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In the Name of God بسم الله

Al Kafi 5 and Women

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Which hadith in particular? I would say that we shouldn't consider every hadith to be the absolute truth. We're not like Sunnis who consider Sahih Bukhari to be error-free. 

But sometimes we may not apply reason and the tools for understanding a hadith properly. It's good to be careful and not reject it outright. Raising questions is alright but we shouldn't have this arrogant attitude of rejecting any hadith which doesn't appeal to us. 

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1 hour ago, ali_fatheroforphans said:

Which hadith in particular? I would say that we shouldn't consider every hadith to be the absolute truth. We're not like Sunnis who consider Sahih Bukhari to be error-free. 

But sometimes we may not apply reason and the tools for understanding a hadith properly. It's good to be careful and not reject it outright. Raising questions is alright but we shouldn't have this arrogant attitude of rejecting any hadith which doesn't appeal to us. 

[ 25372 ] 3 ـ وعنهم ، عن أحمد ، عن يعقوب بن يزيد ، عن رجل من اصحابنا يكنى ابا عبدالله رفعه ، عن أبي عبدالله ( عليه السلام ) قال : قال أمير المؤمنين ( عليه السلام ) : في خلاف النساء البركة . 

3 – And from them from Ahmad from Yaqub b. Yazid from a man from our companions who has the kunya AbuAbdillah going up from Abu `Abdillah عليه السلام.  He said: Amir al-Mu’mineen عليه السلام said: In contradicting (khilaf, variance, opposing) women is the blessing.

[ 25371 ] 2 ـ وعنهم ، عن أحمد ، عن الجاموراني ، عن الحسن بن علي بن أبي حمزة عن صندل ، عن ابن مسكان ، عن سليمان بن خالد قال : سمعت أبا عبدالله ( عليه السلام ) يقول : اياكم ومشاورة النساء فإنّ فيهن الضعف والوهن والعجز . 

2 – And from them from al-Jamurani from al-Hasan b. Ali b. Abi Hamza from Sandal from Ibn Muskan from Sulayman b. Khalid.  He said: I heard AbuAbdillah عليه السلام saying: Beware you of consulting women, for in them is weakness, feebleness and incapacity.

[ 25372 ] 3 ـ وعنهم ، عن أحمد ، عن يعقوب بن يزيد ، عن رجل من اصحابنا يكنى ابا عبدالله رفعه ، عن أبي عبدالله ( عليه السلام ) قال : قال أمير المؤمنين ( عليه السلام ) : في خلاف النساء البركة . 

3 – And from them from Ahmad from Yaqub b. Yazid from a man from our companions who has the kunya AbuAbdillah going up from Abu `Abdillah عليه السلام.  He said: Amir al-Mu’mineen عليه السلام said: In contradicting (khilaf, variance, opposing) women is the blessing.

I don't have citations for them but here's a link I found. 

http://shiaonlinelibrary.com/الكتب/1206_وسائل-الشيعة-آل-البيت-الحر-العاملي-ج-٢٠/الصفحة_180

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8 hours ago, tri-star said:

I have seen some pretty sexist hadith from al kafi regarding women being feeble minded, and not to consult women. Are these hadith true and what is the basis for them?

It relates to the wicked women, their mind is feeble and their consultation leads to destruction. So, take hadith by considering kinds of woman. Hadith are read in accordance with various other parameters.

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2 hours ago, Flying_Eagle said:

It relates to the wicked women, their mind is feeble and their consultation leads to destruction. So, take hadith by considering kinds of woman. Hadith are read in accordance with various other parameters.

Actually, it seems to relate, in general, to the fact that men, ceteris paribus, are biologically suited for the public sphere and women for the domestic. For this reason and others, there is a partition between the sexes (not “genders,” a postmodernist confabulation) in terms of sphere and interaction. For example, there are well-known hadith to the effect that women are not suited for high-level and/or visible political positions, since these are not their biological sphere and create a host of other complications that run contrary to Islam. That is why the ideal Islamic woman is submissive and restricted to training the Islamic household in terms of piety and upbringing. Cf. the standards that the Prophet’s wives were expected to abide by. Even in Iran, relatively few women follow the Islamic standards that will be incumbent on people at the advent of the Islamic world-government under the Hidden Imam. Simply put, truly Islamic behaviour is largely absent from the current world-order insofar as the matter of the sexes, their roles, and their duties/responsibilities is concerned. So the hadith in question does not seem to relate solely to “wicked” women, but to women generally.

