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In the Name of God بسم الله

How to deal with big doubts in religion?

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Guest Abid

Sometimes I am doubting there is no god. Sometimes I am thinking it is not a personal god.

How do I deal with this? Please help.

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51 minutes ago, Guest Abid said:

Sometimes I am doubting there is no god. Sometimes I am thinking it is not a personal god.

How do I deal with this? Please help.

These lectures saved me from complete atheism....thiey are really short as well

https://sekaleshfar.com/lecture-series/gnosis-of-the-soul/

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Guest Pschological Warfare

فَأُلْقِيَ السَّحَرَةُ سُجَّدًا قَالُوا آمَنَّا بِرَبِّ هَارُونَ وَمُوسَىٰ {70}

[Pickthal 20:70] Then the wizards were (all) flung down prostrate, crying: We believe in the Lord of Aaron and Moses.

I believe in the lord of Muhammad al-Mustafa ( peace be upon him and his pure progeny) and Amir al-Muminin(Commander of the Faithful), Imam al-Muttaqeen(Leader of the Pious), Hujjah of Allah(عزّ وجلّ)(Proof of Allah(عزّ وجلّ), Imam Ali ibn Abi Talib(عليه السلام).

21 Ramadhan & 10 Muharram. Their life and Blood testifies to HIS(عزّ وجلّ) Lordship. 

Allah(عزّ وجلّ) directed us to Them, they take you to their Lord. Unless you are more knowledgeable than them. 

 man kuntu mawlahu fa `Aliyyun mawlahu

"For whoever I am his Leader (mawla), 'Ali is his Leader (mawla)."

If someone tells you, you can't think, tell them I think and based on my research and unbiased study I find myself to have hit a limit and beyond that limit is where they help me recognize the reality, I take them to be my Master. I follow them. 

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3 hours ago, Guest Abid said:

Sometimes I am doubting there is no god. Sometimes I am thinking it is not a personal god.

How do I deal with this? Please help.

idk where i heard this, i think it may be from imam al jaffar but i heard someone quote "a physician went up to the imam and asked the imam to prove that god exists. The physician asked him "if god exists can he put the whole universe in an egg without the egg or the universe changing in size?" the imam responded with "look around you, if allah can fit all the great wonders and mountains that you see in your small pupil, then he can definitely fit the universe in an egg""  

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, Guest Abid said:

Sometimes I am doubting there is no god. Sometimes I am thinking it is not a personal god.

How do I deal with this? Please help.

Whatever you see around you is created. If you know that these things are contingent (they need something for them to exist), thenthey require a cause to come into existence.

If these things require a cause then that cause can't also be contingent because then there's infinite regress - impossible. 

There is a cause which exists that does not require or need anything for its existence! When you've understood this, then you've just proven the existence of God who is the ultimate cause. It's nothing complicated, it's as rational as saying 2+2=4.

 

Edited by ali_fatheroforphans
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4 hours ago, Guest Abid said:

Sometimes I am doubting there is no god. Sometimes I am thinking it is not a personal god.

How do I deal with this? Please help.

Sometimes we try to find something (e.g. a house to rent or a potential wife/husband) and not able to see or get it yet.  Can we conclude there isn't a house or potential partner?  Maybe we are not looking at the right place or the method of findings are not well refined.

The relationship between God and us is defined as the relationship between "A master (Rabb) and a slave (Abd)".

You can find God by pondering at The Master or at the Slave.

1.  Look at yourself and compare it to the universe, other creations, how you existed, how weak you are in term of knowledge, actions, survival, planning...we cannot  even live without foods, communications, transports, agriculture.....  we are basically DEPENDENT on everything in the Universe.  If there is no Sun, the earth will be frozen and we all die, no animals, no plants...  We basically a slave that we are too dependent on all other things.  But, we are given free wils and intelligence to survive and to ponder.  We are a slave.

 

2.  Why everything in the universe is so organized.  The amount of energy generated by the sun just enough for living creatures on earth to flourish.  The amount of water on earth and how it is circulating through clouds and rains ,  to ensure all plants, animals and humans to live on... Who made and control of these to the exact measures?  Then we are looking at the Master (Rabb).

