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Netflix 'Messiah' Series

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On 12/5/2019 at 1:14 PM, Abu Nur said:

Most of the students in hawza of Najaf have taking similar positions about the political quatisim. But about the amr bil maroof wa nahi anil munkar, that is an essential for all believers and it is mentioned in Qur'an. But I disagree that we need sometimes involve to politics, because we don't. I don't want to belong to any groups who highly possible can do injustice act, because they are fallible. We have narration that supporting such a groups even when they do injustice, you are also involved to such injustice. I don't trust our scholars who are involved to politics to do always justice.

This is a position I never really understood and this is why without beginning a new debate I want just to ask some questions about these for better understanding these opinion.

1) What do these persons mean exactly "political quietism" ? Do that means that if someone become president of Iraq and want to legalize many unislamic things we must do nothing and stay "neutral" ? We are just supposed to do nothing excepted doing some discourses for saying this is not good and thats it ? Or this is more complicate ?

2) Before Islamic Revolution happened Shiism was practically restricted only to Iran and Iraq and most people on Earth had no idea of what was shiism. But Islamic Revolution in Iran permitted to many people to know this part of Islam and we could met thousands of people from every part of the world who said they had been inspired by the Islamic revolution of Iran for becoming Shia. Could we not think that putting religion separate from government would at the end stop people to knowing shiism ? 

Thanks by advance for your answers and help.

Edited by Mohammadi_follower

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1) What do these persons mean exactly "political quietism" ? Do that means that if someone become president of Iraq and want to legalize many unislamic things we must do nothing and stay "neutral" ? We are just supposed to do nothing excepted doing some discourses for saying this is not good and thats it ? Or this is more complicate ?

We can advice but not to become members of political groups, nor make any political groups in government. This Unislamic and Islamic thing in politics, both of them no matter what, will always do injustice in some sense because it is always will be an fallible system with fallible people running it. One of the reason why I don't take any sides is because if I support a group that do injustice, I will be part of it. 

Quote

2) Before Islamic Revolution happened Shiism was practically restricted only to Iran and Iraq and most people on Earth had no idea of what was shiism. But Islamic Revolution in Iran permitted to many people to know this part of Islam and we could met thousands of people from every part of the world who said they had been inspired by the Islamic revolution of Iran for becoming Shia. Could we not think that putting religion separate from government would at the end stop people to knowing shiism ? 

This awareness does not necessary  means it need to create such an Islamic revolution to have such an awareness about Shia Islam. Nowadays we have internet that give even easier way to come close to Shia Islam.

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On 12/6/2019 at 9:48 AM, Abu Nur said:

We can advice but not to become members of political groups, nor make any political groups in government. This Unislamic and Islamic thing in politics, both of them no matter what, will always do injustice in some sense because it is always will be an fallible system with fallible people running it. One of the reason why I don't take any sides is because if I support a group that do injustice, I will be part of it. 

Could we not think that at least religious people will do less errors and advocate more Islamic principles toward the state? 

Between pahlavi and Islamic Republic for exemple we could clearly see that Islamic principles are more respected in Iran than before. Sometimes talking is not enough and acting is better. 

On 12/6/2019 at 9:48 AM, Abu Nur said:

This awareness does not necessary  means it need to create such an Islamic revolution to have such an awareness about Shia Islam. Nowadays we have internet that give even easier way to come close to Shia Islam.

I just can't more disagree. With internet we have littéraly the worst and the best applications. You have now some idiots like tawhidi who could say their heresies to everyone and you have thousands of sheik Google and Ayatollah Facebook who say their nonsense without any religious scholarship and mislead tons of Shia Muslims. 

Anyway like I said I didn't want to begin a new debate. You explained to me the opinion of people like you and we will never agree. But thanks a lot to answer. Salam aleykoum. 

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14 hours ago, Abu Nur said:

We can advice but not to become members of political groups, nor make any political groups in government. This Unislamic and Islamic thing in politics, both of them no matter what, will always do injustice in some sense because it is always will be an fallible system with fallible people running it. One of the reason why I don't take any sides is because if I support a group that do injustice, I will be part of it. 

advice regarding? Let's say Isis has taken over half of Iraq, what do you do? go in alone, or join an organized group? In Iraq, 80% of government are former baath party members, pushing anti Islamic agendas, like the recent riots, or opening the country up for Isis invasion? what do you do? sit around and hope they play nice? Far more evil will be done if you don't take action and let your country fall into the zionist hands, like it was with Saddam.  

it's not a 0 to 100 thing, do nothing unless you have infallible Imam. It's a process, from individual to cultural development to political evolution. The entirety of Shia Marjayat is about that. It took a 1000 years before Shia's in Iran reached the point where the Marja of his time (1890), Mirza Shirazi could give the tabaco Hukm and have most Shia's in Iran carry it out ( A political move to get rid of the British influence). Then from that point, another 80 years until a marja could lead a revolution against bahai dominated government. Now 40 years have passed, and Shia Islam is becoming the dominant power in the region, pushing back the zionist agenda of greater Israel and destruction of Islam. 

