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In the Name of God بسم الله

Why do we focus on Imams (عليه السلام) more than the Prophet or Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى)?

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Posted (edited)

Sorry if this question is stupid, but why do we always mention what happened on Karbala, Fadak, Ghadir Khumm in majalis and lectures but we don’t focus on Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) or his Nabi as much. 

Further to this we only talk about them superficially and we don’t talk about what this all represents I.e. Karbala was about belief tawheed.

Edited by Ejaz
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Posted (edited)

Salam, 

Is there any problem if anyone focuses on "Wajhullah"? Is there any problem to focus on what appears as "Noorun ala Noor"? 

Edited by Logic1234
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3 hours ago, starlight said:

 

2. Birth and death of Prophet Muhammad (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) is commemorated just like that of any Imam (عليه السلام)

 

This is not accurate. Birth of Imam Ali is more festive these days. And obviously there’s a bigger crowd on Ashura and 21st Ramadan. Good attempt to sweep under the rug however.

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45 minutes ago, 786:) said:

This is not accurate. Birth of Imam Ali is more festive these days. And obviously there’s a bigger crowd on Ashura and 21st Ramadan. Good attempt to sweep under the rug however.

You obviously have never been to a 28 Safar majlis. 

About Ashura I already said that there is no tragedy like the massacre of Karbala. 

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Posted (edited)
26 minutes ago, starlight said:

You obviously have never been to a 28 Safar majlis.  

In my community 28th Safar gets 50% attendance. 21st Ramadan gets 100%. Ashura gets 125%.

Also, focus is more on Imam Hasan during 28th Safar. The Prophet is just a “oh well” character. This undermining of the Prophet is not something you can dismiss.

Edited by 786:)
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49 minutes ago, 786:) said:

Also, focus is more on Imam Hasan during 28th Safar.

 

52 minutes ago, 786:) said:

gets 125%

Lolz at ^^

You will come up with an objection with EVERYTHING. That's what you are here for :)

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Guest Molana Laddan

First off, no other group of Muslims talk about the Prophet Muhammad sawaw as much in quantity and more so in respect respect as much as Shia do. 

Contrast this with the way every non-Shia addresses the Prophet: Hz. Muhammad SalleSallam (this is for some reason true for Sunnis from Morocco to Malaysia). And when it comes to their demigods Umer and Aisha etc. it’s Radi Allah taala Anhu wa Ajmaeen, blah blah blah. 
 

Muslims as a whole don’t dispute on Allah, Quran, and the Holy Prophet sawaw. The real dispute is on WILAYAH. 
 

Iblees (Satan) the cursed one, knows Allah more than you and I. But his problem has Akash been, “Yes, I know you are the oboe and only God, but I won’t agree to what you tell me. When you tell me that I need to submit to the WILAYAH of Adam, I would just refuse and say I’m better than him.”

The reason you find Shias constantly talking about WILAYAH so we separate ourselves from the Muslims of Ibleesi character. We Shia submit to who Allah wants us to submit to, first to Himself, then to Prophet Muhammad sawaw, and then to Imam Ali and the res tif Imams after him. 
 

This is why on the day of Ghadeer sermon, the Prophet started with this, Is Allah your Wali? If He is, then am I your Wali? Once everybody said yes, the Prophet proclaimed that, “For whoever I’m his MAWLA, Ali is also his MAWLA.”

End of the day, it’s all about Wilayah. Knowing God and Prophet is one thing (Iblees does it too). Being in their Wilayah is another. Only Shia Muslims do this. 
 

 

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44 minutes ago, Guest Molana Laddan said:

End of the day, it’s all about Wilayah. Knowing God and Prophet is one thing (Iblees does it too). Being in their Wilayah is another. Only Shia Muslims do this. 

If a person who had no idea about Islam read the Quran for the first time, I guarantee you this would not be the narrative they would pick up. Quran is supposed to guide all of humanity. So tell me why your narrative is not supported by the Quran. "Its all about Wilayah"...so the Prophet preached Wilayah for 23 years? Tawheed was just a throw in?

