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In the Name of God بسم الله

"Twelve" in Quran

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There are proofs in Quran that lead to other proofs, and doors that open other doors.   

If the concept of non-Nabi Messengers and non-Nabi Imams is accepted, this leads to other doors.  If the concept of the chosen family is accepted, this leads to other doors.

One of these things that lead to, is the concept of Twelve with respect to succession.  It is understood with reflection:

1. 5th Surah, is about the day God completed his religion and makes us journey to that day, by even verses not revealed on that day, but in flow with that, then is the Twelve Captains of the covenant of Moses with respect to his people, and in flow with that is God's judgment ruling humanity, and in flow with that, is the Prophets role with judging by revelation for the Jews and their scholars, and being one's entrusted to safeguard the revelation in this regard, and in flow with that, is even though the people revealed books to were entrusted to judge by what God revealed, not to take them as Authorities rather then God and his chosen ones, as some of them are authorities over others. And it warns like it does else where not to not love humans as much as God so as to attribute God what we don't know nor become intoxicated in the game of thrones of idols that we take people who take the religion as a game as authorities. In this regard, it reminds God the Messenger and those granted security - the one's represented by Imam Ali (a) when we have his ring in Ruku, are our only Wali (religious Authority to rely on for guidance in this context). The flow back to twelve is clear, and then later it reminds of the covenant again but says he sent Messengers.... instead of emphasizing on raising Twelve Captains.

2. In 7th Surah, it reminds of Messengers when rejected the people were destroyed. I then takes a magnifying glass at Moses' and his story, and in flow of that, reminds from the people of Moses' is an a course who guide by the truth and by it they establish justice. And this is in flow of reminding the universal position of Mohammad (s) and that in is context that God has authority in the heavens and the earth, and his is the authority, and so it's obviously flowing with respect to that. Then it goes on to say while they were one course, one way, they were split into twelve branches as ways, the word branches refers to tree like branches stemming from a root, while in Hebrew, the word for that is with rivers, water splitting to more would be the word, and both are used for tribes by parable, but original meaning is not tribes.  This is why Quran reminds of the splitting of the twelve rivers by Moses' because a lot of the words tribes is mistranslation of what should be seen to be as branches in the Torah and be referring to successors of Moses'. In flow with that later, is the reminder from who God created is a people who guide by the truth again. And linked that with God's beautiful names and rejection of them as rejection of signs/proofs of God and trespassing God's Names.

3.

9th Surah...

In the same way Ulil-Amr is in context of negating the false authority of clergy class claiming to represent God's teachings or revelations, the twelve "Shahr" is in flow of that, and in flow of people going into extreme as a result of wanting to idolize their scholars to the extent they end up going to extremes with respect to worshiping humans like Jesus, but the intention in worshiping Jesus really stems from the love of the idols among clergy... And it talks about how clergy often take money from people and don't spend it in God's way and the corruption nature of religion and money when intertwined.  Shahr although refers to lunar month in Arabic, it originally meant luminary, and was by parable - the moon and it's giving light - was said to be a Shahr (luminary)…

However, the flow with the topic before, was about clergy and going into extreme of God's chosen. In this regard, it can be that twelve luminaries is the accurate meaning, and the sacred nature of 4 of them has to do with the name Ali. The reason is because if you go beyond exalting, you worship since exalting is the level below Worship, and also if you neglect or equate others with the exalted you discounted God's chosen and their superior nature. So this is a sacred ground by which we have to be balanced in, exalting but not worshiping them but yet not raising others to the status of God's chosen ones.

In this light, it saying, the representatives after Mohammad (s) was twelve the day God created the heavens and the earth, and so don't mix corrupt clergy with their authority, but also, do not worship them, for God is above exalted ones, and although he is an exalted one, they are not gods to be worshiped.

Then the next word for year, can instead of year "generic" and be referring to Mohammad (s) as a Messenger and that this number twelve is always the way of God not just for Mohammad (s), and so delaying a luminary, would be disbelief, in order to extinguish the number twelve which is sacred by God. Although the verse before talks about four of them being sacred, that is due to with the name. Here it has to do with their sacred number which is Thirteen including the founder and twelve when excluding the founder with respect to representing and illuminating the way.