If it wasn't for the Islamic revolution, this is what Middle East would have been like: 

The%20Project%20for%20the%20New%20Middle

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14 hours ago, Abu Nur said:

This awareness does not necessary  means it need to create such an Islamic revolution to have such an awareness about Shia Islam. Nowadays we have internet that give even easier way to come close to Shia Islam.

We live in an era where internet can easy be monitored, censored and shutdown. Without control over our own internet, the zionists can easy censor anything related to Shia Islam and leave only propaganda. This Messiah tv series is an example of that. Censorship is already occurring and will increase. 

We also live in an era of system theories and implementations. A system can only be countered by a system.  For example, you can’t talk against Usury, and how its declaration of war against God, when all are money are tainted by it through the banking system. You need an Islamic economic system to counter it. The first step towards that is an Islamic government and independence from foreign powers. Now, expand this to the other 1400 systems that govern a society, from education to health to foreign policy, political, etc.. 

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1 hour ago, Shiawarrior313 said:

advice regarding? Let's say Isis has taken over half of Iraq, what do you do? go in alone, or join an organized group? In Iraq, 80% of government are former baath party members, pushing anti Islamic agendas, like the recent riots, or opening the country up for Isis invasion? what do you do? sit around and hope they play nice? Far more evil will be done if you don't take action and let your country fall into the zionist hands, like it was with Saddam.  

it's not a 0 to 100 thing, do nothing unless you have infallible Imam. It's a process, from individual to cultural development to political evolution. The entirety of Shia Marjayat is about that. It took a 1000 years before Shia's in Iran reached the point where the Marja of his time (1890), Mirza Shirazi could give the tabaco Hukm and have most Shia's in Iran carry it out ( A political move to get rid of the British influence). Then from that point, another 80 years until a marja could lead a revolution against bahai dominated government. Now 40 years have passed, and Shia Islam is becoming the dominant power in the region, pushing back the zionist agenda of greater Israel and destruction of Islam. 

If it wasn't for the Islamic revolution, this is what Middle East would have been like: 

The%20Project%20for%20the%20New%20Middle

What the heck is this guy on about lool 

Iraq was already invaded by the "Zionists" and guess who welcomed them when they invaded? The Islamists, specifically the Shi'a ones.

The last ones who can talk about America in Iraq are those political Shi'a with turbans on their head who only come to power because Bush came and gave them the country.

And now guess who people are protesting? The same people America put in power. 

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On 12/4/2019 at 9:07 PM, ali_fatheroforphans said:

Observe the timing and why did they show the man to be of an Arab origin? 

Without watching the show -- and I plan on because my interest is piqued (by Torrenting, though, not on Netflix I don't plan on supporting this trash) -- I'd guess two things. The show is dealing with the Antichrist, a figure who's supposed to deceive people into thinking that he's really Christ per popular conception of him -- biblical discussions are another matter, this seems to be going with popular conception as many shows and movies discussing religion do. I believe the show is trying to go the route other movies about Jesus have gone in recent years, not depicting him as a white man with lovely long hair but as a brown middle eastern as he likely would've been. If the Antichrist is his counterpart meant to fool people into thinking it's really him, he'd also be a Middle Eastern like Christ. Another instance of a Middle Eastern Christ is in the movie Risen (something I enjoyed despite the, admittedly, stale acting at parts) where he's brown with wavy black hair. Secondly, I think they're presenting a generic Abrahamic Antichrist-figure. This is one that fits in with popular Christian theology since the trailer seems to depict Christians supporting him and him vaguely resembling depictions of Jesus -- thin with long hair and a beard. However he also seems to fit the bill as Dajjal -- this I can only guess is due to him doing what Islamic texts say Dajjal is capable of doing (e.g. travelling the Earth very quickly, the role of deceiving people, etc) and that his character was named al-Masih al-Dajjal. The matter of the actor being named Mahdi is coincidental I'd guess as well, I really don't think Netflix is in on some anti-Iran conspiracy to make people disbelieve in something they've most likely never heard of -- Imam Mahdi. I'm really a bit embarrassed of the reactions some Muslims are having saying things like the Illuminati is behind this anti-Mahdi film. I don't think anything nefarious is going on at all, I think media companies scraped the bottom of the barrel and churned out more garbage. And frankly I wish they'd bring back Marco Polo rather than this nonsense, that show being cancelled was a real tragedy.