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10 minutes ago, 786:) said:

If a person who had no idea about Islam read the Quran for the first time, I guarantee you this would not be the narrative they would pick up. Quran is supposed to guide all of humanity. So tell me why your narrative is not supported by the Quran. "Its all about Wilayah"...so the Prophet preached Wilayah for 23 years? Tawheed was just a throw in?

I guess I was giving a High School Level perspective. Didn’t know you want a 1st grader perspective. 

Ok son, you need to go back to the drawing board. Fix your concept in Tawheed and build from there. Once you graduate to grade-3 level, read Ayat ul Kursi in Sura Baqra with translation, ponder, and then report back to us with your findings. Then I would tell you to look more into other ayaat which would get your intellect up a bit more. 
 

Friendly hint: Ibless, after millions of years in vicinity of angels, only had the Tawheed intellect of a 1st grader. For Tawheed, amount of time doesn’t matter though. It’s the sincerity in faith and the will to progress that matters. 
 

 

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32 minutes ago, 786:) said:

Entire message of Quran: Wilayah of Ali.

It is famous that the verse which revealed just prior to ghadeer sermon is this:

Surah Al-Maeda, Verse 67:
يَا أَيُّهَا الرَّسُولُ بَلِّغْ مَا أُنزِلَ إِلَيْكَ مِن رَّبِّكَ وَإِن لَّمْ تَفْعَلْ فَمَا بَلَّغْتَ رِسَالَتَهُ وَاللَّهُ يَعْصِمُكَ مِنَ النَّاسِ إِنَّ اللَّهَ لَا يَهْدِي الْقَوْمَ الْكَافِرِينَ

O Apostle! deliver what has been revealed to you from your Lord; and if you do it not, then you have not delivered His message, and Allah will protect you from the people; surely Allah will not guide the unbelieving people.
(English - Shakir)

Keep learning why wilayah of Imam Ali (عليه السلام) is of so importance.

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Posted (edited)
45 minutes ago, Cool said:

It is famous that the verse which revealed just prior to ghadeer sermon is this:

Surah Al-Maeda, Verse 67:
يَا أَيُّهَا الرَّسُولُ بَلِّغْ مَا أُنزِلَ إِلَيْكَ مِن رَّبِّكَ وَإِن لَّمْ تَفْعَلْ فَمَا بَلَّغْتَ رِسَالَتَهُ وَاللَّهُ يَعْصِمُكَ مِنَ النَّاسِ إِنَّ اللَّهَ لَا يَهْدِي الْقَوْمَ الْكَافِرِينَ

O Apostle! deliver what has been revealed to you from your Lord; and if you do it not, then you have not delivered His message, and Allah will protect you from the people; surely Allah will not guide the unbelieving people.
(English - Shakir)

Keep learning why wilayah of Imam Ali (عليه السلام) is of so importance.

Yes even Rasoolallah only got his Prophethood after accepting the wilayah of Ali. He struggled with this for 40 years, but ultimately submitted to the wilayah of Ali after Ali whispered the entire Quran to him 10 years before Gibril at the ripe age of 2 days old! Ali Haq! Nara Haideri!

Edited by 786:)
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11 hours ago, Ejaz said:

Karbala, Fadak, Ghadir Khumm in majalis and lectures

These 3 are most controversial topics. Fadak and Ghadeer tops the list. You don't talk about things which are easily understood and have less disagreement. We have hold onto Karbala for centuries through annual commemoration of Ashura otherwise you would have seen sunnis today putting raziallah for Yazid and Shimr and shamelessly defending them as they do for Abu Bakr and Umar. We should commemorate Fatimiyah likewise.

Secondly, these 3 topics are also the reason for most conversion to Shia. So, there should be more discussion on this. 

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6 hours ago, 786:) said:

In my community 28th Safar gets 50% attendance. 21st Ramadan gets 100%. Ashura gets 125%.

Also, focus is more on Imam Hasan during 28th Safar. The Prophet is just a “oh well” character. This undermining of the Prophet is not something you can dismiss.

