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In the Name of God بسم الله

9th Rabi Al Awal And The Biddah of Eid e Shuja / Eid e Zahra (عليه السلام) - Joy Over Shahadat of Imam Hassan Al-Askari

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Ref#1 Bihaar Al Anwaar volume 95 page 351

image.thumb.png.d35a831ff5afe323217faa9e34fb0e3d.pngimage.thumb.png.d21712e7d296820982d4adc719c1b40f.png 

Translation from an Old Thread at ShiaChat:

Part of Translation:

Al-Sayed ibn Tawoos writes in the book, 'Zawaa'id al-Fawaa'id' :

that Ibn Abi Alaa Al-Hamadani al-Waasiti and Yahya ibn Mohammad bin Huwaij Al-Baghdadi said:

We were quarreling about ibn Al-Khattab (Omar) and we became uncertain about him, so we travelled to Ahmad bin Isaac al-Qummi (Imam Hassan Al-Askari's companion) in Qum.

Comments:

This Suggests that both "Ibn Abi Alaa Al-Hamdani" and "Yahya Bin Muhammad Al Baghdadi" met companion of Imam Hassan Al Askari (عليه السلام) which is the time of 200s A.H (Late 800s A.D)

While Sayid Ibn Tawus (رضي الله عنه) Died in 664 A.H according to this book: 

سعد السعود للنفوس 

المؤلف: السيد رضي الدين علي بن موسى بن طاووس

image.thumb.png.a2c5f7ef9ed80d36907b767b45667fa4.png

Therefore narration reaches us disconnected with gap of a few hundred years. (664-260 = 404 years Gap)

Thus a Very Weak Hadith. That can't serve as a proof.

Additionally, these two narrators Yahya Bin Muhammad Al Baghdadi and ibn Abi Al-Alaa Al Hamdani Al have no clear tawtheeq plus i couldn't find Ibn Abi Al-Alaa. If you do let me know.

Do any supporters of this Eid got some proof? Why do you celebrate 9th Rabi Al-Awal as Eid?

Edited by Syed Ali Mehdi Shah Naqvi
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Some People would say, Its Eid because its the First day of rulership ( Tajposhi ) of Imam e Zamana (عليه السلام). He became the Imam of time thus we celebrate 9th Rabi Al-Awal. And its an Eid for Ahle-Wilayah and No hypocrite would celebrate it.

:hahaha:

For this, there isn't much left to say. Imam e Zamana's (عليه السلام) father (عليه السلام) passed away, would he be happy over becoming an Incharge Imam or would he be Sad over death of his father (عليه السلام)?

Also according to this argument, following are some more dates of celebration but even you guys cry on these dates:

1. 28th Safar ( Ameer Al Momineen Ali ibn Abi Talib (عليه السلام)'s first day of Rulership and he (عليه السلام) became an Incharge Imam ) and (  same for Imam Hussein (عليه السلام) )

2. 21st Ramazaan ( Imam Hassan (عليه السلام) first day of rulership and becoming an Incharge Imam ) Tajposhi e Imam Hassan (عليه السلام)

3. 10th Muharram ( Imam Ali ibn Hussein (عليه السلام)'s first day of rulership and becoming an incharge Imam ) Tajposhi Imam Zain ul Abideen (عليه السلام)

4. 25th Muharram ( Imam Muhammad Baqir (عليه السلام)'s first day of rulership and becoming an incharge imam ) Tajposhi Imam Muhammad Baqir (عليه السلام)

and it will continue.

Now who's the hypocrite? Lol

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44 minutes ago, Sirius_Bright said:

One oppressor less is always better. If we are sure about the date or not, let shia rejoice one day in a year on the death of greatest oppressor and dushmane Ahlulbayt. 

Actually Shahadat of Imam Hassan Al Askari is almost at the same day. Therefore there is no point in celebration. 

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17 minutes ago, Syed Ali Mehdi Shah Naqvi said:

Actually Shahadat of Imam Hassan Al Askari is almost at the same day. Therefore there is no point in celebration. 

8th Rabiul Avval is shahadat. 9th Rabiul Avval is when people celebrate. Different days, nothing like 'almost'. 

You don't celebrate if you don't like but don't prevent others. 

Edited by Sirius_Bright
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15 minutes ago, Syed Ali Mehdi Shah Naqvi said:

Actually Shahadat of Imam Hassan Al Askari is almost at the same day. Therefore there is no point in celebration. 

