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In the Name of God بسم الله

(Doubts because of) Ya'juj and Ma'juj

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Salam everyone,

Lately I'm having a lot of doubts because of Ya'juj/Ma'juj story. :confused:

A) the story of Dhul Qarnain (عليه السلام) and him building the wall against Gog/Magog ressembles other stories like those in the Alexander Romance and the Syriac Alexander Legend. Of course, it could be that those stories are based on a true event, hence the ressemblance. This isn't my main concern.

B) the main issue -- which I want to discuss here -- is that we don't know the location of the barrier of Dhul Qarnayn (عليه السلام) despite the fact that such a barrier made out of iron and copper would be easily visible using satellites. Since G/M are so numerous (1000 times the number of Muslims according to some ahadith) they would also be quite easy to spot, being located behind that barrier.

So, I was wondering whether it is possible that Ya'juj and Ma'juj are already out in the world (released from the barrier) and that they'll attack only at the end of times. If that's possible then I think my doubts would decrease.

The quranic verses on that subject are the following:
 

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1) Al-Kahf, 98-99 : (98) [Dhul-Qarnayn] said, "This is a mercy from my Lord; but when the promise of my Lord comes, He will make it level, and ever is the promise of my Lord true." (99) And We will leave them that day surging over each other, and [then] the Horn will be blown, and We will assemble them in [one] assembly.

2) Al-Anbiya, 95-97 : (95) And there is prohibition upon [the people of] a city which We have destroyed that they will [ever] return (96) until when [the dam of] Gog and Magog has been opened and they, from every elevation, descend. (97) And [when] the true promise has approached; then suddenly the eyes of those who disbelieved will be staring [in horror, while they say], "O woe to us; we had been unmindful of this; rather, we were wrongdoers."


I searched (sunnii) hadiths and that's what I found out typing "Gog", "Yajuj" and then "Ya'juj":

- Abu Sa`id Al-Khudri narrates in one hadith (I didn't find any other) explicitly stated that people would continue performing Hajj and Umra AFTER the release of Gog and Magog and that the Hour would come only when Hajj is abandoned (https://sunnah.com/bukhari/25/79)

- Many other ahadith (up to 9 I think, but all from the same original narrator) say that the Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) informed Zaynab that an opening was made into the wall. She then asked " Shall we be destroyed even though there are pious persons among us?" and the Prophet said "Yes, when the evil person will increase" (https://sunnah.com/bukhari/60/26). To me it looks like these ahadith is telling us that we'll be destroyed as soon as G/M are released.

- There is a couple of ahadith narrated by Abu Hurrairah in which G/M will not escape until they utter "Inchallah" and it seems as if they will cause destruction as soon as they are released (https://sunnah.com/ibnmajah/36/155)

- Then there are different versions talking about the coming of Jesus (عليه السلام). One hadith tells the story of Hazrat Isa (عليه السلام) fighting against the Dajjal and, after the latter is defeated, the release of G/M. From the wording it seems like the release of G/M and they killing everyone happens at the same time (https://sunnah.com/ibnmajah/36/150). There is also a similar hadith but it simply indicates that "the people will return to their own lands and will be confronted with Gog and Magog people": we can't infer anything from this narration (https://sunnah.com/ibnmajah/36/156). Four other similar ahadith instead mention that Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) will warn Isa (عليه السلام) and order him to take the Muslims to Tur in safety and then Gog and Magog will emerge and they will, as Allah describes, "swoop down from every mound." : again we can't infer anything based on that (https://sunnah.com/ibnmajah/36/150).

--> to sum up, there are a few verses about the barrier and I'm not sure if they could be interpreted as God already having freed G/M. As for the ahadith, we have only one hadith explicitely stating that the moment of release of Ya'juj/Ma'juj and the moment they'll cause destruction are separated in time but all the other ahadith make it seem like G/M won't wait at all and will destroy everything as soon as they are released.

So, according to you, brothers and sisters, is it possible to interpret the verses and ahadith in the way I mentionned above? :book:
 

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  • Advanced Member
1 hour ago, kashif.h said:

Come on guys, anyone?

In short, the question is: is it possible that Ya'juj and Ma'juj are already out and, if yes, what are the evidences of that in the Qur'an and ahadith?

Hmm, thats interesting, actually.

I mean, wouldn't it be obvious if they were out? There must be some type of evidences that they are?

Perhaps @Sumerian would be able to help.

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On 9/13/2019 at 10:56 PM, kashif.h said:

Lately I'm having a lot of doubts because of Ya'juj/Ma'juj story. :confused:

What sort of doubts though?

Doubts that.....?

On 9/13/2019 at 10:56 PM, kashif.h said:

B) the main issue -- which I want to discuss here -- is that we don't know the location of the barrier of Dhul Qarnayn (عليه السلام) despite the fact that such a barrier made out of iron and copper would be easily visible using satellites. Since G/M are so numerous (1000 times the number of Muslims according to some ahadith) they would also be quite easy to spot, being located behind that barrier.

So you think the shiny copper iron barrier would be visible from satellites, STILL visible after thousands of years. Brother to be honest I mourn your understanding. Don't you think it would have been buried under trainloads of dust? I have solar panels on my roof and I have to clean the dust every few days. THINK.