This all flows of course with respect to God's promise to make his religion superior to all religions. There is a hadith from Imam Mohammad Al-Baqir (a) that interprets the verse like this.

One luminary is accepted for one generic (Ibrahim's successors for example) and another delayed for another generic (Aaron or Ali for example)… this is the meaning of generic here, and the generic here is a founder like Mohammad (s), that is why Imam Mohammad Baqir (a) says the word here "A'ama" refers to Mohammad (s) in that hadith.

There is three other places that allude to the number of Imams, but these should suffice.

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On 8/2/2020 at 5:39 PM, Muhammed Ali said:

Interestingly the word 'imam' appears 12 times in the Quran. This is the only one of those so called numerical miracles that I have found to be valid.

Can you please reference those twelve instances? According to my research, the word imam does not occur twelve times in the Quran

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16 hours ago, Cherub786 said:

Can you please reference those twelve instances? According to my research, the word imam does not occur twelve times in the Quran

It appears 5 times plural and 7 times singular I believe. This is all off-topic though.

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7 hours ago, Muhammed Ali said:

http://corpus.quran.com/qurandictionary.jsp?q=Amm#(36:12:13)

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In two places it says imamin mubin which shias and sunnis tend to differ over their interpretation. But the word is imam either way.

Can you tell me if you found more or less instance of the word imam?

Oh I see, you have actually combined the counts of two different words, Imam (singular) and A'immah (plural), otherwise, the word Imam occurs six times. I would also like to point out that the words Imam and A'immah as occur in the Quran are not always in the positive sense, but also referring to evil Imams, like in 9:12, 28:41, 17:71. Then the word Imam is also used in the Quran to refer to the Torah (not a person) like in 11:17 and 46:12

So in summary I see this argument as very problematic, data manipulation

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8 hours ago, Cherub786 said:

, 17:71

What's 'Evil' about 17:71? 

One day We shall call together all human beings with their (respective) Imams: those who are given their record in their right hand will read it (with pleasure), and they will not be dealt with unjustly in the least.

 

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Posted (edited)
16 hours ago, Cherub786 said:

Oh I see, you have actually combined the counts of two different words, Imam (singular) and A'immah (plural), otherwise, the word Imam occurs six times. I would also like to point out that the words Imam and A'immah as occur in the Quran are not always in the positive sense, but also referring to evil Imams, like in 9:12, 28:41, 17:71. Then the word Imam is also used in the Quran to refer to the Torah (not a person) like in 11:17 and 46:12

So in summary I see this argument as very problematic, data manipulation

Having it in other ways wouldn't be possible because it would restrict the Quran to using that word in only one way. Can you imagine if in order to have imam mentioned 12 times it could only use it in the singular or plural? Or it couldn't use it to refer to evil leaders? The best way is to allow it to be used in differing ways but to restrict it to 12. E.g having the word mentioned 12 times for good leaders but 1 times for evil leaders just wouldn't be as effective because people would say that the word appeared 13 times.

BTW I am not using this as an argument because that is not how I approach these things. I am only stating a fact. You can take from it what you want.

Edited by Muhammed Ali
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On 8/12/2020 at 1:12 AM, starlight said:

What's 'Evil' about 17:71? 

One day We shall call together all human beings with their (respective) Imams: those who are given their record in their right hand will read it (with pleasure), and they will not be dealt with unjustly in the least.

 

This verse includes both good and bad Imams, because Allah says He will call all humans by their Imam.

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5 hours ago, Cherub786 said:

This verse includes both good and bad Imams, because Allah says He will call all humans by their Imam.

This raises the simple question whom one should follow, a bad imam or a good imam?

 

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Posted (edited)
4 minutes ago, Cherub786 said:

All good qualities befitting a Believer

Believer qualities are not sufficient for a good Imam / leader alone.

May like to see with some reference please either from verses of quran or a hadith please, if you like to share. wasalam

Edited by Muslim2010
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Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, Cherub786 said:

Evidence?

