Jump to content
Guests can now reply in ALL forum topics (No registration required!) ×
Guests can now reply in ALL forum topics (No registration required!)
In the Name of God بسم الله
Sign in to follow this  
A_KazmiSayyid313

Apparent killing of ayatullahs for opposing ali khamenei

Rate this topic

Killing opposers of government  

13 members have voted

  1. 1. Do you think that ali khamenei killed people for opposing his government do you think it's righ?

    • I do think it happened and it's not right
      4
    • I do not think it happened and it's not right
      4
    • It's right and it did happen
      0
    • It's not right and did not happen
      5


Recommended Posts

Guest Molana Laddan

We Shia are followers of Prophet Muhammad (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) and Ahlulbayt AS. 

Here are a few examples from their lives in their running the government mode and keeping the mufaedden at bay:

1. Marwan, the son in law and cousin of Othman was banished for life from the city of Madina by our dear Prophet.
2. After the first two tribes of trouble making Jews were banished from the city of Madina, the third tribe who caused the breach of Madina city during the 2nd defense of Madina in Uhud, all of the men of the tribe were banished for capital punishment by our dear Prophet. A large pit was dug, and men were brought one by one to be punished by sword. 
3. During the taking back of Makkah by the dear Prophet, everybody else was forgiven but there were some eleven men and one woman who were ordered to be killed, “even if they were found to be clinging to the curtain of Kaba”. 
4. When Roman governor of Jordan killed the ambassador of the Prophet, he sent a small army in the leadership of most sincere Muslims. Orders for the army to never come back, and keep fighting till the end of the campaign or till the Shahadat of all of them. Jaffar Tayyar, the cousin of our dear Prophet was killed in this war along with some of the other diehard Muslims of that time. 
 

Now Imam Ali AS, our first Imam got government only for a few years, and in those four (to six) years, he had to fight three wars. 

1. In the battle against Kharjites (those who were opponents of Wilaya aka leadership of a human all together) were ordered to be “not even one to let go alive”. In this battle against Kharjiites, only seven of them managed to run away. The rest were all liquidated as were the orders of Imam Ali AS.

2. When in battle against Muawiah, he asked his soldiers to carry the pages of Quran on their spears, Imam Ali ordered to keep fighting, and keep hunting the enemies of humanity and Islam. He was eventually forced to stop the war when the stupids around him (some of them sound like most of us on Shia Chat in this thread) almost killed Imam Ali for not stopping the war, his words to Malik Ashtar, “either stop the war or you won’t find me alive here”. He had swords at his neck by some of his stupid apolitical soldiers to force him to stop the war, in which Muawiah was about to be killed. 

There are a few other examples from the government running lives of dear Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) and Imam Ali AS, but I think this should suffice. 
 

In our times, no ayatollah, no mullah, and no big head hotshot is worth more than the Shia Islamic government of Iran (the only Origen savior of Lebanon, Damascus, Najaf, Samarra, and Karbala). Had Shia Islamic government of IRI not been there, the Qaedas and ISIS had razed all what we Shia keep holy. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, starlight said:

P.S Brother, If I was wrong I wouldn't have minded getting corrected. I don't have a big ego.

But you are wrong, the term regime has a strong negative connotation to it, it is in fact how it is practically used. Take it from mike pompeo.

You really dont understand how disrespectful it is to compare seyyed Khameneis rulership to that of the abbasids as well as people who support him like the supporter of the abbasids?

"Disrespect to any Mujtahid, Marja' Taqleed, or religious authority will not be tolerated whatsoever."

Consider if what your saying, that seyyed Khamenei is a dhalim like the abbasid rulers, who were enemies of God, is considered disrespectful or not, if you dont have a big ego, I am sure you realize the answer.

A person who is more concerned with being liked than saying what is right is the one with the big ego and I am not the one who is ignoring others simply because I do not agree with them.