In your community, maybe. Personally I haven't seen this in most of the islamic centres I've attended. 

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10 hours ago, Ejaz said:

why do we always mention what happened on Karbala, Fadak, Ghadir Khumm in majalis and lectures but we don’t focus on Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) or his Nabi as much.

As a layperson I would not know why sheiks priorities like they do and it may even be different from the mosque you go to and the one I go to, but as I see it these tree event in the beginning of Islam is essential in the way that Islam turned out. Maybe I will make some Sunnis angry by saying this, but these events has created two tracks in Islamic history. One track is that of worldly power which is the Khalifa and one track of the preservation of the deen. Through the centuries where the Caliphs has been obsessed with the worldly power, the Imams of the Ahl ul Bayt has meticulously preserved the Sunnah of the prophet. Where would the Sunni madhabs be if it was not for imam Jafar al Sadiq?
 Karbala, Fadak and Ghadir Khumm is about injustice done to the true believers by the worldly power. In this way it embodies the Quranic message and exemplify sin against virtue and those who put false gods in place of Allah against those who act with justice.
Maybe the Khalifa had a purpose in its time by spreading Islam, but there has only been one caliph who ruled with justice, Amir al Mu'mineen, Imam Ali ibn abi Talib (عليه السلام) And there will only be one in the future that will rule with justice, the Imam Mahdi(عليه السلام), but that will not be until the end of time. This is because worldly power will corrupt. So to me it makes completely sense.

This of cause doesn't mean that we shouldn't focus on Allah(سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) and the prophet(صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم). As a matter of fact I don't see it as separate. Allah is of cause much bigger than the Ahl ul Bayt, much bigger that Islam and much bigger that religion because he is limitless. However the events of Karbala, Fadak and Ghadir Khumm is an essential part of his divine plan and he is the best planner.
Well anyway that is just my 5 laypersons cents on the matter.

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This thread just proves once again what a massive inferiority complex Shias have. Instead of talking positively about our entire religion, we only talk about the bits that are different from the Sunnis, and spend all our time quoting from Sunni books. Which other religion stops talking about their own founder just because another group also believes in the same person? It would be like Catholics only talking about Mary and their saints, and justifying neglecting Jesus with ‘we don’t talk about him because the Protestants believe in him too’.

Ever notice that the Sunnis aren’t busy having countless lectures on the same topics to prove their perspectives? They mostly just get on with preaching their religion, and addressing issues of importance to their communities. Shias are truly stuck in the dark ages, listening to third rate lecturers and ‘scholars’ recycling the same stories over and over, many of which are fabricated. Given the complete absence of any critical thinking, or any sense of standards, absolute frauds are elevated to superstars and imbeciles are held in high esteem. And if anyone ever challenges this status quo, they are told not to rock the boat, because you might give ammunition to the Sunnis. What a pathetic state of affairs.

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14 hours ago, Ejaz said:

Sorry if this question is stupid, but why do we always mention what happened on Karbala, Fadak, Ghadir Khumm in majalis and lectures but we don’t focus on Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) or his Nabi as much. 

Further to this we only talk about them superficially and we don’t talk about what this all represents I.e. Karbala was about belief tawheed.

بِسْمِ اللَّهِ الرَّحْمَٰنِ الرَّحِيمِ {1}

[Pickthal 1:1] In the name of Allah, the Beneficent, the Merciful.

الْحَمْدُ لِلَّهِ رَبِّ الْعَالَمِينَ {2}

[Pickthal 1:2] Praise be to Allah, Lord of the Worlds,

الرَّحْمَٰنِ الرَّحِيمِ {3}

[Pickthal 1:3] The Beneficent, the Merciful.

مَالِكِ يَوْمِ الدِّينِ {4}

[Pickthal 1:4] Master of the Day of Judgment,

إِيَّاكَ نَعْبُدُ وَإِيَّاكَ نَسْتَعِينُ {5}

[Pickthal 1:5] Thee (alone) we worship; Thee (alone) we ask for help.

