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In the Name of God بسم الله
Islandsandmirrors

Zina and why it’s haram

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Guest Itzme101

What about some people having mutah with multiple people before marriage?

What about the zina of the eyes which a lot of people do because marriage has been made so difficult in the Muslim community?

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17 hours ago, Islandsandmirrors said:

Obviously, we all know that Zina or sex outside of marriage is haram. I think I found out why today. 

Non-Muslims have no shame in having 10, 20, even 50 different sexual partners and they think it’s all fun. Zina make sexual intimacy between a husband and wife cheap. I always wondered why sex before marriage was a sin if you were going to get married to that person, however most people who commit Zina aren’t intending to get married, at least not right away, and that’s why Allah says that it’s an indecency and an evil way. 

Salam,

Islam means peace.  Islam attempts to create law & order or control on human natural instincts so that we can survive and live in peace.

For example, when a person addicted to illegal drug, alchohol or free sex, there will be less control and major crimes likely to occur.  

 Just imagine if the rule about zina does not exist.  Sex is free between men and women.  Married couples can have children, but we don't know the real father. Men and women can have sex with anyone, even children !!! Chaos everywhere.

By making the marriage as an holy institution and "sexual intimacy between husband and wife" is even holier, Islam is to maintain peace, order and harmony in human society.  Zina is the opposite, and that is why it is haram and the penalty is heavy.

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13 hours ago, Guest Itzme101 said:

What about some people having mutah with multiple people before marriage?

Zina isn’t the same thing as a religious nikah mutah. One is an unlawful sexual intercourse, the other is a legal marriage between two consenting adults that comes with consequences and rules. “Whataboutism” is not a valid argument. Nikah mutah isn’t meant as a substitute for the relationships before or during marriage. If some Muslim uses nikah mutah for the sole purpose of sexual gratification instead of a nikah, then he will answer for his intentions and actions on the Judgment Day.

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11 hours ago, layman said:

Salam,

Islam means peace.  Islam attempts to create law & order or control on human natural instincts so that we can survive and live in peace.

For example, when a person addicted to illegal drug, alchohol or free sex, there will be less control and major crimes likely to occur.  

 Just imagine if the rule about zina does not exist.  Sex is free between men and women.  Married couples can have children, but we don't know the real father. Men and women can have sex with anyone, even children !!! Chaos everywhere.

By making the marriage as an holy institution and "sexual intimacy between husband and wife" is even holier, Islam is to maintain peace, order and harmony in human society.  Zina is the opposite, and that is why it is haram and the penalty is heavy.

You've said it very well.

I'd also add that like pornography, the ultimate role it has in society is a destruction of the family. It appears innocent on the surface, what could be more natural than sex right? but things are way more serious (and aren't as simple) than that when you get down the specifics and the way that ideas perpetuate a culture. 

What we have over in the mainstream Western world is people who can't commit, people who share nothing in common and people who have no sense of self-discipline and also people who end up loosing any sense of value to their sexuality (were it just gets thrown around as a inclination-based pleasure rather than anything personally or spiritually significant). 

Sex is a holy thing and I wish more people these days would realize it. Sex is also a powerful and very beautiful thing. But the insentient obsession with it in the West definitely has turned it into a carnal, capitalistic (hence prostitution) downfall of family.

Edited by HakimPtsid

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Guest AbdulKarim_NolaATX
On 4/11/2019 at 9:32 PM, Islandsandmirrors said:

Obviously, we all know that Zina or sex outside of marriage is haram. I think I found out why today. 

Non-Muslims have no shame in having 10, 20, even 50 different sexual partners and they think it’s all fun. Zina make sexual intimacy between a husband and wife cheap. I always wondered why sex before marriage was a sin if you were going to get married to that person, however most people who commit Zina aren’t intending to get married, at least not right away, and that’s why Allah says that it’s an indecency and an evil way. 

Bismillah 

 

Asalaam wa laikum wa rahmatullahi wa barakatu 

 

May Allah shower his mercy and blessings upon Muhammad and his family. 

