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In the Name of God بسم الله
KarbalaWarrior

What do Shias think of taking non Muslims as close friends?

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Was there John, a Christian, in Karbala, who fought on the side of Imam Hussain (عليه السلام) against evil and died a martyr? If so, and if you believe this, then you probably already have your answer.

Edited by SoRoUsH

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1 hour ago, KarbalaWarrior said:

What is the Shia view on taking non Muslims as friends I know in Sunni its non recommended, but what is Shia view? is it different of the same? Any hadiths Marjara opionions?

My best friend at the moment is Sunni.

And among my best friends in the past, there was one atheist, one Christian, one Hindu, and two Sunnis.

I don't think there is any harm in taking anyone for a friend, as long as you don't allow yourself to be influenced by them.  

 

 

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It depends what type of people they are and what your definition of “friend” is.

Allah عز وجل says in His book in Surah al-Mumtahanah: 

لَا يَنۡهٰٮكُمُ اللّٰهُ عَنِ الَّذِيۡنَ لَمۡ يُقَاتِلُوۡكُمۡ فِى الدِّيۡنِ وَلَمۡ يُخۡرِجُوۡكُمۡ مِّنۡ دِيَارِكُمۡ اَنۡ تَبَرُّوۡهُمۡ وَ تُقۡسِطُوۡۤا اِلَيۡهِمۡؕ اِنَّ اللّٰهَ يُحِبُّ الۡمُقۡسِطِيۡ

“Allah forbids you not, with regard to those who fight you not for (your) Faith nor drive you out of your homes, from dealing kindly and justly with them: for Allah loveth those who are just.”
 

This is followed up in the following verse (both translations by Yusuf Ali, which are reasonably accurate)

اِنَّمَا يَنۡهٰٮكُمُ اللّٰهُ عَنِ الَّذِيۡنَ قَاتَلُوۡكُمۡ فِى الدِّيۡنِ وَاَخۡرَجُوۡكُمۡ مِّنۡ دِيَارِكُمۡ وَظَاهَرُوۡا عَلٰٓى اِخۡرَاجِكُمۡ اَنۡ تَوَلَّوۡهُمۡۚ وَمَنۡ يَّتَوَلَّهُمۡ فَاُولٰٓـئِكَ هُمُ الظّٰلِمُوۡنَ‏

“Allah only forbids you, with regard to those who fight you for (your) Faith, and drive you out of your homes, and support (others) in driving you out, from turning to them (for friendship and protection). It is such as turn to them (in these circumstances), that do wrong.“

These two verses and indeed the entire first 10 ayat of Surah al-Mumtahanah are good to go over brother. These verses are clearly addressing extreme circumstances, but if you actually be Muslim around them and they are hostile to Islamic beliefs, particularly social issues that people, even those who call themselves Muslims these days audhubi Rabi, would publicly abuse and shame you for (such as belief in the family, worship, nahi 3an al munkar w amr bil ma3roof) then they are not people to aid you towards jannah.

In Surat at-Tawbah Allah Almighty says:

يَا أَيُّهَا الَّذِينَ آمَنُوا اتَّقُوا اللَّهَ وَكُونُوا مَعَ الصَّادِقِينَ

“O ye who believe! Fear Allah and be with those who are true“

So for all intents and purposes having friends who are not Muslim is not haraam, but it is advisable to surround yourself with the saadiqeen (some Muslims might not be among them either). Remember your environment and acquaintances have an impact on your soul and to be careful with who you keep around you outside of kinship. This world is a hellhole and is not created for the believer.

Allah knows best and May He guide us all and give us tawfiq to gain His pleasure and become those of jannah.

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Assalaamun aleikum,

As br @baqar has mentioned, as long as yourw not influenced by them.

The problem I see is there's always the potential to be subliminally affected by them, kind of in a way that you don't really realize that you're being affected by them. It's been said we become like the three people we spend the most time with, and I can personally attest to this from before I was a Muslim, to after I became Muslim, so we ought to be careful with the quality of friends we surround ourselves with. I don’t see a problem with keeping company with pious Christians, Jews, atheists, Hindus, etc. Just guard you aqaed and watch the amount of time invested. We can all learn from each other, but we need to be able to discern TRUE knowledge from falsehood.