Actually I believe Imam Hasan al Askari was martyred on the 8th

https://thaqalayn.net/chapter/1/4/124

 

And I don't see any problem for rejoicing on a certain day, whether that be due to the Imamate of The Imam of our Time(atjf), or the death of an enemy of the AhlulBayt(عليه السلام)

I don't see how this is so problematic, if you want to rejoice then rejoice! If not, then that's cool, there is no problem in that, after all the Imam(عليه السلام) did allegedly say:

 

"‘Everything is permissible unless there is a prohibition order for it"

Wasail e Shia, V6, Ch 19, H 7997

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1 hour ago, Sirius_Bright said:

8th Rabiul Avval is shahadat. 9th Rabiul Avval is when people celebrate. Different days, nothing like 'almost'. 

You don't celebrate if you don't like but don't prevent others. 

For Gods Sake bro. You are senior member.

1 hour ago, MaisumAli said:

And I don't see any problem for rejoicing on a certain day, whether that be due to the Imamate of The Imam of our Time(atjf), or the death of an enemy of the AhlulBayt(عليه السلام)

I don't see how this is so problematic, if you want to rejoice then rejoice! If not, then that's cool, there is no problem in that, after all the Imam(عليه السلام) did allegedly say:

 

"‘Everything is permissible unless there is a prohibition order for it"

Celebrate what? Shahadat of Imam Al-Askari (عليه السلام)?

You spend many days weeping for others but can't wait for evening to celebrate it for no reason?

You are misquoting hadith.

Celebrating Shahadat of Imam (عليه السلام) is not permitted at all. Even Bukhari allows 3 days of sorrow and we shias can't even wait for one day?

Two Narrators are Majhool,

Hadith is disconnected 

Its at the level of a fabrication.

It proves nothing.

If you have a proof then mention. InshaAllah i will celebrate it with you if you prove its an Eid.

If everything is permissible then what is an innovation?

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43 minutes ago, Syed Ali Mehdi Shah Naqvi said:

For Gods Sake bro. You are senior member.

Celebrate what? Shahadat of Imam Al-Askari (عليه السلام)?

You spend many days weeping for others but can't wait for evening to celebrate it for no reason?

You are misquoting hadith.

Celebrating Shahadat of Imam (عليه السلام) is not permitted at all. Even Bukhari allows 3 days of sorrow and we shias can't even wait for one day?

Two Narrators are Majhool,

Hadith is disconnected 

Its at the level of a fabrication.

It proves nothing.

If you have a proof then mention. InshaAllah i will celebrate it with you if you prove its an Eid.

If everything is permissible then what is an innovation?

Like I said bro, some may chose to celebrate it with others may not, it's up to you in the end, nobody's forcing anybody 

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Hazrat Allamah Hur Amili (رضي الله عنه) in his book Isbat ul Hudat Mentions a Chain for this Hadith here:

image.thumb.png.d165b82aa718854602b5603b3336074c.pngimage.thumb.png.a2c7ddcb25eeaa8b9342045e88c86228.png 

Ref: Isbat Ul Hudat Volume 4 Page 211 - Chapter 86 - Hadith 1005

Ali Bin Muzahir Al-Wasiti:

(

   10538 - علي بن مظاهر:
لم يذكروه. هو الشيخ الفقيه الفاضل نقل عنه في كتاب المختصر. مستدرك الوسائل ج 1 / 221.

   Ali Bin Muzahir - Not Mentioned (Clearly proves Ali Nimazi Himself admits he wasn't mentioned by Rijal Scholors but was claimed Sheikh Faazil in a chain in Book written in late 8th century (Al- Mukhtasir) thus it wouldn't serve as a proof for his tawtheeq. He is not known among Classical Ulima of Rijal).

   ref: مستدركات علم رجال الحديث - الشيخ علي النمازي الشاهرودي - ج ٥ - الصفحة ٤٨٠

   Link: http://shiaonlinelibrary.com/الكتب/2988_مستدركات-علم-رجال-الحديث-الشيخ-علي-النمازي-الشاهرودي-ج-٥/الصفحة_480

)

Muhammad Bin Ali Al-Hamdani:  

(

   وقال الشيخ في رجاله في من لم يرو عن الأئمة (عليهم السلام): محمد بن علي الهمداني ضعيف

   And the sheikh said about his men about those who did not see from the imams (peace be upon them):

   Muhammad bin Ali al-Hamdani weak

   link: http://shiaonlinelibrary.com/الكتب/3035_قاموس-الرجال-الشيخ-محمد-تقي-التستري-ج-٩/الصفحة_425 

   ref: قاموس الرجال - الشيخ محمد تقي التستري - ج ٩ - الصفحة ٤٢٥

  11263 - 11258 - 11285 - محمد بن علي بن إبراهيم بن محمد: الهمداني، روى عن أبيه عن جده عن الرضا (ع) قاله النجاشي - ضعيف - له كتاب - طريق الشيخ اليه ضعيف - روى في كامل الزيارات - عنونه ابن الغضائري: محمد بن علي بن إبراهيم الهمداني.