 

Zina is haraam first and foremost because Allah deems it haraam which means there can never be any good to come from it in any society at any period of time. The Sin and it’s negatives outweighs the uncontrollable gratification that man may find in it. 

 

Zina is a characteristic of the unbelievers so like all the other sins it serves as a form of rebellion against Allahs sovereignty and kingdom. The sin means something different to unbelievers than it does for the believers. 

 

Allah Ta’ala has made copulation between man and woman a holy process. This desire serves as the natural and holy process of transitioning souls to the Earth. The woman’s womb serves as a star-gate. This is how Allah sends his perfect believing souls. Zina and adultery acts as an impurity to the entire process of sending such a perfected soul. Shaitan then has a claim and So there is a higher chance of a soul entering the world from such a unclean act becoming an unbeliever and rebelling against Allah. This explains why the punishment for such crime is stern in the Holy Qur'an. Repentance is not only detrimental for the participants of such crime but also for the possible soul that could be born from such crime in its chances of being a believer. 

 

Imam Ja’far AS has said there are three signs of a person born from adultery. 1. The person has a tendency to harm people. 2 The person also looks to engage in adultery and 3. The person has ill will towards the Ahlul Bayt. 

 

I can go into many sub topics of Zina and why it’s haraam and it’s plague upon societies but I’m sure you can understand and can further your knowledge insh’Allah. If you have any questions feel free to ask Insha’Allah. 

 

May Allah have mercy on the believing men and women. 

 

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6 hours ago, HakimPtsid said:

What we have over in the mainstream Western world is people who can't commit,

This is very true. In another forum I was on (I wrote a recent thread on it) many people pointed out how “in love” I was with my husband. What they meant was they’d never seen commitment like that, especially at my age. Actually, I don’t think my or anyone else’s age is the main factor. Non-Muslims who live together before marriage and commit Zina are, as a whole, less likely to commit to their marriages. Even the couples who were together years before marriage have no problem divorcing only a few years after over nothing. Lack of commitment is the number one reason most marriages today end in divorce—not abuse, not alcoholism—commitment. 

I even mentioned there that the mindset to commit must be there prior to marriage, or else even marriages will fail to work out. Obviously, I was met with resistance and was told something along the lines of people “need to date lots of people and discover what they want.” They even encouraged another woman in her early twenties to leave her seven year relationship all because she was getting a bit bored, and that most people shouldn’t stay with someone they dated since high school. 

They have no problem telling others to leave their relationships over juvenile things such as boredom and wanting to “travel and find one’s self.”

Not to mention that many men and women have likely had sexual partners in the double digits by the time they are in their mid-twenties. Do they really think that they are built for marriage and commitment? 

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11 minutes ago, SoRoUsH said:

Salam, 

Most of your arguments are based on a flawed assumption: sex is special thing. 

Sex is special, it is as special as food. No more, no less. If you don't make a big deal about eating a variety of Halal food, then you shouldn't make a big deal about having Halal sex with a variety of people. 

There's absolutely nothing wrong,  strange, or undesirable with Muta'a. 

Zina is as forbidden as eating Haram food. Like eating Haram food, Zina is bad because it's beyond the boundary of God's permitted blessings. 

We should treat sex as casualty as we treat food. They're both blessings from God. We can have plenty of both, and different varieties. 

To think of sex as something extraordinary is to Christianize sex. Early Christian opponents of Islam and The Prophet considered him a pervert for his sexual teachings and partners. We must not hold a Christian view of sex. 

Even today, Catholics view the main purpose of sex as procreative. If one doesn't have sex for procreative purposes, then one shouldn't have it. 

In Islam, Halal sex, even just for pleasure and unitive purposes, is good and encouraged. 

I’m confused... you’re saying that sex is not special? That to think of sex as something special to only be shared by a husband and wife (mutah or Nikah) is to “Christianize” it? I’ve never heard such bollocks in my life. 

