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Why no zakaat or khums on gold jewellery

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Why is there no zakaat or khums on gold jewellery when it is actually like a savings for most people which can be converted into money? Especially in the sub continent that's a way of savings. 

While in the Sunni school of thought, they have scary stories of what will happen to those ladies who don’t pay zakaat on the gold jewellery they have.

Did I miss something?

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I haven't heard the scary stories, but in the Sunni school we are supposed to pay zakat on any assets we have such as silver and gold (if above a certain threshold) and even things like stock. Then we have to take outgoings into consideration... It all gets very complicated and we often have to resort to some online calculator to work it out. I always used to just give 2.5% of my earnings when I went to the mosque on a Friday, but then as I got older I started to become institutionalised.

Would be interesting to see what the school of the Ahlul Bayt do on the matter.

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13 hours ago, Questioner said:

Why is there no zakaat or khums on gold jewellery when it is actually like a savings for most people which can be converted into money? Especially in the sub continent that's a way of savings. 

Salam

Conditions of Zakat for Gold and Silver

There are three conditions for the zakat of gold and silver:

  1. It is obligatory to pay the zakat of gold and silver when they are minted as coins transaction with which is common.
  2. One year must have passed from having them.
  3. Reaching the lower limit: the first lower limit of gold is about ninety six grams and the first lower limit of silver is about seven hundred grams and their zakat is 1⁄40.

http://en.wikishia.net/view/Zakat

13 hours ago, Questioner said:

While in the Sunni school of thought, they have scary stories of what will happen to those ladies who don’t pay zakaat on the gold jewellery they have.

I don't hear such stories but it's from their myths but doesn't has real basis , if it was true it must be paid at least by one of wives of Prophet Muhmmad (pbu) like as Lady Khdija (رضي الله عنه) that was a wealthy woman or specially by Aisha  because all of their narrations & stories about women in Sunni sources refers to her .

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On 5/28/2019 at 7:35 PM, aaaz1618 said:

I haven't heard the scary stories, but in the Sunni school we are supposed to pay zakat on any assets we have such as silver and gold (if above a certain threshold) and even things like stock. Then we have to take outgoings into consideration... It all gets very complicated and we often have to resort to some online calculator to work it out. I always used to just give 2.5% of my earnings when I went to the mosque on a Friday, but then as I got older I started to become institutionalised.

Would be interesting to see what the school of the Ahlul Bayt do on the matter.

 
Scary stories 
 

Zakaah on jewellery that has been prepared for use

 59866

EN

Question

My father-in-Law gave 560grams Gold ornaments at the time of Marriage in 1994. Also we got some gold jewels as a gift from relatives at the time of my wife delivery. I bought some Jewels for my wife in the mean time(1994-2004). Now my wife told me that we have to give 240 Grams gold as a Zakaat. 
My Question is: I should pay Zakaat for all the above 3 categories ?.
Praise be to Allaah.

Jewellery that has been prepared to be worn and used as an adornment is something concerning which the fuqaha’ differed as to whether it is obligatory to pay zakaah on it. The Hanafis are of the view that it is obligatory to pay zakaah on it, but the majority of Maalikis, Shaafa’is and Hanbalis are of the view that it is not obligatory to pay zakaah on it. 

The more correct view is that of the Hanafis, because of the great deal of evidence, including the following: 

1 – The general meaning of the evidence which indicates that it is obligatory to pay zakaah on gold and silver, without differentiating between jewellery that is worn and other kinds. 

2 – It was narrated that ‘Aa’ishah (may Allaah be pleased with her), the wife of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him), said: The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) entered upon me and I was wearing rings of silver on my hand. He said: “What is this, O ‘Aa’ishah?” I said: “I made them to adorn myself for you, O Messenger of Allaah.” He said: “Have you given zakaah on them?” I said: “No.” He said: “The punishment for them in Hell is enough for you.”

Narrated by Abu Dawood, 155; classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in Saheeh Abi Dawood. 

It was narrated from ‘Amr ibn Shu’ayb, from his father, from his grandfather, that a woman came to the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) and she had a daughter of hers with her. On her daughter’s hand were two thick bracelets of gold. He said to her: “Have you given the zakaah on these?” She said: “No.” He said, “Would you like Allaah to make you two bracelets of fire on the Day of Resurrection because of these?” So she took them off and gave them to the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) and said: “They are for Allaah and His Messenger.” Narrated by Abu Dawood, 1563; al-Nasaa’I, 2479; classed as Hasan by al-Albaani in Saheeh Abi Dawood. 

