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In the Name of God بسم الله
alih13

No longer a Muslim, how to proceed

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26 minutes ago, Guest To u said:

Salam, these plenty of guys that you know who are like this,are all of them Shia?

Yeah, the ones in my local community and most of my relatives. I fear this is normal at least here where I live. Maybe in other Western countries like United Kingdom this is not like this (which I honestly doubt).

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8 hours ago, alih13 said:

ironically I want to live a more honest life where I am not pretending all the time.

alhamdulillah,

You were pretending meaning your children were a pretence all this time? 

8 hours ago, alih13 said:

I no longer see life with Islamic or unislamic lenses

" he sees through their eyes..."

8 hours ago, alih13 said:

tell kids their pets go to pet heaven, that is how I see heaven and hell, make us feel good places. 

 

" he speaks untruth through their tongues..."

7 hours ago, Flying_Eagle said:

But, its solution lies in being Patient

 

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On 8/12/2019 at 10:54 PM, Mzwakhe said:

alhamdulillah,

You were pretending meaning your children were a pretence all this time? 

" he sees through their eyes..."

" he speaks untruth through their tongues..."

I had my kids while still Muslim, obviously no longer plan on having more children brother.

but currently I feel that I am pretending...

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On 8/12/2019 at 2:40 PM, Isaam said:

If that was true, that religion is for comfort it’s not. You know why? Because Muslims believe it’s very hard to get into heaven, and we have the fear of Hell.

its psychological comfort for all the suffering you see around you and live through. its to help you through the hard times... living a hard life has nothing to do with it, the purpose is to make you live a hard life while psychologically imagining an invisible entity is with you all times and will reward/punish you. it allows those in authority to send thousands to their death if needed... even if for a good cause.

I will tell you what would make me a Muslim again:

1. God speaks to me directly

2. A Prophet or Imam speaks to me in person in the flesh and is willing to answer my questions. 

There seems to be a shortage of Prophets and Imams, the one Imam that is supposedly alive is conveniently in hiding...

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9 hours ago, alih13 said:

I don't believe in anything nor any theories. I posted this thread in family section, mods moved it to theology.

Salam, what do you think of this argument that Imam Sadiq AS presented to an atheist at his time?

You may believe in God, and God exists, in which case you go to heaven.

*You may believe in God, and God doesn't exist, in which case you gain nothing.

*You may not believe in God, and God doesn't exist, in which you gain nothing again. 

*You may not believe in God, and God may exist, in which case you will be *punished.

 

Therefore, the only possible loser is the atheist!

 

Also, if Islam is not really from God, how was the Prophet Muhammad ((صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم)) able to tell his companions signs of the end of time that have in fact occurred.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=sCbaX9KmUq8

 

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9 hours ago, eThErEaL said:

Do you pray or fast in front of them?

yes, I pray even when no one is around. don't ask me why. fasting has been hard due to addiction to smoking, but I do fast in front of others. 

I am also giving my children the best Islamic education possible... I don't want them to have beliefs like mine, if they are happy being Muslims, that's great.

 

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9 minutes ago, SeekingHeaven said:

Salam, what do you think of this argument that Imam Sadiq AS presented to an atheist at his time?

You may believe in God, and God exists, in which case you go to heaven.

*You may believe in God, and God doesn't exist, in which case you gain nothing.

*You may not believe in God, and God doesn't exist, in which you gain nothing again. 

*You may not believe in God, and God may exist, in which case you will be *punished.

 

Therefore, the only possible loser is the atheist!

I consider this fear tactics. Its the boogie monster in the closet we use to scare kids into doing what we want them. 

I don't believe in a God that is so petty that He feels the need to test His creation and then punish them. This makes as much sense to me as the idea of multiple Gods to you. 

God now makes as much sense to me as a Hindu worshipping a idol does to you. I think Allah is just another idol made by humans, so what if you don't make images out of Him?

Lastly I would tell the Imam is not your God Just and also All powerful? So why does He want to punish me if I can't believe in Him? What difference does it make to Him? 