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On 12/6/2019 at 3:36 PM, Ibn al-Hussain said:

If you are looking for 20th and 21st century politically-correct ahadith on women, you will not find them in Shi'a or Sunni books. 

Is it possible that our hadith compilers just copied from Sunni books?

Because our hadith books were written after our current Imam had gone into concealment in 256 Hijri.

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23 hours ago, Northwest said:

Actually, it seems to relate, in general, to the fact that men, ceteris paribus, are biologically suited for the public sphere and women for the domestic. For this reason and others, there is a partition between the sexes (not “genders,” a postmodernist confabulation) in terms of sphere and interaction. For example, there are well-known hadith to the effect that women are not suited for high-level and/or visible political positions, since these are not their biological sphere and create a host of other complications that run contrary to Islam. That is why the ideal Islamic woman is submissive and restricted to training the Islamic household in terms of piety and upbringing. Cf. the standards that the Prophet’s wives were expected to abide by. Even in Iran, relatively few women follow the Islamic standards that will be incumbent on people at the advent of the Islamic world-government under the Hidden Imam. Simply put, truly Islamic behaviour is largely absent from the current world-order insofar as the matter of the sexes, their roles, and their duties/responsibilities is concerned. So the hadith in question does not seem to relate solely to “wicked” women, but to women generally.

One of the excessive habit of female is overthinking that is why Aziz-e-Misr said: "The Makr (psychological traps) of women are great". Excess of everything is bad. If Allah (عزّ وجلّ) prevented you from something then it's for your own good sister, do not overthink and give it a bad shape.

:hahaha:

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1 hour ago, baqar said:

Is it possible that our hadith compilers just copied from Sunni books?

There is really no evidence for the fact that Shi'a scholars were simply mass-copying Sunni traditions and attributing them to the Imams. I've seen this claim made by some recent speakers in a means to avoid dealing with these issues, but this is nothing but a cop out. 

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2 minutes ago, Ibn al-Hussain said:

There is really no evidence for the fact that Shi'a scholars were simply mass-copying Sunni traditions and attributing them to the Imams. I've seen this claim made by some recent speakers in a means to avoid dealing with these issues, but this is nothing but a cop out. 

Is it a possibility that some reliable individuals really weren't? Some sought prestige and reverse engineered chains to the Imams based on commonly heard traditions or rip-offs of Sunni traditions? 

Is the Earth placed upon a whale? Does astrology impact real world events? Should we conveniently use colourful metaphors are what are otherwise , if taken at face value clearly incorrect statements about the Earth and universe and how things work, which coincidentally of course mirror ancient world myths and misunderstandings? 

Sunnis, with a far more rigorous process have got it badly wrong with most of their narrators. I'd say we have with a greater proportion than we'd like to admit. I don't know the truth and leave it to God though.

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14 minutes ago, Ibn al-Hussain said:

There is really no evidence for the fact that Shi'a scholars were simply mass-copying Sunni traditions and attributing them to the Imams. I've seen this claim made by some recent speakers in a means to avoid dealing with these issues, but this is nothing but a cop out. 

But what about the quality of the narrators?

Is it possible that there were fabrications by our narrators (intentional or not intentional) which escaped notice by the compilers?

After all, Shia narrators were not all saints. Were they?   

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6 minutes ago, baqar said:

But what about the quality of the narrators?

Is it possible that there were fabrications by our narrators (intentional or not intentional) which escaped notice by the compilers?

After all, Shia narrators were not all saints. Were they?   

One needs to prove this, otherwise its just a far-fetched possibility. The quantity of the narrations is too much and there are too many different narrators for someone to come and say everything was just made up, especially during a time when all of this was pretty normal in the Muslim world. I mean, what makes your argument that all of this could just be made up worth more than someone else just coming and saying all of the narrations on Imamah were also all just made up.

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21 minutes ago, baqar said:

If my understanding is right, every hadith passed through many different hands before it reached the compiler's desk.

I find it difficult to believe that everyone of those carriers was an absolutely honest person. 