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On 5/29/2019 at 1:17 AM, Ashvazdanghe said:

Salam

Conditions of Zakat for Gold and Silver

There are three conditions for the zakat of gold and silver:

  1. It is obligatory to pay the zakat of gold and silver when they are minted as coins transaction with which is common.
  2. One year must have passed from having them.
  3. Reaching the lower limit: the first lower limit of gold is about ninety six grams and the first lower limit of silver is about seven hundred grams and their zakat is 1⁄40.

http://en.wikishia.net/view/Zakat

I don't hear such stories but it's from their myths but doesn't has real basis , if it was true it must be paid at least by one of wives of Prophet Muhmmad (pbu) like as Lady Khdija (رضي الله عنه) that was a wealthy woman or specially by Aisha  because all of their narrations & stories about women in Sunni sources refers to her .

walaikum asalam

I understand about gold coins and silver coins used as currency.

What I don’t understand is back in those days gold and silver coins were the currency, they were the savings so khums had to be paid on them.

Similarly gold jewellery is like savings also. Why then is there no khums on such savings when on the other hand so many different types of savings have khums on them including material things that can be sold for money. No mention on this category of savings at all.

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1 hour ago, Questioner said:

Similarly gold jewellery is like savings also. Why then is there no khums on such savings when on the other hand so many different types of savings have khums on them including material things that can be sold for money. No mention on this category of savings at all.

Salam by default husband must pays khums & Zakat & property of his wife belongs to her ,also Imam Khamenei says that if woman buys jewelry from his money that earned from her work & borrows it to other  women & she doesn't need that jewelry must pay Khums of it.

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21 hours ago, Ashvazdanghe said:

Salam by default husband must pays khums & Zakat & property of his wife belongs to her ,also Imam Khamenei says that if woman buys jewelry from his money that earned from her work & borrows it to other  women & she doesn't need that jewelry must pay Khums of it.

Walaikum asalam 

But how about gold jewellery she had for herself?

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Also there are gold bars people have even ladies in shape of coins, rectangles, squares.

Those are money. Those are savings. Why are they not khumsable? or zakaatable?

When khums even apply to bags of flour unused for whole year. Why such other valuables are exempt?

It doesnt make sense.:ko:

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17 hours ago, Questioner said:

Walaikum asalam 

But how about gold jewellery she had for herself?

Salam if if it just for herself doesn't has Khums & Zakat

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On 5/28/2019 at 6:53 PM, Questioner said:

Why is there no zakaat or khums on gold jewellery when it is actually like a savings for most people which can be converted into money? Especially in the sub continent that's a way of savings. 

While in the Sunni school of thought, they have scary stories of what will happen to those ladies who don’t pay zakaat on the gold jewellery they have.

Did I miss something?

Part of the reason is that in Islam, the concept of the sha'n of of a woman is very  important and affects some ahkaam relating to her. Zakat is not payable for the amount of gold that is part of her jewellery, and to the limit that is within her sha'n to own and possess, and use if she feels so inclined. So, this level is not the same for all women. For some women, their limit may be 2 to 3 sets of gold, because for their status in society, they are not expected to have more than that, and it would fall in the excess. For some women, even if they have 20 to 30 sets, it falls within what is ordinarily expected of women of their status to own, and so would not be liable for Zakat. 

These rulings can be justified for the same reasons that Islam did NOT set a maximum limit for mahr, despite the apparently obvious "positives" this can have in society. Understanding the concepts of mahrul aam and mahrul mithl can also help make this matter clearer. The societal status of different women varies, and Islam recognizes this difference in status, and incorporates in into the ahkaam. This difference can even be seen in the hijab standards for a labouring class woman who has to work in the fields all day, and a woman who is comfortably sustained within her home and has all her needs provided for her, or has her matters attended to on her behalf.

Wsalaam

Edited by habib e najjaar

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Salam also Imam Ali (عليه السلام)after becoming caliph said he will bring back beit al mal to it's place even it  being paid as dowry of women that proofs when a money in any form becomes property of wife Khums & Zakat doesn't applies on property of women that people were using this matter to escape from paying Khums & Zakat by making their wealth to dowry of women that jewelry for women  is favorite of types of dowry 

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15 hours ago, habib e najjaar said:

Part of the reason is that in Islam, the concept of the sha'n of of a woman is very  important and affects some ahkaam relating to her. Zakat is not payable for the amount of gold that is part of her jewellery, and to the limit that is within her sha'n to own and possess, and use if she feels so inclined. So, this level is not the same for all women. For some women, their limit may be 2 to 3 sets of gold, because for their status in society, they are not expected to have more than that, and it would fall in the excess. For some women, even if they have 20 to 30 sets, it falls within what is ordinarily expected of women of their status to own, and so would not be liable for Zakat. 

These rulings can be justified for the same reasons that Islam did NOT set a maximum limit for mahr, despite the apparently obvious "positives" this can have in society. Understanding the concepts of mahrul aam and mahrul mithl can also help make this matter clearer. The societal status of different women varies, and Islam recognizes this difference in status, and incorporates in into the ahkaam. This difference can even be seen in the hijab standards for a labouring class woman who has to work in the fields all day, and a woman who is comfortably sustained within her home and has all her needs provided for her, or has her matters attended to on her behalf.

