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In the Name of God بسم الله
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Mzwakhe

Ya HuWa (Oh He)

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salam alykum wrwb,

is it safe to think thoughts about the existence of or non in terms of Jehovah's witnesses being not real.

They are called Jehovah's witnesses & the word Jehovah is said to be actually Ya HuWa & not Jehovah.

not bothered by JW & have no ill motives against them, just that title that's all.

ws

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On 12/5/2019 at 2:30 PM, Mzwakhe said:

salam alykum wrwb,

is it safe to think thoughts about the existence of or non in terms of Jehovah's witnesses being not real.

They are called Jehovah's witnesses & the word Jehovah is said to be actually Ya HuWa & not Jehovah.

not bothered by JW & have no ill motives against them, just that title that's all.

ws

Jehovah's witnesses are an extra monotheistic branch of Christianity. They follow the same Bible, old and new testaments but add italics and footnotes that are different than mainstream. Of course every other Christian group rejects them because to them Jesus is a Prophet, not God. They have a few strange beliefs but I don't think they're dangerous to their salvation. 
As with every religion, there are people who are real, and those who follow, go through the motions. I think you could have a deep meaningful conversation with them if you stick to similarities. Just remember, their job is to convert you.

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On 12/5/2019 at 4:30 PM, Mzwakhe said:

is it safe to think thoughts about the existence of or non in terms of Jehovah's witnesses being not real.

They are called Jehovah's witnesses & the word Jehovah is said to be actually Ya HuWa & not Jehovah.

Salams,

Addressing just how the tetragrammaton might be pronounced and not the argument you might be trying to get at -- because I'm not exactly sure what it is. There's two popular suggestions and the theory of Jehovah (or Yehowa for that matter) isn't one of them. Jehovah is a reading of the way the tetragrammaton is commonly vocalized, יְהֹוָה, with a schwa under the first yodh, a holam after the first he, and a qames gadhol under the second yodh. This however is what might be referred to as a qere in the study of the Hebrew text, it's an intended reading different from the written word (the kethib) indicated by its vowels. A common instance of this in the vocalization of the pronoun hu (he) as hiw (nonsense) to indicate reading it as hi (she), this is due to the practices of the Masoretic reading tradition. YHWH being vocalized as the Hebrew word "Adonay" (literally, "my Lords", a pluralis maiestatis -- often translated as the LORD) is a sort of qere since the vowels are indicating a different pronunciation. The vowels of Adonay are a (patah compound-)shwa, holam, then a qames gadhol, the same as the tetragrammaton. So Jehovah is not how the name is intended to be pronounced by the vowels are meant to remind the reader to say Adonay, less commonly Elohenu, and often nowadays Jews say hash-shem (the name).

Now, the correct vocalization of the name is definitely not Yahuwa either -- if that was the implication. You'll commonly see it written as Yahweh, and there is some weight to that theory. In compound names you often find the name of God as "yah" or "yahu", e.g., Elijah/Eliyahu (My God is Yahu), or Abijah/Abiya (My father is Yah), and, famously, Hallelujah (Praise ye all Yah!). You also have some extrabiblical evidence, e.g. a Phoenecian inscription saying El Du Yahwi Seba'ot. El who creates the armies. You also have evidence in the Septuagint, the tetragrammaton is written ιαω (iao). Alternatively, and a theory I personally am drawn to, is that it was pronounced like Yihweh. When Moses speaks to the burning bush and asks its name, God answers ehye asher ehye (I am who I am/I will be who I will be), you have ind impf 1s hayah (to be)=I am/I will be+relative pronoun asher+repetition of the verb. If Moses were to speak about God he would use the third person, and the third person of ehye is yihyeh (he is/he will be). If the yodh mutates to a waw (which isn't unheard of), or was a waw in another non-standard dialect it just changes from yihyeh to yihweh. There's actually a sort of neat etymology there -- though not without its own problems.

But it can't be yahuwa because that's Arabic, not Hebrew/Canaanite. In fact that's not even how Northern Arabic is commonly constructed. The vocative particle "ya" is found in Hijazi varieties of Arabic and spread, but in Northern Old Arabic dialects -- the Safaitic variety is the one with the most data -- the vocative particple was a ha (fa-hallaat is a commonly found phrase meaning "So, o' Laat"). In Hebrew as well the vocative particle was a ha (with a compound schwa under it as opposed to a patah). Huwa is also the Classical Arabic 3rd person masculine singular pronoun.

Wallahu A'lam
wassalam

Edited by Ibn Al-Ja'abi

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8 hours ago, Ibn Al-Ja'abi said:

Addressing just how the tetragrammaton might be pronounced and not the argument you might be trying to get at -- because I'm not exactly sure what it is. There's two popular suggestions and the theory of Jehovah (or Yehowa for that matter) isn't one of them

alhamdulillah for such insight.

Now having addressed the tetragrammaton  to be not 'Jehovah' or ' Ya Huwa' it leads to that unwanted argument of JW's existence. Maybe it was cooked & Allah(سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) knows best.

12 hours ago, Son of Placid said:

but add italics and footnotes that are different than mainstream. Of course every other Christian group rejects them because to them Jesus is a Prophet, not God.

not sure here, these italics & footnotes are added according to whose guidance & do they ( I & f) help in conveying the truth or is it part of distortion?

Them being rejected doesn't matter so long as they're accepted by Allah(سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) which leads to another matter not for here.

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11 hours ago, Mzwakhe said:

alhamdulillah for such insight.

Now having addressed the tetragrammaton  to be not 'Jehovah' or ' Ya Huwa' it leads to that unwanted argument of JW's existence. Maybe it was cooked & Allah(سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) knows best.

not sure here, these italics & footnotes are added according to whose guidance & do they ( I & f) help in conveying the truth or is it part of distortion?

Them being rejected doesn't matter so long as they're accepted by Allah(سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) which leads to another matter not for here.

The Watch Tower is a group in the States that decides everything JW.

Personally I believe any translation with the best intent can still cause distortion. We start with God's word. That is translated into human, then to modern language, then is subject to interpretation by scholars often sponsored by an agenda. That's why we span from orthodox to reformed. From dancing with snakes to twirling. Peace and war...

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6 hours ago, Son of Placid said:

Personally I believe any translation with the best intent can still cause distortion. We start with God's word. That is translated into human, then to modern language, then is subject to interpretation by scholars often sponsored by an agenda. 

This concept is true for all scriptures, which is why we, the lovers of Ahlul Bayt (عليه السلام) seek our truth only from the source, Ahlul Bayt (عليه السلام) themselves. That way, we minimise the chances for distortion. 

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On 12/16/2019 at 5:22 PM, Moalfas said:

Ahlul Bayt (عليه السلام) themselves.

This is worrying & also true.

What do you mean by AB(عليه السلام) themselves? 

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On 12/16/2019 at 6:58 PM, Son of Placid said:

The Watch Tower is a group in the States that decides everything JW.

alhamdulillah thanks & it would be good to stop talking about JW as I needed a simple verification of the word 'j' 'y' & really it is of no benefit yet the concern is my mother who calls that name.

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2 hours ago, Mzwakhe said:

This is worrying & also true.

What do you mean by AB(عليه السلام) themselves? 

I mean we strive to get our knowledge from them directly through their most trusted followers. 

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