وَجَعَلْنَاهُمْ أَئِمَّةً يَهْدُونَ بِأَمْرِنَا وَأَوْحَيْنَا إِلَيْهِمْ فِعْلَ الْخَيْرَاتِ وَإِقَامَ الصَّلَاةِ وَإِيتَاءَ الزَّكَاةِ ۖ وَكَانُوا لَنَا عَابِدِينَ

And We made them Imams who guided (people) by Our command, and We revealed to them the doing of good and the keeping up of prayer and the giving of the alms, and Us (alone) did they serve; (21:73)

وَجَعَلْنَا مِنْهُمْ أَئِمَّةً يَهْدُونَ بِأَمْرِنَا لَمَّا صَبَرُوا ۖ وَكَانُوا بِآيَاتِنَا يُوقِنُونَ

And We made of them Imams to guide by Our command when they were patient, and they were certain of Our communications. (32:24)

Edited by Muslim2010
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1 minute ago, Muslim2010 said:

وَجَعَلْنَاهُمْ أَئِمَّةً يَهْدُونَ بِأَمْرِنَا وَأَوْحَيْنَا إِلَيْهِمْ فِعْلَ الْخَيْرَاتِ وَإِقَامَ الصَّلَاةِ وَإِيتَاءَ الزَّكَاةِ ۖ وَكَانُوا لَنَا عَابِدِينَ

And We made them Imams who guided (people) by Our command, and We revealed to them the doing of good and the keeping up of prayer and the giving of the alms, and Us (alone) did they serve; (21:73)

 

How is that evidence of your claim?

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4 minutes ago, Cherub786 said:

How is that evidence of your claim?

The good imams are chosen by Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) and they guide the people by thy (Allah) command. This is not the quality of an ordinary believer. 

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Just now, Muslim2010 said:

The good imams are chosen by Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) and they guide the people by thy (Allah) command. This is not the quality of an ordinary believer. 

What is the proof that every Imam must be chosen by Allah? The verses you quoted are speaking of Prophets. Obviously Prophets are also Imams, and they are chosen by Allah in their capacity of being Prophets.

But I shall now prove from the Quran that the rank of Imamate is not only wahbi it may be kasbi also:

وَٱلَّذِينَ يَقُولُونَ رَبَّنَا هَبْ لَنَا مِنْ أَزْوَٰجِنَا وَذُرِّيَّـٰتِنَا قُرَّةَ أَعْيُنٍ وَٱجْعَلْنَا لِلْمُتَّقِينَ إِمَامًا

And those who say, "Our Lord, grant us from among our wives and offspring comfort to our eyes and make us an Imam for the righteous." (25:74)

Here Allah is encouraging Believers to pray that they be made into an Imam. Thus it is possible a Believer attains Imamate through prayer and righteousness, and so not every Imam is chosen by Allah.

Question: Do you personally pray to Allah to make you an Imam? Yes or No?

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1 hour ago, Cherub786 said:

What is the proof that every Imam must be chosen by Allah? The verses you quoted are speaking of Prophets. Obviously Prophets are also Imams, and they are chosen by Allah in their capacity of being Prophets.

The verse 21:73 quotes about the prophet as imams no doubt about it.

The verse 32:24 quotes the imams in Children of Israel and those were not prophets.

The other verses for explanation regarding the selection of leaders/ imams /caliphs are given below:

وَلَقَدْ أَخَذَ اللَّهُ مِيثَاقَ بَنِي إِسْرَائِيلَ وَبَعَثْنَا مِنْهُمُ اثْنَيْ عَشَرَ نَقِيبًا

Shakir:  And certainly Allah made a covenant with the children of Israel, and We raised up among them twelve chieftains; (5:12)

وَقَالَ لَهُمْ نَبِيُّهُمْ إِنَّ اللَّهَ قَدْ بَعَثَ لَكُمْ طَالُوتَ مَلِكًا ۚ قَالُوا أَنَّىٰ يَكُونُ لَهُ الْمُلْكُ عَلَيْنَا وَنَحْنُ أَحَقُّ بِالْمُلْكِ مِنْهُ وَلَمْ يُؤْتَ سَعَةً مِّنَ الْمَالِ ۚ قَالَ إِنَّ اللَّهَ اصْطَفَاهُ عَلَيْكُمْ وَزَادَهُ بَسْطَةً فِي الْعِلْمِ وَالْجِسْمِ ۖ وَاللَّهُ يُؤْتِي مُلْكَهُ مَن يَشَاءُ ۚ وَاللَّهُ وَاسِعٌ عَلِيمٌ

