Jump to content
Guests can now reply in ALL forum topics (No registration required!) ×
Guests can now reply in ALL forum topics (No registration required!)
In the Name of God بسم الله
starlight

Does Disney believe in flat Earth theory?

Recommended Posts

3 minutes ago, 313 Seeker said:

Well your disrespectful tone and words are definitely not called for in any thread.

Neither are yours

11 minutes ago, 313 Seeker said:

just express your opinion without any substance, insult everyone who believes otherwise and ideally also mock

I did none of those things

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, AmirioTheMuzzy said:

Neither are yours

I did none of those things

Really? I am sorry if I came across as non-respectful. I definitely didn't mean that!

And whatever. You believe the Earth is a ball, and I don't. Let's move on. Let the other people enjoy this thread in whatever halal way they want.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, 313 Seeker said:

bashing people who believe otherwise

I take great offence to this, I would much rather bash the

17 minutes ago, 313 Seeker said:

mushriq or munafiq


I would give it the same treatment, but I really can't tolerate many of those threads.  :hahaha:

Note: I don't mean bash in a insulting way.

Edited by AmirioTheMuzzy

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, 313 Seeker said:

Let it GOOOOO Let it GOOOOO ... today my wife refused to watch that movie, so it seems I won't see it either. oh well .. let it goooo let it goooo .. 

It wasn't very good, in my opinion.  My eight year old liked it.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, AmirioTheMuzzy said:

I take great offence to this, I would much rather bash the


I would give it the same treatment, but I really can't tolerate many of those threads. 

no person deserves bashing because of an opinion. We can bash for actions. People with wrong opinions deserve peaceful, loving and clear education.

There is no compulsion in religion has the word ikrah that is translated as compulsion. krh is also hate. So we should not make munafiqs or mushriqs hate our deen by being haught, rude or immature in our speech. So if you think I'm a total idiot, then mocking or labeling or accusing will not enlighten me to the truth. And let us say hypothetically you are right and I am wrong. If you make me hate your point of view because of your way, then you are blocking my sabeel to Allah. You are blocking my path to the truth and carry responsibility for my ignorance, even though you know the truth. Get what I mean. I just want to have a good discussion and find information, and I love being proved wrong. I LOVE IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, 313 Seeker said:

no person deserves bashing because of an opinion. We can bash for actions. People with wrong opinions deserve peaceful, loving and clear education.

There is no compulsion in religion has the word ikrah that is translated as compulsion. krh is also hate. So we should not make munafiqs or mushriqs hate our deen by being haught, rude or immature in our speech. So if you think I'm a total idiot, then mocking or labeling or accusing will not enlighten me to the truth. And let us say hypothetically you are right and I am wrong. If you make me hate your point of view because of your way, then you are blocking my sabeel to Allah. You are blocking my path to the truth and carry responsibility for my ignorance, even though you know the truth. Get what I mean. I just want to have a good discussion and find information, and I love being proved wrong. I LOVE IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thank you for the reminder brother. I hope you forgive me for my actions. 

Sincerely,

Amirio

Edited by AmirioTheMuzzy

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, notme said:

It wasn't very good, in my opinion.  My eight year old liked it.  

I can imagine. The first one wasn't the greatest cartoon I've seen in my life. When I was younger I was obsessed with A Land Before Time, and then Lion King that I saw 5 times in the cinema.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, AmirioTheMuzzy said:

Thank you for the reminder brother. I hope you forgive me for my actions. 

I hope you forgive me too. You are welcome brother and I am terrified of Allah not forgiving me for so many sins, that I see your mistake - if it is one to start with - as tiny and puny as can be. I don't think you had any bad intentions.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, 313 Seeker said:

I hope you forgive me too. You are welcome brother and I am terrified of Allah not forgiving me for so many sins, that I see your mistake - if it is one to start with - as tiny and puny as can be. I don't think you had any bad intentions.