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4 hours ago, Shiawarrior313 said:

We live in an era where internet can easy be monitored, censored and shutdown. Without control over our own internet, the zionists can easy censor anything related to Shia Islam and leave only propaganda. This Messiah tv series is an example of that. Censorship is already occurring and will increase. 

We also live in an era of system theories and implementations. A system can only be countered by a system.  For example, you can’t talk against Usury, and how its declaration of war against God, when all are money are tainted by it through the banking system. You need an Islamic economic system to counter it. The first step towards that is an Islamic government and independence from foreign powers. Now, expand this to the other 1400 systems that govern a society, from education to health to foreign policy, political, etc.. 

No zionist is going to censor Shia content and if they do it has only little effect. About the Islamic banking system, you don't need Islamic government for it. 

Edited by Abu Nur

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On 12/5/2019 at 1:14 PM, Abu Nur said:

Most of the students in hawza of Najaf have taking similar positions about the political quatisim. But about the amr bil maroof wa nahi anil munkar, that is an essential for all believers and it is mentioned in Qur'an. But I disagree that we need sometimes involve to politics, because we don't. I don't want to belong to any groups who highly possible can do injustice act, because they are fallible. We have narration that supporting such a groups even when they do injustice, you are also involved to such injustice. I don't trust our scholars who are involved to politics to do always justice.

You don’t think we need to get involved in politics and yet we should perform amr bil maroof wa nahi anil munkar?

Can I ask you what your definition of politics is?

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2 minutes ago, Soldiers and Saffron said:

You don’t think we need to get involved in politics and yet we should perform amr bil maroof wa nahi anil munkar?

Can I ask you what your definition of politics is?

Yes you are correct we don't need to involve in politics and amr bil maroof wa nahi anil munkar is not an political action. 

Quote

Can I ask you what your definition of politics is?

The same definition that all else countries practice it trough a government. 

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3 hours ago, Abu Nur said:

No zionist is going to censor Shia content and if they do it has only little effect. 

When they have full control over the internet, social media, etc... they can sensor as they please. You just need to look at the recent censoring on youtube, facebook and other social media sites of Iranian content. 

http://english.alarabiya.net/en/News/middle-east/2019/12/06/Facebook-closes-Iranian-Supreme-Leader-Khamenei-s-page.html

The effect of it will be significant if they remove all major Shia related sites/content. Imagine living in china ( a blueprint for the nwo) and trying to access Shia content.

3 hours ago, Abu Nur said:

About the Islamic banking system, you don't need Islamic government for it. 

Islamic banking is one facet of the Islamic economic/financial system. How are you going to implement it if you don't control the country and the system you live in? Islamic banking/financial/economic system is paradigm changing and threatens the entirety of the global zionist system. They will never allow its existence. 

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3 hours ago, Abu Nur said:

The same definition that all else countries practice it trough a government. 

so if a group is not involved with the government, it's not politics?

More proper definition of politics: Politics is a set of activities associated with the governance of a country or an area. It involves making decisions that apply to group of members. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Politics

When the Americans first invaded and tried to bring in a strongman to lead Iraq and Ayatollah Sistani threatened a call to Jihad if elections weren't held, was that not involvement in governance of the society?

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To support the points of our brother @Abu Nur I think the following points must be kept in mind:

-the ends do not justify the means in Islam. One cannot reason that any action is acceptable as long as the end result is positive. For example, stealing is haram even if I steal from the rich and distribute to the poor. 

-similarly, Islam is not about the greater good that comes out of mixing truth with falsehood. 

For these two reasons we are unable to back the large majority of current day and historical politics because they almost always include falsehood. 

The majority of the a'immah (عليه السلام) kept away from political positions altogether and the few who were involved did so in a short or limited capacity. 

May Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) keep us all on the right path. 