No one is saying everyone who pops up in a chain was an absolute honest person, but you have to actually study the traditions and their chains to make this decision. Even though I personally lean to a very strict criteria for attaining conviction in the traditions, even then, the quantity and wide variety of narrators on this matter, which definitely includes honest and reliable narrators, gives one certainty that there was a general phenomenon as such even if the details of it may not be that convincing. Also there is this false idea that everyone was just orally transmitting traditions and hence every tradition was subject to the problem of "Chinese Whispers" - this is far from true. Many of the earlier companions had documented and written these traditions down and hence many of these names mentioned in the chains were not always orally transmitting rather they were passing down the book to the next narrator, or orally narrating and dictating from the book directly to the next person.

Even modern Muslim reformists don't deny the readability of these traditions and the existence of such a phenomenon. They take the discussion more so towards contextualizing, historicizing and questioning absolute nature of these laws.

Edited by Ibn al-Hussain
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People are viewing this through a contemporary lens. This is not how it works. Why shouldn’t men consult women during those old times? Because women were generally uneducated (not using this word in a bad manner). This is why religion studies is no walk in the park. It requires historical knowledge.

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On 12/5/2019 at 11:36 PM, Ibn al-Hussain said:

:salam:

If you are looking for 20th and 21st century politically-correct ahadith on women, you will not find them in Shi'a or Sunni books. 

Salam.

do we have Reliable Sunni Hadith about the Prophet (S) being “sexist”?

 

Edited by eThErEaL
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On 12/6/2019 at 3:39 AM, tri-star said:

[ 25372 ] 3 ـ وعنهم ، عن أحمد ، عن يعقوب بن يزيد ، عن رجل من اصحابنا يكنى ابا عبدالله رفعه ، عن أبي عبدالله ( عليه السلام ) قال : قال أمير المؤمنين ( عليه السلام ) : في خلاف النساء البركة . 

3 – And from them from Ahmad from Yaqub b. Yazid from a man from our companions who has the kunya AbuAbdillah going up from Abu `Abdillah عليه السلام.  He said: Amir al-Mu’mineen عليه السلام said: In contradicting (khilaf, variance, opposing) women is the blessing.

[ 25371 ] 2 ـ وعنهم ، عن أحمد ، عن الجاموراني ، عن الحسن بن علي بن أبي حمزة عن صندل ، عن ابن مسكان ، عن سليمان بن خالد قال : سمعت أبا عبدالله ( عليه السلام ) يقول : اياكم ومشاورة النساء فإنّ فيهن الضعف والوهن والعجز . 

2 – And from them from al-Jamurani from al-Hasan b. Ali b. Abi Hamza from Sandal from Ibn Muskan from Sulayman b. Khalid.  He said: I heard AbuAbdillah عليه السلام saying: Beware you of consulting women, for in them is weakness, feebleness and incapacity.

[ 25372 ] 3 ـ وعنهم ، عن أحمد ، عن يعقوب بن يزيد ، عن رجل من اصحابنا يكنى ابا عبدالله رفعه ، عن أبي عبدالله ( عليه السلام ) قال : قال أمير المؤمنين ( عليه السلام ) : في خلاف النساء البركة . 

3 – And from them from Ahmad from Yaqub b. Yazid from a man from our companions who has the kunya AbuAbdillah going up from Abu `Abdillah عليه السلام.  He said: Amir al-Mu’mineen عليه السلام said: In contradicting (khilaf, variance, opposing) women is the blessing.

I don't have citations for them but here's a link I found. 

http://shiaonlinelibrary.com/الكتب/1206_وسائل-الشيعة-آل-البيت-الحر-العاملي-ج-٢٠/الصفحة_180

Thats what omar and abu bakr said! Not the family of fatima, zainab, etc. 

In this case yazid had a pretty good argument against heeding advice of sayida zainab

Satanic hadiths, 

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On 12/18/2019 at 4:09 AM, eThErEaL said:

Salam.

do we have Reliable Sunni Hadith about the Prophet (S) being “sexist”?

 

Yes we do, many of them, but don’t call it “sexist” as that is disrespectful if the Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) said it.

Quote

بَابُ شَهَادَةِ النِّسَاءِ

Narrated Abu Sa`id Al-Khudri:

The Prophet (ﷺ) said, "Isn't the witness of a woman equal to half of that of a man?" The women said, "Yes." He said, "This is because of the deficiency of a woman's mind."