Hope that you find that there is God, and there must exist Absolute Wise, Powerful, Merciful, Creative, Intelligent God to organize everthing we see, hear, taste, feel...

All God wants from us is to submit to HIS Wise Directives...God created us and God knows what is good for us.  Where should we put our trust??

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Posted (edited)
10 hours ago, Guest Abid said:

Sometimes I am doubting there is no god. Sometimes I am thinking it is not a personal god.

How do I deal with this? Please help.

When we know nothing, we don’t doubt anything. As we begin to gain pieces of different information, we starting comparing one piece of info to another, and as we find differences or one current set of beliefs is challenged, we begin doubting the pieces of information we have.

In this sense, doubt has roots in knowledge as well ignorance, as it is a combination of both, doubts can only be removed with knowledge, however what if we may never know anything for sure? I just started this thread, it might help, i wrote it to help myself actually:

Edited by khamosh21
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I want everyone to watch this and pay attention, especially to Maulana Ali Raza Rizvi when he talks about the net. Its a lecture about the Imam of our time (عجّل الله تعالى فرجه الشريف) but really pay attention to everything that is being said.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ARFMPo1vsrM&list=WL&index=18&t=0s

 

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12 hours ago, ali_fatheroforphans said:

Whatever you see around you is created. If you know that these things are contingent (they need something for them to exist), thenthey require a cause to come into existence.

If these things require a cause then that cause can't also be contingent because then there's infinite regress - impossible. 

There is a cause which exists that does not require or need anything for its existence! When you've understood this, then you've just proven the existence of God who is the ultimate cause. It's nothing complicated, it's as rational as saying 2+2=4.

Rivers need rain or snow to exist. There is no need for the rain or snow to be conscious in order for it to rain or snow.

+1 and -1 exist... they equal 0

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Salam brother,

This is amazing news!!! Wait, am I really praising you for having doubts? 

Sometimes doubts are sent down as blessings from Allah to test your faith, will you weaken and fall, or will you push past these doubts and attempt to gain more knowledge. Other times, this is Shaytan whispering and attempting you to commit sins. Again, this is another great opportunity to build off of your doubts, and attain knowledge to strenghten your faith, build a stronger relationship with Allah, and increase your spiritually ranking. 

We all have doubts, we aren't Prophets of God, or Imams. And if anyone on here says they never had doubts, well they are lying. Doubts are blessings in disguise, and its all on YOU on what you do with it. 

Let me ask you a question, when you are thirsty, what do you do? You drink water!!! Likewise, if you have doubts, you should dive into the water of knowledge that is very easily available online, or better yet, ask a Sheikh at your local mosque. Like an Hadith in Al-Kafi says. "

Ali ibn Muhammad and others have narrated from Sahl ibn Ziyad and Muhammad ibn Yahya from Ahmad ibn Muhammad ibn 'Isa all from ibn Mahbub from Hisham ibn Salim from abu Hamza from abu Ishaq al-Subay'i from one who narrated to him who has said the following."I heard Amir al-Mu'minin Ali ((عليه السلام).) say, 'O people, you must know that religion becomes complete through seeking knowledge and acting accordingly. You must know that seeking knowledge is much more urgent for you than seeking wealth. In wealth every one's share is guaranteed. A just person has already divided the wealth among you. He and my sword guarantee you to receive your share. Knowledge, however, is stored with those who possess it. You are commanded to seek knowledge from its sources (those who possess it). You must seek knowledge.'"

H 39, Ch. 1, h 5

Also, try to examine the way of life you are living. Are you living a life of a muslim that prays on time five times a day, fasts, pays charity, and does all the obligatory acts... or have you been slacking off a bit. Remember sins add up, and as sins add up, Allahs blessings diminish. The heart slowly begins to build up a spiritual disease that often lowers your iman. This is why praying five times a day is wajib as it erases sins, and enables you to keep your connection with Allah. 