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36 minutes ago, Shiawarrior313 said:

When they have full control over the internet, social media, etc... they can sensor as they please. You just need to look at the recent censoring on youtube, facebook and other social media sites of Iranian content. 

http://english.alarabiya.net/en/News/middle-east/2019/12/06/Facebook-closes-Iranian-Supreme-Leader-Khamenei-s-page.html

The effect of it will be significant if they remove all major Shia related sites/content. Imagine living in china ( a blueprint for the nwo) and trying to access Shia content.

Islamic banking is one facet of the Islamic economic/financial system. How are you going to implement it if you don't control the country and the system you live in? Islamic banking/financial/economic system is paradigm changing and threatens the entirety of the global zionist system. They will never allow its existence. 

Many countries have nowdays Islamic banking, instead of riba, they take the money from services. That at least is better than riba. 

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29 minutes ago, Shiawarrior313 said:

so if a group is not involved with the government, it's not politics?

More proper definition of politics: Politics is a set of activities associated with the governance of a country or an area. It involves making decisions that apply to group of members. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Politics

When the Americans first invaded and tried to bring in a strongman to lead Iraq and Ayatollah Sistani threatened a call to Jihad if elections weren't held, was that not involvement in governance of the society?

I'm not sure did Sistani threatened with Jihad, but what Sistani do is not political. He guides and give fatwahs. I don't understand how we are talking about so simplistic matter. Sistani is not an political figure. 

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On 12/7/2019 at 9:59 AM, Abu Nur said:

I'm not sure did Sistani threatened with Jihad, but what Sistani do is not political. He guides and give fatwahs. I don't understand how we are talking about so simplistic matter. Sistani is not an political figure. 

Ayatollah Sistani did threaten fatwa for direct elections. This was an act affecting the governance of the society. Thats what politics is. Redefining politics to fit your narrow view is very dishonest. This is what Marja's do, they don't associate with political parties. Even Imam Khamenie does not associate with political parties. They set the structure for the society to grow, for the people to gain social responsibilities and move towards implementing Islamic values at social layer.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2004/jan/16/Iraq.rorymccarthy

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If Bremer rejects Ayatollah Sistani's opinion, he would issue a fatwa depriving the US-appointed council of its legitimacy,

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On 12/4/2019 at 7:59 PM, Kaya said:

Do you guys notice any parallels of this with Imam Mahdi (atj)? Or any other thoughts about this? Positive or negative influence?

A guy on twitter posted a couple of tweets where he ''predicted'' the storyline of Messiah. He wrote on twitter something along the lines of ''I bet he's going to lose one eye and have Kafir spelled on his forehead and then turn out to be the Anti-Christ.''

The director and netflix I think immediately blocked him and removed that tweet, so it's safe to say they basically took all the ahadith of Dajjal (la) and tried making a series out of it. 

Personally I feel like it's a pretty weird series to make, but they have made series like Lucifer based on the comic Lucifer by DC before. 

I think we should all take it with a grain of salt, either watch it, don’t be affected by it or don’t watch it at all. Perhaps they want you to be sympathetic with the Anti-Christ as they did Lucifer on the series?

Wallahu A'lam

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On 12/7/2019 at 9:49 AM, Abu Nur said:

Many countries have nowdays Islamic banking, instead of riba, they take the money from services. That at least is better than riba. 

They're not really Islamic, more of a hack trying work with a bad system. They function within the usuary based money creation system, using fiat money and applying fractional reserve banking system. Hence, they find different ways to add charges to the loans. Basically, the same purpose, making profit over loans is served. Banking system is one component of the usary based economic system, that needs complete overhaul, from the very philosophy that defines it to its design and implementations. 

Islamic banking, and financial system needs complete system change, from money creation to principles governing the economic structure. eg. it will not be capitalism anymore. Iran is currently working on such system, expanding to the entirety of the economic system.

Here is an article on how the premium charged by Islamic banks in Malaysia is aligned with interest charged in non Islamic banks

https://www.asianinvestor.net/article/are-Islamic-banks-really-interest-free/407600

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Gut says he'll end up being a con man. Probably this might be just be there to Mock or cause confusion if Imam Mehdi does appear. ( I know this sounds like usual conspiracy theory ).

So the Lead actors Name is Mehdi Debi an Arab-European.

The show creator is Micheal Petroni who is probably a Jewish. 