And their prophet said to them: Surely Allah has raised Talut to be a king over you. They said: How can he hold kingship over us while we have a greater right to kingship than he, and he has not been granted an abundance of wealth? He said: Surely Allah has chosen him in preference to you, and He has increased him abundantly in knowledge and physique, and Allah grants His kingdom to whom He pleases, and Allah is Amplegiving, Knowing. (2:247)

No one has  been selected as imam/ caliph/ leader for the guidance of the nation by people but Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) has appointed them.

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Cherub786 said:

But I shall now prove from the Quran that the rank of Imamate is not only wahbi it may be kasbi also:

وَٱلَّذِينَ يَقُولُونَ رَبَّنَا هَبْ لَنَا مِنْ أَزْوَٰجِنَا وَذُرِّيَّـٰتِنَا قُرَّةَ أَعْيُنٍ وَٱجْعَلْنَا لِلْمُتَّقِينَ إِمَامًا

And those who say, "Our Lord, grant us from among our wives and offspring comfort to our eyes and make us an Imam for the righteous." (25:74)

Here Allah is encouraging Believers to pray that they be made into an Imam. Thus it is possible a Believer attains Imamate through prayer and righteousness, and so not every Imam is chosen by Allah.

Question: Do you personally pray to Allah to make you an Imam? Yes or No?

This verse mentions Imam as general term for pray to Allah   not as imam who are appointed by Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى). It is only selection by Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) who appoint the prophet  or alike as Imam (not ordinary believers like us). The following verse describes this meaning clearly:

وَإِذِ ابْتَلَىٰ إِبْرَاهِيمَ رَبُّهُ بِكَلِمَاتٍ فَأَتَمَّهُنَّ ۖ قَالَ إِنِّي جَاعِلُكَ لِلنَّاسِ إِمَامًا ۖ قَالَ وَمِن ذُرِّيَّتِي ۖ قَالَ لَا يَنَالُ عَهْدِي الظَّالِمِينَ

And when his Lord tried Ibrahim with certain words, he fulfilled them. He said: Surely I will make you an Imam of men. Ibrahim said: And of my offspring? My covenant does not include the unjust, said He. (2:124)

The prophet Ibrahim as was chosen as Imam to mankind  by Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى).

I may pray to Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) to make me a leader in my community or professional field but I already  know we do have Imams as announced by the hadith of prophets in our nation likewise  there were 12 leaders in the children of Israel and their count is 12. (First of them is Ali Ibne Abi Talib and 12th ie last is AL Mahdi )

Would you like to quote a verse of quran mentioning the example of an Imam / leader / caliph for the guidance of the nation chosen by the people?

Edited by Muslim2010
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13 hours ago, Muslim2010 said:

No one has  been selected as imam/ caliph/ leader for the guidance of the nation by people but Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) has appointed them.

This is the claim whose evidence I am asking for. The evidence you present does not substantiate your argument. You have only presented instances from the Quran where Allah appointed a Prophet or an Imam or a King. How does it then follow that every single Imam or King must therefore be appointed by Allah? I hope you understand basic logic. No one is disputing that there were certain Imams whom Allah appointed, but how does this fact negate that there are other Imams who were not divinely appointed?

Furthermore, you quote the fact that Talut (Saul) was appointed as King by Allah through the agency of the Prophet Samuel عليه السلام. Based on your logic, this means every king must be appointed by Allah otherwise his kingship is invalid? Look how ridiculous this logic is.

So according to you, every king in the world, throughout human history, was not a king, except for Talut because Allah appointed him?

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Posted (edited)
15 hours ago, Muslim2010 said:

No one has  been selected as imam/ caliph/ leader for the guidance of the nation by people but Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) has appointed them.

 

14 hours ago, Muslim2010 said:

Would you like to quote a verse of quran mentioning the example of an Imam / leader / caliph for the guidance of the nation chosen by the people?