اهْدِنَا الصِّرَاطَ الْمُسْتَقِيمَ {6}

[Pickthal 1:6] Show us the straight path,

صِرَاطَ الَّذِينَ أَنْعَمْتَ عَلَيْهِمْ غَيْرِ الْمَغْضُوبِ عَلَيْهِمْ وَلَا الضَّالِّينَ {7}

[Pickthal 1:7] The path of those whom Thou hast favoured; Not the (path) of those who earn Thine anger nor of those who go astray.

-----

As a Muslim, directive is to formally be in the presence of the Lord of the world. The First Surah you recite in Salat gives you the entirety of your religion. 1:1-1:4 who He(عزّ وجلّ) is ( His(عزّ وجلّ) remembrance and 1:5-1:7 what his pleasure and displeasure is . The entire Book is just an expansion/explanation of the first Surah(Entirety of your Core belief).

We are directed to Prayer/Dua/ need/ is expressed in this way "Show us the Straight Path" and the answer is given in 1:7. So, blame Allah(عزّ وجلّ) for directing you to Say Ya Ali(عليه السلام) and Curse/distance yourself form his(عليه السلام) enemies.- For your Salvation in this world and the next. 

-----------------------------------------------

Directives of Muhammad al-Mustafa (peace be upon him and his pure progeny) is: 

"I am the city of knowledge and 'Ali is its gate'.

&

I am leaving among you the Two Weighty Things: the Book of Allah and my `Itrat (Progeny), my Ahlul Bayt. So long as you (simultaneously) uphold both of them, you will never be misled after me; so, do not go ahead of them else you should perish, and do not lag behind them else you should perish; do not teach them, for they are more knowledgeable than you.1

-----

Love of Allah(عزّ وجلّ)

قُلْ إِنْ كُنْتُمْ تُحِبُّونَ اللَّهَ فَاتَّبِعُونِي يُحْبِبْكُمُ اللَّهُ وَيَغْفِرْ لَكُمْ ذُنُوبَكُمْ ۗ وَاللَّهُ غَفُورٌ رَحِيمٌ {31}

[Pickthal 3:31] Say, (O Muhammad, to mankind): If ye love Allah, follow me; Allah will love you and forgive you your sins. Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.

Love is Expressed in this way

يَا أَيُّهَا الَّذِينَ آمَنُوا أَطِيعُوا اللَّهَ وَأَطِيعُوا الرَّسُولَ وَأُولِي الْأَمْرِ مِنْكُمْ ۖ فَإِنْ تَنَازَعْتُمْ فِي شَيْءٍ فَرُدُّوهُ إِلَى اللَّهِ وَالرَّسُولِ إِنْ كُنْتُمْ تُؤْمِنُونَ بِاللَّهِ وَالْيَوْمِ الْآخِرِ ۚ ذَٰلِكَ خَيْرٌ وَأَحْسَنُ تَأْوِيلًا {59}

[Pickthal 4:59] O ye who believe! Obey Allah, and obey the messenger and those of you who are in authority; and if ye have a dispute concerning any matter, refer it to Allah and the messenger if ye are (in truth) believers in Allah and the Last Day. That is better and more seemly in the end.

-----

Five times a day your formally remember Allah(عزّ وجلّ), Weekly you should gather on Fridays to listen to Lecture. (52 weeks a Year), Entire month of Ramadhan- to be used for learning Fiqh/current issues/quranic learning. 

Regarding the Events and Tragedies mentioned:

Muharram: ( the two months and 10 days) Are for the Remembrance of a Tragedy - First ten days and the after that the Captives of Karbala, you have arbaeen and you formally end 9 th of rabi awwal.  For those who constantly say that we follow what the imams(عليه السلام) did. Look into it. 

(Sayyid Ibn Tawoos says, that the narrator says, that then they left from Karbala towards Madinah. Basheer bin Jazlam says, that when we reached near Madinah, Imam Ali Zainul Abedeen ((عليه السلام).) dismounted there and pitched tents and told the women to alight too, and then said,

“O Basheer! May Allah have mercy upon your father, he was a poet. Then can you recite elegies too?”