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20 hours ago, Ibn al-Hussain said:

If you are pretty adamant and convinced that you are not going to come back to Islam, then you really need to leave this lady and hand over the children to her so she can up-bring them as Muslims. Though as long as she is uninformed about your beliefs, the marriage is deemed valid from her perspective, but remaining in a relationship where you have to pretend to be a Muslim - which is a complete worldview, theology, practices - is going to lead to disastrous consequences for her and the children later on. They might as well deal with it and get over it now, before it is too late. When she figures out you have left Islam, she should know that her marriage is nullified automatically.

Since you are in a moral dilemma about leaving her, perhaps you can financially support them until necessary, such as, until she can get married again or find some other form of support - God willing.

@alih13 You didn't reply to the quote above but instead replied to everyone talking about theology. The post quoted above should be what you takeaway from this thread in my opinion

Quranic verses about disbelief, a major disease of the heart:

"And they say: There is nothing but our life in this world; we live and die and nothing destroys us but time, and they have no knowledge of that; they only conjecture." Surah Jathiya 45:24.

"And when it was said, Surely the promise of Allah is true and as for the hour, there is no doubt about it, you said: We do not know what the hour is; we do not think (that it will come to pass) save a passing thought, and we are not at all sure" Surah Jathiya 45:32.

"Nay, they reject that of which they have no comprehensive knowledge, and the final sequel of it has not yet come to them; even thus did those before them reject (the truth)" Surah Yunus 10:39.

"Nay, their knowledge respecting the hereafter is slight and hasty; nay, they are in doubt about it; nay, they are quite blind to it." Surah Naml 27:66.

"Say: Have you any knowledge with you so you should bring it forth to us? You only follow a conjecture and you only tell lies" Surah Anam 6:148.

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To add onto to @Kaya 

Anas ibn Malik reported: The Messenger of Allah, peace and blessings be upon him, said, “A time of patience will come to people in which adhering to one’s religion is like grasping a hot coal.”

Source: Sunan al-Tirmidhī 2260

Grade: Sahih (authentic) according to Al-Albani

عَنْ أَنَسِ بْنِ مَالِكٍ قَالَ قَالَ رَسُولُ اللَّهِ صَلَّى اللَّهُ عَلَيْهِ وَسَلَّمَ يَأْتِي عَلَى النَّاسِ زَمَانٌ الصَّابِرُ فِيهِمْ عَلَى دِينِهِ كَالْقَابِضِ عَلَى الْجَمْرِ

 

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Reborn - I discovered myself when I found the Ahlul Bayt 

Watch this if you are losing hope 

End of times | Can you hold a Cactus | Syed Asad Jafri

Astaghfirullah -Islamic song nasheed about repentance | BISKITOONS

 

Edited by Ashvazdanghe

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Guest To u
10 hours ago, Bakir said:

Yeah, the ones in my local community and most of my relatives. I fear this is normal at least here where I live. Maybe in other Western countries like United Kingdom this is not like this (which I honestly doubt).

I would like it if you could extrapolate your answers:-

-Do you know why this is happening in your community?

-Is it safe for you to tell us,or unless you feel it may turn people astray?

-Do you feel it is only your community?

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33 minutes ago, Guest To u said:

I would like it if you could extrapolate your answers:-

-Do you know why this is happening in your community?

-Is it safe for you to tell us,or unless you feel it may turn people astray?

-Do you feel it is only your community?

- I can guess that lack of communication. And that, by itself, is the consequence of losing hope in communication itself (understanding). The breach is greater and greater.

- I believe people "turn astray" more oftenly for what is left unsaid, than for what is publicly said.

- No, though I believe it is more noticeable in my local community because there is just less fear of exposure and shame.

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Salaam Alaykum Brother,

Its great that you take care of your family and kids. Allah rewards you afterlife.

Regarding your concerns about religion, I would suggesst to travel to Iran and talk to scholars there. They might help you. Ask all your questions about religion. I think its a logical approach to take. When you don’t know engineering fir example, you go to college and ask. Take same approach for religion. Do research on religion.

I just have a simple logic in my mind that prevents me from leaving religion and I remind myself of it every time. I tell myself, look everything has a creator, my phone that Im typing now, my cloth, my apt, tables, desks, etc. Who is my creator? Im definitely more important than my PC, so I should have a creator. The second thing is that every manufacturer provides the product with a user manual. What is my user manual? How should I live? Religion is the way we should live brother because God made us and he knows better. It makes more sense to get life style from the person who made me not other people who are created not creator. 