The other thing is, as Muslims, in order for people who are non-Muslims to consider Islam as possibly a religion they would be interested in converting to, they need to see and know us to some degree. So there's that element of it too. I guess the best way of putting it is just too operate under caution. If they have elements about them that are bad, then we should probably distance ourselves from them if they don’t start to gravitate towards our ways of doing things. (Assuming we are being good, pious Muslims on siratal mustaqeem)

Anyhow...

I'm still friends with a few women that I knew since I was 15 years old, (44 in a few weeks:ko:)but I keep them at arm's length, only occasional texts here and there to see how the families are doing. We really have nothing in common anymore. Completely different Lifestyles and belief systems. I am not of any benefit or help to them, and they are certainly not of any help or benefit to me.

W/s

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We are more likely to be influenced negatively by nonpracticising Shia friends , religious[ but woefully ignorant of religion] Shia family & friends than nonmuslim friends or Sunni friends 

 

Edited by Panzerwaffe

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On 1/22/2020 at 5:42 PM, SoRoUsH said:

Was there John, a Christian, in Karbala, who fought on the side of Imam Hussain (عليه السلام) against evil and died a martyr? If so, and if you believe this, then you probably already have your answer.

Did he die believing in trinity ? Jesus as God ?

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1 minute ago, SoRoUsH said:

I don't know. 

Well if he didn't believe in wilayah and tawheed then im sure many would argue hes got a one way ticket to the big H.

This is the same argument Sunnis use against Abu Talib (رضي الله عنه) 

 

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Friendship is for the sake of Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) and enmity is for His sake as well. 

One can and should have good and courteous relations with all decent people, but true friendship should be established on closeness to Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى). 

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1 hour ago, Panzerwaffe said:

Well if he didn't believe in wilayah and tawheed then im sure many would argue hes got a one way ticket to the big H.

This is the same argument Sunnis use against Abu Talib (رضي الله عنه) 

First, judgement is for Allah. We don't know what's in people's hearts. So, we shouldn't and don't judge. Ever. 

Second, we don't and shouldn't care what Sunnis say, in the same way that we don't and shouldn't care what Ismaelis or Khawarij or Jews or Buddhists or ... say.

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27 minutes ago, SoRoUsH said:

First, judgement is for Allah. We don't know what's in people's hearts. So, we shouldn't and don't judge. Ever. 

Second, we don't and shouldn't care what Sunnis say, in the same way that we don't and shouldn't care what Ismaelis or Khawarij or Jews or Buddhists or ... say.

 Well maybe we should apply the same principle towards Abu buker and umer maybe they repented right before they died so who knows?

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On 1/22/2020 at 6:10 PM, baqar said:

My best friend at the moment is Sunni.

And among my best friends in the past, there was one atheist, one Christian, one Hindu, and two Sunnis.

I don't think there is any harm in taking anyone for a friend, as long as you don't allow yourself to be influenced by them.  

 

 

I have a question on that, what if the friend is harming another Shia or Muslim or mistreating them and causing fitnah with him?

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59 minutes ago, Panzerwaffe said:

 Well maybe we should apply the same principle towards Abu buker and umer maybe they repented right before they died so who knows?

There's obviously a very clear distinction between these individuals and other people. 

We do not judge people. Ever.

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2 hours ago, KarbalaWarrior said:

I have a question on that, what if the friend is harming another Shia or Muslim or mistreating them and causing fitnah with him?

Then the friend is not a true friend and you should disengage with him.

Goes without saying, I suppose.

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3 hours ago, Panzerwaffe said:

 Well maybe we should apply the same principle towards Abu Bakar and Umar maybe they repented right before they died so who knows?

It is our understanding that it will be easier for God to forgive sins that are committed solely against Him.

But several factors come into play in evaluating an individual's repentance for sins committed other human beings.