JazakAllah Khair

Wasalam

You didn't do anything wrong, but I forgive you.

Edited by AmirioTheMuzzy

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, AmirioTheMuzzy said:

JazakAllah Khair

Wasalam

w iyakum dear brother.

 

At your service 

walaikum asalaam warahmat Allah wa barakatu. may you be resurrected with Imam Ali in sha Allah, and may Allah raise you in His degrees day by day and moment by moment in sha Allah, and may anybody who reads this say ameen

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Walt Misery
2 hours ago, 313 Seeker said:

@AmirioTheMuzzy I have observed in conversations with you that you are intelligent. Why would you disagree with the concept of researching an issue, or studying both sides of a debate? That is all I am saying in my previous post. 

According to ancient Hindu cosmology the world is suspended on the backs of sixteen elephants standing on the back of a giant turtle. When they shift under the load it creates earthquakes. Should we research and debate that idea further in case the current theory of plate tectonics is a giant conspiracy theory to pull the wool over people's eyes as to the true nature of the world? Maybe I should stand on a corner wearing a placard denouncing Walt Disney and accosting passers-by to tell them that the Great Tokyo Earthquake of 1923 was caused not by the shifting of the Philippine tectonic plate against the Eurasian but was in fact caused by a gargantuan pachyderm the size of Australia who had flatulence?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, Guest Walt Misery said:

gargantuan pachyderm the size of Australia who had flatulence?

:hahaha::hahaha:

I thought the Earth was balanced on the head of a 'shesh nag' a giant python? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Walt Misery
6 minutes ago, starlight said:

:hahaha::hahaha:

I thought the Earth was balanced on the head of a 'shesh nag' a giant python? 

No. That is a fake theory put about by the underground reptilian overlords to discredit those who would question the doctrinal orthodoxy of plate techtonics. Surely their ways are both devious and numerous to retain secret control and keep Halliburton's stock price up.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
23 hours ago, 313 Seeker said:

Flat_Earth_The_Wonders_of_Creation.jpg.9b03bbe7780eefdb2219311d0689b690.jpg

There definitely flat Earth conception in Islam, but like many other topics there are people on both sides of the argument.

Here is a Qur'an analysis from the other side:

Flat Earth and the Qur'an

I found hadiths from ahl bayt referring to our world being the shape of a ring that is on a creature.

Word al-ard can mean the land or the Earth

Farsh : A wide, or,spacious, plain, or tract of land, or place

http://lexicon.quranic-research.net/data/20_f/082_frX.html

In geography, a plain is a flat, sweeping landmass that generally does not change much in elevation. Plains occur as lowlands along valleys or on the doorsteps of mountains, as coastal plains, and as plateaus or uplands.

Plains are one of the major landforms on Earth, where they are present on all continents, and would cover more than one-third of the world's land area.

Plains in many areas are important for agriculture because where the soils were deposited as sediments they may be deep and fertile, and the flatness facilitates  crop production; they support grasslands which provide good grazing for livestock.

What I think is Qur'an talks  about the plain Land on the Earth.

And the land we have made  it  plain.  51:48

He who made the land plain for you 2:22

 Mahad: plain, even, or smooth

 http://lexicon.quranic-research.net/data/24_m/183_mhd.html

 Have We not made the land plain? 78:6

 Who made the land  plain for you and made for you therein paths and sent down water from the cloud; then thereby We have brought forth many species of various herbs.20:53

 He Who made the land plain for you, and made in it ways for you that you may go aright; 43:10

 If we take al-ard  as  Earth in the above verses then it contains mountains and oceans  which can not be compared with bed or carpet. But plain land is like a bad or carpet.