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On 8/11/2019 at 2:05 PM, alih13 said:

salaam... im a married man for about 10 years with 2 kids that are below the age of 7... I'm 36 years old. I was a devout a Muslim for much of my life, however in the past 10 years I really began looking for the truth. sadly it's resulted in me longer believing in Allah, a God etc... this post is not about my theological problems. I never wanted to be a disbeliever, but that really is the state of affairs at the moment.

I havent told anyone about this. I am not too happy in my marriage as I want to do different things but feel like I have to continue pretending to be a Muslim because my wife may leave me, it would hurt my parents etc

on the other hand I'm really unhappy and feel like im being dishonest, and maybe my kids deserve a better father than me... (but they may never get another father)... but I would be hurting too many people if I came out and said im no longer a Muslim...

any advice???

This is a very tight and trapped situation. Part of you wants to tell her because you don't want to hide things from her, you want to be open and honest. But then that other part doesn't want to tell her because you know what it would lead to. You still love her, and your children, so you don't want to leave them.

On 8/12/2019 at 7:13 AM, 2Timeless said:

Isnt it easier for you if you just tried to go back to Islam? 

If it was easier for him then he would have tried ages ago, he has been this way for 10 years.

My advice to you brother is that if you choose to stay on this path, then it is best to let her go. I get that you are worried for them, but this is literally the best for both you and your wife. If your wife is very religious as you have mentioned earlier, then she would understand that concept of patience and perseverance, and that in life we're going to have to endure hardship. Mentally it isn't good for you either.

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3 minutes ago, Quran313 said:

Regarding your concerns about religion, I would suggesst to travel to Iran and talk to scholars there. They might help you.

According to Sharia law, a man who is a murtad fitri is to be killed, and no repentance will avoid him from capital punishment. Suggesting an apostate to visit one of the few countries in which Sharia law is applied is probably among the worst advices I have ever heard in ShiaChat.

I don't even know why religion is even discussed in this thread, it's pointless. If any, we should, for once, give reason and empathy the rights to judge this moral problem. A moral problem that is rather easier to identify if you judge by the golden rule.

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The fact that people here are giving religious advice to the user isn't even beneficial; even I thought to be able to give him some religious guidance, but then I thought twice; literally its pointless. Allah(سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) guides whom He wills, so no matter how much advice we will give to someone who has left Islam, it won't change anything. Besides he's been this way for 10 years now, so what makes us think that he'll change his views now? 

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9 hours ago, alih13 said:

yes, I pray even when no one is around. don't ask me why. fasting has been hard due to addiction to smoking, but I do fast in front of others. 

I am also giving my children the best Islamic education possible... I don't want them to have beliefs like mine, if they are happy being Muslims, that's great.

 

Alright.  Given your reasons for for not having faith, I would still consider you a Muslim.  And as a matter of fact I would still consider the possibility that you may be having more faith than me or anyone else on this thread.  I think you shouldn't care too much about judging your level of faith or Islam.  The religion of God revealed by His Messenger Muhammad (S) is all about living a life of happiness and peace.  So the bottom line for you is you need to be happy and at peace.  You should continue to focus on doing the right thing because at the end of the day that is what God wants from you.  Just continue to be a good father and a good husband.  Continue to care for your wife and your children.  There is NO big problem in your live unless you think so and you magnify it.  I believe if the Prophet (S) were present before you and you told him of your situation, he would smile compassionately towards you and tell you to relax.

 

Edited by eThErEaL

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41 minutes ago, 3wliya_maryam said:

The fact that people here are giving religious advice to the user isn't even beneficial; even I thought to be able to give him some religious guidance, but then I thought twice; literally its pointless. Allah(سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) guides whom He wills, so no matter how much advice we will give to someone who has left Islam, it won't change anything. Besides he's been this way for 10 years now, so what makes us think that he'll change his views now? 

None of us know what this man did or read or thought through those ten years that made him lose faith in Islam. It might be something simple that could be dispelled by knowledgeable people here engaging in theological discussions with the OP. So, obviously it is beneficial but if the OP has no interest in doing so, we can only make assumptions about his intent and advice him to at least research further or allow his wife and kids to live a better life. 

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1 hour ago, Bakir said:

According to Sharia law, a man who is a murtad fitri is to be killed, and no repentance will avoid him from capital punishment. Suggesting an apostate to visit one of the few countries in which Sharia law is applied is probably among the worst advices I have ever heard in ShiaChat.