As one example, if you do injustice to an evil person, your repentance has a greater chance of acceptance then if you did the same injustice to a godly person.

And in the case of Abu Bakr and Umar, their sin was against one of the godliest and holiest people who ever lived. 

So who knows what will happen?

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I have a lot of Hindus and Christians whom I talk to, most whom I met online or Reddit and telegram on my city's chat or weekend activities. They are very helpful to me. 

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On 1/22/2020 at 6:06 PM, KarbalaWarrior said:

What is the Shia view on taking non Muslims as friends I know in Sunni its non recommended, but what is Shia view? is it different of the same? Any hadiths Marjara opionions?

Well there is no problem making non-Muslim friends I have non Muslim friends from work but I keep my distance still I am not to close with them like visiting their homes or eat food prepared by them ...We Shias Consider Kuffars unclean we don’t even eat food prepared from their hand or eat in Their restaurants. its haram for us...on the other hand Sunnis are allowed tobe friends with them and they are also allowed to eat food prepared by their hands its halal for them ..I've seen all Sunni owned restaurants hire kuffars as cooks in their resturants and they eat in kuffar resturants too its all halal for them....

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17 hours ago, Panzerwaffe said:

Did he die believing in trinity ? Jesus as God ?

Salam no he died as a believer to Imam Hussain (عليه السلام) that it confirmed that Imam Hussain (عليه السلام) prayed for him to resurrect & to enter paradise with him .

 

12 hours ago, Panzerwaffe said:

Well if he didn't believe in wilayah and tawheed then im sure many would argue hes got a one way ticket to the big H.

This is the same argument Sunnis use against Abu Talib (رضي الله عنه) 

 

we believe that he will be in Paradise that is confirmed in all Shia Hadiths by our Imams (عليه السلام).

11 hours ago, Panzerwaffe said:

 Well maybe we should apply the same principle towards Abu buker and umer maybe they repented right before they died so who knows?

anyway even if they repented their repentance not accepted because Lady Fatima (عليه السلام) martyred while she was angry from them & she cursed both of them until her last prayer that Prophet Muhammad (pbu) said who makes her angry so he makes Prophet (pbu) angry from him & who makes Prophet Muhammad (pbu) angry is making angry Allah from him that is also accepted by all Sunni sources but they fabricated a story that Imam Ali (عليه السلام) made her angry to erase real story of  Lady Fatima (sa)  martyred while she was angry from both Caliphs.

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^^^ but again you rely on fallible individuals who narrated from infallibles

Narrations from fallibles recorded by fallible scholars 

So for all intents and purposes we are having the same issues as with Sunni muhadith just different chains , methods and names 

Edited by Panzerwaffe

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Depends on your definition of "freind"

This is on translation of the ayat

“Oh you who be believe!  Do not take the Jews and the Christians as protecting allies [lit. awliya – plural of wali, mistranslated often here as “friends” ]!  Each of them are protecting allies within their own.  And the one amongst you who turns to them as protecting allies, then he is one of them.  And truly, Allah does not guide the wrongdoing people.”  [al-Qur'an, 5:51]

I'd advice against making close friends as there way of life is very different.

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On 1/26/2020 at 10:16 AM, Guest said:

Imam Ali said "it is not the Jews and Christians whom are our enemies, it is ignorance"

Nice. Reference? 

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15 hours ago, Panzerwaffe said:

^^^ but again you rely on fallible individuals who narrated from infallibles

Narrations from fallibles recorded by fallible scholars 

So for all intents and purposes we are having the same issues as with Sunni muhadith just different chains , methods and names 

Salam in field of narrations we don't have other choice but we have holy Qur'an for examining narration that have clear verses about total obeying from  Allah & Prophet Muhammad (pbu) commands that three caliphs clearly disobeyed clear commands from Allah & Prophet Muhammad (pbu) that first two caliph also violated Dhawi_l-Qurba & Al-Mawadda_Verses. 