So  the word   “Farash” & “Mahad”  have nothing to do with the shape of the Earth.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Guest Walt Misery said:

According to ancient Hindu cosmology the world is suspended on the backs of sixteen elephants standing on the back of a giant turtle. When they shift under the load it creates earthquakes. Should we research and debate that idea further in case the current theory of plate tectonics is a giant conspiracy theory to pull the wool over people's eyes as to the true nature of the world? Maybe I should stand on a corner wearing a placard denouncing Walt Disney and accosting passers-by to tell them that the Great Tokyo Earthquake of 1923 was caused not by the shifting of the Philippine tectonic plate against the Eurasian but was in fact caused by a gargantuan pachyderm the size of Australia who had flatulence?

Good you showed us that HInduism has a similar world view as Islam ..

Al Kafi Volume 8:

H 14591 – Muhammad Bin Yahya, from Ahmad Bin Muhammad, from Abdul Rahmaan Bin Abu Najraan, from Safwaan, from Halaf Bin Hammaad, from Al-Husayn Bin Zayd Al-Hashimy, who has narrated the following: 

 

Then hesaww said: ‘This Earth with what is upon it, compared to that which is below it, is like a ring thrown in the desert, and these two with what is within them and what is upon them, compared to what is beneath them is like a ring thrown in the desert, and the third one, until it ends with the seventh’. And hesaww recited this Verse: “[65:12] Allah is He Who created seven Firmaments and of the Earth a similar number”. The seven earths (firmaments) along with all that is contained within it and what is on it are upon the back of the rooster, like a ring thrown in the desert. And the rooster has two wings to it – a wing in the east and a wing in the west, and its legs are on the fringes of it, and the seven (firmaments) and the rooster and all that is contained with these and whatever is on it, are upon a rock, like a ring thrown in the desert. And the rock along with all that it contains, and all that is on it, are upon the back of the whale like a ring thrown in the desert. And the seven (firmaments), and the rooster, and the rock, and the whale along with that they contain and what is on them are upon the dark ocean like a ring thrown in the desert. And the seven (firmaments), 

and the rooster, and the rock, and the whale, and the dark ocean are upon the outgoing air like a ring thrown in the desert. And the seven (firmaments), and the rooster, and the rock, and the whale, and the dark ocean, and the air are upon the soil (Al-Sarayy) like a ring thrown in the desert’. Then hesaww recited this Verse: “[20:6] To Him belongs what is in the heavens and on Earth, and all between them, and all beneath the soil”. Then the information about the soil (Al-Sarayy) is terminated. And the seven (firmaments), and the rooster, and the rock, and the whale, and the dark ocean, and the air, and the soil (Al-Sarayy) along with all that these contain and whatever is on it, compared to the first sky is like a ring thrown in the desert. And all of this, and the sky of the world along with what is on it and what is contained within it, compared to that which is above it, is like a ring thrown in the desert. And these two skies and whatever these two contain, and what is on them, compared to what is above these two, are like a ring thrown in the desert. And these three, along with what is contained within them and whatever is on them, compared to the fourth, are like a ring thrown in the desert, (and it is like this) until it ends with the seventh. And these and all that is contained within them and whatever is on them, compared to the ocean hidden from the people of the Earth, is like a ring thrown in the desert. And these seven, and the hidden ocean, compared to the cold mountain are like a ring thrown in the desert’. And hesaww recited this Verse: “[24:43] And He sends down of the clouds that are (like) mountains wherein is hail”. And these seven, and the hidden ocean, and the cold mountain, compared to the air which the hearts are confused about, are like a ring thrown in the desert. And these seven, and the hidden ocean, and the cold mountain, and the air, compared to veils of the light are like a ring thrown in the desert. 

And these seven, and the hidden ocean, and the cold mountain, and the air, and the veils of the light, compared to the Chair (Al-Kursy) are like a ring thrown in the desert’. And hesaww recited this Verse: “[2:255] His Throne (Chair) includes the heavens and the Earth, and He is never weary of preserving them. He is the Sublime, the Tremendous”. And these seven, and the hidden ocean, and the cold mountain, and the air, and veils of the light, and the Chair, compared to the Throne are like a ring thrown in the desert’. And hesaww recite this Verse: “[20:5] The 

Beneficent One, Who is established on the Throne”. (And in the report of Al- Hassan) – ‘The veils before the air about which the hearts are confused’. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
42 minutes ago, elite said:

If we take al-ard  as  Earth in the above verses then it contains mountains and oceans  which can not be compared with bed or carpet. But plain land is like a bad or carpet.