I don't even know why religion is even discussed in this thread, it's pointless. If any, we should, for once, give reason and empathy the rights to judge this moral problem. A moral problem that is rather easier to identify if you judge by the golden rule.

It's true but it must be verified by four just witness also if it verified by judge ,he will have a frame of time for repentance & he is not losing his faith completely but faced a hard time in his religious life that must thinks more about it.

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20 hours ago, alih13 said:

I see life the way an animal is. once an animal dies, do you worry about where it's "soul" will go? you might tell kids their pets go to pet heaven, that is how I see heaven and hell, make us feel good places. 

Allah did create humans to worship him, however animals do not have the same purpose. 

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13 hours ago, alih13 said:

I consider this fear tactics. Its the boogie monster in the closet we use to scare kids into doing what we want them. 

I don't believe in a God that is so petty that He feels the need to test His creation and then punish them. This makes as much sense to me as the idea of multiple Gods to you. 

God now makes as much sense to me as a Hindu worshipping a idol does to you. I think Allah is just another idol made by humans, so what if you don't make images out of Him?

Lastly I would tell the Imam is not your God Just and also All powerful? So why does He want to punish me if I can't believe in Him? What difference does it make to Him? 

All I can say is your reasons for disbelief are not based on logic but personal experience and emotions, you have not presented any logical reasons for your personal positions. And honestly personal reasons can be used to justify just about anything because there is no logic or external reasons as to how you came to the conclusion for the people in this forum and yourself present external reasons. An animal surviving or being or wanting to survive is not an end justification in itself but something observable it doesn’t explain why survival is a good thing or where the information in animals that survival is “good” came from, information theory states that information can only come from preexisting information if we see order currently than some preexisting order caused it, if a chair exists in present times the idea of a chair or consciousness or whatever object stands in front of you has existed as an idea at all points in time, if the very idea of chair or consciousness did not exist some shape or form in the past it’s existence would not even be possible. So in essence survival  or any generic ideal is not an end goal in and of itself or a sufficient reason for existence but an extrapolated effect.

Edited by Enlightened Follower

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47 minutes ago, Enlightened Follower said:

All I can say is your reasons for disbelief are not based on logic but personal experience and emotions, you have not presented any logical reasons for your personal positions. And honestly personal reasons can be used to justify just about anything because there is no logic or external reasons as to how you came to the conclusion for the people in this forum and yourself present external reasons. An animal surviving or being or wanting to survive is not an end justification in itself but something observable it doesn’t explain why survival is a good thing or where the information in animals that survival is “good” came from, information theory states that information can only come from preexisting information if we see order currently than some preexisting order caused it, if a chair exists in present times the idea of a chair or consciousness or whatever object stands in front of you has existed as an idea at all points in time, if the very idea of chair or consciousness did not exist some shape or form in the past it’s existence would not even be possible. So in essence survival  or any generic ideal is not an end goal in and of itself or a sufficient reason for existence but an extrapolated effect.

This debate has raged on for millennia, you are not going to settle it on ShiaChat.  There is no conclusive, irrefutable proof for the existence of God.  Furthermore, there is even less evidence for a personal God that concerns himself with the affairs of human beings.  At the end of the day it boils down to the individual.  Most approachable Muslim scholars are extremely weak in formulating or elaborating on elementary philosophical arguments, let alone be well versed in epistemology and metaphysics. Even still, as someone who is fascinated by philosophical inquiry, it is still limited in our attempt to gain a richer understanding about extremely difficult questions.  

As for the OP, I feel he should put his family first.  it isn't that difficult to be weakly inclined towards a belief in God, especially if his beliefs are more agnostic than a complete dismissal of of a higher power.  Family matters are complex and although the Islamic point of view is that he should leave his family, it doesn't necessarily make it the most prudent thing to do, it just depends.  I would really think this stuff through more, especially if the children are young.

Edited by King

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Guest To u
16 hours ago, 3wliya_maryam said:

The fact that people here are giving religious advice to the user isn't even beneficial; even I thought to be able to give him some religious guidance, but then I thought twice; literally its pointless. Allah(سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) guides whom He wills, so no matter how much advice we will give to someone who has left Islam, it won't change anything. Besides he's been this way for 10 years now, so what makes us think that he'll change his views now? 

