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eThErEaL

Sexual Intercourse During Full Moon

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Just now, eThErEaL said:

I would just like to know the GRADING on such hadith.  
 

if you are not an expert of hadith grading then please don’t interfere. 
 

thanks

You have a brain , and reasoning. Grade it yourself.  You don't need me or anyone else to do it.

The evidence is there.  The Imam never said such garbage because he is not an idiot.  His ancestor and our Prophet was Highly likely conceived under a full moon.

If you know/believe the Prophet's birthdate is April 22, 571 AD in the Gregorian calendar.

Then the most probable conception window is July 28-August 1 570 , add less likely  days +- 2 days around those bounds.

 July 28-August 1 570 ,  hold a full moon or at least 90% full moon, with less likely days at 80%+

 

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28 minutes ago, Moalfas said:

The Hadith refers to conception times not births. 

You are not obliged to accept it, but I suggest not referring to anything you can't accept or comprehend as 'nonsense made up Hadith'. 

Our Prophet was conceived under a full moon, it is nonesense.

No one, not even the Imam would comprehend this because it is not authentic.

Knowing birth times can make it easy aproximate  the highest probable 4 day window of conception , with maximum threshold of 6 day window.   

Lunar calculations with today's advances in physics, models، and overall mathematics make it accurate well beyond 99.5% Accuracy thresholds.   

The greatest minds/people were conceived statistically/probably on both full moons and none alike,  and the worst minds and people in equal proportions after normalizing proportions.

"not referring to anything you can't accept or comprehend as 'nonsense made up Hadith"

I have an obligation not to do this with the Qur'an.

NO such obligation exists for one of hundreds of thousands hadith's floating around.

The modern world has uncovered causes with studies and evidence the causes of birth defects and miscarriages and their mitigation.

The causes are real and should be emphasized, smoking,  drinking  genetic issues, active infections etc.

This garbage Hadith puts us all back into Jahil and ignorance, ignoring real issues that are preventable with using sound and evidence backed recourse to minimize such outcomes like miscarriage and birth defects.

It diminishes real progress and generates negative impact with REAL consequences.  So please excuse my tone of disgust when reconciling this so called Hadith. 

Edited by wmehar2

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2 hours ago, wmehar2 said:

If you know/believe the Prophet's birthdate is April 22, 571 AD in the Gregorian calendar.

I'm in fact very interested to know how you reached this date, because If I remember correctly, there are several dates in our Islamic literature and no real consensus.  

Further to that, you seem to have built much of your calculations and assertions around this date?

 

2 hours ago, wmehar2 said:

Our Prophet was conceived under a full moon, it is nonesense.

??

No one, not even the Imam would comprehend this because it is not authentic.

Subhanallah the Imam (عليه السلام) would smile at this 

 

Quote

Knowing birth times can make it easy aproximate  the highest probable 4 day window of conception , with maximum threshold of 6 day window.   

Lunar calculations with today's advances in physics, models، and overall mathematics make it accurate well beyond 99.5% Accuracy thresholds.   

The greatest minds/people were conceived statistically/probably on both full moons and none alike,  and the worst minds and people in equal proportions after normalizing proportions.

"not referring to anything you can't accept or comprehend as 'nonsense made up Hadith"

I have an obligation not to do this with the Qur'an.

NO such obligation exists for one of hundreds of thousands hadith's floating around.

If there was a 1 percent chance of authenticity, I shall give it the respect that the Prophet saw and Imams (عليه السلام) deserve, until I can certainly and with 100 percent conviction say that no part of it whatsoever is from the source. 

But that's me. 

I would like to give your suggestions the attention and respect that I expect given to narrations and would like to hear the details of. 

And I would not refer to them as 'nonsense made up' 

but that's me. :) 

I will leave the rest of your theory for after I give the first part the attention it deserves.

Quote

The modern world has uncovered causes with studies and evidence the causes of birth defects and miscarriages and their mitigation.

The causes are real and should be emphasized, smoking,  drinking  genetic issues, active infections etc.

This garbage Hadith puts us all back into Jahil and ignorance, ignoring real issues that are preventable with using sound and evidence backed recourse to minimize such outcomes like miscarriage and birth defects.

It diminishes real progress and generates negative impact with REAL consequences.  So please excuse my tone of disgust when reconciling this so called Hadith. 

 

Edited by Moalfas
Typo

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I don’t understand what’s wrong here... the first hadith doesn’t say that your child will be crazy. The hadith simply states that people with severe mental illness project hyper behavior during those days. The Prophet is merely saying as a precaution to stay away from intercourse during those days as it is not for us (because the different energies), it’s the Jinn’s tradition to engage with their wives on those days.

The second hadith uses the word Yukhbal. According to Lisanu Al-‘Arab it can mean a variety of things, from having مس to being a simpleton. Some phrasing in the book sounds like it’s Autism, which has been scientifically proven that it develops in the womb, not post-birth.