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12 hours ago, Shiawarrior313 said:

Ayatollah Sistani did threaten fatwa for direct elections. This was an act affecting the governance of the society. Thats what politics is. Redefining politics to fit your narrow view is very dishonest. This is what Marja's do, they don't associate with political parties. Even Imam Khamenie does not associate with political parties. They set the structure for the society to grow, for the people to gain social responsibilities and move towards implementing Islamic values at social layer.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2004/jan/16/Iraq.rorymccarthy

 

As an example,  if I advice Maliki about some issue, suddenly I do politics when I did not vote him or anyone nor do I belong to any political groups or support anyone in politics?

Quote

Even Imam Khamenie does not associate with political parties.

This is what Ayotullah Khomeini authority is:

Supreme Leadership Authority, (مقام معظم رهبری, maqām mo'azzam rahbari) is the head of state, ultimate political and religious authority of the Islamic Republic of Iran. The armed forces, judiciary, state television, and other key government organizations are subject to the Supreme Leader.

Politic + Religion.

--- 

Sistani have none of this.

Quote

If Bremer rejects Ayatollah Sistani's opinion, he would issue a fatwa depriving the US-appointed council of its legitimacy,

And is fatwah an political action? No, it is not, it is an legal opinion.

Edited by Abu Nur

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They're not really Islamic, more of a hack trying work with a bad system. They function within the usuary based money creation system, using fiat money and applying fractional reserve banking system. Hence, they find different ways to add charges to the loans. Basically, the same purpose, making profit over loans is served. Banking system is one component of the usary based economic system, that needs complete overhaul, from the very philosophy that defines it to its design and implementations. 

Does it even concern me if I take my money from such a bank who does not apply riba to my case?

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The fact of the matter is the "Dajjal" has very little mention in Shi'I literature, he is mentioned much more in Sunni texts, even the few hadiths we do have regarding him, majority of them are weak and alot have come through Sunni chains.

Our "End Times" texts revolve much more around the Sufyani and the events surrounding him.

Read the comments of brother @Qa'im on this thread regarding this topic:

https://www.shiachat.com/forum/topic/235007581-I-need-Shia-hadith-of-dajjal-please/

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On 12/7/2019 at 5:32 AM, Abu Nur said:

Yes you are correct we don't need to involve in politics and amr bil maroof wa nahi anil munkar is not an political action. 

The same definition that all else countries practice it trough a government. 

I am not sure that you have a real definition of what politics is, how would you explain it to someone who has never heard about it?

To me politics is a system for governance, that is, a system for which the society should function according to, which brings order through a system of laws. This is practically speaking what Islam is as well, as it is a complete religion.

And to perform amr bil maroof wa nahi anil munkar on a societal level is to implement laws which enjoin that which is good and to prohibit that which is bad.

If you were in a position of power, would you refrain from performing amr bil maroof wa nahi anil munkar or would you make sure it is performed? Some would call a person who has the power to set laws and change them a politican involved in politics. I would call such a man a Muslim involved in Islam if he was righteous Muslim.

On 12/7/2019 at 9:35 AM, Mahdavist said:

The majority of the a'immah (عليه السلام) kept away from political positions altogether and the few who were involved did so in a short or limited capacity. 

Did they keep away from politicis because they did not want to lead or did they keep away from leadership because people did not want them to lead?

To my understanding, leadership is the right and purpose of our Imams(عليه السلام), even though their rights were taken by others.

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I am not sure that you have a real definition of what politics is, how would you explain it to someone who has never heard about it?

To me politics is a system for governance, that is, a system for which the society should function according to, which brings order through a system of laws. This is practically speaking what Islam is as well, as it is a complete religion.

You are right about the Governance, for example the governance of Prophet David (عليه السلام) is ideal and wonderful, something that we are waiting for to get it. But right now it is not ideal because it lack a divine leader.

Quote

And to perform amr bil maroof wa nahi anil munkar on a societal level is to implement laws which enjoin that which is good and to prohibit that which is bad.

That is a good thing and should applied that way too. But still it can and must be performed from individual level. Something that specially we need to do it in countries that does not have Islamic Laws applied.

The reason why I don't support or belong to any political groups is because I don't want to belong to any group that do slight injustice. I may criticize action of political figures that I clearly see what they have done is not right, but for others it seems that they can justify it easily.

Edited by Abu Nur

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8 hours ago, Soldiers and Saffron said:

I am not sure that you have a real definition of what politics is, how would you explain it to someone who has never heard about it?

To me politics is a system for governance, that is, a system for which the society should function according to, which brings order through a system of laws. This is practically speaking what Islam is as well, as it is a complete religion.

And to perform amr bil maroof wa nahi anil munkar on a societal level is to implement laws which enjoin that which is good and to prohibit that which is bad.