Well the connection between Earth and mountains to our beds and carpets is much more far fetched than adding bodies of water to this. 

Le's look at some words:

Farashna .. that means spread and is still used today among modern Arabic speakers when it comes to spreading a table cloth for instance. I think all translators are in unison about this one.

Madad .. that you mentioned too

Bisaatan (example 71:19)

let's look at all the translations I could find ..

2051611792_ScreenShot2020-03-25at9_15_31AM.thumb.png.5e35e08db0b7a92eedbd71ba3a5fc69f.png

Taha (example 91:6)

Let's look how all translators translate that word

1399965016_ScreenShot2020-03-25at9_21_00AM.thumb.png.f3f4a844b4f2b0a84ea4dfa9b6f30b04.png

When you look at Suni hadiths, you will find they are in agreement with the above Shia one, especially with the whale part. 

Here I found a website discussing it from a suni perspective. (I know some hate this website called wikiislam, but maybe you can just look at the references and ignore the rest)

Did Muhammad and the Earliest Muslims know the Earth is Round?

So these suni hadiths are in unison with the Shia hadith and the Qur'an.

 

I think we can conclude from the Qur'an examples given by both sides of the argument, that there is much more evidence of flat spread-out world, with 7 layers below us and 7 layers above us, with the sky as a roof, than having the heliocentric model of today. To me anyway.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, MuhammadFreeman said:

People using religious arguments: Don't bother. Modern day flat Earthers don't come from a place of "my holy book says so", but rather from a place of "Our government lies to us"

Of the things that raise suspicion among some:

  1. Richard Byrd explores the Antarctic on behalf of the US government and states that it is full of resources and riches.
  2. After that they suddenly decide that Antartica is off limits for any kind of mining or permanent presence
  3. After Richard Byrd's last exploration called Operation Deep Freeze, he dies and the Soviets and US start nuking the atmosphere. The US operation was called Operation Fishbowl, with a missile called Thor.

Adding to the Darwinist evolution, and the whole LGBTQ mania + the "do as thou wilt" mentality initiated by the self-proclaimed beast 666 Alistair Crowly, and the heliocentric model, etc etc .. you just have more and more anti Bible/Qur'an beliefs that make people treat the religions of God as fairytales.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Walt Misery
2 hours ago, 313 Seeker said:

Good you showed us that HInduism [sic] has a similar world view as Islam ..

True Hindus following their ancient beliefs know that the world rests upon sixteen continent-sized elephants atop a planetary-sized tortoise. True, knowledgeable Muslims rely on a hadith that the Earth rests on the back of a gargantuan rooster standing on top of "a rock" bigger than the Earth itself which is carried by a whale bigger still that swims eternally through the reaches of the solar system.

You think that's a "similar world view"?

Gee, you've convinced me. How could I not be swayed by such logic and reasoning and clear similarity in the ancient holy sources? Thank you for unshackling me from the darkness in which I once dwelt.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, Guest Walt Misery said:

You think that's a "similar world view"?

Gee, you've convinced me. How could I not be swayed by such logic and reasoning and clear similarity in the ancient holy sources? Thank you for unshackling me from the darkness in which I once dwelt.

 My advice to you is first of all not to mock especially religious discussions. We are posting ahadeeth and Qur'an so let's have some fear.