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14 minutes ago, Darth Vader said:

So you think the shiny copper iron barrier would be visible from satellites, STILL visible after thousands of years. Brother to be honest I mourn your understanding. Don't you think it would have been buried under trainloads of dust? I have solar panels on my roof and I have to clean the dust every few days. THINK.

Sallam Darth.

Don't be so discouraging -_-.

He's asking a question, answer it, no need to add any unnecessary comments. A lot of people here wouldn't know the answer to this, and a lot of people who are curious and trying to learn would come on the thread and look for answers, its not very effective to just say "think" for someone to try and look for answers and learn.

He isn't doing anything wrong.

And the answer of dust? Hmm, maybe... or maybe not.

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Guest Nite.jogger

Salam the answer is easy either Allah has chosen for them to be hidden just as other individuals are hidden until the end of times or they have been released already and this is the chaos you see in the World  which will get worse as foretold. 

 

Allah knows best

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The only identification of Ya'juj Ma'juj in Qur'an is that they were mufsideen:

Surah Al-Kahf, Verse 94:
قَالُوا يَا ذَا الْقَرْنَيْنِ إِنَّ يَأْجُوجَ وَمَأْجُوجَ مُفْسِدُونَ فِي الْأَرْضِ فَهَلْ نَجْعَلُ لَكَ خَرْجًا عَلَىٰ أَن تَجْعَلَ بَيْنَنَا وَبَيْنَهُمْ سَدًّا

They said: O Zulqarnain! surely Gog and Magog make mischief in the land. Shall we then pay you a tribute on condition that you should raise a barrier between us and them
(English - Shakir)

And as per this definition, a vast majority of humans are Ya'juj & Ma'juj (Mufsideen).

In present day, these two are the guards of the City of London :

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“Corineus and Gogmagog were two brave giants who richly valued their honour and exerted their whole strength and force in the defence of their liberty and country; so the City of London, by placing these, their representatives in their Guildhall, emblematically declare, that they will, like mighty giants defend the honour of their country and liberties of this their City; which excels all others, as much as those huge giants exceed in stature the common bulk of mankind.”

The Gigantick History of the two famous Giants, and other curiosities in Guildhall, London (volume 1), 1741

https://lordmayorsshow.London/history/gog-and-magog

 

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  • Advanced Member
On 9/13/2019 at 1:56 PM, kashif.h said:

Salam everyone,

Lately I'm having a lot of doubts because of Ya'juj/Ma'juj story. :confused:

Salam brother. Yajooj majooj were most likely released during the time of Prophet(صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم). There are ruins of a destroyed fortress in particular mountain range. 

I hope this decreases your doubts.
 

 

Edited by hasani
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21 hours ago, Ruqaya101 said:

Hmm, thats interesting, actually.

I mean, wouldn't it be obvious if they were out? There must be some type of evidences that they are?

Perhaps @Sumerian would be able to help.

According to one hadith (mentionned in the original post), Y/M will be out for a while but will cause destruction only when people abandon Hajj. It's the only one though.

 

21 hours ago, Darth Vader said:

What sort of doubts though?

Doubts that.....?

So you think the shiny copper iron barrier would be visible from satellites, STILL visible after thousands of years. Brother to be honest I mourn your understanding. Don't you think it would have been buried under trainloads of dust? I have solar panels on my roof and I have to clean the dust every few days. THINK.

Doubts about the veradicity of Yajuj and Majuj's story in the Qur'an.

As for the dust, it seems that the barrier is in a montanious region, not in a desert with a lot of dust for example. Also, the dust would need to be very thick and should stay in place despite winds. And the barrier's outline (I.e. a straight and perfect construction) would still be visible from above, especially in contrast with the surrounding mountains.

But the biggest question is, if Gog and Magog are still behind that barrier, in a mountanious region (not in the jungle where the tree leaves provide shelter), then satellites would detect an enormous amount of people chilling in the open in a sort of pass.

14 hours ago, hasani said:

 

Interesting. In which country is the fortress located?

 

18 hours ago, Cool said:

The only identification of Ya'juj Ma'juj in Qur'an is that they were mufsideen:

Surah Al-Kahf, Verse 94:
قَالُوا يَا ذَا الْقَرْنَيْنِ إِنَّ يَأْجُوجَ وَمَأْجُوجَ مُفْسِدُونَ فِي الْأَرْضِ فَهَلْ نَجْعَلُ لَكَ خَرْجًا عَلَىٰ أَن تَجْعَلَ بَيْنَنَا وَبَيْنَهُمْ سَدًّا

They said: O Zulqarnain! surely Gog and Magog make mischief in the land. Shall we then pay you a tribute on condition that you should raise a barrier between us and them
(English - Shakir)

And as per this definition, a vast majority of humans are Ya'juj & Ma'juj (Mufsideen).

In present day, these two are the guards of the City of London :

 

To me it looks like Yajuj and Majuj are a sort of tribe or people that cause corruption. Many people are mufsideen nowadays but they aren't necessarily from this tribe. As for the guards of London, it seems like they were two historical figures in the past while Yajuj and Majuj in the Qur'an two groups of people.

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Shiekh imran Hosein believes that Barrier is located in Caucasus Mountains in a place called Darial Gorge but is now destroyed as yajooj majooj have been released. He has also revealed Travel path of Dhul-qarnain(عليه السلام) which is between Caspian and black sea(so basically Caucasus mountains Range).

You can do more research on this subject yourself too. 

 

 

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