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just a muslim

What is taqiyya

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Salam all. 

I always thought that the taqiyya that Shias do is basically hiding ones beliefs if one fears harm but it isnt necessary. And my point of view was confirmed by what al-Islam.org say. 

But the problem arose when I came across quite a few narrations from Imam jafar (عليه السلام). that said otherwise:

He said: taqiyya is my deen and the deen of my forefathers. And he has no iman who does not have taqiyya. 

Usool ul kafi 2/217, bihar ul anwar 75/423

Also, he said: if I were to say that the one who abandons taqiyya is like the one who abandons salah, I would be telling the truth. 

Usool ul kafi 2/217, 219

Can someone please explain why al-Islam say one thing while Imam jafar as Sadiq says another? What exactly is taqiyya? 

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Taqqiyah is a word used by nawasib to derail discussions with Shia's or other Muslims friendly towards Shia's.

Edited by Faruk

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Taqiyah is a defensive mechanism and accusation used by non-Muslim Islamaphobes in Youtube comments whenever a Muslim tries to reason with them or expresses a different opinion to them.

It is also utilised by Nawasib as mentioned above, whenever a Shia makes an argument or point which goes against the Nasibi's views.

Edited by Propaganda_of_the_Deed

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14 hours ago, just a Muslim said:

Can someone please explain why al-Islam say one thing while Imam jafar as Sadiq says another? What exactly is taqiyya? 

The word taqiyah comes from waqaya, meaning to protect. In this context, taqiyah means

“to agree with someone, in words or in action, on something which is not true, because of fear of harm from that person”

There are a number of instances in the Holy Qur’an where taqiyah is endorsed. The first is the story of Ammar ibn Yasir who under severe torture gave in and denounced Islam verbally with words. However, his heart never swayed from the true faith. He went to the Prophet distraught, thinking he had lost his religion. The Prophet ((صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم)) asked: ‘was your heart sure of Islam?’ Ammar replied: ‘yes, I only denounced it verbally because of their torture’. The Prophet ((صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم)) said: ‘then it is okay, and if they come and do the same to you again, you say the same thing again’. The following ayah of the Holy Qur’an is regarding this incident.

“Whoever disbelieved in Allah after his belief (except him who is forced thereto and whose heart is at rest with Faith)…theirs will be a great torment.” [16:106]

Also the incident of the believer of Ale Firun can be seen in Qur'an doing taqayah for his protection

Edited by Muslim2010

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2 hours ago, Muslim2010 said:

The word taqiyah comes from waqaya, meaning to protect. In this context, taqiyah means

“to agree with someone, in words or in action, on something which is not true, because of fear of harm from that person”

There are a number of instances in the Holy Qur’an where taqiyah is endorsed. The first is the story of Ammar ibn Yasir who under severe torture gave in and denounced Islam verbally with words. However, his heart never swayed from the true faith. He went to the Prophet distraught, thinking he had lost his religion. The Prophet ((صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم)) asked: ‘was your heart sure of Islam?’ Ammar replied: ‘yes, I only denounced it verbally because of their torture’. The Prophet ((صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم)) said: ‘then it is okay, and if they come and do the same to you again, you say the same thing again’. The following ayah of the Holy Qur’an is regarding this incident.

“Whoever disbelieved in Allah after his belief (except him who is forced thereto and whose heart is at rest with Faith)…theirs will be a great torment.” [16:106]

Also the incident of the believer of Ale Firun can be seen in Qur'an doing taqayah for his protection

I agree with all this. But narrations which I quoted above by Imam jafar say something completely different. 

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4 hours ago, Faruk said:

Taqqiyah is a word used by nawasib to derail discussions with Shia's or other Muslims friendly towards Shia's.

 

4 hours ago, Propaganda_of_the_Deed said:

Taqiyah is a defensive mechanism and accusation used by non-Muslim Islamaphobes in Youtube comments whenever a Muslim tries to reason with them or expresses a different opinion to them.

It is also utilised by Nawasib as mentioned above, whenever a Shia makes an argument or point which goes against the Nasibi's views.

Yes but what about the narrations I quoted? That was the main issue I had. Narrations are telling something completely different

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26 minutes ago, just a Muslim said:

 

Yes but what about the narrations I quoted? That was the main issue I had. Narrations are telling something completely different

1. What's the intention of your question?

To judge or to learn?