No,if it is beneficial religious advice the brother may listen to it,don’t turn back on someone who leaves Islam or thinking about thinking they wont change so they should forget about it.

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On 8/13/2019 at 1:18 AM, alih13 said:

I consider this fear tactics. Its the boogie monster in the closet we use to scare kids into doing what we want them. 

I don't believe in a God that is so petty that He feels the need to test His creation and then punish them. This makes as much sense to me as the idea of multiple Gods to you. 

God now makes as much sense to me as a Hindu worshipping a idol does to you. I think Allah is just another idol made by humans, so what if you don't make images out of Him?

Lastly I would tell the Imam is not your God Just and also All powerful? So why does He want to punish me if I can't believe in Him? What difference does it make to Him? 

Actually if you look in any country that has a somewhat stable society you will find that it also has a good justice punishment system because that is the only way to guarantee that humans will obey the laws and so God knows this more than anyone that that is how humans will listen and obey the complete moral laws and guidance that will create a healthy society.

If his intent was to truly punish his creation he wouldn’t have sent 124,000 Prophets as Warner’s.

AND wouldn’t have waited in some cases hundreds of years to actually send a punishment on the ones who mocked his Prophets and warnings.

I believe that through the 10 years that you have been in doubt you never looked in the right place for answers and I doubt you’re wife albeit she’s a good believer, can answer all your questions.

 

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On 8/12/2019 at 2:40 PM, Isaam said:

Because Muslims believe it’s very hard to get into heaven, and we have the fear of Hell.

And Christians believe Jesus paid our debt to God, so heaven is guaranteed to all Christ-followers. We no longer have the fear of hell. But we believe it exists. Our belief in God's purpose of sending Jesus to live and die as a man to secure our salvation from hell, is worth sacrificing everything and everyone else.

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Guest To u
On 8/13/2019 at 9:52 AM, Bakir said:

- I can guess that lack of communication. And that, by itself, is the consequence of losing hope in communication itself (understanding). The breach is greater and greater.

- I believe people "turn astray" more oftenly for what is left unsaid, than for what is publicly said.

- No, though I believe it is more noticeable in my local community because there is just less fear of exposure and shame.

First of all I didnt understand a word of what you said.So could you make it more clearer.Second,please Stop beating around the bush by sugarcoating your answers or not answering directly.and tell us exactly whats causing them to leave. Is it the religion? 

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On 8/13/2019 at 6:10 AM, alih13 said:

yes, I pray even when no one is around. don't ask me why. fasting has been hard due to addiction to smoking, but I do fast in front of others. 

I am also giving my children the best Islamic education possible... I don't want them to have beliefs like mine, if they are happy being Muslims, that's great.

 

This here is the part I find relevant, and others should too. 

From my own experience I have had times where my imaan was so low, not to the point you are now, but to a point where I felt hopeless and that there was no point in the things I did. Yet... I would still pray, I would go off to a quiet room as normal and pray. Why I do not know because sometimes I felt nothing to the untrained mind, but really, if I actually felt nothing I wouldn't pray at all.

You don't know why you pray, but you do. Beneath everything you say on here, there is obviously still something otherwise you would not pray.

You also mention how you still give your kids Islamic teaching and don't want them to have your beliefs, if you were truly deep down convinced then why would you want your kids to follow something you believe to not be true? Somewhere else you mention the boogie monster approach.

I find these things interesting, and as someone who has gone through very low dips in faith I can relate somewhat. Although I found a sense of hope after a year or so, not 10. Perhaps you just haven't found the interpretation of Islam that puts you at peace, because interpretation is all it is at the end of the day. 

I see interpretations like houses, we all mostly have one, and so long as they make us happy, so long as they comply with building regulations (aren't so unorthodox they don't follow the basic rules), have firm foundations (you establish and are firm in your belief) and and so long as we don't build them to annoy others (some people have beliefs and make a point of causing conflict with those who don't share those beliefs) then I don't see the big issue in having your own interpretation.

Nobody else will be accountable for what you believe and the choices you makes except for you.

 

Just a thought.

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4 hours ago, Guest To u said:

First of all I didnt understand a word of what you said.So could you make it more clearer.Second,please Stop beating around the bush by sugarcoating your answers or not answering directly.and tell us exactly whats causing them to leave. Is it the religion? 