 

I also find it amusing that a thread like this who is creating rumors, which is a sin, has been given a platform to spread it instead of deleting it, further lowering the overall standards, and now, even when people agree that the rumors are rumors and that its nonsense, some are desperately trying to turn the subject into something else in efforts to feed their never ending IR phobia.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, Soldiers and Saffron said:

Regime has a largely negative connotation to it and in practise it is used to describe rulerships one does not agree with/do not recognize/intend to insult.

Yes, you are correct, it does generally have a negative connotation these days, but in terms of the definition of the word, it can apply to any government, so there is no need to jump on someone for using it. Rather give them the benefit of the doubt, and assume they didn't intend any negative connotation.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, Haydar Husayn said:

Yes, you are correct, it does generally have a negative connotation these days, but in terms of the definition of the word, it can apply to any government, so there is no need to jump on someone for using it. Rather give them the benefit of the doubt, and assume they didn't intend any negative connotation.

If a shia or even non shia refers to the rulership of amir ul mumineen(عليه السلام) as a regime, then I will jump on that because either A: they are ignorant of the use of the word or B: they mean to say that it was a regime. Either of the cases needs to be addressed in my opinion.

And as you can see now its case A, but I guess it makes no difference since we are going to pretend that in this particular case, calling his rulership a regime is not a negative formulation and neither is comparing sayyed Khamenei to abbasid caliphs disrespectful.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Guest Molana Laddan said:

some of them sound like most of us on Shia Chat in this thread)

If this web was not like them I would’ve shown the reality of the “sheikyan” and give them an end. And the reality off Sunnism. The sameway I show the trinitarians their reality of their pagan doctrine.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Soldiers and Saffron said:

I also find it amusing that a thread like this who is creating rumors, which is a sin, has been given a platform to spread it instead of deleting it, further lowering the overall standards, and now, even when people agree that the rumors are rumors and that its nonsense, some are desperately trying to turn the subject into something else in efforts to feed their never ending IR phobia.

Deleting the thread would give out the wrong message and be misinterpreted as 'hiding the truth' whereas leaving it open has clearly showed that the accusations were baseless. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, Mahdavist said:

Deleting the thread would give out the wrong message and be misinterpreted as 'hiding the truth' whereas leaving it open has clearly showed that the accusations were baseless. 

No expert sources have been provided so far, and no real discussion has taken place of these accusations (which presumes both an action and a motive), because nobody here has enough knowledge or expertise in this area. The burden of proof is on the accuser, not the accused. It’s just sprouting “I heard” heresay.

Could the people who voted “I think it happened” (think is an interesting word) provide any evidence for their opinion? Or should we brush these off as the obligatory Iran hatred that some people reflexively have?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Mahdavist said:

Deleting the thread would give out the wrong message and be misinterpreted as 'hiding the truth' whereas leaving it open has clearly showed that the accusations were baseless. 

Then perhaps it is time to lock this thread since some are not happy with the outcome of the subject of discussion and wish to discuss other subjects that they hope will have a more favorable outcome, then whoever wish to discuss something else, can make a another thread and do so.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
44 minutes ago, Soldiers and Saffron said:

Then perhaps it is time to lock this thread since some are not happy with the outcome of the subject of discussion and wish to discuss other subjects that they hope will have a more favorable outcome, then whoever wish to discuss something else, can make a another thread and do so.

We’ll give it a little more time for people to provide their evidence clarifying these accusations if they are truthful. Any other posts that are off topic will be hidden. If after a reasonable period of time, nobody provides anything, we’ll lock the topic.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Reza said:

We’ll give it a little more time for people to provide their evidence clarifying these accusations if they are truthful. Any other posts that are off topic will be hidden. If after a reasonable period of time, nobody provides anything, we’ll lock the topic.

Yesterday I asked for them to put the proofs but they are still stating what their opinions are

Yesterday they talk about house arrest now it's the 14 infallibles and the defention of regime:mod:????

Edited by HusseinAbbas

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

- Iran has committed XYZ crimes. Do you agree?

- No. You should provide solid proofs for them.