Wsalaam

That's quite a thought provoking theory.
But doesnt sha'n kind of co relate in some sense to ego
How much gold she needs is quite dependant on her ego.
E.g. if she has a bangle she needs the thickest possible gold bangle to show off her status
if u do sit with ladies you will know gold for them is a 'show off' thing the thicker the heavier the better they can show off.
some ladies coming back from Hajj need to show one hand of their rings
'this is from mecca'
and show another hand
'this is from medina'

*bling bling*

"so n so mother in law put a lot of gold for her new daughter in law
the necklace was so heavy
the bangles were thick"

so I don’t understand about this sha'n thing other than people to show their status in society n let the poorer feel poorer for not being able to give their ladies especially daughters anything close to what they (sha'n ladies) have.

A poor hajji can’t go into a gold shop to get some gold earrings for his daughter while so  many are flaunting what they can get n wear it right there.

 

what's next all those people living close by the haram and masjid e nabvi in luxurious buildings deserve those stay because of their status?

while so many poor old people have to walk in the heat from afar to get to these masjids?

that's acceptable too because of this sha'n theory?

where does this status thing come in if we are all equal?

how does owning 20 to 30 sets of gold be 'ordinary' for their status.

Which country of this world is not touched by poverty.

I can understand this 20 to 30 sets of gold thing if there was no poverty around.

 

Edited by Questioner

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15 hours ago, Ashvazdanghe said:

Salam also Imam Ali (عليه السلام)after becoming caliph said he will bring back beit al mal to it's place even it  being paid as dowry of women that proofs when a money in any form becomes property of wife Khums & Zakat doesn't applies on property of women that people were using this matter to escape from paying Khums & Zakat by making their wealth to dowry of women that jewelry for women  is favorite of types of dowry 

A woman's savings is khumsable so that money is part of her propery and she still has to pay khums on it.

so in a way a khums does apply to a woman's property doesnt it?

Edited by Questioner

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3 minutes ago, Questioner said:

so I don’t understand about this sha'n thing other than people to show their status in society n let the poorer feel poorer for not being able to give their ladies especially daughters anything close to what they (sha'n ladies) have.

A poor hajji can’t go into a gold shop to get some gold earrings for his daughter while so  many are flaunting what they can get n wear it right there.

 

what's next all those people living close by the haram and masjid e nabvi in luxurious buildings deserve those stay because of their status?

while so many poor old people have to walk in the heat from afar to get to these masjids?

that's acceptable too because of this sha'n theory.

where does this status thing come in if we are all equal?

how does owning 20 to 30 sets of gold be 'ordinary' for their status.

Salam owning 20 to 30 is completely show off & doesn't relate to Sha'n but people specially women think show off is eaqual to Sha'n that is totally wrong for example lady Fatima (sa) just had one neckles from her mother but her Sha'n is over all women from past to future but women like as wife of ummayid Abbasids with all of their wealth didn't have Sha'n

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5 minutes ago, Questioner said:

so in a way a khums does apply to a woman's property doesnt it?

No as I said people were using this tactic by making public wealth to property of their women to avoid paying Khums & Zakat but I'ma Ali (عليه السلام) even they made public property to property of your women ,it won't save them

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6 hours ago, Questioner said:

That's quite a thought provoking theory.
But doesnt sha'n kind of co relate in some sense to ego
How much gold she needs is quite dependant on her ego.
E.g. if she has a bangle she needs the thickest possible gold bangle to show off her status
if u do sit with ladies you will know gold for them is a 'show off' thing the thicker the heavier the better they can show off.
some ladies coming back from Hajj need to show one hand of their rings
'this is from mecca'
and show another hand
'this is from medina'

*bling bling*

"so n so mother in law put a lot of gold for her new daughter in law
the necklace was so heavy
the bangles were thick"

so I don’t understand about this sha'n thing other than people to show their status in society n let the poorer feel poorer for not being able to give their ladies especially daughters anything close to what they (sha'n ladies) have.

A poor hajji can’t go into a gold shop to get some gold earrings for his daughter while so  many are flaunting what they can get n wear it right there.

 

what's next all those people living close by the haram and masjid e nabvi in luxurious buildings deserve those stay because of their status?

while so many poor old people have to walk in the heat from afar to get to these masjids?

that's acceptable too because of this sha'n theory?

where does this status thing come in if we are all equal?

how does owning 20 to 30 sets of gold be 'ordinary' for their status.

Which country of this world is not touched by poverty.

I can understand this 20 to 30 sets of gold thing if there was no poverty around.

 

Status isn't chosen or "shown off". It is an indicator and culmination of a lot of factors such as the lineage she is from, the continuous economic background she comes from, the current financial status, the societal and financial potential she has .. a lot of things which are not easy to explain but affect a lot about the person, and this is why the shariah caters for this "aspect" of a woman, and not only gives her increased rights for some matters, but also increased obligations, like the direct example of the level of hijab required of a woman of a certain class.

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