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In the Name of God بسم الله

Attack on tomb of Umar Bin Abdul Aziz

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Posted (edited)
45 minutes ago, Syed Ali Mehdi Shah Naqvi said:

Mufti Muneeb Ur Rehman has confirmed it.

Plus its famous all over the internet.IMG-20200529-WA0017.thumb.jpg.813450cea578bd0da39118f435ba943e.jpg

Lol. That's no confirmation. What would shia do this?

Edited by starlight
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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, starlight said:

Can anyone confirm the authenticity? And why would they do that? 

https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/20200528-tomb-of-umayyad-caliph-exhumed-by-militias-in-syria/

 

It appears to have happened, videos in the link.. This does not look good at all.

إنَّا لله و إنَّا اليه راجعون 

Edited by Moalfas
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There’s no proof that religious Twelver Shi’ites had anything to do with the desecration. First of all, Sunnis have a history of not only destroying and exhumating remains of dozens of famous people, be it Sahaba or Ahlul Bayt, they at times did it even to the people revered by their own school to blame the Shias. These kind of people won’t stop at anything. Secondly, Assad’s regime relies heavily on secularised Sunni masses for its manpower, majority of people fighting for him are Sunnis, then Alawites, not Twelver Shias. Besides, Assads are in power since like 50 years, why would now they decide to worsen their position by turning Sunni masses against themselves, it looks like a provocation to me. For example, when the great mosque of Hama was heavily damaged in 1982 uprising by the Syrian Wahhabis, after crushing the rebellion, Hafez al-Assad immediately restored and rebuilt it. When the Umayyad Mosque was heavily damaged in the fighting, after taking over Aleppo, Bashar immediately started renovating and rebuilding it. Secular Syrian regime has no reason to destroy any mosques or graves on its territories to antagonise Sunni masses even further. The last point made should be a clear one, Umayyad caliphs weren’t infallible and we hold them all, including Umar Ibn Abdulaziz, as usurpers and tyrants who took the rights of Ahlul Bayt. They hold no special place for us in any way or form. Abdulaziz usurped at the time of persecution of Imam Zayn al-Abidin (عليه السلام), and this whole situation just exposes Sunni hypocrisy where they love lay Umayyad caliphs more than the infallible Prophet’s family. 

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1 hour ago, OrthodoxTruth said:

There’s no proof that religious Twelver Shi’ites had anything to do with the desecration. First of all, Sunnis have a history of not only destroying and exhumating remains of dozens of famous people, be it Sahaba or Ahlul Bayt, they at times did it even to the people revered by their own school to blame the Shias. These kind of people won’t stop at anything. Secondly, Assad’s regime relies heavily on secularised Sunni masses for its manpower, majority of people fighting for him are Sunnis, then Alawites, not Twelver Shias. Besides, Assads are in power since like 50 years, why would now they decide to worsen their position by turning Sunni masses against themselves, it looks like a provocation to me. For example, when the great mosque of Hama was heavily damaged in 1982 uprising by the Syrian Wahhabis, after crushing the rebellion, Hafez al-Assad immediately restored and rebuilt it. When the Umayyad Mosque was heavily damaged in the fighting, after taking over Aleppo, Bashar immediately started renovating and rebuilding it. Secular Syrian regime has no reason to destroy any mosques or graves on its territories to antagonise Sunni masses even further. The last point made should be a clear one, Umayyad caliphs weren’t infallible and we hold them all, including Umar Ibn Abdulaziz, as usurpers and tyrants who took the rights of Ahlul Bayt. They hold no special place for us in any way or form. Abdulaziz usurped at the time of persecution of Imam Zayn al-Abidin (عليه السلام), and this whole situation just exposes Sunni hypocrisy where they love lay Umayyad caliphs more than the infallible Prophet’s family. 

It makes sense.

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Posted (edited)

I don't think that we can discount the possibility that it was some extremists somehow linked to the government or Iran - it would be interesting to know if the footage really was first shared on a "pro-Assad website" and in what context.

The area had been under the control of terrorist factions for a while, this would not be the first tomb that they had exhumed, there is also the possibility that the contents of the tomb were taken to Turkey who funded a lot of the militias in Idlib.

Either way there is no point jumping to conclusions until we have more evidence, so far it seems to be presented in a way to cause sectarian strife, a parting gift before the government retakes the remaining parts of the country under occupation.

Edited by Ali_Hussain
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Posted (edited)
9 hours ago, OrthodoxTruth said:

Umar Ibn Abdulaziz, as usurpers and tyrants who took the rights of Ahlul Bayt. They hold no special place for us in any way or form. Abdulaziz usurped at the time of persecution of Imam Zayn al-Abidin (عليه السلام), and this whole situation just exposes Sunni hypocrisy where they love lay Umayyad caliphs more than the infallible Prophet’s family. 