   Muhammad Bin Ali Al - Hamdani narrated from his father from his father from Imam Raza (عليه السلام).

   Al-Najashi said - weak - he has a book

   He narrated in Kamil Az Ziaraat

   link: http://shiaonlinelibrary.com/الكتب/3021_المفيد-من-معجم-رجال-الحديث-محمد-الجواهري/الصفحة_559

   ref: المفيد من معجم رجال الحديث - محمد الجواهري - الصفحة ٥٥١

)

Hassan Bin Hussein Al-Saamri

(

   Majhool

)

Thus narration looses its credibility.

 

From the Foot Notes of Al Mukhtasar, this Chain is mentioned in Anwaar e Numaniya:

«الأنوار النعمانية» للجزائري ص ٤٠ ط إيران سنة ١٣١٦

قال: أخبرنا السيد أبو البركات بن محمد الجرجاني هبة الله القمي، واسمه يحيى قال: حدثنا أحمد بن إسحاق بن محمد البغدادي قال: حدثنا الفقيه الحسن بن الحسن السامري قال: كنت أنا و يحيى بن جريح البغدادي فقصدنا أحمد بن إسحاق القمي صاحب الإمام أبي محمد الحسن العسكري بمدينة قم، وساق الحديث كما هنا.

1.  يحيى بن جريح البغدادي

16249 - يحيى بن محمد بن حويج (جريح) البغدادي:
لم يذكروه. روى السيد ابن طاووس في كتاب زوائد الفوائد، عنه، عن أحمد بن إسحاق القمي الرواية المفصلة في فضل يوم التاسع من ربيع الأول، وفيها دلالات

على حسنه وكماله ج 20 / 330 و 332، وج 8 / 314، وجد ج 98 / 351 و 355.

ref: مستدركات علم رجال الحديث - الشيخ علي النمازي الشاهرودي - ج ٨ - الصفحة ٢٢٩

Link: http://shiaonlinelibrary.com/الكتب/2991_مستدركات-علم-رجال-الحديث-الشيخ-علي-النمازي-الشاهرودي-ج-٨/الصفحة_229#top

Ali Nimazi again admits this guy wasn't mentioned by scholors of Rijaal.

Its amazing that Ali Namazi tries to authentic him based upon the narration under discussion which is by no means acceptable since narration is authentic.

Thus again, Its pretty much settled يحيى بن محمد بن حويج (جريح) البغدادي is Majhool ( Unknown )

2. الحسن بن الحسن السامري: Not Found in Any Books of Rijal Hence Majhool

3. أحمد بن إسحاق بن محمد البغدادي 

1. Not mentioned in مستدركات علم رجال الحديث Checked in names list in Volume 1

Link: http://shiaonlinelibrary.com/الكتب/2984_مستدركات-علم-رجال-الحديث-الشيخ-علي-النمازي-الشاهرودي-ج-١/الصفحة_266#top

2. Note mentioned in المفيد من معجم رجال الحديث Checked in names list

Link: http://shiaonlinelibrary.com/الكتب/3021_المفيد-من-معجم-رجال-الحديث-محمد-الجواهري/الصفحة_30#top

3. Not mentioned in  Mujam Rijal Al Hadith by Ayatullah Khoi Volume 2 Page 50 - 55 

I don't even want to check beyond this. Its enough. Narration is severely weak and proves nothing.

And a chain from Misbah Al Anwaar from footnotes of this book, here is another chain:

ونص سند «المصباح»: قال: أخبرنا أبو محمد الحسن بن محمد القمي بالكوفة، قال: حدثنا أبو بكر محمد بن جعدويه القزويني، وكان شيخا صالحا زاهدا سنة إحدى وأربعين وثلاثمائة صاعدا إلى الحج، قال: حدثني محمد بن علي القزويني، قال: حدثنا الحسن بن الحسن الخالدي بمشهد أبي الحسن الرضا (عليه السلام)، قال: حدثنا محمد بن العلاء الهمداني الواسطي ويحيى بن محمد بن جريح البغدادي، قالا:

Majhool narrators have been highlighted.