I replied, “Yes, O son of the Prophet of Allah (S)! I too am a poet”. Imam ((عليه السلام).) said,

“Then go to Madinah and announce the news of the martyrdom of Abu Abdullah ((عليه السلام).)”.)

https://www.shiachat.com/forum/topic/235052840-is-there-a-dibil-here-who-can-compose-a-line-or/

Imam Sadiq ((عليه السلام).) said:

فقال الصادق (ع):

الحمد لله الذي جعل في الناس مَن يفِد إلينا ويمدحُنا ويرثِي لنا

All praise is for Allah, who has placed amongst the people, those who arrive in our presence, eulogizing us and reciting elegies about us.

Wasail al‑Shiah vol. 10, pg. 469.

https://www.al-islam.org/forty-hadith-on-azadari/ahadith-traditions#1-inferno-husayni-love

----------------------------------------

Other events were/are either ignored by the Muslims - or they highlight the Oppression/Injustice- So, in these events the topic will be based on the Event or tragedy. 

Lastly, people who offer such great ideas should offer I to the Lord of the world- Replace The Event of Hajj and rituals and remembrance with reading of the Quran. You knwo what the answer will be, these Events explain the Qur'an to you. 

No we will not desist in the remembrance of the Oppressed ones. 

Say, ‘I do not ask of you any reward for it except the affection for [my] relatives.’ (42:23)

-----

The Name of Imam Ali(عليه السلام) is what bothers the Hostile ones. So, Inshallah the Azadar will continue on the path of making these events more prominent and will sacrifice ALL to preserve them. 

 

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Years ago when I use to attend sunni khutbas they would constantly talk about umar ibin khattab and abu bakir and bukhari and immam ghazali and ibin taymiyyah, etc..

So thoses sunnis who claim this about shias really have no ground to stand on.

I even remeber talking to a turkish hanbali and he told me "hazarat umar" in one of his phrases and I told him umar is not a prophet, the guy told me this was one of my shia lies :hahaha:.

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4 hours ago, 786:) said:

Yes even Rasoolallah only got his Prophethood after accepting the wilayah of Ali. He struggled with this for 40 years, but ultimately submitted to the wilayah of Ali after Ali whispered the entire Quran to him 10 years before Gibril at the ripe age of 2 days old! Ali Haq! Nara Haideri!

When the directive to spread Islam to the Prophet closest family members among the Quresh, Rasul (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) invited them for a dinner.  Why did the Prophet was made fun by the leaders of Quresh and members of close relatives?

Because Rasul mentioned that Ali (عليه السلام) will be his successor, wali, and khalifah after him?

And not to mention that Islam only being perfected and accepted by Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) as official religion after wilayat of Ali (عليه السلام) was announced publicly to all sahabahs.

I hope you are not among those who undermined the wilayat of Ali (e.g. leaders of Quresh or those who denied Ali at Ghadeer Khum).

At the same time, we don't misinterpret about wilayah of Ali like you did.  

We understand the position of Ali (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) as Harun (عليه السلام) to Moses (عليه السلام), except there will be no Prophethood after Muhammad (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم)

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Posted (edited)
9 minutes ago, layman said:

When the directive to spread Islam to the Prophet closest family members among the Quresh, Rasul (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) invited them for a dinner.  Why did the Prophet was made fun by the leaders of Quresh and members of close relatives?

Because Rasul mentioned that Ali (عليه السلام) will be his successor, wali, and khalifah after him?

And not to mention that Islam only being perfected and accepted by Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) as official religion after wilayat of Ali (عليه السلام) was announced publicly to all sahabahs.

I hope you are not among those who undermined the wilayat of Ali (e.g. leaders of Quresh or those who denied Ali at Ghadeer Khum).

At the same time, we don't misinterpret about wilayah of Ali like you did.  

We understand the position of Ali (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) as Harun (عليه السلام) to Moses (عليه السلام), except there will be no Prophethood after Muhammad (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم)

I think Imam Ali is the wali of the Prophet. However, I find it absurd to say Wilayah was the main message of the Prophet's mission. What were the pagan Arabs opposing? Were they opposing oneness of Allah the or wilayah of Ali? These extreme opinions are a function of polemics during the Golden Period when one party countered the other party's extremism (Nasb) with extremism of their own (Ghuluw).