Quote
  • Ahl al-Bayt (a): according to the majority of Shi'a scholars which is close to consensus, "dhi l-qurba" in the Verse of Mawadda refers to Infallible Imams (a),[10] and according to others, it also includes Fatima (a).[11] However, there are many Sunni exegetes and scholars of hadiths who, in spite the efforts by other Sunni scholars to interpret "dhi l-qurba" as referring to Quraysh polytheists, have appealed to some hadiths to interpret it as referring to Ahl al-Bayt and close relatives of the Prophet (s), especially 'Ali b. Abi Talib (a), Fatima (a), their children, and so on. Such scholars include Ahmad b. Hanbal[12], al-Bukhari[13], al-Tabari[14], al-Hakim al-Nishaburi,[15] al-Zamakhshari,[16] al-Shafi'I,[17] Ibn Sabbagh al-Maliki,[18] al-Hafiz al-Kunji,[19] Ibn Hajar al-Haytami,[20] Shablanji,[21] al-Suyuti,[22] Muhyi l-Din al-'Arabi,[23] Ibn Kathir,[24] and al-Qurtubi[25]. For example, in his interpretation of the verse, "Then give to the near of kin his due", al-Alusi says: "it refers to Fatima."[26] And al-Zamakhshari says in his al-Kashshaf: "when the verse was revealed, the Prophet (s) was asked about his relatives the love for whom was obligatory for people. He said: 'Ali, Fatima, and their two sons".[27] Al-Fakhr al-Razi takes "dhi l-qurba" to refer to the household of the Prophet (s) and says: "the household of Muhammad (s) are those whose affair goes back to that of Muhammad (s). He who has a better, more perfect, and firmer relation with the Prophet (s) counts as his household. And undoubtedly, Fatima, 'Ali, al-Hasan, al-Husayn have the firmest relation with the Prophet (s). This is an obvious fact which comes from mutawatir hadiths."[28]

In his Sharh ihqaq al-haqq, Sayyid Shahab al-Din Mar'ashi Najafi mentions about 50 great Sunni scholars who have cited the hadiths regarding the Verse of Mawadda in their books.[29] Al-Sayyid Hashim al-Bahrani has cited 17 Sunni hadiths and 22 Shi'a hadiths in his Ghayat al-maram wa hujjat al-khisam.[30]

http://en.wikishia.net/view/Dhawi_l-Qurba

http://en.wikishia.net/view/Al-Mawadda_Verse

Edited by Ashvazdanghe

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On 1/22/2020 at 4:06 PM, KarbalaWarrior said:

What is the Shia view on taking non Muslims as friends I know in Sunni its non recommended, but what is Shia view? is it different of the same? Any hadiths Marjara opionions?

  1. Non Muslims or Kufar?
  2. Non Muslims, no problem in having Friends 
  3. Kufar are not friends of Muslims
  4. If non Muslim is your neighbor, its your duty to protect him, respect him, and watch over his property.
  5. if Kufar is your neighbor, its your duty to protect him, respect him, and watch over his property. ( may Allah protect us from such trial)

may Allah help and bless us all 

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On 1/27/2020 at 11:26 AM, Guest said:

I read this hadeeth from al-Islam in a book a while back so I don’t remember where I seen it and in the book the hadeeth was referenced I will try find it and give you the reference but I don’t have any idea where to even begin as it was a few months back

I will do my best to find it and reference it

No worries. If it's going to be difficult to find, I don't need it. I was curious. 

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Guest Meee

I don’t even understand the point of this question.

Do you live in a non-Muslim country? If so, then you will have non-Muslim friends. 

Besides, no one cares if you’re Muslim, Jew, Atheist, Hindu. People become friends when they build rapport and find topics of similarities, not focusing on differences. If we discriminate and keep our distance, then how is this different from racists and Islamiphobes who refuse to be friends with you based on how you look? Doesn’t feel very good, does it?  

And yes, my closest friends are non-Muslims because the Muslims I know, I can’t be friends with due to culture clashes. I’m very American... and they are too immersed in their own cultural biases to try and get along. 

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