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11 hours ago, Mahdavist said:

No, but he is correctly pointing out that it has no basis in our madhab. 

https://www.iqraonline.net/celebrating-9th-rabi-al-awwal-what-for/

 

Great link. It already has everything in it lol

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@Syed Ali Mehdi Shah Naqvi, @Mahdavist, @786:)

 

I personally don't have a stance on Eid Al Zahra, I like to stay neutral in this matter, if you don't want to celebrate it then that's fine, if you do then go ahead!

 

But since you guys seem to be against this alleged "Eid", what are your stances on celebrating Eids like Eid Al Ghadeer, Mubahila? Or maybe Arabeen perhaps? The birthdates and Martydoms of the Imams(عليه السلام)? Heck, what about your own birthdays? Just curious

 

Oh and Br. @Syed Ali Mehdi Shah Naqvi

 I know that narration, is weak, that's why I didn't bring it up

Edited by MaisumAli
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1 hour ago, Allah Seeker said:

Eid u zahra is obviously not joy over the martyrdom of the 11th, but the advent of the final one who will avenge the killing of the 11th! 

I understand that. But Due to martyrdom of Imam Hassan Al-Askari (عليه السلام), its a bit odd logically to start celebrations and mubaraks in the evening.

As i mentioned, 28th Safar would be advent of Imam Ali (عليه السلام) and Hussein ibn Ali (عليه السلام) and 21th Ramazaan would be advent of Imam Hassan (عليه السلام) etc

But we don't and can never think of celebrating the evenings of 28th safar / 21st Ramazaan / 10th Muharram etc

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1 hour ago, MaisumAli said:

But since you guys seem to be against this alleged "Eid", what are your stances on celebrating Eids like Eid Al Ghadeer, Mubahila?

I didn't say I was against it, I merely pointed out that it doesn't appear to have any basis in our madhab. 

Eid al Ghadeer on the other hand is firstly based on a factual event, and secondly has specific narrations from the ma'soomeen (عليه السلام), so there is a clear difference.

 

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@MaisumAli 

I heard  ( Allamah Sayed Ali Raza Rizwi ) say only Munafiqs will not celebrate Eid Al Zahra (عليه السلام). I like him though but here he has used some harsh words for something, that can't even be backed up by evidence. 

I mean, what is this behaviour pooja?

As for me, i don't preach against or in favor of Eid Al Zehra (عليه السلام), threads here are mean to discuss the issues with other people who are willing to as it may benefit (inc me) the people who are going to visit threads looking for info, and will get (biased , un-biased) views of the supporters and opposers. Which is way better than getting biased views from Zakir or Molvi.

And this has really helped me alot ( this website in particular ) and i have changed many of my views since my first post on Shahadat E Salisa in Tashahud here.

If it was not for Shahadat of Imam Hassan Al - Askari (عليه السلام), i don't think i would've made this post.

As for Ghadeer, it has been mentioned in narrations as Eid Al-Akbar.

Mubahila Isn't Eid though but we celebrate the victory of 5 Infallibles (عليه السلام) by commemorating the event.

No one can deny these events.

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On 10/26/2020 at 8:18 PM, Syed Ali Mehdi Shah Naqvi said:

We were quarreling about ibn Al-Khattab (Omar) and we became uncertain about him

Quote

disputing over ‘Umar ibn al-Khattab (or in some books it says Abu al-Khattab Muhammad bin Abi Zaynab the founder of the extremist Khattabiyah sect). 

https://www.iqraonline.net/celebrating-9th-rabi-al-awwal-what-for/

 

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1 hour ago, Sirius_Bright said:

Talking about Bid'ah and having no basis in religion, what is this unity week business. Would like to see one narration supporting it, no chain of narrators would do. 

No one claimed its an islamic festival, or Imam ordered to celebrate unity week or imam's companion did ghusl for unity week etc

Did hadiths ever instruct us to avoid fitnah? Its only for the purpose of avoiding fitnah thats all. By the way i'm not familiar with this unity week.

