that he is justified in commiting some sexual sin, eg masturbation. But as per the law, masturbation will not be allowed for him even if he spends his entire life in prison. If he does this sin even once, he would still be considered as crossing the limits. This shows Islamic law never accepts that it can be impossible to avoid sin. 

That's what I understand but please discuss if you disagree. Thanks. 

Edited by Anonymous-Male
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Advanced Member

@Abu Hadi

Thank you very much for your very well structured and powerful message for the couple! I will pass it on as soon as possible and hopefully it will give them the courage to act in an Islamic way following the advice you have given. I'm sure they will be very happy and satisfied with your reply even if it's not exactly what they were initially seeking, I'm sure your reply will be most beneficial for them! I'll let you know what they say, InshaAllah. 

I personally agree strongly with your reply and with your permission I would use it for myself in discussion in the future. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Advanced Member
On 10/30/2020 at 4:20 PM, Gaius I. Caesar said:

Wait, I'm confused; Have they actually met in person or no?

In short, no.

But I asked and apparently their identites have been well verified between them. And several pictures and videos exchanged, conversations, a lot of information has been exchanged between them and although it's not as good as meeting in person, they are sure of each other they are saying. For them it is almost as if they have met in person without actually meeting in person. Wonders of the technology today apparently. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Advanced Member
On 10/30/2020 at 4:20 PM, Gaius I. Caesar said:

I just hope that the couple aren't rushing into marriage because of hormones and a need for release. 

Well I asked and new information comes to light now, neither of them really feel strongly about this subject any more as they did in a few years ago. Even though they're still having difficulties controlling urges, they aren't really considering doing anything after marriage. It just isn't something important to them even if the desire is there. Eventually they know their desires will decrease. They are saying want to marry because they feel really connected on a spiritual level, they love each others personality and character. They both say that they're really compatible and deeply in true love with each other. And they say that they want to overall marry for most importantly their love, friendship, companionship and spiritual bond/connection. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Development Team
7 hours ago, Vindemiatrix said:

And several pictures and videos exchanged, conversations, a lot of information has been exchanged between them and although it's not as good as meeting in person

I hate to be that guy, but that could easily change when they meet in person. They could meet in person and just instantly dislike each other,  while I don't believe that will happen to them, it has happened. So I could understand the parents' insistence on studies, although I think their parents don't understand the seriousness of the situation 

I'm in a similar situation, so I wish them the best success. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Moderators
On 10/30/2020 at 12:22 PM, Anonymous-Male said:

Yes but what does Islamic law say about this? Does the law accept that if someone is forced to remain unmarried for decades then it can become impossible for him to avoid sin? 

If the law accepts that it can be impossible, in that situation would it become permissible for the man to sin, because a man cannot be expected to do something which the law itself says is impossible?

What I understand is that the law states that no matter how long a person may be forced to remain celibate, he will not be allowed to sin, and that means the law doesn't believe that it can ever be impossible to avoid sin. 

Simply put, if it ever becomes really and actually impossible to avoid sin, then it would become permissible to sin in that situation. But we know that sexual sins never become permissible, and that indicates that avoiding sin can never be so difficult that it becomes an impossible target to achieve. 

Of course, early marriage is obligatory if there is danger of sin and Allah is the forgiver of all sins....but as far as Islamic law goes, it doesn't accept that it can ever be "impossible" to stay chaste , even if forced into a lifetime of celibacy. 

Moreover, suppose a person is facing a situation where he genuinely cannot get married for an extremely long time. For instance, a person who is incarcerated for decades. If this man is told that it is impossible to avoid sin for this long, he might feel that he is justified in commiting some sexual sin, eg masturbation. But as per the law, masturbation will not be allowed for him even if he spends his entire life in prison. If he does this sin even once, he would still be considered as crossing the limits. This shows Islamic law never accepts that it can be impossible to avoid sin. 

That's what I understand but please discuss if you disagree. Thanks. 

I never said it was 'impossible'. I said it was very improbable. There is a difference. Yes, if it was impossible then it would not be haram to sin, based on the fact that Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) is just. The difference between 'very improbable' and 'impossible' is that in the case it is very improbable, the majority of those who try to do this (stay celibate for years or decades under the guise of an 'engagement', 'finishing their studies', or some other reason) fail, and do haram, and many of those get into the habit of doing haram which will destroy or severely affect their akhira, unless Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) chooses to forgive them. There are some that make it thru this severe trial without doing haram, those are very few.

Also, every single one of these brothers and sisters, and their parents start off on this thinking that they will the the 'very few' who make it thru without destroying their deen. If they thought about it logically, they would realize that it's much more likely that they will be in the majority group, because noone starts out on this thinking that they will be in the majority group, but most end up in this group. To me, this is very similar to gambling, When you gamble, you always think that you will be that 'one' who defies the overwhelming odds and wins that big prize without losing your money. Then you end up losing your money. Except in this case, you end up losing your soul, which is the most valuable thing you have. You can replace money, you can't replace your soul. If Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) forbids you from gambling with your money, which can be replaced, what about your soul, which can't be replaced ? This is why there are so many hadiths that encourage early marriage and highly discourage brothers and sisters from delaying marriage. The fact that these are being ignored in most communities under the pretext of 'honor' doesn't mean they don't exist. 