Of course sex is special and to not be cheaply given away to some stranger, mutah or through a one-night stand. Your body (and sex) is worth more than that. The intention of mutah is to make a halal alternative for those who can’t afford to get married permanently, not so one can sleep around. If one’s intention of mutah IS to sleep around, then this is no better than the non-Muslims who have haram encounters and selfishly “test run” a relationship.  

Studies have shown that the less partners one has prior to permanent marriage, the more likely the marriage is to be successful and couples rate highly their marriage satisfaction. Couples who have even had 5-10 partners increase their divorce rate significantly. 

Edited by Islandsandmirrors

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19 minutes ago, SoRoUsH said:

Salam, 

Most of your arguments are based on a flawed assumption: sex is special thing. 

Sex is special, it is as special as food. No more, no less. If you don't make a big deal about eating a variety of Halal food, then you shouldn't make a big deal about having Halal sex with a variety of people. 

There's absolutely nothing wrong,  strange, or undesirable with Muta'a. There are multiple authentic narrations that encourage Muta'a and consider it mustahab.

Zina is as forbidden as eating Haram food. Like eating Haram food, Zina is bad because it's beyond the boundary of God's permitted blessings. Just as there are specific criteria that make food Halal, there are specific criteria that make sex halal. And Nikah isn't a necessary requirement. Our problem is, we've come to define "marriage" in a Christian way. A better word would be "coupling." "Marriage" comes with a baggage of concepts and ideas, many of which are highly influenced by non-Islamic cultures. We can "couple", according to the given criteria, and as couples we can have sex, without any problem. 

We should treat sex as casualty as we treat food. They're both blessings from God. We can have plenty of both, and different varieties. 

To think of sex as something extraordinary is to Christianize sex. Early Christian opponents of Islam and The Prophet considered him a pervert for his sexual teachings and partners. We must not hold a Christian view of sex. 

Even today, Catholics view the main purpose of sex as procreative. If one doesn't have sex for procreative purposes, then one shouldn't have it. 

In Islam, Halal sex, even just for pleasure and unitive purposes, is good and encouraged. 

I like the general idea of your post but personally I think it's a little more significant than mere food. 

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3 hours ago, Islandsandmirrors said:

only be shared by a husband and wife (mutah or Nikah) is

A Muta'a could be as short as 5 minutes. It's sole purpose could be Halal sex. It's special, just like food, because it's a blessing from Allah. What else is so special about a five-minute sex session? It's special because it's Halal, and it quenches a human need.

3 hours ago, Islandsandmirrors said:

Of course sex is special and to not be cheaply given away to some stranger, mutah or through a one-night stand.

This is not an Islamic view. Where do you get idea from? What's your source? We've come to, mistakenly, hold this view by default. Consider the permission and criteria of Muta'a. There's nothing "cheap" about sex. Just like there's nothing "cheap" about a piece of bread, or a small snack.

Your view is baseless and "bollocks." Before you reply hastily, stop, gather authentic narrations on Muta'a, then we'll examine them together. 

3 hours ago, Islandsandmirrors said:

The intention of mutah is to make a halal alternative for those who can’t afford to get married permanently, not so one can sleep around.

Prove your position through authentic narrations of Ahlul Bayt (عليه السلام).

Before you hastily reply, stop, gather authentic narrations on Muta'a, post them here, then we'll continue.

3 hours ago, Islandsandmirrors said:

Studies have shown

Studies have shown a lot about healthy eating, too, healthy diets. But if you choose to ignore them and eat non-healthy Halal foods, you're not commiting anything Haram. 

Teachings of Ahlul Bayt (عليه السلام) give us plenty of options, a broad boundary. Within this boundary, among Halal options, some are better and healthier than others. But the worse options aren't Haram. 

Having Halal sex with multiple partners, through Muta'a, may not be the best choice, but it's not Haram. 

I won't continue this discussion with you until you gather some authentic narrations on Muta'a, or until you support your position through authentic narrations. 