حَدَّثَنَا ابْنُ أَبِي مَرْيَمَ، أَخْبَرَنَا مُحَمَّدُ بْنُ جَعْفَرٍ، قَالَ أَخْبَرَنِي زَيْدٌ، عَنْ عِيَاضِ بْنِ عَبْدِ اللَّهِ، عَنْ أَبِي سَعِيدٍ الْخُدْرِيِّ ـ رضى الله عنه ـ عَنِ النَّبِيِّ صلى الله عليه وسلم قَالَ ‏"‏ أَلَيْسَ شَهَادَةُ الْمَرْأَةِ مِثْلَ نِصْفِ شَهَادَةِ الرَّجُلِ ‏"‏‏.‏ قُلْنَا بَلَى‏.‏ قَالَ ‏"‏ فَذَلِكَ مِنْ نُقْصَانِ عَقْلِهَا ‏"‏‏.‏

Reference : Sahih al-Bukhari 2658

In-book reference : Book 52, Hadith 22

USC-MSA web (English) reference : Vol. 3, Book 48, Hadith 826

  (deprecated numbering scheme)

https://sunnah.com/bukhari/52/22


 

Quote

Narrated Abu Sa`id Al-Khudri:

Once Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) went out to the Musalla (to offer the prayer) of `Id-al-Adha or Al-Fitr prayer. Then he passed by the women and said, "O women! Give alms, as I have seen that the majority of the dwellers of Hell-fire were you (women)." They asked, "Why is it so, O Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) ?" He replied, "You curse frequently and are ungrateful to your husbands. I have not seen anyone more deficient in intelligence and religion than you. A cautious sensible man could be led astray by some of you." The women asked, "O Allah's Messenger (ﷺ)! What is deficient in our intelligence and religion?" He said, "Is not the evidence of two women equal to the witness of one man?" They replied in the affirmative. He said, "This is the deficiency in her intelligence. Isn't it true that a woman can neither pray nor fast during her menses?" The women replied in the affirmative. He said, "This is the deficiency in her religion."

حَدَّثَنَا سَعِيدُ بْنُ أَبِي مَرْيَمَ، قَالَ أَخْبَرَنَا مُحَمَّدُ بْنُ جَعْفَرٍ، قَالَ أَخْبَرَنِي زَيْدٌ ـ هُوَ ابْنُ أَسْلَمَ ـ عَنْ عِيَاضِ بْنِ عَبْدِ اللَّهِ، عَنْ أَبِي سَعِيدٍ الْخُدْرِيِّ، قَالَ خَرَجَ رَسُولُ اللَّهِ صلى الله عليه وسلم فِي أَضْحًى ـ أَوْ فِطْرٍ ـ إِلَى الْمُصَلَّى، فَمَرَّ عَلَى النِّسَاءِ فَقَالَ ‏"‏ يَا مَعْشَرَ النِّسَاءِ تَصَدَّقْنَ، فَإِنِّي أُرِيتُكُنَّ أَكْثَرَ أَهْلِ النَّارِ ‏"‏‏.‏ فَقُلْنَ وَبِمَ يَا رَسُولَ اللَّهِ قَالَ ‏"‏ تُكْثِرْنَ اللَّعْنَ، وَتَكْفُرْنَ الْعَشِيرَ، مَا رَأَيْتُ مِنْ نَاقِصَاتِ عَقْلٍ وَدِينٍ أَذْهَبَ لِلُبِّ الرَّجُلِ الْحَازِمِ مِنْ إِحْدَاكُنَّ ‏"‏‏.‏ قُلْنَ وَمَا نُقْصَانُ دِينِنَا وَعَقْلِنَا يَا رَسُولَ اللَّهِ قَالَ ‏"‏ أَلَيْسَ شَهَادَةُ الْمَرْأَةِ مِثْلَ نِصْفِ شَهَادَةِ الرَّجُلِ ‏"‏‏.‏ قُلْنَ بَلَى‏.‏ قَالَ ‏"‏ فَذَلِكَ مِنْ نُقْصَانِ عَقْلِهَا، أَلَيْسَ إِذَا حَاضَتْ لَمْ تُصَلِّ وَلَمْ تَصُمْ ‏"‏‏.‏ قُلْنَ بَلَى‏.‏ قَالَ ‏"‏ فَذَلِكَ مِنْ نُقْصَانِ دِينِهَا ‏"‏‏.‏

Reference : Sahih al-Bukhari 304

In-book reference : Book 6, Hadith 9

USC-MSA web (English) reference : Vol. 1, Book 6, Hadith 301

Grade: Sahih
https://sunnah.com/bukhari/6/9

Similar ahadith in Jami al Tirmidhi and Riyadh as Saliheen


Note that we Shias have opposite hadiths saying most people in paradise are mustadh’af women.

see: https://www.al-islam.org/ask/it-is-claimed-that-a-majority-of-people-in-hell-will-be-women-is-this-idea-supported-by-the-quran-or-hadees

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The advancement of any society is indicated by the respect of the weak. First and foremost is the putting of the elderly, women and children on their heads as a crown. Secondly the minorities.