Reflect on this dunya! We are all living busy lives , and reflection time is often reserved for Ramadan. Reserve 5-10 minutes a night, or even a week to reflect. Reflect on life, ask yourself challenging questions, look at what this dunya contains ( the galaxy, night and day, water, earth, seasons, mountains, animals, etc). Then do your research. 

Also, open up the Quran and read it. Understand it, make it a part of your life, memorize it, love it. Also, open up Mafathih Al-Jinan and read some amazing dua's in their that highlight Allahs power, creations, and so forth. I'd recommend reading Dua'AAAUL-A'Adeelah, Dua Kumayl, and Joshan Al Kabeer- very very very powerful supplications that make your think/reflect. 

Lastly, look at the Prophets mentioned in the Quran, and the Imams. Amazing stories such as Prophet Musa, Imam Ali, and Imam Hussein. Whatever religion they followed, and made them into the personalities they are, I too want to follow that religion. 

Remember brother, this dunya is nothing but a journey. One day we are alive, the next, 6 feet under. Always keep this in mind, always reflect, and always ask questions. Like Imam Ali says " How poor is the son of Adam, he knows not his length of days, nor understands his sickness. The sting of a flea will make him suffer, he smelts of sweat and dies of cough".

Always brother, wish you all the best .

WS 

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10 hours ago, Unsapien said:

Rivers need rain or snow to exist. There is no need for the rain or snow to be conscious in order for it to rain or snow.

+1 and -1 exist... they equal 0

So what is your point?

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On 5/18/2020 at 12:53 AM, Guest Abid said:

Sometimes I am doubting there is no god. Sometimes I am thinking it is not a personal god.

How do I deal with this? Please help.

Lolz, a baby never gets birth without parents and this universe came into being without God. 

What is meant by personal god?

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33 minutes ago, Unsapien said:

My point is that there is no reason to think that however or whatever started off our universe that a conscious entity is required.

What do you mean conscious when you said "rain"? Do you expect it to breathe and have eyes or a brain?

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18 minutes ago, ali_fatheroforphans said:

What do you mean conscious when you said "rain"? Do you expect it to breathe and have eyes or a brain?

I was responding to a post where someone was saying that all things need a cause and then went on to say that this means that god must be the first cause of the universe.

Rain causes rivers, rain is not conscious. Things can be caused by non-conscious things. Similarly there's no reason to think that the universe needs a god in order to exist. 

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1 hour ago, Unsapien said:

My point is that there is no reason to think that however or whatever started off our universe that a conscious entity is required.

Unconsciousness does not and cannot beget consciousness. Lack of knowledge does not beget knowledge. Disorder does not beget harmony.

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4 hours ago, Unsapien said:

I was responding to a post where someone was saying that all things need a cause and then went on to say that this means that god must be the first cause of the universe.

Rain causes rivers, rain is not conscious. Things can be caused by non-conscious things. Similarly there's no reason to think that the universe needs a god in order to exist. 

This Universe does need god in order to exist. Something unconscious could not have brought this Universe into existence. That "thing" needed to have a will to bring this Universe into existence, to design it, to plan. It was an intelligent being, with a will and conscience; Allah.

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On 5/19/2020 at 12:01 AM, Ejaz said:

Unconsciousness does not and cannot beget consciousness. Lack of knowledge does not beget knowledge. Disorder does not beget harmony.

How do you know that unconsciousness cannot beget consciousness? None of the elements required for our consciousness are. We are made of carbon, hydrogen, oxygen and many other elements. Stop those chemical reactions and we stop thinking, or living for that matter. 

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On 5/18/2020 at 11:01 PM, Ejaz said:

Unconsciousness does not and cannot beget consciousness. Lack of knowledge does not beget knowledge. Disorder does not beget harmony.

Sorry I forgot to respond to the rest of your query. Lack of knowledge begets curiosity, which increases our knowledge, the more things we know, the more things we know we do not know, which increases our curiosity. So we investigate, to learn more and therefore learn more and increase our knowledge.