From what I have read, the only reason that marriage was not made wajib, like Salat, Saum, Hajj, etc, is that there are truly some brothers and sisters who are in a position where marriage, any sort of marriage, is impossible for them in their current situation, and because Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) is merciful, He(s.w.a) will not punish someone for not doing something which is impossible for them to do. At the same time, the vast majority of brothers and sisters are able to marry, at least mutah, but it is the community / parents under false pretenses who discourage them from it. 

 

 

Edited by Abu Hadi
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Advanced Member
5 hours ago, Abu Hadi said:

I never said it was 'impossible'

Actually you did say that...

On 10/30/2020 at 3:59 PM, Abu Hadi said:

it is very improbable and in some cases impossible for a human being to go for years or decades without doing haram

I completely understand and agree with your points but I believe if any person is told that it is impossible for him to go for decades without doing haram, then he might take this as a justification to sin if he really cannot get married for decades. 

Suppose a man is in jail for 30 years or so and cannot get married or do mutah. If we tell him it is impossible to avoid sin (eg masturbation) for this long, he will consider that he has a valid reason to do this sin because of his unusual situation. 

However, Islamic law does not allow even this person to masturbate, which proves that the law doesn't consider that it can be impossible for this man to avoid sin. 

This shows that Islamic law never really considers that there can ever be a situation where a person will find it impossible to avoid sin (except when a person is forced to sin to save his life). 

In other words, we should never tell anyone that it can be impossible to stay chaste because the law does not accept that it can ever be impossible. We should always warn people that no matter how difficult it may become to avoid sin, if they do sin, then it will be their own exaggerated, uncontrolled sexual desire and they would be crossing the limits. If Allah forgives them or even changes their sins into reward, that is a separate matter, but the man himself can never give an excuse to Allah that it had become impossible for him to avoid sin, even if he has to spend his entire life in prison without ever getting the chance to get married or do mutah. I might be wrong but this is what I understand as far as Islamic law goes. Correct me if you think I'm mistaken, thanks. 

I absolutely 100% agree with you that marriage must not be delayed for petty reasons and early marriage protects against sin. But I was only referring to rare situations where someone genuinely cannot get married for a long time; such individuals must not consider that staying chaste can become impossible because help from Allah is in proportion to the degree of hardship. 

Edited by Anonymous-Male
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Moderators
24 minutes ago, Anonymous-Male said:

Actually you did say that...

I completely understand and agree with your points but I believe if any person is told that it is impossible for him to go for decades without doing haram, then he might take this as a justification to sin if he really cannot get married for decades. 

Suppose a man is in jail for 30 years or so and cannot get married or do mutah. If we tell him it is impossible to avoid sin (eg masturbation) for this long, he will consider that he has a valid reason to do this sin because of his unusual situation. 

However, Islamic law does not allow even this person to masturbate, which proves that the law doesn't consider that it can be impossible for this man to avoid sin. 

This shows that Islamic law never really considers that there can ever be a situation where a person will find it impossible to avoid sin (except when a person is forced to sin to save his life). 

In other words, we should never tell anyone that it can be impossible to stay chaste because the law does not accept that it can ever be impossible. We should always warn people that no matter how difficult it may become to avoid sin, if they do sin, then it will be their own exaggerated, uncontrolled sexual desire and they would be crossing the limits. If Allah forgives them or even changes their sins into reward, that is a separate matter, but the man himself can never give an excuse to Allah that it had become impossible for him to avoid sin, even if he has to spend his entire life in prison without ever getting the chance to get married or do mutah. I might be wrong but this is what I understand as far as Islamic law goes. Correct me if you think I'm mistaken, thanks. 

I absolutely 100% agree with you that marriage must not be delayed for petty reasons and early marriage protects against sin. But I was only referring to rare situations where someone genuinely cannot get married for a long time; such individuals must not consider that staying chaste can become impossible because help from Allah is in proportion to the degree of hardship. 

I edited my OP to take out the 'impossible' part. I made a mistake in including that phrase. You are right, it is never impossible. But you never addressed the main point. The main point is that now it has become the norm and the expectation of the community that brothers and sisters will wait for years and decades. If this only happened once in a while, it wouldn't be that big of an issue, but it has become the norm. That was my point. 

If we (as a community) keep telling the youth that 'going without sin for years or decades while staying unmarried is what we expect of you, because so and so claims that he did it', then the consequence of that will be that more and more of the youth will turn away from the religion, because they see it as impractical and impossible to follow (even if in fact it is not impossible). We, as a community need to come up with practical solutions and then work to implement them. 

Edited by Abu Hadi
Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...