Keep in mind, being here for years, seeing hundreds of threads on Muta'a, searching for and studying authentic narrations on Muta'a, I'm not clueless. 

 

Edited by SoRoUsH

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2 hours ago, ireallywannaknow said:

I like the general idea of your post but personally I think it's a little more significant than mere food. 

Why do you think so? 

The problem is, we don't think of food as something special as it really is. 

Food sustains us. It's a gift from Allah. 

Why is it any less special than sex? Is it because we're regularly blessed with it and comes to us rather easily, in comparison with sex?

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3 hours ago, SoRoUsH said:

Zina is as forbidden as eating Haram food.

Pretty sure the sharia punishment for zina is way harsher than the punishment for haram food. Your comparison makes little sense.

Food is essential for our survival. Intercourse isnt.

Food is available to all and in fact compulsory for all humans to eat because we as humans and creation of Allah, have the duty to maintain our health and treat our body like it is a amanah that we need to take care of perfectly until Allah decides to take life back. Intercourse is only permitted in specific circumstances. It's not haram to die without having ever been intimate. Its not an obligatory act. It's purely recreational and partially a mode of worship (procreation). 

3 hours ago, SoRoUsH said:

If one doesn't have sex for procreative purposes, then one shouldn't have it. 

 

3 hours ago, SoRoUsH said:

In Islam, Halal sex, even just for pleasure and unitive purposes, is good and encouraged. 

Arent you contradicting yourself? On the one hand, only be intimate for the sake of procreation, on the other hand intercourse for the sake of pleasure is encouraged. 

I think you're downplaying the importance of intimacy and are trivialising it alot. You can’t "christianize" or "westernize" a human behaviour that has existed since the beginning of time.

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9 minutes ago, SoRoUsH said:

Why is it any less special than sex? Is it because we're regularly blessed with it and comes to us rather easily, in comparison with sex?

Food is completely unemotional and you can eat with anyone. As long as you're eating halal food, you can eat with a non mahram, with a child with anyone. Intercourse is giving up your modesty. You are giving away a part of yourself. As Muslims, we guard our modesty very very much. So when the time comes to give it up, it will be a physical and emotional challenge. It's not as easy as eating. To compare it to eating is to trivialize such an important act. You can’t just have intercourse with anyone. It needs to be someone you're comfortable with etc etc . Its something you share with one person or very few people. Its something you do in complete privacy and something that takes alot of emotional vulnerability to do. You're right, intercourse isnt very very sacred in Islam considering polygamy and mutah but that doesnt mean it's something as trivial as food. Food is almost like a chore. There is no emotional vulnerability or attachment when a person eats. Intercourse is all about the intimacy and emotional attachment. In fact, studies show that emotional intimacy correlates to the physical aspect of intercourse.

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14 minutes ago, 2Timeless said:

Arent you contradicting yourself? On the one hand, only be intimate for the sake of procreation, on the other hand intercourse for the sake of pleasure is encouraged. 

I think you're downplaying the importance of intimacy and are trivialising it alot. You can’t "christianize" or "westernize" a human behaviour that has existed since the beginning of time.

I'm not contradicting myself. Read what I said carefully.

Sex is is necessary for a healthy life, too. Don't downplay the significance of sex. Read up on the enormous positive effects of sex on human health. 

Intimacy and sex are two different issues. You don't have to be intimate to have sex. There's no requirement to be intimate first, before being allowed to have sex. See the two requirements for Muta'a. Nothing else is needed. 

Don't conflate having sex with being intimate.

Edited by SoRoUsH

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1 minute ago, SoRoUsH said:

Sex is is necessary for a healthy life, too. Don't downplay the significance of sex. Read up on the enormous positive effects of sex on human health

It is necessary but humans can live happily and healthily without it. Our lives do not depend on it like we depend on food. We can live very healthy lives without it, it's not vital.

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2 minutes ago, 2Timeless said:

Intercourse is giving up your modesty.