Edited by 786:)
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13 minutes ago, 786:) said:

I think Imam Ali is the wali of the Prophet. However, I find it absurd to say Wilayah was the main message of the Prophet's mission. What were the pagan Arabs opposing? Were they opposing oneness of Allah the or wilayah of Ali? These extreme opinions are a function of polemics during the Golden Period when one party countered the other party's extremism (Nasb) with extremism of their own (Ghuluw).

Brother,

Prophethood and Imamat (wilayah), both belong to Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى).  Both must exist to teach humans on ONENESS of Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى)..  Muhammad and Ali are humans that entrusted to uphold both.

Remember the verse below, Prophet and Ali were one (ourselves).  Is Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) so obsessed with Ali?  Or to tell people that Nubuwwah and Imamah are equally important.

[Yusufali 3:61] If any one disputes in this matter with thee, now after (full) knowledge Hath come to thee, say: "Come! let us gather together,- our sons and your sons, our women and your women, ourselves and yourselves: Then let us earnestly pray, and invoke the curse of Allah on those who lie!"

Oneness of Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) exists in Nubbuwah and Imamat... the human parts of Muhammad and Ali are just entrusted to uphold the Oneness that exists in Nubuwwah and Imamat.  

The moment Muhammad and Ali were purified and entrusted with Nubuwwah and Imamah, they are Pure.  Since they accept the trust, they are Pure Slaves.  And Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) and Angels send blessings on them.  And we put (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) and (عليه السلام) after their names.

If we want to understand ONENESS of Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى), be with the Prophet and accept fully the wilayat of Ali (عليه السلام).

Avoid making wrong assumptions on those who revere wilayat of Ali (عليه السلام) or other Imams.

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6 hours ago, Cool said:

It is famous that the verse which revealed just prior to ghadeer sermon is this:

Surah Al-Maeda, Verse 67:
يَا أَيُّهَا الرَّسُولُ بَلِّغْ مَا أُنزِلَ إِلَيْكَ مِن رَّبِّكَ وَإِن لَّمْ تَفْعَلْ فَمَا بَلَّغْتَ رِسَالَتَهُ وَاللَّهُ يَعْصِمُكَ مِنَ النَّاسِ إِنَّ اللَّهَ لَا يَهْدِي الْقَوْمَ الْكَافِرِينَ

O Apostle! deliver what has been revealed to you from your Lord; and if you do it not, then you have not delivered His message, and Allah will protect you from the people; surely Allah will not guide the unbelieving people.
(English - Shakir)

Keep learning why wilayah of Imam Ali (عليه السلام) is of so importance.

Do Sunni brothers agree that this verse was revealed before Ghadir Khumm? 
If so, it would be a big blow since the message of Islam (to make them mu’min) would not be complete without Wilayah 

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9 minutes ago, Ejaz said:

Do Sunni brothers agree that this verse was revealed before Ghadir Khumm? 

I think you mean to ask whether this Ayah (5:67) directed the Prophet صلى الله عليه وسلم to make the announcement of Amir al-Mu'minin's كرم الله وجهه Wilayah which he did at Ghadir Khumm. According to Asbab al-Nuzul of al-Wahidi, several different narrations are narrated that mention different circumstances for the revelation of this Ayah, among them is the view that it was revealed concerning the directive of announcing Amir al-Mu'minin's Wilayah. Therefore, for me as a Sunni Muslim that is entirely plausible and I accept it

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2 hours ago, Ejaz said:

Do Sunni brothers agree that this verse was revealed before Ghadir Khumm? 

Well, I personally don't care what they agree or disagree when I see sahih ahadith supporting this and explaining this verse. 