Salam wahabists & Salafis are enemy of Umar Ibn Abdulaziz because he stopped cursing on Imam Ali(عليه السلام) permanently & returend land of Fadak to Ahlulbayt (عليه السلام) after becoming caliph that because of his reforms & fear of returning leadership through him to our Imams , his cursed tribe killed him & took back land of Fadak but they couldn't  revive cursing of Imam Ali (عليه السلام) because of his reforms that until now Nawasibs are hating him so attacking to his tomb & accusing Shias & Asad forces to it by wahabists is rational.

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According to hadiths, Imam al-Baqir (a) referred to him as the nobleman among Umayyads.[43] Notwithstanding this, he believed that in spite of his justice, he will be cursed in the skies after his death, because he occupied a position that was only the right of Imams.[44]

Some scholars believe that Imam al-Baqir (a) adopted a compassionate approach to 'Umar b. 'Abd al-'Aziz.[41] Imam al-Baqir (a) charitably admonished him and warned him against consequences of injustice. He believed that such advice fitted the spirit of 'Umar b. 'Abd al-'Aziz who wanted to be just.[42]

Actions
Prevention of cursing Imam 'Ali (a)

Returning Fadak :Moreover, Umar b. Abd al-Aziz paid khums to Banu Hashim

Lifting the ban on the transcription of hadiths

Abolishment of taxes and jizyas

Dialogues with Khawarij

Compensating injustices

Death

Umar b. Abd al-Aziz died in Rajab, 101, Feburary, 720, in Khanaser at the age of thirty nine, and was buried in the Church of Saint Simeon Stylites,[45] which is located in Homs in today's Syria.[46] His mausoleum is located six kilometers from Maarat al-Numaan (a city in eastern Syria). A darih was built over it during the reign of the Ayyubid dynasty in the sixth/twelfth century. Some people believe that 'Umar b. 'Abd al-'Aziz was poisoned by Umayyads because they feared the loss of the position of caliphate if 'Umar stayed in power.[47]

http://en.wikishia.net/view/'Umar_b._'Abd_al-'Aziz

Edited by Ashvazdanghe
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15 hours ago, OrthodoxTruth said:

There’s no proof that religious Twelver Shi’ites had anything to do with the desecration.

There's ample proof that some Shias have been propping up and supporting a dictator. That's a big enough calamity in of itself. 

Bashar's forces have not long ago desecrated graves of 'rebel' fighters so instead of burying our heads in the sand, lets take some responsibility for propping up a dictator.

 

 

15 hours ago, OrthodoxTruth said:

Secondly, Assad’s regime relies heavily on secularised Sunni masses for its manpower, majority of people fighting for him are Sunnis, then Alawites, not Twelver Shias.

The Syrian Army was indeed made up of mainly Sunnis whilst Alawaites held the important high ranking posts, but that was before the events of 2011 after which many Sunnis turned against the regime. Now the main manpower is his own Alawaites propped up by Shias from Syria, Lebanon, Iraq, Iran and Afghanistan. These are all 'Twelever Shias'.      

15 hours ago, OrthodoxTruth said:

it looks like a provocation to me.

It certainly is a provocation and it's unknown when this happened or under who's control.

15 hours ago, OrthodoxTruth said:

in 1982 uprising by the Syrian Wahhabis, after crushing the rebellion, Hafez al-Assad immediately restored and rebuilt it.

They weren't 'Wahhabis', they were Ikhwan (Muslim brotherhood). Suggesting they were Wahhabis seems to me like trying to excuse a ruthless dictator going on a bloody rampage to stay in power.

15 hours ago, OrthodoxTruth said:

When the Umayyad Mosque was heavily damaged in the fighting, after taking over Aleppo, Bashar immediately started renovating and rebuilding it.

How kind of dictators to rebuild buildings after having taken away and destroyed countless lives to stay in power..

15 hours ago, OrthodoxTruth said:

They hold no special place for us in any way or form. Abdulaziz usurped at the time of persecution of Imam Zayn al-Abidin (عليه السلام), and this whole situation just exposes Sunni hypocrisy where they love lay Umayyad caliphs more than the infallible Prophet’s family. 

Whether a dead person was good or bad, There's no excuse for desecrating graves. Shias don't do this, nor should they have supported a dictator.

On the flip side, It's really astounding how some Shia are ready to disparage some Palestinians who love and support Saddam because he served their interests, yet they happily support another dictator for the exact same reason. That's not Haqq nor is it inline with Ahlulbayt's (عليه السلام) principles.

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Inna lillahe wa inna illahye raji'oon for shias in 'islamic' countries. This can lead to massive sectarian riots. In my country people are already calling out for revenge from Rafidhis and Shias. 