 

1 hour ago, Cherub786 said:

This is the claim whose evidence I am asking for. The evidence you present does not substantiate your argument.

I have mentioned so far 6 verses where imams/ leaders have been chosen by Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) for the guidance of the people.

I still await a  verse of Quran where an example has been mentioned for selection of an imam/ leader / ;caliph by the people for nation / ummah instead  of Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) before  i can given any further attention to your false claims.

Edited by Muslim2010
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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Cherub786 said:

You have only presented instances from the Quran where Allah appointed a Prophet or an Imam or a King. How does it then follow that every single Imam or King must therefore be appointed by Allah? 

Do you not consider that quran is the first source of guidance  of islam like all muslims believe? 

Edited by Muslim2010
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3 hours ago, Muslim2010 said:

I have mentioned so far 6 verses where imams/ leaders have been chosen by Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) for the guidance of the people.

I still await a  verse of Quran where an example has been mentioned for selection of an imam/ leader / ;caliph by the people for nation / ummah instead  of Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) before  i can given any further attention to your false claims.

It doesn't matter if you quote a 1000 verses from Quran, your claim is that the only Imam is someone who is appointed by Allah. You have failed to prove this argument.

On the other hand, I did quote the verse 25:74 which answers your challenge. The Quran proves a person can become an Imam by praying to Allah to make him an Imam.

According to your doctrine, after the Twelfth Imam the silsilah of Imamate has ceased, just like Nubuwwah has ceased. Fine, the Quran says Prophet Muhammad is Seal of the Prophet (33:40), but where in the Quran does it say that after the Twelfth Imam there can't be a Thirteenth Imam?

Also, the Quran is universal and for all times and places. Allah teaches us to pray to Him that He make us an Imam (25:74), but according to you now it is impossible for a new Imam to be made, therefore why don't you delete this verse (25:74) from the Quran and tell people it is Haram to make the Du'a that the Quran teaches us?

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18 hours ago, Muslim2010 said:

This verse mentions Imam as general term for pray to Allah   not as imam who are appointed by Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى).

Thanks for proving my point: Not all Imams are appointed by Allah, like you said "This verse mentions Imam as general term"

So what is there left to argue, you just admitted that I'm right

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Posted (edited)
7 hours ago, Cherub786 said:

It doesn't matter if you quote a 1000 verses from Quran, your claim is that the only Imam is someone who is appointed by Allah. You have failed to prove this argument.

The general  meaning verse does not provide any example that a person like me or you can become an Imam. It is the permission of Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) and thy grace whom he chooses as Imam. There are many verses already quoted but you prefer to keep eyes closed from their meaning and truth. 

 

7 hours ago, Cherub786 said:

On the other hand, I did quote the verse 25:74 which answers your challenge. The Quran proves a person can become an Imam by praying to Allah to make him an Imam.

Already refuted and replied in earlier post

https://www.shiachat.com/forum/topic/235067265-twelve-in-quran/?do=findComment&comment=3303255

7 hours ago, Cherub786 said:

Also, the Quran is universal and for all times and places. Allah teaches us to pray to Him that He make us an Imam (25:74), but according to you now it is impossible for a new Imam to be made, therefore why don't you delete this verse (25:74) from the Quran and tell people it is Haram to make the Du'a that the Quran teaches us?

Can you remove a verse pf Quran? Is this a muslim belief? 

The verses of Quran provides the principle of imams chosen by Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) for the guidance of ummah and hadith of the prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) also mention the count of imams/caliphs after him is 12.

Do you deny all these verses and hadith of the prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم)?

There is no verse in quran so far mentioned by yourself that provides the evidence with an example of a chosen leader / caliph  / imam by the people thus your view in this regard is just a false claim and thus rejected.