2. Can you also tell us the context, the details, the historical time and political landscape of the narration and the scholarly interpretations of these narrations?

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14 hours ago, just a Muslim said:

I agree with all this. But narrations which I quoted above by Imam jafar say something completely different. 

The concept has been mentioned in the verses of Qur'an and hadith of  the Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم).

How do you consider Imam Jafar (عليه السلام) has mentioned a different view? Would you clarify please?

Edited by Muslim2010

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8 hours ago, just a Muslim said:

the taqiyya that Shias do is basically hiding ones beliefs if one fears harm but it isnt necessary.

Not necessary, but it comes in handy in life and death situations.

Despite what Salafi/Wahabbi online forum users claim, Taqiyya does not apply in debates or other online discussions. Its simply not a life or death situation. Most Salafi know this and use it as a means of delegitimizing the Shi'a beliefs during a debate. Its a malicious tactic used to discredit and debase Shi'a and our beliefs. It works extremely well for Salafi when the thread is being read by un-educated or under-educated people. 

The entire logic behind Taqiyaa is based on the situation which caused the Quranic Verses to be revealed regarding it. When Ammar e Yasir was being tortured and he lied in order to save his life after watching his parents tortured to death. His faith was never under doubt, he spoke those words simply to save his life. Its quite logical when you think about, especially when its a life or death situation, it preserves the life of a Muslim. 

8 hours ago, just a Muslim said:

quite a few narrations from Imam jafar (عليه السلام). that said otherwise:

He said: taqiyya is my deen and the deen of my forefathers. And he has no iman who does not have taqiyya. 

Usool ul kafi 2/217, bihar ul anwar 75/423

Also, he said: if I were to say that the one who abandons taqiyya is like the one who abandons salah, I would be telling the truth. 

Usool ul kafi 2/217, 219

The basis upon which Imam Jaffar e Sadiq (عليه السلام) spoke is in regard to the era that he was living in. At the time Al-Mansur was conducting a brutal campaign against Shi'a. Specifically, against the Syeds who descended from Imam Hasan (عليه السلام) as he saw them as legitimate claimants against his throne due to them being the descendants of both Imam Ali (عليه السلام) as the 4th Caliph, and Imam Hasan (عليه السلام) as the 5th Caliph. 

So if you take that into account, then you can properly understand the context of what he was saying. If Shi'a were not to practice Taqiyya at that time then not only would the Shi'a have been eliminated, but also the bloodline of Imam Hasan (عليه السلام). Its no secret that a significant amount of Sunni Syeds (especially in Arabia) descend from Imam Hasan (عليه السلام) as a result of prolonged Taqiyya resulting in them becoming Sunni because of it. 

As such, there is some logic to the usage of Taqiyya. However, it doesn't simply allow a person to lie, it depends on the situation in which you are in. If lying saves the life of a Muslim then what's the problem? 

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2 hours ago, Faruk said:

1. What's the intention of your question?

To judge or to learn?

2. Can you also tell us the context, the details, the historical time and political landscape of the narration and the scholarly interpretations of these narrations?

1. To learn. Not trying to judge. If it is what it is, who am I to say anything? 

2. I can’t. I wouldnt be asking this question otherwise. 

42 minutes ago, Muslim2010 said:

The concept has been mentioned in the verses of Qur'an and hadith of  the Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم).

How do you consider Imam Jafar (عليه السلام) has mentioned a different view? Would you clarify please?

The ahadith I mentioned in the OP. Imam jafar says whoever leaves taqiyya is like the one who leaves salah. While Qur'an says it is permissible to do taqiyya. Implying one is allowed to leave it. 

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6 minutes ago, Akbar673 said:

Not necessary, but it comes in handy in life and death situations.

Despite what Salafi/Wahabbi online forum users claim, Taqiyya does not apply in debates or other online discussions. Its simply not a life or death situation. Most Salafi know this and use it as a means of delegitimizing the Shi'a beliefs during a debate. Its a malicious tactic used to discredit and debase Shi'a and our beliefs. It works extremely well for Salafi when the thread is being read by un-educated or under-educated people. 