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Perhaps some of the daesh boys retreating were afraid that the shias would do their loved ones graves what they usually do to our loved ones graves and so they tried to "save" the one in the grave.

I hope the truth of the matter will be revealed soon, no point jumping guns before more information is found.

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6 hours ago, Moalfas said:

There's ample proof that some Shias have been propping up and supporting a dictator. That's a big enough calamity in of itself. 

And this supposed to mean what? We don’t have one, uniformed foreign policy. Iran supports Assad purely on geopolitical grounds, not religious ones. Iran can’t lose logistical corridor from Persia to Lebanon. Others disagree. Maraji’ of Najaf forbid believers from participating in Syrian conflict. Muqtada al-Sadr called for Assad to step down. Shias are not united on Syria. 

Quote

Bashar's forces have not long ago desecrated graves of 'rebel' fighters so instead of burying our heads in the sand, lets take some responsibility for propping up a dictator.

 

I’ve seen this video and again, there’s no proof that Shias were involved in any way or form in such. “Syrian” rebels have a long history of fabricating such and blaming the regime and “rafidah”. Even if that was true, they did the same time the graves of SAA soldiers. Last but not least, regime forces are based on secularised Sunnis and Alawites, not Twelver Shi’ites.

Quote

The Syrian Army was indeed made up of mainly Sunnis whilst Alawaites held the important high ranking posts, but that was before the events of 2011 after which many Sunnis turned against the regime. Now the main manpower is his own Alawaites propped up by Shias from Syria, Lebanon, Iraq, Iran and Afghanistan. These are all 'Twelever Shias'.      

That’s what Wahhabis and Western countries want you to believe. To this day majority of men fighting for Assad are secularised Sunnis, from Syria and abroad, and Syrian Alawites, not Twelver Shiites. Hence why some maraji’ ruled that there’s no jihad in Syria. Assad, to this day, is supported by many Sunni tribes who benefit from his rule, like al-Berri, al-Baggara, al-Hasasne and al-Zeido, and others. The Times of Israel reported in June 2014 that individuals interviewed in a "Sunni-dominated, middle-class neighborhood of central Damascus" claimed wide support for Assad among the Sunnis in Syria. In 2015, the Foreign Policy reported how Sunni Syrians not only didn’t abandon Syrian regime, but are its and armed forces’ main backbone. In 2018 The Economist reported that “the country has been led by Alawites since 1966, but Sunnis hold senior positions in government, the armed forces and business. Even today many Sunnis prefer Mr Assad’s secular rule to that of Islamist rebels.” It’s a geopolitical conflict, not a religious one. 

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It certainly is a provocation and it's unknown when this happened or under who's control.

Exactly, but that contradicts your previous statements.

Quote

They weren't 'Wahhabis', they were Ikhwan (Muslim brotherhood). Suggesting they were Wahhabis seems to me like trying to excuse a ruthless dictator going on a bloody rampage to stay in power.

The militancy of the 1980’s is described as a campaign by “Islamist militants”. Not all of them were Muslim Brotherhood members, some were following Wahhabism. Regardless of semantics, they all are Sunni extremists who wish to overthrow secular regime and replace it with a Sunni state in one form or another. “Ruthless dictator” went on rampage in the 1980’s after Sunni militants kidnapped Alawite civilians and started bombing civilian infrastructure. I can reassure you that if that happened in the West, for example the US, American government would of went on rampage to crush such groups as well.

Quote

How kind of dictators to rebuild buildings after having taken away and destroyed countless lives to stay in power..

There’s always civilian casualties in every conflict but unlike Saudis, Syrian regime doesn’t have a deliberate policy of killing of civilians. Antagonising masses would be counterproductive to the war effort. Buildings are being rebuilt to bring back normality to the liberated areas.

Quote

Whether a dead person was good or bad, There's no excuse for desecrating graves. Shias don't do this, nor should they have supported a dictator.

I understand your anger and bias against Syrian regime, but don’t issue your own rulings as religious facts. Safavids demolished numerous graves and tombs once they took over Mesopotamia. Abu Hanifa’s mosque and grave was destroyed for example, and it was sanctioned by some of the ulama. Various maraji’ issued fatwas for exhumation of bodies of Abu Bakr and Umar, so they wouldn’t be buried next to the Prophet ((صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم)). 

Quote

On the flip side, It's really astounding how some Shia are ready to disparage some Palestinians who love and support Saddam because he served their interests, yet they happily support another dictator for the exact same reason. That's not Haqq nor is it inline with Ahlulbayt's (عليه السلام) principles.

Agreed. Palestinians have no love for Shias or Iran, it’s all geopolitics. I personally belong to the camp that believes that we should focus first and foremost on freeing Shiites in Bahrain and Azerbaijan, and spreading dawah elsewhere (Afghanistan, Tajikistan), instead of spending khums money on supporting Hamas or Assad’s secular regime. However, we have no influence on Iran’s current foreign policy. 