Edited by Muslim2010
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Posted (edited)
7 hours ago, Cherub786 said:

Thanks for proving my point: Not all Imams are appointed by Allah, like you said "This verse mentions Imam as general term"

I like to quote the following example:

"O you who believe! do not go near prayer ....................... (4:43)"

Does the above verse say believer should not go near to the prayer? No this is a part of the verse only that should be read like given below for complete meaning:

Shakir: O you who believe! do not go near prayer when you are Intoxicated until you know (well) what you say, nor when you are under an obligation to perform a bath-..(4:43)

This verse provide complete meaning. This is what your interpretation is made for the statement  quoted in last my post. The complete reply has already been given earlier that should be read as whole instead of a cut paste manner explained above: 

The above post clearly differentiate between the divinely appointed Imam Ibrahim (عليه السلام) and use of this term as general meaning for prayer only.

wasalam

Edited by Muslim2010
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5 hours ago, Muslim2010 said:

The general  meaning verse does not provide any example that a person like me or you can become an Imam. It is the permission of Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) and thy grace whom he chooses as Imam. There are many verses already quoted but you prefer to keep eyes closed from their meaning and truth. 

Already refuted and replied in earlier post

25:74 clearly refutes your argument and establishes the fact that any righteous person can become an Imam through prayer. The possibility is definitely there.

You claim to have refuted it, but this was your answer: "This verse mentions Imam as general term for pray to Allah   not as imam who are appointed by Allah"

This is not a refutation, it is actually an admission. My argument is that not all Imams are necessarily divinely appointed, and that someone can become an Imam through prayer and righteousness. You just acknowledged that this is true.

Hence, Imamate is of two kinds: 1. wahbi and 2. kasbi

25:74 is the proof text for kasbi Imamate

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3 hours ago, Cherub786 said:

25:74 clearly refutes your argument and establishes the fact that any righteous person can become an Imam through prayer. The possibility is definitely there.

You claim to have refuted it, but this was your answer: "This verse mentions Imam as general term for pray to Allah   not as imam who are appointed by Allah"

This is not a refutation, it is actually an admission. My argument is that not all Imams are necessarily divinely appointed, and that someone can become an Imam through prayer and righteousness. You just acknowledged that this is true.

Hence, Imamate is of two kinds: 1. wahbi and 2. kasbi

25:74 is the proof text for kasbi Imamate

You know full well he means the Imam which acts as a guide under God's authority, like the Prophet Ibrahim ((عليه السلام)) when he asked to be upgraded to an Imam, not an "imam" who does not have God's authority. Additionally he has given you the context several times thus making that clear. Yet you insist on sharpening your debating skills on forum posts not designed for formal debates and continue to play semantics... well, enjoy I guess =)

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5 minutes ago, dragonxx said:

You know full well he means the Imam which acts as a guide under God's authority, like the Prophet Ibrahim ((عليه السلام)) when he asked to be upgraded to an Imam, not an "imam" who does not have God's authority. Additionally he has given you the context several times thus making that clear. Yet you insist on sharpening your debating skills on forum posts not designed for formal debates and continue to play semantics... well, enjoy I guess =)

Incorrect. His claim was that there is only a single category of Imams, i.e., Imams that are divinely appointed. As for me, my claim is that there are two categories of Imams, Imams that are divinely appointed and Imams that are not divinely appointed.

He said he will prove that there is only the one category of divinely appointed Imams, and proceeded to quote Verses of the Quran which mention divinely appointed Imams.

I told him that this is not proof of his argument, because عدم ذكر (omission or lack of mention) is not a proof to deny the existence of something or to prove the exclusivity of something.

He answered by challenging me to cite a Verse in the Quran which proves my claimed second category of Imams, Imams that are not divinely-appointed.

I therefore quoted 25:74

He acknowledged that the type of Imam that is mentioned in 25:74 is not divinely appointed

I concluded that I have won the debate because he has admitted my position is correct (without realizing it though)

Let me also mention that the type of Imamate described in 25:74, although it is not wahbi or divinely appointed, but attained through prayer and righteousness, i.e., it is kasbi, it serves the same purpose of guidance, as the verse says:

لِلْمُتَّقِينَ إِمَامًا

"An Imam for the Righteous"

Meaning an Imam that acts as a guide and role model for the righteous.

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10 hours ago, Cherub786 said:

Imams that are not divinely appointed.

we have Imams that are leading people to Paradise that these Imams appointed by Allah but there is another group of Imams that are leading people  to hell that thedses Imams are not divinely appointed .

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