The entire logic behind Taqiyaa is based on the situation which caused the Quranic Verses to be revealed regarding it. When Ammar e Yasir was being tortured and he lied in order to save his life after watching his parents tortured to death. His faith was never under doubt, he spoke those words simply to save his life. Its quite logical when you think about, especially when its a life or death situation, it preserves the life of a Muslim. 

The basis upon which Imam Jaffar e Sadiq (عليه السلام) spoke is in regard to the era that he was living in. At the time Al-Mansur was conducting a brutal campaign against Shi'a. Specifically, against the Syeds who descended from Imam Hasan (عليه السلام) as he saw them as legitimate claimants against his throne due to them being the descendants of both Imam Ali (عليه السلام) as the 4th Caliph, and Imam Hasan (عليه السلام) as the 5th Caliph. 

So if you take that into account, then you can properly understand the context of what he was saying. If Shi'a were not to practice Taqiyya at that time then not only would the Shi'a have been eliminated, but also the bloodline of Imam Hasan (عليه السلام). Its no secret that a significant amount of Sunni Syeds (especially in Arabia) descend from Imam Hasan (عليه السلام) as a result of prolonged Taqiyya resulting in them becoming Sunni because of it. 

As such, there is some logic to the usage of Taqiyya. However, it doesn't simply allow a person to lie, it depends on the situation in which you are in. If lying saves the life of a Muslim then what's the problem? 

I have no problem in a Muslim lying to save ones life. Who am I when the Qur'an permits it. 

But what Imam jafar apparently says goes against the Qur'an. Leaving taqiyya is like leaving salah? How is that? 

And whoever does do taqiyya has no imaan? Meaning taqiyya is wajib and whoever doesnt do it is kafir? How does that make any sense? 

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28 minutes ago, just a Muslim said:

1. To learn. Not trying to judge. If it is what it is, who am I to say anything? 

2. I can’t. I wouldnt be asking this question otherwise. 

1. That still says nothing about your intention. 

2. How did you came across this hadith? It's strange that you found this in your 'research' without any context, detail or whatsoever.

Edited by Faruk

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2 hours ago, just a Muslim said:

But what Imam jafar apparently says goes against the Qur'an. Leaving taqiyya is like leaving salah? How is that? 

Please see my previous post regarding the situation and context under which he was speaking. That is critical to understanding what he is saying.

11 hours ago, just a Muslim said:

He said: taqiyya is my deen and the deen of my forefathers. And he has no iman who does not have taqiyya. 

Usool ul kafi 2/217, bihar ul anwar 75/423

I'm not familiar with the Isnad of this hadith.

However, let's assume this is graded as Sahih for the sake of discussion. If he is saying Taqiyya is his deen and the deen of his forefathers (its safe to assume that when he is saying this, he is speaking specifically of the Holy Prophet ((صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم)) and the previous 5 Imams (عليه السلام) ) then doesn't it sound like he is saying that Taqiyya is indeed a part of his faith since the Qur'an allows it? By saying that he believes and supports anything which has been mentioned in the Qur'an? That's how I'm reading it.

Then he goes on to say that no person can have faith, if he does not adhere to what the Qur'an has allowed him to do? 

Again, this is assuming that the hadith is graded as being valid.

11 hours ago, just a Muslim said:

Also, he said: if I were to say that the one who abandons taqiyya is like the one who abandons salah, I would be telling the truth. 

Usool ul kafi 2/217, 219

Again, I don't take every hadith from Al Kafi as reliable. Its not a collection based on validity, its simply a bulk collection that needs grading to determine whether its acceptable.

Again, assuming this is graded as Sahih. Sounds to me that is he saying that anyone who abandons that which the Qur'an has made acceptable is the same as the one who abandons prayer. Doesn't that sound like he is stating the importance of the Qur'an and using Taqiyya as an example? How important it is to accept what it has made acceptable, and to deny that which it has made unacceptable? 

Post the Isnad of the two hadith you have quoted. As I said, not every hadith in Al Kafi is accepted.

2 hours ago, just a Muslim said:

And whoever does do taqiyya has no imaan?

How are you interpreting that? Nowhere in the two hadith you've posted does it mention that.

2 hours ago, just a Muslim said:

Meaning taqiyya is wajib and whoever doesnt do it is kafir?

Please explain how you arrived at that conclusion based on the hadith you posted. 

2 hours ago, just a Muslim said:

How does that make any sense? 