 - Do you think Iranian authorities are infallibles? There are just 14 infallibles.

Above is the process of various threads about Iran, from my experience here during the past years.

Because there are 14 infallibles, allegations against Iranian government are true, since they aren't infallible!!!

This is not how we evaluate matters, my dear brothers and sisters.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, Soldiers and Saffron said:

Then perhaps it is time to lock this thread since some are not happy with the outcome of the subject of discussion and wish to discuss other subjects that they hope will have a more favorable outcome, then whoever wish to discuss something else, can make a another thread and do so.

Fair enough. 

@A_KazmiSayyid313 I asked you before in this thread if you're willing to retract your accusations. This is the opportunity to do so. If no evidence is provided for your claims then we will lock this thread. 

Edited by Mahdavist

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 7/3/2020 at 12:07 AM, Mahdavist said:

Sayed Khamenei wasn't the leader at the time. 

Anyway, are we discussing murder or house arrest?

Please decide so that we can rename or lock the thread accordingly. 

Please keep the thread title the same. We don't want anyone to think Mods are censoring the OP. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ok here is proof time

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blasphemy_law_in_Iran#:~:text=Iran is a constitutional%2C Islamic,against blasphemy derives from Sharia.&text=Persecuted individuals are subject to,mistreatment%2C torture%2C and execution.

individuals are subject to surveillance by the "religious police," harassment, prolonged detention, mistreatment, torture, and execution 

Islam Does not permit what is in bold not for a death sentence anyway only for gathering information which would save other innocent lives but this is haram torture and mistreatment is haram. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, A_KazmiSayyid313 said:

Ok here is proof time

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blasphemy_law_in_Iran#:~:text=Iran is a constitutional%2C Islamic,against blasphemy derives from Sharia.&text=Persecuted individuals are subject to,mistreatment%2C torture%2C and execution.

individuals are subject to surveillance by the "religious police," harassment, prolonged detention, mistreatment, torture, and execution 

Islam Does not permit what is in bold not for a death sentence anyway only for gathering information which would save other innocent lives but this is haram torture and mistreatment is haram. 

Wikepedia is a source people should refrain from using, I have seen wikepedia get a lot of things wrong, even in the past they would put nonsense about islam it self, anyone can change and edit it, it is why many teachers for example don't accept wikepedia as a source.

What people here are asking is actuall sources so we can evaluate them and not a source where anyone can edit it.

It also does not help when the guy who wrote the page put american state funded sources as a reliable source on iran like annual us freedom of religion commission or NY times which has a bad reputation.

Edited by HusseinAbbas

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, A_KazmiSayyid313 said:

Ok here is proof time

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blasphemy_law_in_Iran#:~:text=Iran is a constitutional%2C Islamic,against blasphemy derives from Sharia.&text=Persecuted individuals are subject to,mistreatment%2C torture%2C and execution.

individuals are subject to surveillance by the "religious police," harassment, prolonged detention, mistreatment, torture, and execution 

Islam Does not permit what is in bold not for a death sentence anyway only for gathering information which would save other innocent lives but this is haram torture and mistreatment is haram. 

I must have misread your original post or your link.

Which ayatullahs did you say were murdered? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, A_KazmiSayyid313 said:

Ok here is proof time

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blasphemy_law_in_Iran#:~:text=Iran is a constitutional%2C Islamic,against blasphemy derives from Sharia.&text=Persecuted individuals are subject to,mistreatment%2C torture%2C and execution.

individuals are subject to surveillance by the "religious police," harassment, prolonged detention, mistreatment, torture, and execution 

Islam Does not permit what is in bold not for a death sentence anyway only for gathering information which would save other innocent lives but this is haram torture and mistreatment is haram. 

It is a bit dishonest to quote that because if you Google: is torture legal in Iran - most of the articles written to demonise Iran quote the Iranian constitution that state that it is illegal.

I'm not saying that no torture goes on, but it more likely to be at the behest of overzealous officers or even officials than to be ordered from the very top.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...