Complete, utter, nonsense. 

 

3 minutes ago, 2Timeless said:

You're right, intercourse isnt very very sacred in Islam considering polygamy and mutah but that doesnt mean it's something as trivial as food

There's nothing trivia about food.

 

4 minutes ago, 2Timeless said:

Intercourse is all about the intimacy and emotional attachment.

Intercourse and intimacy are different. Don't conflate them.

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1 minute ago, SoRoUsH said:

Complete, utter, nonsense. 

 

If you're not willing to address all my points and elaborate on "utter nonsense", how are we meant to have a constructive discussion? 

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1 minute ago, SoRoUsH said:

No. They can't. 

Yes they can. You can literally survive without ever touching another person sexually ever. You simply cannot survive without food after a certain period of time. That's a fact.

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3 minutes ago, SoRoUsH said:

I won't continue this discussion until authentic narrations of Ahlul Bayt (عليه السلام) on Muta'a are present. 

I don't care much for baseless conventional views. 

This thread isn't about mutah and the  points you've raised have absolutely nothing to do with mutah. Your point is intercourse is as necessary and unextraordinary as food. How is that in any way related to mutah? Mutah is also used for 'halal dating ' where people simply joke and talk to each other without the restraints that would otherwise be on them. 

Also, very nice of you, thanks :) just seems like you have no way to support the curious claims you make.

Edited by 2Timeless

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1 hour ago, SoRoUsH said:

won't continue this discussion with you until you gather some authentic narrations on Muta'a, or until you support your position through authentic narrations. 

Keep in mind, being here for years, seeing hundreds of threads on Muta'a, searching for and studying authentic narrations on Muta'a, I'm not clueless

The discussion isn’t even about mutah. The OP is about non-Muslims who have multiple sexual partners in the double or even triple digits prior to marriage and how people like that can never understand true commitment. 

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1 hour ago, Islandsandmirrors said:

The discussion isn’t even about mutah. The OP is about non-Muslims who have multiple sexual partners in the double or even triple digits prior to marriage and how people like that can never understand true commitment. 

There's nothing outrageous or Haram about having multiple or numerous sexual partners. Let me introduce you to the teachings of Ahlul Bayt (عليه السلام). 

 

Here's an authentic narration:

محمد بن يحيى ، عن أحمد بن محمد ، عن ابن محبوب ، عن ابن رئاب ، عن زرارة بن أعين قال : قلت : ما يحل من المتعة ؟ قال : كم شئت .

...from Muhammad b. Yahya from Ahmad b. Muhammad from Ibn Mahbub from Ibn Ri’ab from Zurara b. A`yan.  He said: I said: What is allowed from mut`a?  He said: However many you want.

 

Another authentic narration: 

 محمد بن يعقوب ، عن الحسين بن محمد ، عن أحمد بن إسحاق ، عن بكر بن محمد قال : سألت أبا الحسن ( عليه السلام ) عن المتعة ، أهي من الاربع ؟ فقال : لا . 

 ورواه الحميري في ( قرب الاسناد ) عن أحمد بن إسحاق ، مثله . 

1 – Muhammad b. Ya`qub from al-Husayn b. Muhammad from Ahmad b. Ishaq from Bakr b. Muhammad.  He said: I asked Abu ‘l-Hasan عليه السلام about mut`a, is she from the four?  So he said: No.

 

Another authentic narration: 

عن علي بن إبراهيم ، عن أبيه ، عن ابن أبي عمير ، عن عمر بن اُذينة ، عن أبي عبدالله ( عليه السلام ) ، قال : قلت له : كم يحل من المتعة ؟ قال : فقال : هن بمنزلة الاماء . 

And from `Ali b. Ibrahim from his father from Ibn Abi `Umayr from `Umar b. Udhayna from Abu `Abdillah عليه السلام.  He said: I said to him: How many are allowed in mut`a?  So he said: They are of the status of slave women.