Anyway, the point is that Islam and Hinduism both say Earth is flat and rests on bigger creatures. Just like all kinds of cultures such as Native American, Indian and Chinese talk about Earth resting on a turtle. 
If Allah wants something like this, then that is reality. Why not?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

By the way, I am not propagating flat Earth theory or anything. I am enjoying a good challenge to my beliefs, because that is the only way that I can grow and find out my own shortcomings. That is why I am answering those posts that talk about evidence for ball-Earth heliocentric models. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Walt Misery
1 hour ago, 313 Seeker said:

Ancient Egyptian world view. That red disk is the sun in its daily procession, being swallowed by Nut every day and given birth to in the morning.

1215946744_Nut3.jpg.5dcb10214b60891335e741046dd83912.jpg

Your mind surely encompasses a wide range of evidences for your suppositions. Walt Disney being a closeted Flat Earther, Alistair Crowley being an actual minion of Shaitan and not just a whackjob heroin junkie with a Cambridge education, planet-sized roosters balancing the Earth on their beaks like a cosmological parody of Charlie Chaplin in the Great Dictator, Admiral Byrd hiding Antarctic mineral wealth for the Illuminati, Copernicus' heliocentric model being patently false and now you're posting ancient Egyptian tomb paintings proving that sunrise and sunset are merely the Goddess Nut swallowing and giving birth to the Sun every day.

I reckon you put yourself into extreme social isolation about 30 years prematurely, buddy. On that one you were way ahead of the curve.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Wag1
6 hours ago, 313 Seeker said:

Al Kafi Volume 8:

Who said we should just accept any hadith? Where's the isnad?

And you shouldn't be taking that hadith literally. All these creation hadith and Qur'anic verses use metaphores. Further, with this hadith pertaining to the

5 hours ago, 313 Seeker said:

heliocentric model

you switched up the convo my guy. This is more believable than early Islamic sources believing in flat Earth, which had already been largely dispelled among the civilizations. From other narrations, it does seem that many a scholar believed in a heliocentric model at that time. Which may I add was largely disproved prior to the U.S.A & discovery of the Antarctic & NASA.

Anyways, check out these authoritative sources on the topic that paint a different picture than the one you're presenting:

Quote

“He has arranged the depressions and elevations of the openings of the sky. He has joined the breadths of its breaches, and has joined them with one another. He has made easy the approach to its heights for those (angels) who come down with His commands and those (angels) who go up with the deeds of the creatures. He called it when it was yet (in the form of) vapor. At once the links of its joints joined up. Then God opened up its closed door and put the sentinels of meteors at its holes, and held them with His hands (I.e. power) from falling into the vastness of air.

He commanded it to remain stationary in obedience to His commands. He made its sun the bright indication for its day, and moon the gloomy indication for its night. He then put them in motion in their orbits and ordained their (pace of) movement in the stages of their paths in order to distinguish with their help between night and day, and in order that the reckoning of years and calculations may be known by their fixed movements.

Then He hung in its vastness its sky and put therein its decoration consisting of small bright pearls and lamp-like stars. He shot at the over-hearers arrows of bright meteors. He put them in motion on their appointed routine and made them into fixed stars, moving stars, descending stars, ascending stars, ominous stars and lucky stars.”

(Peak of Eloquence, vol. 1, pp. 167).

 

«إنَّ الأشْيَاءَ تَدُلُّ عَلى حُدُوثِهَا مِنْ دَوَرَانِ الفُلكِ بِمَا فِيهِ، وَهِيَ سَبْعَةُ أفْلَاكٍ، وَتَحَرُّكُ الأرْضَ وَمَنْ عَليْهَا، وَانْقِلَابِ الأزْمِنَةِ، وَاخْتِلَافِ الوَقْتِ»

“Things indicate that its occurrence is from the rotation of the eclipses, with what’s inside of it, and they are seven eclipses, 
and the rotation of the Earth, and those whom are on it, and the inversion of times, and time difference.”

(Seas of Lights, vol. 10, pp. 166).

