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In the Name of God بسم الله
313 Seeker

Marjas are Fallible

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Salam,

Do you treat your marjas as infallible or are you aware that they make mistakes and teach things that are wrong at times? Are you aware that our ideas of Islam could be wrong and what we are taught is full of shortcomings? Feel free to share your experience where you yourself found out that you were wrong about something in Islam, or s great scholar who admitted a mistake in their beliefs. I used to believe - like so many Islamic scholars - that all Prophets friends were great, then I changed my mind about it, and had not problem admitting it. 

I believe that a good scholar is a person who admits that they are imperfect and who are not afraid to learn, develop, evolve, and change their opinions about things. 

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6 minutes ago, memoryblack said:

only the Prophets and Ahlul Bayt are infallible

Personally I disagree but that is not part of this discussion in a direct sense. I know that my opinion on this is at odds with 99.9% of the community here.

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Walaykum as salam, 

Nobody considers marājiʿ to be infallible in the sense of the Fourteen ma‘ṣūmūn or the Prophets, but they are a bridge between us and the Imams during the time of ghayba. We follow the mujtahids on the fiqh issues because let’s be honest, people left alone without a clear guidance on furu al-din usually cause corruption and mischief. There are people who reach the stage of ijtihad and follow their own rulings, I.e. they are knowledgeable enough to derive the laws by themselves, but they are in extremely small minority. By the way, this is a solid argument against Wahhabism and their rejection of taqlid. As a Usulis, we take ijtihad to be a part of al-wajib al-kifa'I, therefore the marājiʿ have very purposeful role in our Ummah. I remember debating once an Akhbari from Pakistan who told me we shouldn’t do taqlid to marja’. Once I asked him how he derives sharia laws on everyday life, for example if the perfumes he uses are halal because they contain alcohol, he told me laughably that he consults his auntie on the issues he isn’t sure of. Subhanallah, that’s a case of full infallibility right there. 

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I don't think any of our maraja claim to be infallible in the first place. It's very rational that they are in a better position than us to derive rulings because they spent all their lives studying the traditions of our Imams (عليه السلام). There is a chance that one of their rulings may be incorrect (even if the chance is 1%), but it gives us no right to arrogantly reject the laws. On the day of judgement we will be held accountable because we had no knowledge of the rulings yet we were willing to reject them. That's the reason why taqleed is wajib on us, we can''t create our own rules. Yes, everything in our books of fiqh isn't 100% correct but it is our duty to follow the rules as a precaution, and anyone with some rationality will agree.

Our maraja say- "According to the research I have done, these are the rulings and here are the proofs etc.".  No one claims to be infallible. 

 

Edited by ali_fatheroforphans

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@OrthodoxTruth and @ali_fatheroforphans

Did you ever think about what the Marjas teaching you in a more critical sense? Most of the time they don’t share the Qur'an/ hadith reasoning behind their rulings. Maybe they are wrong about more than 1%. Did you ever hear about a scholar who realized something that contradicts his past beliefs? 

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4 minutes ago, 313 Seeker said:

@OrthodoxTruth and @ali_fatheroforphans

Did you ever think about what the Marjas teaching you in a more critical sense? Most of the time they don’t share the Qur'an/ hadith reasoning behind their rulings. Maybe they are wrong about more than 1%. Did you ever hear about a scholar who realized something that contradicts his past beliefs? 

We could however think they do less mistakes than us.

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3 minutes ago, Mohammadi_follower said:

The main problem of our time is the raising of ayatollah made in google.

Every Marja, every scholar is a unique case in front of God. Impossible to generalise, and we should be alert to hypocrisy even among our own creed. Also remember aya Allah is sign of Allah, including verses in the Qur'an. The sun and moon and we ourselves are ayat. Nobody has a claim to monopolize those terms. You and I are also signs of God. 

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1 minute ago, 313 Seeker said:

Every Marja, every scholar is a unique case in front of God. Impossible to generalise, and we should be alert to hypocrisy even among our own creed. Also remember aya Allah is sign of Allah, including verses in the Qur'an. The sun and moon and we ourselves are ayat. Nobody has a claim to monopolize those terms. You and I are also signs of God. 

I was in fact sarcastic and talking about people coming from nowhere and saying in internet that they have probably more knowledges that some marjas who studed Islam all their lifes.

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46 minutes ago, 313 Seeker said:

Most of the time they don’t share the Qur'an/ hadith reasoning behind their rulings. Maybe they are wrong about more than 1%.

They do have a book which explains the reasoning behind every rule, however the books are in Arabic and are in volumes.

That's what I've heard. The English books we use are simplified.

Edited by ali_fatheroforphans

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