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Posted (edited)
17 hours ago, OrthodoxTruth said:

And this supposed to mean what?

Allow me to use your name to explain this:

The Orthodox Truth is that supporting Batil is Batil.  

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Iran supports Assad purely on geopolitical grounds,

I completely agree here. The problem is that it was through religious overtones 'protecting the shrines' etc that they garnered sympathy and enrolled thousands of 'Twelver' fighters to keep Assad is power.

Quote

regime forces are based on secularised Sunnis and Alawites, not Twelver Shi’ites.

Had it not been for some 'Twelvers' and Russia, Assad would not have stayed in power. It's easy to say 'Shias didn't commit such crimes, it was the secular Assad forces that did', but Allah Ta'ala holds the criminals and their supporters/backers accountable. That is justice.

 

17 hours ago, OrthodoxTruth said:

I understand your anger and bias against Syrian regime, but don’t issue your own rulings as religious facts. Safavids demolished numerous graves and tombs once they took over Mesopotamia. Abu Hanifa’s mosque and grave was destroyed for example, and it was sanctioned by some of the ulama. Various maraji’ issued fatwas for exhumation of bodies of Abu Bakr and Umar, so they wouldn’t be buried next to the Prophet ((صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم)). 

Brother, desecrating graves is Haram full stop. I could care less whether Safavids or anyone else did it. Rasulullah's saww Akhlaq that we claim to follow are far from such acts. Only the Imam AJF has the authority and Hujja to say or do otherwise.  

 

 

Edit: My stance is regarding the whole Syrian issue, not specifically this incident as we do not know who did it or when it was done.

Edited by Moalfas
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It’s pretty sickening to see how people in here are justifying exhumation. Guess it’s warranted when a few pockets of the sect believe the savior will be doing the same. I personally find it hard to believe the Mahdi will do such horrendous acts when his Grandfather Nabi Muhammad pulled the Arabs out of burying their daughters alive and other vile acts.

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. First this is a civil war. It is a tit for tat situation. Just because person A claims to be from Banner 1 does negate the fact that they will behave immorally. The objective of mass media bias's are the result of not logic but money and sides. If rationality was used, then it would state that, the causation of war has desecrated whatever inch of ingrained thiestic humanity that many of the civilians had, which now has been lost to immorality. This is in affect now allowing irrational choices to be made to carry on the war as the destruction around them has made them lose sight of hope and revenge is the only answer. Perhaps the lack of real education before the war is allowing such deviation from rebuilding a functioning society.

None of you are in the war or have seen the horrors or have experienced war. If shias and sunni do create their usual online rhetoric, leave them be. Stupid people will always stay stupid it is incumbent upon those who know to concentrate on building life.

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Posted (edited)
14 hours ago, 786:) said:

It’s pretty sickening to see how people in here are justifying exhumation. Guess it’s warranted when a few pockets of the sect believe the savior will be doing the same. I personally find it hard to believe the Mahdi will do such horrendous acts when his Grandfather Nabi Muhammad pulled the Arabs out of burying their daughters alive and other vile acts.

Salam nobody here is justifying exhumation because definetly it's not Shia & Sunni practice but wahabists & Salafis have a long history in exhumation & destroying Tombs in muslim lands & humiliating of dead bodies of muslims but this time they attacked to tomb of a revered sunni leader then they spread false propaganda to accuse Assad's military & Shias to doing it same as their previous accusation about attacking to Khalid ibn Walid mausoleum & they cried crocodile tear for it but when they destroyed mausoleum of  companion Hijr ibn Adi nobody from sunni world condemned it because he was enemy of cursed Muawiah (la)

Shrine of the great companion Hijr ibn Adi destroyed and body reportedly exhumed

https://www.aimislam.com/shrine-of-the-great-companion-hijr-ibn-adi-destroyed-and-body-stolen/

 

https://middle-east-online.com/en/assad-army-destroys-historic-khaled-bin-walid-mausoleum-syria

Grave [Hazrat] Khalid Ibn Al Walid After Renovation

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d9ltjiMAbc8

desecration of holy shrine (hujr ibn adi) 04052013

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hKlDzXo9w1M

https://kashmirobserver.net/2013/05/04/shrine-of-sahabi-hujr-ibn-adi-destroyed-body-exhumed/

Sahaba Hujr Ibn Adi body (رضي الله عنه) - Subhanallah | ஸஹாபி ஹுஜ்ர் இப்னு அதி (ரழி) அவர்களின் உடல் (the body is not verified as him )

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6KbUs8NnOAo

 

Edited by Ashvazdanghe
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