And it's an insult to our Imams & Rasul & they family & ancestors & they righteous companions & they righteous wives (alayhi salam, peace of Lawd a mercy fi pon dem) to use sites like WikiIslam. You could have (don't bother now) copy pasted the primary sources. Not their idiot liar interpretations. Wrath of God Almighty fi pon dem wasteman propagandists, if what I say about them is true, which I'm most certain it is.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Here is the oldest world map known to humanity, from the old Mesopotamian (now Iraq) civilization. Along with the ancient Egyptian one, they are known to be more advanced in mathematics (including geometry of course), architecture, astronomy, astrology and science than we are today.

Baylonianmaps.jpg.52e3500d345cb27710b3f9727a648aed.jpg

 

ancient-near-eastern-religions-iraq-and-iran-11-728.jpg.199c92d010abefaf947554283279c981.jpg

 

The mountains on the side that hold up the firmament remind of some early Muslim scholars narration about Mount Qaf. I don't know much about that and whether there are any Shia narrations about this, but could this be what Richard Byrd found in this last expedition, that ended up with US and Soviets nuking the firmament?

Edited by 313 Seeker

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Tayyab

Brother 313seeker, sorry I don't know how to tag someone since I have not posted here before.

Can you kindly give me more references from the Hadith and Qur'an as you have mentioned Al Kafi above? 

I am studying this topic also and I do believe in a globe Earth but I think we should learn all sides so I would be much obliged if you would tell me how you came upon these and share links to sources.

JazakAllah 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
24 minutes ago, Guest Wag1 said:

“He has arranged the depressions and elevations of the openings of the sky. He has joined the breadths of its breaches, and has joined them with one another. He has made easy the approach to its heights for those (angels) who come down with His commands and those (angels) who go up with the deeds of the creatures. He called it when it was yet (in the form of) vapor. At once the links of its joints joined up. Then God opened up its closed door and put the sentinels of meteors at its holes, and held them with His hands (I.e. power) from falling into the vastness of air.

He commanded it to remain stationary in obedience to His commands. He made its sun the bright indication for its day, and moon the gloomy indication for its night. He then put them in motion in their orbits and ordained their (pace of) movement in the stages of their paths in order to distinguish with their help between night and day, and in order that the reckoning of years and calculations may be known by their fixed movements.

Then He hung in its vastness its sky and put therein its decoration consisting of small bright pearls and lamp-like stars. He shot at the over-hearers arrows of bright meteors. He put them in motion on their appointed routine and made them into fixed stars, moving stars, descending stars, ascending stars, ominous stars and lucky stars.”

(Peak of Eloquence, vol. 1, pp. 167).

Thank you this is the flat Earth model I think I'll save this one. I am truly greatly thankful that over several years you are the first to bring more confirming hadiths.

 

26 minutes ago, Guest Wag1 said:

«إنَّ الأشْيَاءَ تَدُلُّ عَلى حُدُوثِهَا مِنْ دَوَرَانِ الفُلكِ بِمَا فِيهِ، وَهِيَ سَبْعَةُ أفْلَاكٍ، وَتَحَرُّكُ الأرْضَ وَمَنْ عَليْهَا، وَانْقِلَابِ الأزْمِنَةِ، وَاخْتِلَافِ الوَقْتِ»

“Things indicate that its occurrence is from the rotation of the eclipses, with what’s inside of it, and they are seven eclipses, 
and the rotation of the Earth, and those whom are on it, and the inversion of times, and time difference.”

(Seas of Lights, vol. 10, pp. 166).

Thanks for this too. It talks about an occurrence of something. What is that thing?

انْقِلَابِ

This word is most interesting in this context. Maybe once we know what is the subject, we can better discuss this critical word.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Wag1
2 hours ago, Guest Wag1 said:

it does seem that many a scholar believed in a heliocentric model at that time. Which may I add was largely disproved prior to the U.S.A & discovery of the Antarctic & NASA.

Mi mix up heliocentric wid geocentric

pardon

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...