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1 hour ago, Syed Ali Mehdi Shah Naqvi said:

No one claimed its an islamic festival, or Imam ordered to celebrate unity week or imam's companion did ghusl for unity week etc

Eid-e-Zehra (sa) have weak hadith so it's Bid'ah. Unity week doesn't have any hadith but it is not bidah. Inconsistent. 

Unity week is famously known as Hafta e Wahdat. 

Edited by Sirius_Bright
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6 hours ago, Sirius_Bright said:

Eid-e-Zehra (sa) have weak hadith so it's Bid'ah. Unity week doesn't have any hadith but it is not bidah. Inconsistent. 

Unity week is famously known as Hafta e Wahdat. 

Come on man. Unity weak isn't islamic festival 

Nothing to do with deen. its related with political stuff and relations between groups for peace. Even Rasool (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) and Imam Hassan (عليه السلام) signed peace treaties. 

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1 hour ago, Syed Ali Mehdi Shah Naqvi said:

Come on man. Unity weak isn't islamic festival 

In the same way you can say Eid-e-Zehra (sa) is for expressing bara'at with enemies of Ahlulbayt (عليهم اسلام) and a day is dedicated for that. Be it in narrations or made by man, it reaffirms our love for Holy Ahlulbayt (عليهم اسلام) and dissociation from their enemies. 

If someone's got problem, he can simply stay away. 

1 hour ago, Syed Ali Mehdi Shah Naqvi said:

Nothing to do with deen. its related with political stuff and relations between groups for peace. Even Rasool (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) and Imam Hassan (عليه السلام) signed peace treaties.

The political stuff you are talking about is propagated more than deen. It has become harmful to one's Imaan. 

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On 10/28/2020 at 1:58 AM, Sirius_Bright said:

Talking about Bid'ah and having no basis in religion, what is this unity week business. Would like to see one narration supporting it, no chain of narrators would do. 

Nobody ever claimed that it came from an Imam or is based on an event during their lives (not that I participate in it myself, but the comparison doesn't make any sense). 

If those who promote eid al zahra also admit that there's no basis for it, then I think we're all in agreement. 

Unfortunately, we see speakers falsely trying to claim that those who don't participate in these fabricated events are actually hypocrites. 

Truly incredible. May Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) protect us from dishonesty and deviation. 

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8 hours ago, Mahdavist said:

Nobody ever claimed that it came from an Imam or is based on an event during their lives (not that I participate in it myself, but the comparison doesn't make any sense). 

If those who promote eid al zahra also admit that there's no basis for it, then I think we're all in agreement. 

I have said before even if it is weak or fabricated, there should be no problem. Meaning if Imam (عليه السلام) hasn't said anything about it doesn't make a day Bid'ah automatically. Azadari and bara'at should be part of our life. 

So, one believes Eid-e-Zehra (sa) is fabricated and didn't came from Imam (عليه السلام) and there should be nothing like that on 9th Rabiul Avval. 

On the other hand, the same person also believes unity week has no basis in religion (didn't came from Imam) but can be celebrated whole week. 

This is hypocrisy. 

8 hours ago, Mahdavist said:

Unfortunately, we see speakers falsely trying to claim that those who don't participate in these fabricated events are actually hypocrites. 

I believe one should ask that Maulana why he thinks so. 

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4 hours ago, Sirius_Bright said:

I believe one should ask that Maulana why he thinks so. 

Luckily the guidelines for imaan and nifaaq have already been provided to us by the ma'soomeen (عليه السلام). 

Each person will answer for their statements one day, particularly those who made them from the pulpit. 

4 hours ago, Sirius_Bright said:

So, one believes Eid-e-Zehra (sa) is fabricated and didn't came from Imam (عليه السلام) and there should be nothing like that on 9th Rabiul Avval. 

On the other hand, the same person also believes unity week has no basis in religion (didn't came from Imam) but can be celebrated whole week. 

This is hypocrisy. 

Like I said, as long as each person is honest about what they're doing I don't see an issue. The fact is, neither of these have any proper basis. They're both man made. 

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6 hours ago, Mahdavist said:

Luckily the guidelines for imaan and nifaaq have already been provided to us by the ma'soomeen (عليه السلام). 

Each person will answer for their statements one day, particularly those who made them from the pulpit. 

I mean Maulana might have some other hadith/riwayat or reasoning. 

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Eid al Zahra come from a weak chain. Most scholars agree that Abu Lulu (رضي الله عنه) killed Umar in Dhul Hujjah. Its not a Bida', as its not an addition to the religion or anything to change the religion. But, the hadith being weak, I won't take it.

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