I'm having a hard time understanding your logic.

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https://www.al-Islam.org/taqiyyah-Sayyid-akhtar-Rizvi

What is Taqiyah? When can it be used? Best way to perform taqiyah, and when it is not allowed.

_________________________________________________________________________________

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“Concealing or disguising one’s beliefs, convictions, ideas, feelings, opinions, and/or strategies at a time of eminent danger... to save oneself for the sake of the religion; from physical and/or mental injury.”

As you can see: chronically & historically, we were always persecuted & underprivileged for our beliefs: so in order to extricate or save ourselves from death

(or killing), we had to dissimulate & deny our faith. Thus and so, in order to elucidate the meaning for you, I’d recommend reading any

chronicle, and it’ll be elucidated for you (I hope). Many people nowadays blame us for obfuscating

our identities, while they’re closing their eyes, on why we did so, in a perfunctory manner.

However, thankfully, now everyone can express his/her feelings and beliefs,

through the internet or through the helpful social media, so the

chains of the past & the restrictions are gone,

and we can hopefully share our ideas

with the outside world.

Thank you!

Edited by Simon the Canaanite

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On 5/2/2019 at 6:00 PM, just a Muslim said:

The ahadith I mentioned in the OP. Imam jafar says whoever leaves taqiyya is like the one who leaves salah. While Qur'an says it is permissible to do taqiyya. Implying one is allowed to leave it. 

The context of the hadith should be look in the light of the concept instead of simply creating a doubt that meaning of taqaya is different in hadith. I do not find any difference between the meaning of taqaya and hadith of Imam as.

Do you know how the time Imams spent during the periods of Bani umamyad and Abbasid caliphate? Do you know that 11 of Imams were killed and martyred duirng these caliphate?

wasalam

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On 5/2/2019 at 2:31 PM, just a Muslim said:

Salam all. 

I always thought that the taqiyya that Shias do is basically hiding ones beliefs if one fears harm but it isnt necessary. And my point of view was confirmed by what al-Islam.org say. 

But the problem arose when I came across quite a few narrations from Imam jafar (عليه السلام). that said otherwise:

He said: taqiyya is my deen and the deen of my forefathers. And he has no iman who does not have taqiyya. 

Usool ul kafi 2/217, bihar ul anwar 75/423

Also, he said: if I were to say that the one who abandons taqiyya is like the one who abandons salah, I would be telling the truth. 

Usool ul kafi 2/217, 219

Can someone please explain why al-Islam say one thing while Imam jafar as Sadiq says another? What exactly is taqiyya? 

Wasalam

The word taqiyyah comes from waqaya, meaning to protect.

So any act by which one protect his life or protect himself from persecution (of tyrant)  or protection of faith is taqiyyah.

Ali b. Ibrahim from his father from Ibn Umair from Hisham b. Salim and others from Abi Abdullah(عليه السلام) regarding the word of Allah mighty and majestic “those will be given their reward twice because they are steadfast ( He(عليه السلام) said : on which they were patient was taqiyyah) and they repel the good with evil. He(عليه السلام) said good is protection  and  bad is spreading (of terror).   Al kafi vol 2 pg 217 hadith 1

Imam Ali(عليه السلام) preferred patience over putting  his family to death.

I looked and found that there is no supporter for me except family, so I refrained from thrusting them unto death. I kept my eyes closed despite motes in them. I drank despite choking of throat. I exercised patience despite trouble in breathing and despite having to take sour colocynth as food.   Nahjul balagah sermon 26

From him from Ahmad b. Muhammad from Muammar b.Khalad  “He said I asked Aba al-Hasan (عليه السلام) regarding uprising against rulers  He(عليه السلام) said Abu Ja’far(عليه السلام) said al -taqiyyah is my religion and religion of my forefathers there is no faith who does not have taqiyya.    Al Kafi vol 2 pg 219 Hadith 12

Messenger of Allah Protected his life by Hijrah from Mecca to Madina

Imam Ali(عليه السلام) preferred patience over war in the absence of supporter

Then I began to think whether I should assault or endure calmly the blinding darkness of tribulations wherein the grown up are made feeble and the young grow old and the true believer acts under strain till he meets Allah (on his death).