Such hadiths cause people in society to dismiss and arrogantly look down upon women, which creates an atmosphere reminiscent to the pre islamic arabia, where women had very little rights. Why give women rights and power, if they are apparently to lacking in faith and intelligence?

Such hadiths are like spiderwebs that one verse in the quran makes it like this spider web is bombarded with one of those iranian missiles that hit al Asad military base. 

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For discussions like this, I like to quote this verse:

Quote

Indeed the muslim men and the muslim women, the faithful men and the faithful women, the obedient men and the obedient women, the truthful men and the truthful women, the patient men and the patient women, the humble men and the humble women, the charitable men and the charitable women, the men who fast and the women who fast, the men who guard their private parts and the women who guard, the men who remember Allah greatly and the women who remember [Allah greatly] —Allah holds in store for them forgiveness and a great reward (33:35)

Quote

It is said that, after the return from Abysinia, Asma wife of Jafar Tayyar, wondered as to why there was no particular mention about women in the Quran so far revealed, then this verse was revealed. On several occasions the Holy Prophet had said that every Muslim man and Muslim woman must cultivate the following virtues:

(i) Faith, hope and trust in Allah, and in His benevolent administration of the whole universe;

(ii) devotion and service in practical life;

(iii) love and practice of the teachings of Islam in thought and intention, word and deed;

(iv) patience in suffering and constancy in right endeavour;

(v) humility, the avoidance of an attitude of arrogance and superiority;

(vi) financial help to the poor and less fortunate fellow-beings;

(vii) self denial,

(viii) purity in sex life, purity in motive, thought, word and deed;

(ix) constant attention to Allah's commands,

(x) safeguarding oneself against evil with full awareness of laws made by Allah.

Forgiveness and equal recompense are for both men and women. Refer to the commentary of Ali Imran: 195.

 

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You answered your own question brother.

4 minutes ago, Allah Seeker said:

Why give women rights and power, if they are apparently to lacking in faith and intelligence?

 

5 minutes ago, Allah Seeker said:

The advancement of any society is indicated by the respect of the weak

 
Btw, I’m not saying women are lacking in anything, I’m just saying that if they did, we would still give them rights :)

 

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On 12/6/2019 at 4:44 AM, tri-star said:

I have seen some pretty sexist hadith from al kafi regarding women being feeble minded, and not to consult women. Are these hadith true and what is the basis for them?

There are two kinds of women namely women who are feeble due to their worldly relations, this hadith is for them because there were women who stopped men of Kufa to stand along Hazrat Muslim ibn Aqeel (عليه السلام). 

Second type is a women feeble for Allah (s), they stand firm and encourage men to struggle in the way of Allah (s) like wife of Hazrat Zuhair ibn Qayn (عليه السلام). So, this hadith is not for them. 

Likewise, its prohibited to take advice from feeble minded men. 

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20 minutes ago, Strange Samurai said:

There are two kinds of women namely women who are feeble due to their worldly relations, this hadith is for them because there were women who stopped men of Kufa to stand along Hazrat Muslim ibn Aqeel (عليه السلام). 

Second type is a women feeble for Allah (s), they stand firm and encourage men to struggle in the way of Allah (s) like wife of Hazrat Zuhair ibn Qayn (عليه السلام). So, this hadith is not for them. 

Likewise, its prohibited to take advice from feeble minded men. 


What about these hadiths, they seem to be general:

 

Quote

So Rasool-Allah (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) said: ‘O you woman! That is a Judgment from a King, Just, Wise, and He (azwj) is neither tyrannous, nor does He azwj infringe, nor is He azwj biased. It will not benefit you (women) what He azwj has Prevented from you, nor would it incur a loss for you what He azwj Does for you. He azwj Manage the affairs by Hisazwj Knowledge. O you woman! (This is) because you are deficient in the Religion and the Intellect.