As for disorder & harmony, I see these things as just two sides of the same coin.

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On 5/19/2020 at 4:19 AM, KumayI said:

This Universe does need god in order to exist. Something unconscious could not have brought this Universe into existence. That "thing" needed to have a will to bring this Universe into existence, to design it, to plan. It was an intelligent being, with a will and conscience; Allah.

Really? This universe looks "planed & designed" to you? For what? Certainly not for us, for bacteria & viruses I guess it's more ideal, but even they can't deal with the vast stretches of spaces in between the stars and planets. We live in the universe of mostly nothing? And most of the "something" is trying to kill us, we can't even live on most of our own planet without our own ingenuity.  

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8 hours ago, Unsapien said:

Really? This universe looks "planed & designed" to you? For what? Certainly not for us, for bacteria & viruses I guess it's more ideal, but even they can't deal with the vast stretches of spaces in between the stars and planets. We live in the universe of mostly nothing? And most of the "something" is trying to kill us, we can't even live on most of our own planet without our own ingenuity.  

This Universe needs an intelligent being to bring it into existence, no other way is possible, not infinite, not eternal "thing", it has to be willing, perfect, necessary existent, Creator

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2 hours ago, KumayI said:

This Universe needs an intelligent being to bring it into existence, no other way is possible, not infinite, not eternal "thing", it has to be willing, perfect, necessary existent, Creator

Simply asserting something doesn't make it true. Nobody knows how the universe came into existence, so nobody can assert that it "must have happened this way".

I can't even say that a "creator" can exist, outside the laws of the universe, since we have no evidence that there is anything that can exist outside our universe.

 

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Ali (عليه السلام) Describes God .

Everything that is known through itself has been created, and everything that exists by virtue of other things is the effect (of a cause). .

He works, but not with the help of instruments;

He fixes measures but not with the activity of thinking;

He is rich but not by acquisition;

Times do not keep company with Him, and implements do not help him;

His being precedes time;

His existence precedes non-existence;

And his eternity precedes beginning;

By His creating the senses it is known that He has no senses;

By the contraries in various matters it is known that he has no contrary, and by the similarity between things it is known that there is nothing similar to Him.

He is not confined by limits nor counted by numbers;

Stillness and motion do not occur in Him, and how can that thing occur in Him which He has Himself made to occur; And how can a thing revert to Him which he first created, and how can a thing appear in Him which He first brought to appearance.

If it had not been so, His Self would have been subject to diversity, His Being would have become divisible (into parts), and His reality would have been prevented from being deemed Eternal. .

He would need completing only if shortage befell Him.

In that case signs of the created would appear in Him, and He would become a sign (leading to other objects) instead of signs leading to Him.

Through the might of His abstention (from affectedness) He is far above being affected by things which affect others;

He is that which does not change or vanish;

He has not begotten any one lest He be regarded as having been born;

He has not been begotten otherwise He would be contained within limits;

He is One, but not by counting;

He is everlasting without any limit;

He is existent without any support. —————————————————————

Extracts from Sermons 185-186 By: Ali ibn ʾAbī Ṭālib.

 

From: Nahjul Balagha

—————————————————————

‘He’ and ‘Him’ is used as a third person pronoun God has no gender.

—————————————————————

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Posted (edited)
12 hours ago, Unsapien said:

Simply asserting something doesn't make it true. Nobody knows how the universe came into existence, so nobody can assert that it "must have happened this way".

I can't even say that a "creator" can exist, outside the laws of the universe, since we have no evidence that there is anything that can exist outside our universe.

 

However few things are undeniable, notably that whatever this "force" is which we call nature, it follows "laws" - whether this force is intelligent or not, doesn't matter - and as such this force must be united/one that is impacting on the universe since the big bang - the expansion of the universe - down to every atom we know it is possible to deduce laws.

Conclusion - a single natural united/unity force is observable in the universe. What is the force? It's not nothing.

Edited by khamosh21
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12 hours ago, Unsapien said:

Simply asserting something doesn't make it true. Nobody knows how the universe came into existence, so nobody can assert that it "must have happened this way".