I found that endurance thereon was wiser. So I adopted patience although there was [Edited Out]ing in the eye and suffocation (of mortification) in the throat. I watched the plundering of my inheritance till the first one went his way but handed over the Caliphate to Ibn al-Khattab after himself.     Nahjul Balagah sermon 3

From him from Ahmad b.Muhammad  from Hasan b.Ali from Darasta al-Wasti He said Abi Abdullah(عليه السلام) said nothing has reached to me from Taqiya of anyone  (of former generation) similar to taqiya of Ashab al-kahaf they were participating in the festival and were pulling the sashes so Allah gave them their reward twice.  Al kafi vol 2 pg 218 hadith 8

Ashab al-Kahaf had to participate in the act of shirk but still they protected themselves from the tyrant ruler.

 From some of my companions from Ahmad b. Muhammad b. Khalid from Uthman b. Isa from Sama’ah from Abi basir he said Abi Abdullah(عليه السلام) said taqiya is from the religion of Allah. I said from the religion of Allah? He said yes by Allah from the religion of Allah and Indeed Yusuf said “O caravan! you are most surely thieves” by Allah they did’nt steal anything.And Ibrahim said “verily I m sick” by Allah he was not sick.  Al kafi vol 2 pg 217 hadith 3

 The people of Ibrahim(عليه السلام) went out for festival but he  didn’t want go with them. Ibrahim(عليه السلام) protected himself from participating in festival of shirk.

 Yusuf (عليه السلام) secured himself against violation of the king’s law  “ it was not (lawful) that he should take his brother under the king's law unless Allah willed it.12:76

Edited by elite

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Taqiyya is a part of Islamic belief. The People of Ignorance, something that everyone oddly either never mentions on purpose or omits unknowingly, also believe in it. It is a consensus among mainstream Sunni ulama that a Sunni person forced to eat pork or drink alcohol, should do so instead of choosing death. The summary on that can be found for example in Fatḥ al-Bārī fī Sharḥ Ṣaḥīḥ al-Bukhārī by Ibn Ḥajar al-ʿAsqalānī, where he explicitly proves so from Ṣaḥīḥ al-Bukhārī:

Quote

أجمعوا على أن من أكره على الكفر واختار القتل أنه أعظم أجرا عند الله ممن اختار الرخصة ، وأما غير الكفر فإن أكره على أكل الخنزير وشرب الخمر مثلا فالفعل أولى

Al-Tabari comments on sura XVI, verse 106 (Tafsir, Bulak 1323, xxiv, 122): "If any one is compelled and professes unbelief with his tongue, while his heart contradicts him, in order to escape his enemies, no blame falls on him, because God takes his servants as their hearts believe." In practice, for example, Ahmad ibn Abi Jum'ah issued fatwa in early 16th century instructing the Sunnis in Spain about how to secretly practice their religion, and granting comprehensive dispensations for them to publicly conform to Christianity and performing acts normally forbidden in Islam when necessary to survive. It includes relaxed instructions for fulfilling the ritual prayers, the ritual charity, and the ritual ablution, and recommendations when obliged to violate Islamic law, such as worshipping as Christians, committing blasphemy, and consuming pork and wine. Sunnis in Muslim majority countries that came under the yolk of the Soviet communism (Tatarstan, Kazakhstan, Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan, Kyrgyzstan), actively resorted to denial of their faith for generations to come. There’s also a trend among Sunni women living in the West to take off their hijab in search of better work prospects due to Islamophobia. Wahhabis are notorious at using deception and outward lies in order to carry out their terrorism. Taqiyya isn’t only confined and inclusive to Shia Muslims, but we don’t use it for petty reasons and worldly desires but to preserve the real Islamic teachings that the People of Ignorance try to erase, forget and destroy. 

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Oh, I never knew Taqiyya is okay. I always thought it’s a major sin because I remember I asked in one Sunni webs that if someone asked me if I am Muslim and I said no because of fear of harm, it it haram, he is yes and it’s one of the worst sin. Plus he told me I should not be scared from anyone except Allah. 

 

Thank you guys for the clarification.

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Salam.
which book of al-Islam, you studied about taqiyyah?
did you find information from the Shia rebuts?
if not, please see question 31 from this book.
Question 31: What is the criterion of taqiyyah {dissimulation}?
https://www.al-Islam.org/Shia-rebuts-Sayyid-rida-husayni-nasab
Allah bless you!

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