If you were in a position of power, would you refrain from performing amr bil maroof wa nahi anil munkar or would you make sure it is performed? Some would call a person who has the power to set laws and change them a politican involved in politics. I would call such a man a Muslim involved in Islam if he was righteous Muslim.

Did they keep away from politicis because they did not want to lead or did they keep away from leadership because people did not want them to lead?

To my understanding, leadership is the right and purpose of our Imams(عليه السلام), even though their rights were taken by others.

I don't think they kept away from leadership. They were the rightful leaders as you correctly mentioned and those who followed them recognized them as such.

They did however distance themselves from all forms of injustice and oppression, thus their disassociation from the Abbasids, Umayyads and other oppressive powers of their time.

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5 hours ago, Mahdavist said:

I don't think they kept away from leadership. They were the rightful leaders as you correctly mentioned and those who followed them recognized them as such.

They did however distance themselves from all forms of injustice and oppression, thus their disassociation from the Abbasids, Umayyads and other oppressive powers of their time.

So then they did not avoid leadership rather people did not follow them.

Is the position of leadership over a group of people considered a political position?

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On 12/6/2019 at 11:36 AM, Abu Nur said:

Under the Maliki government he did revenge attack towards Sunnis and he also did a lot mischief and all under the Shia Islam name.

Sorry if I misunderstood, but can you clarify or expand on this? When you say "he" are you referring to Ayatullah Sistani?

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4 hours ago, Propaganda_of_the_Deed said:

Sorry if I misunderstood, but can you clarify or expand on this? When you say "he" are you referring to Ayatullah Sistani?

I'm referring Maliki, not Ayotullah Sistani. Sistani have done only good, may Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) bless him. 

Edited by Abu Nur

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9 hours ago, Soldiers and Saffron said:

So then they did not avoid leadership rather people did not follow them.

Is the position of leadership over a group of people considered a political position?

Leadership is not necessarily political. There is leadership within the home, within the masjid, within a small group of people who are travelling from point A to point B.

Leadership can be political, there is no issue with this. The issue lies in political establishments which are not rightful (large majority of establishments that exist and have ever existed) and this is what our a'immah (عليه السلام) disassociated themselves from.

Furthermore, the leadership of the a'immah (عليه السلام) was based on guidance rather than power. The efforts and objectives were never to take over governance or rulership, rather to ensure that those who seek guidance receive it. 

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On 12/7/2019 at 11:25 AM, Sumerian said:

What the heck is this guy on about lool 

Iraq was already invaded by the "Zionists" and guess who welcomed them when they invaded? The Islamists, specifically the Shi'a ones.

The last ones who can talk about America in Iraq are those political Shi'a with turbans on their head who only come to power because Bush came and gave them the country.

And now guess who people are protesting? The same people America put in power. 

Iraq & Iran also invaded by Moguls that based on new Shia  analyzers their intention was to total destruction of Islam that even some of Moghul kings were chritians because of activities of forefathathers of current zionism in disguise of  Christian missionary between Moguls but at the end Shia scholars like as Sheikh Tusi (رضي الله عنه) used their invasion as a great tool for overthrowing Abbasids dynasty that in advance other great Shia scholars like as Allamh Hili (رضي الله عنه) turned at least one Moghul king to a Shia Muslim that had great achievements for Shias that same policy followed during invasion of Zionists & America  to Iraq that Great Shia scholars used it to overthrow Baathi Regime specially Saddam (la) although real intention of invaders was fighting & defeating Iran but at the end it leads to empowering Shias in Iraq instead of weakening Iran but Iraq will suffer from this invasion side effects until reappearance  of Imam Mahdi (aj) but great Shia scholars are trying to provide better situation  for people of Iraq by supporting Shias & make their situation better that current protests started by our common enemies but it hacked by our great Shia scholars like as great Ayatollah Sistani in order to fix many problems in Iraq but you see it through Antishia propaganda system with mix of extreme patriotism that all anti Shia propaganda compares & relates using of great Shia scholars from both Moghuls & Americans as a negative matter against their favorable viewpoint of Islam like as Ummayids & Abbasids & Baathi regime specially Saddam (la) that is accusing great Ayatollah Sistani to corruption & taking bribe from Americans to  let them to destroy their ideal Iraq under ruling of Saddam (la) & Baath party that you as a person that his mother language is Arabic & understand it better than me can find a tons of these accusations from Arab speaking users in every social media.

Edited by Ashvazdanghe

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