You could be a bit more polite, as I'm investing time in posting. Learn some education, I'm not a dog whose job is to answer your questions brought in an unpolite tone. If you want to be worthy of the time of others, start by treating them with a minimum respect.

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thanks for all your replies....

all the wealthy Muslims have this one belief, that Allah provides their wealth and rizq. they thank God for the food they eat and the beautiful life they enjoy. yet when you ask them what of those dying of hunger, where is Allah for them? then it is oppressors of the world that seem to be stealing resources from Allah? 

I don't turn to science, im not one of those agnostic athiest who thinks science can disprove God and will lead the way. science only describes the process.

with Islam or any religion their only proof of God boils down to an argument... primarily this argument, how did it all start? this is just another theory, like a scientist theorizing... where is the proof? please don't point to a bird flapping and a tree and nature as the evidence... why? 

someone mentioned something about a chair and extrapolating from there. Yes, the universe points to a Creator if we think that everything requires a Creator, however intelligence like ours or higher than ours requires communication. A mute Creator that only spoke to 124,000, now a dead Prophets, out of billions doesn't prove God at all. 

Some flying angel supposedly delivering messages from God sounds ridiculous. These people still exist, they see angels, should we start taking them seriously as well?

Science plus religion doesn't prove or disprove anything for me. Intellectuall theories, which I have read enough of, can remain in the books, where is the intelligent God they supposedly prove? 

if ppl missed, I said my return to Islam is through these 2 means:

1. If God speaks to me.

or (wasnt able to add this OR to my last post)

2. a Prophet or living Imam speaks with me and answers my question.

or

3. Something unknown occurs as God wishes.

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26 minutes ago, alih13 said:

thanks for all your replies....

all the wealthy Muslims have this one belief, that Allah provides their wealth and rizq. they thank God for the food they eat and the beautiful life they enjoy. yet when you ask them what of those dying of hunger, where is Allah for them? then it is oppressors of the world that seem to be stealing resources from Allah? 

I don't turn to science, im not one of those agnostic athiest who thinks science can disprove God and will lead the way. science only describes the process.

with Islam or any religion their only proof of God boils down to an argument... primarily this argument, how did it all start? this is just another theory, like a scientist theorizing... where is the proof? please don't point to a bird flapping and a tree and nature as the evidence... why? 

someone mentioned something about a chair and extrapolating from there. Yes, the universe points to a Creator if we think that everything requires a Creator, however intelligence like ours or higher than ours requires communication. A mute Creator that only spoke to 124,000, now a dead Prophets, out of billions doesn't prove God at all. 

Some flying angel supposedly delivering messages from God sounds ridiculous. These people still exist, they see angels, should we start taking them seriously as well?

Science plus religion doesn't prove or disprove anything for me. Intellectuall theories, which I have read enough of, can remain in the books, where is the intelligent God they supposedly prove? 

if ppl missed, I said my return to Islam is through these 2 means:

1. If God speaks to me.

or (wasnt able to add this OR to my last post)

2. a Prophet or living Imam speaks with me and answers my question.

or

3. Something unknown occurs as God wishes.

Nothing of the three will help your case because you will still doubt it. You mentioned about those dying in hunger, if you could humble yourself and see what they see, perhaps you will see God. 

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41 minutes ago, alih13 said:

1. If God speaks to me.

or (wasnt able to add this OR to my last post)

2. a Prophet or living Imam speaks with me and answers my question.

or

3. Something unknown occurs as God wishes.

Salam for number

1.read Qur'an in must if you read at least one page everyday you will find out that it talks with you even you randomly choose & read an Ayah or verse .

2.you can write your question for forty days to Imam Mahdi (aj) & drop it in flowing water or in a well or put it in a special place also you can visit duas.org for bedtime (sleeping) recommendation that explains how you can see a Prophet or Imam in your dream

3.it depends on you what is unknown event because it's unique about any person like as receiving answer from Imam Mahdi(aj) in number 2 that for occuring it you must practice something like as reciting zyarat Ashura for 40 days or other rituals that you can find in duas.org or mafatihul jonan that must be practic s based on procedure that majority of them must continue for 40 days.

Edited by Ashvazdanghe

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