الله اعلم

Edited by Ibn Al-Shahid

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in other versions of instead of jin , it refers to madness, leprosy, and organ failure

قَالَ يَا عَلِيُّ لاَ تُجَامِعِ اِمْرَأَتَكَ فِي أَوَّلِ اَلشَّهْرِ وَ وَسَطِهِ وَ آخِرِهِ فَإِنَّ اَلْجُنُونَ وَ اَلْجُذَامَ وَ اَلْخَبَلَ يُسْرِعُ إِلَيْهَا وَ إِلَى وَلَدِهَا 

Do not intercourse with your spouse at the beginning of the month and the middle of the month and at the end of the month, because madness, leprosy, and organ failure leads to her and her children.

https://hadith.inoor.ir/hadith/374906?SourceID=0&PageType=ViewTranslate&HadithID=374906&FilterGroupID=0

https://hadith.inoor.ir/hadith/312605?SourceID=0&PageType=ViewTranslate&HadithID=312605&FilterGroupID=0

 مرسل. قوله صلى الله عليه و آله: إن الجن يكثرون أقول: يخطر بالبال أنه إشارة إلى ما يقال: إنه يحصل للإنسان الربى من الجن و هو الذي اتفق ولادته في زمان ولادة ذلك الشخص، فإذا صادف زمان وطئ الإنسان زمان وطئهم تتوافق ولادتهما أيضا فيكون ولد الجن رئيا له و يورث خبله.

 
 

Mursal hadith from Imam Ali (عليه السلام) & Imam Kadhim  (عليه السلام). His saying, may God’s prayers and peace be upon him and his family: The jinn grows in abundance, and he points that it is a sign of what is said to happen to the human being, I.e., a doppelganger.when their timing overlaps on each other and birth of a human   is in same time of their birth too, so the born jin will be with him and causes harm to him and it's possible that just being with each other causes it. 

https://hadith.inoor.ir/hadith/114023?SourceID=0&PageType=ViewExplanation&HadithID=114023&FilterGroupID=0

https://hadith.inoor.ir/hadith/93775?SourceID=0&PageType=ViewExplanation&HadithID=93775&FilterGroupID=0

Mursal : The narrator has not heard it from the infallible, but has inadvertently or deliberately quoted it from him. Or a hadith that one or more of its narrators have fallen out of the chain of document 

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13 hours ago, Ibn Al-Shahid said:

I don’t understand what’s wrong here... the first hadith doesn’t say that your child will be crazy. The hadith simply states that people with severe mental illness project hyper behavior during those days. The Prophet is merely saying as a precaution to stay away from intercourse during those days as it is not for us (because the different energies), it’s the Jinn’s tradition to engage with their wives on those days.

The second hadith uses the word Yukhbal. According to Lisanu Al-‘Arab it can mean a variety of things, from having مس to being a simpleton. Some phrasing in the book sounds like it’s Autism, which has been scientifically proven that it develops in the womb, not post-birth.

الله اعلم

Based on my understanding, autism is a very complex phenomenon and seems to be related to a variety of factors: age of the mother, excessive prenatal levels of oestrogen, environmental toxins, microwave radiation, levels of aluminium, hereditary traits (that is, genetically transmitted), and quite possibly different combinations of influences that vary from case to case. There is circumstantial but convincing evidence that diet plays a role as well. Despite claims to the contrary, the link to vaccines is far from being disproven. (Japanese people are far healthier than Westerners, especially Americans, and the Japanese government does not mandate vaccines, including MMR. In fact, the very wealthy Americans who mandate ever-higher levels of immunisation while repeatedly labelling vaccine skeptics as “anti-vaxxers” themselves avoid immunisation.) Anyway, there is no evidence that autism was as or more common at the time of the Prophet than it is today. Among traditional societies, including those of Orthodox Jews and Arab Muslims, autism is far less frequent than it is in the post-industrial, developed West. So one should not assume per se that the hadith refer to autism. Given worsening diets (thanks to the rise of processed GM foods) and declining health due to ageing, drugged populations, it is plausible that autism is primarily a modern phenomenon. As a person with autism, I do not like to see evidence that I may be a product of jinn dating to the time of conception. That would be a form of ritual impurity.

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Guest Banglu

I though we are talking about the conception time of the baby (few hours after husband and wife meet), not the time of birth of the baby. 
 

All I know, the babies born in or close to the full moons seem to be one of the most blessed individuals.

Full moon = 12th - 17th of the lunar month, while 14/15th to be the height of it.

Here are those blessed ones. 

Prophet Muhammad sawaw - 17th of Rabi 1

Imam Ali as - 13th of Rajab

Imam Hassan as - 15th of Ramazan 

Imam Jaffar Sadiq as - 17th of Rabi 1

Imam Mehdi عجّل الله تعالى فرجه الشريف - 15th of Shabaan

 

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This is a wonderful topic you raised! Thank you and I am NOT joking. 

It all makes sense! Why do you think magicians care so much for the alignment of celestial bodies? Why do you think dates matter to them? 

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