Keep your eyes on "Ma" of "Ma Unzila" and look at the following verse:

Surah An-Najm, Verse 10:
فَأَوْحَىٰ إِلَىٰ عَبْدِهِ مَا أَوْحَىٰ

And He revealed to His servant what He revealed.
(English - Shakir)

"Ma Awha"..... What has been kept secret here? Who can tell us what actually was revealed by Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) here except the Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) or Ahlul Bayt (عليه السلام)? We have sahih narrations which explain this matter to us after which there is no need to worry or care about who agree or disagree with it. 

It is also famous that the verse revealed after the announcement of the wilayah of Imam Ali (عليه السلام) is this:

"Al-yowma akmalto lakum deenokum wa atmamto alaikum ne'mati......."

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Video: English Wikishia and its Articles relating to Imamate

https://en.abna24.com/news//video-bahrami_1060605.html

August 8, 2020 - 6:05 PM News Code : 1060605 Source : ABNALink:   

AhlulBayt News Agency (ABNA): Hujjat al-Islam Hoseein Bahrami, the university lecturer and researcher explained about articles related to Imamate and Ghadir in Wikishia.

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There are 12 Imams (عليه السلام), 1 Zahra (عليه السلام) and 1 Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم).

If we talk equally about all 14, then the Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) should be discussed 7% of the time. I believe that happens.

What happens is that people with agendas say that since we talk about the Imams 86% of the time (12/14) them we are ignoring the Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم).

People who are shia all year round know that the Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) is discussed just as much.

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1 hour ago, ShiaMan14 said:

There are 12 Imams (عليه السلام), 1 Zahra (عليه السلام) and 1 Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم).

If we talk equally about all 14, then the Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) should be discussed 7% of the time. I believe that happens.

What happens is that people with agendas say that since we talk about the Imams 86% of the time (12/14) them we are ignoring the Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم).

People who are shia all year round know that the Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) is discussed just as much.

Leaving aside the fact that the Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) is more important than the Imams (عليه السلام), and hence deserves more time, it's obvious to everybody that Imam al-Hadi (عليه السلام), to pick a random example, doesn't get even a small fraction of the time devoted to Imam Ali (عليه السلام) or Imam Husayn (عليه السلام). So if we actually worked out the real percentages, it may be that the Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) is discussed 7% of the time (although if you take out the times he is mentioned in the context of discussing other members of the Ahlulbayt, then I'm sure it's far less than that), but Imam Ali and Imam Husayn would get much more time than that.

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as salaamu alaikum,

 

I am not sure where the problem is. I go to the Islamic Center of Imam Ali in Detroit Michigan and the brothers there which are Iraqi-Americans speak a lot about the Prophet Muhammad (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم). Not to mention the amount of times we make salawat in the masjid. When I started going often (I live in another city so not always able to make it) the Sheikh and brothers began talking to me and discussing Allah and Allah's guidance. Always talking about the greatness of Allah and how he is beyond anything imaginable. Those brothers although my Arabic is not strong have encouraged me to be deeper in my salat and increase in my love of the Prophet and his ahlul bayt.

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11 hours ago, Haydar Husayn said:

Leaving aside the fact that the Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) is more important than the Imams (عليه السلام), and hence deserves more time, it's obvious to everybody that Imam al-Hadi (عليه السلام), to pick a random example, doesn't get even a small fraction of the time devoted to Imam Ali (عليه السلام) or Imam Husayn (عليه السلام). So if we actually worked out the real percentages, it may be that the Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) is discussed 7% of the time (although if you take out the times he is mentioned in the context of discussing other members of the Ahlulbayt, then I'm sure it's far less than that), but Imam Ali and Imam Husayn would get much more time than that.

I don’t get the defensive mechanism at play when the underemphasis of the Holy Prophet is mentioned. Why not just accept it and acknowledge that we as Shias need to build a better relationship with the Holy Prophet?

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3 minutes ago, 786:) said:

Why not just accept it and acknowledge that we as Shias need to build a better relationship with the Holy Prophet?

It is well accepted and acknowledged, that's why we adorn our majalis with the zikr of Ahlul Bayt (عليه السلام). 

قُل لَّا أَسْأَلُکُمْ عَلَیْهِ أَجْرًا إِلَّا الْمَوَدَّةَ فِی الْقُرْبَی

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