She said, ‘O Rasool-Allahsaww! And what is our deficiency in our Religion?’ He (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) said: ‘One of you sits half of her time not praying due to menstruation, and you are frequent in the cursing, and deny the Bounties. One of you remains with the man for ten years and more, and he is good to her and favours upon her. So when his hand is 

straitened for a day, or disputes with her, she says to him, ‘I did not see any goodness from you, at all!’

So the one from the women who does not happen to be this mannerism, then that is the one who is hit from this reduction, being a test upon her of her patience, and Allahazwj would Magnify her Rewards. Therefore, receive glad tidings!’
ُ
Then Rasool-Allah (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) said to her: ‘There is none from a man who is wicked except the wicked woman would be more wicked than him, nor from a righteous woman, except the righteous man would be superior than her. And Allah azwj has not Equated a woman with a man at all, except what was from the Equalisation by Allah azwj of Fatima (عليه السلام) with Ali (عليه السلام), and joining her (عليه السلام) with him (عليه السلام). And she (عليه السلام) is the most superior of the women of the worlds.


And similar to that is what was from Al Hassan (عليه السلام) and Al Husayn (عليه السلام), and Allah azwj Joining them both asws with the superior ones, the prestigious ones for including themasws in the imprecation (Mubahila). َّ
 

(al-Burhan, v1, p579)


 

Quote

Amir Al Momineenasws said: ‘Regarding His azwj Words If one of the two errs, so the other one should remind him – heasws said: ‘When one of them erred from the testimony and forgot it, the other ones reminds the other one with it, so they would both we straight in the giving of the testimony. Allah azwj Equated the testimonies of two women with the testimony of one man, due to the deficiency of their intellects and their Religion’.

Then heasws said: ‘Community of women! You have been Created deficient of the intellects, therefore preserve yourselves from the mistakes in the testimonies, for Allah azwj the Exalted Grants great Rewards to the male preserves and the female preserves of the testimonies

Source: https://hubeali.com/books/English-Books/TafseerHub-e-Ali/CH2_SuraAlBaqarah_Verses269-286_P12.pdf

@Allah Seeker How would you explain the testimony verse brother?

Edited by 313_Waiter
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@Allah Seeker Liberalizing Islam or secularizing the faith is not a way bro. It's just a satisfaction to the selves. Neither it is a disrespect to any of our dear sisters. If this letter seems offensive, their are countless narrations to describe the virtues and brilliance of woman. Also, commands are quite clear to even respect woman.

See this:

Letter 14: To his soldiers before the Battle of Siffin

Given to the army before the encounter with the enemy at Siffin 1

ومن وصيّته (عليه السلام)

لعسكره قبل لقاء العدو بصفّين

Do not fight them unless they initiate the fighting, because, by the grace of Allah, you are in the right and to leave them till they begin fighting will be another point from your side against them. If, by the will of Allah, the enemy is defeated then do not kill the runner away, do not strike a helpless person, do not finish off the wounded. Do not inflict pain on women even though they may attack your honour with filthy words and abuse your officers, because they are weak in character, mind and intelligence. We have been ordered to desist from them although they may be unbelievers. Even in the pre-Islamic (al-jahiliyyah) period if a man struck a woman with a stone or a stick he was rebuked along with his offspring after him.

لاَ تُقَاتِلُوهُمْ حَتَّى يَبْدَأُوكُمْ، فَإِنَّكُمْ بِحَمْدِ اللهِ عَلَى حُجَّة، وَتَرْكُكُمْ إِيَّاهُمْ حَتَّى يَبْدَأُوكُمْ حُجَّةٌ أُخْرَى لَكُمْ عَلَيْهِمْ، فَإذَا كَانَتِ الْهَزِيمَةُ بِإذْنِ اللهِ فَلاَ تَقْتُلُوا مُدْبِراً، وَلاَ تُصيِبُوا مُعْوِراً، وَلاَ تُجْهِزُوا عَلَى جَرِيح،لاَ تَهِيجُوا النِّسَاءَ بِأَذىً، وَإِنْ شَتَمْنَ أَعْرَاضَكُمْ، وَسَبَبْنَ أُمَرَاءَكُمْ، فَإِنَّهُنَّ ضَعِيفَاتُ الْقُوَى وَالاْنْفُسِ وَالْعُقُولِ، إِنْ كُنَّا لَنُؤْمَرُ بِالْكَفِّ عَنْهُنَّ وَإِنَّهُنَّ لَمُشْرِكَاتٌ، وَإِنْ كَانَ الرَّجُلُ لَيَتَنَاوَلُ الْمَرْأَةَ فِي الْجَاهِلِيَّةِ بِالْفِهْرِ أَوِ الْهِ

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On 12/6/2019 at 1:39 AM, tri-star said:

[ 25372 ] 3 ـ وعنهم ، عن أحمد ، عن يعقوب بن يزيد ، عن رجل من اصحابنا يكنى ابا عبدالله رفعه ، عن أبي عبدالله ( عليه السلام ) قال : قال أمير المؤمنين ( عليه السلام ) : في خلاف النساء البركة . 