I can't even say that a "creator" can exist, outside the laws of the universe, since we have no evidence that there is anything that can exist outside our universe.

 

Also considering existence, nothing can exist outside of existence - if it did, it would be unobservable/unknown, thus nothing.

If we state there is "nothing" outside of existence, by it's very definition it is nothing, thus leaving us only with existence.

If we say there was something "before" existence, that too can be nothing, thus it is existence. If try to say there will be something after existence, that too is existence.

We can conclude existence has always been and takes different forms...?

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Posted (edited)

Why should i conclude that death is lights out, the flame is gone?

We are still barely understanding what consciousness/memory and our life experience is. Even looking at from a material point of view, if consciousness is generated by chemicals and the brain, it is some type of energy form - we don't know what this energy may possibly be converted at time of death. For example at time of sleep it transforms sometimes into dreams. Psychedelics for example can transform the energy. and medicines, and daily life continually transform it

Another way to look at it, many scientists today theorize the universe is simulation/hologram, many atheists scientists very much accept this theory. If the universe is a simulation, what is the source of simulation? It is conceivable that every that the entire simulation is then also being recorded...

 

Edited by khamosh21
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On 5/21/2020 at 5:27 AM, Unsapien said:

Simply asserting something doesn't make it true. Nobody knows how the universe came into existence, so nobody can assert that it "must have happened this way".

I can't even say that a "creator" can exist, outside the laws of the universe, since we have no evidence that there is anything that can exist outside our universe.

 

I am not simply "asserting" it. Please read online about necessary/possible existent, you will find that an eternal "thing" had to have existed for us to come into existence, with this, the eternal "thing" had to be intelligent, and have a will to be able to decide to create us. It does not work any other way. If the eternal "thing" did not have a will, it would not have randomly decided us to come into existence. But again, the truth is clear only for those who seek it. Please review evidences with an unbiased heart, and you will realize that God is the only thing that makes sense.

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On 5/21/2020 at 5:59 PM, khamosh21 said:

Also considering existence, nothing can exist outside of existence - if it did, it would be unobservable/unknown, thus nothing.

If we state there is "nothing" outside of existence, by it's very definition it is nothing, thus leaving us only with existence.

If we say there was something "before" existence, that too can be nothing, thus it is existence. If try to say there will be something after existence, that too is existence.

We can conclude existence has always been and takes different forms...?

The concept of Allah, is that Allah created time and space, and he exists outside of it. How can a thing occur in him, which he himself has made to occur! 

Yes Allah is eternal, his being precedes time itself. The Islamic concept of Allah, is that he is a perfect being, following this, he must be outside of time and space.

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Why not seek knowledge from the fountain that never dries out? 

Imam Jafar al-Sadiq (عليه السلام) debating an Indian atheist

Prophet Muhammad ((صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم)) debating atheists of Medina  

Quote

It is He who created you, and among you is the disbeliever, and among you is the believer. And Allah, of what you do, is Seeing. [64:2]

 

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13 hours ago, KumayI said:

The concept of Allah, is that Allah created time and space, and he exists outside of it. How can a thing occur in him, which he himself has made to occur! 

Yes Allah is eternal, his being precedes time itself. The Islamic concept of Allah, is that he is a perfect being, following this, he must be outside of time and space.

I think there a lot of strange questions that we just can't get answers for.

For example, how is God making decisions if He is unchanging? mainly questions related to His Reality, how He manages to operate out of time, etc etc...

I only wrote my understanding of things... thanks for your input.

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5 hours ago, khamosh21 said:

I think there a lot of strange questions that we just can't get answers for.

For example, how is God making decisions if He is unchanging? mainly questions related to His Reality, how He manages to operate out of time, etc etc...

I only wrote my understanding of things... thanks for your input.

I agree, that some things about the perfect Creator can never be understood by his creation. But I feel we should not linger around these questions, because it leads to confusion, and confusion leads to denial. May Allah protect our faith until the day we die, Inshallah. 

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