3 – And from them from Ahmad from Yaqub b. Yazid from a man from our companions who has the kunya AbuAbdillah going up from Abu `Abdillah عليه السلام.  He said: Amir al-Mu’mineen عليه السلام said: In contradicting (khilaf, variance, opposing) women is the blessing.

[ 25371 ] 2 ـ وعنهم ، عن أحمد ، عن الجاموراني ، عن الحسن بن علي بن أبي حمزة عن صندل ، عن ابن مسكان ، عن سليمان بن خالد قال : سمعت أبا عبدالله ( عليه السلام ) يقول : اياكم ومشاورة النساء فإنّ فيهن الضعف والوهن والعجز . 

2 – And from them from al-Jamurani from al-Hasan b. Ali b. Abi Hamza from Sandal from Ibn Muskan from Sulayman b. Khalid.  He said: I heard AbuAbdillah عليه السلام saying: Beware you of consulting women, for in them is weakness, feebleness and incapacity.

[ 25372 ] 3 ـ وعنهم ، عن أحمد ، عن يعقوب بن يزيد ، عن رجل من اصحابنا يكنى ابا عبدالله رفعه ، عن أبي عبدالله ( عليه السلام ) قال : قال أمير المؤمنين ( عليه السلام ) : في خلاف النساء البركة . 

3 – And from them from Ahmad from Yaqub b. Yazid from a man from our companions who has the kunya AbuAbdillah going up from Abu `Abdillah عليه السلام.  He said: Amir al-Mu’mineen عليه السلام said: In contradicting (khilaf, variance, opposing) women is the blessing.

I don't have citations for them but here's a link I found. 

http://shiaonlinelibrary.com/الكتب/1206_وسائل-الشيعة-آل-البيت-الحر-العاملي-ج-٢٠/الصفحة_180

Put it to the test.

Spend 3 months consulting your wife/wives on everything and follow their advice. 

Then spend 3 month doing what you think is best.

Compare the two periods.

 

 

Edited by Warilla
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Just now, Warilla said:

Put it to the test.

Spend 3 months consulting your wife/wives on everything and follow their advice. 

Then spend 3 month doing what you think is best.

Compare the two periods.

 

 

Btw it's impossible to do this experiment as you will be a mental wreck after the first 3 months :grin:

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2 hours ago, 313_Waiter said:


 


What about these hadiths, they seem to be general:

 


 

Source: https://hubeali.com/books/English-Books/TafseerHub-e-Ali/CH2_SuraAlBaqarah_Verses269-286_P12.pdf

@Allah Seeker How would you explain the testimony verse brother?

When Allah (s) speaks about deficiencies does He (s) says that since you are deficient so you are lesser in degree? 

1. An example: - An infant is deficient to pray or fast so is he less dignified than an adult who prays ? If an infant dies, does he be questioned why he didn't worship and will the person who is adult be allowed to paradise although he was not deficient. I am deficient as compared to Imran Khan so will i be asked questions like he be asked? Im fortunate im deficient and not a ruler lolz. 

2. No women is equal to men thats true sometimes a woman excel over man and sometimes she lags behind. So, can you call them equal? 

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2 minutes ago, Strange Samurai said:

When Allah (s) speaks about deficiencies does He (s) says that since you are deficient so you are lesser in degree?

This is a very good point. I salute you my friend.

 

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@313_Waiterabout wicked women and righteous me. This seems to be inconsistent because what history says is against it or it left out a part. Women is seen more strong in emotions. So, Sometimes, a righteous women assisted a doubting believer to goodness. But, in case of wickedness since her emotions are strong, she could be a hell of trouble for men. See Hind mother of Muawiya went two steps ahead  But for goodness see the first martyr or women who made their men residents of heaven.

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