 

And another authentic narration: 

وعن عليّ ، عن أبيه ، عن ابن أبي عمير ، عن عمر بن اُذينة ، عن إسماعيل بن الفضل الهاشميّ قال : سألت أبا عبدالله ( عليه السلام ) عن المتعة ؟ فقال : إلق عبد الملك بن جريج فسله عنها فإن عنده منها علما ، فلقيتهفأملى علي شيئا كثيرا في استحلالها ، وكان فيما روى لي فيها ابن جريج ، أنه ليس فيها وقت ولا عدد إنما هي بمنزلة الاماء يتزوج منهن كم شاء ، وصاحب الاربع نسوة يتزوج منهن ما شاء بغير ولي ولا شهود ، فاذا انقضي الاجل بانت منهبغير طلاق ، ويعطيها الشيء اليسير ، وعدتها حيضتان ، وإن كانت لا تحيض فخمسة وأربعون يوما ، قال : فأتيت بالكتاب أبا عبدالله ( عليه السلام ) فقال : صدق وأقر به ، قال ابن اذينة : وكان زرارة يقول هذا ويحلف أنه الحق إلا أنه كانيقول : ان كانت تحيض فحيضة ، وإن كانت لا تحيض فشهر ونصف . 

 

And from `Ali from his father from Ibn Abi `Umayr from `Umar b. Udhayna from Isma`il b. al-Fadl al-Hashimi.  He said: I asked Abu `Abdillah عليه السلام about mut`a.  So he said: Go meet `Abd al-Malik b. Jurayj and ask him about it, for he has knowledge about it.  

So I met him and he dictated many things to me in regards to its being deemed lawful, and in what Ibn Jurayj narrated to me regarding it was that there is no time and number in it, she is only with the status of the slave women, one marries from them however many one wants.  And the one who has four wives marries from them what he wants without a guardian or witnesses.  So when the term is expired, she is separated from him without divorce.  And he gives her the simple thing.  And her `idda is two menstruations.  And that if she does not menstruate, then it is forty-five days.  

He said: So I brought the writing to Abu `Abdillah عليه السلام and he said: He has spoken the truth and confirmed it.  

Ibn Udhayna said: And Zurara would say this and swear that it was the truth, except that he would say: If she menstruates, then a (single) menstruation, and if she does not menstruate, then a month and a half.

 

 

Bottom Line: 

There's nothing wrong or Haram with having multiple or numerous sexual partners. There's no limit to the number of people you can do Muta'a with. This is the teaching of Ahlul Bayt (عليه السلام). Anything else that contradicts this is baseless conjecture. 

 

Here's a bonus narration, whose sanad I don't accept but many do: 

عن أحمد بن إسحاق ، عن سعدان بن مسلم ، عن عبيد بن زرارة ، عن أبيه ، عن أبي عبدالله ( عليه السلام ) قال : ذكرت له المتعة ، أهي من الاربع ؟ فقال : تزوج منهن ألفا فانهن مستأجرات . 

And from him from Ahmad b. Ishaq from Sa`dan b. Muslim from `Ubayd b. Zurara from his father from Abu `Abdillah عليه السلام.  He said: I mentioned mut`a to him, is she from the four?  So he said: Marry a thousand of them, for they are rented women.

 

 

 

 

Edited by SoRoUsH

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^ agsin, you keep clinging to mutah when the topic is about NON-Muslims who sleep around. 

Maybe brush up on your reading comprehension. 

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On 4/12/2019 at 3:32 AM, Islandsandmirrors said:

Obviously, we all know that Zina or sex outside of marriage is haram. I think I found out why today. 

Non-Muslims have no shame in having 10, 20, even 50 different sexual partners and they think it’s all fun. Zina make sexual intimacy between a husband and wife cheap. I always wondered why sex before marriage was a sin if you were going to get married to that person, however most people who commit Zina aren’t intending to get married, at least not right away, and that’s why Allah says that it’s an indecency and an evil way. 

That is a very purely Islamic thing to say when they talk about non-Muslims.

none of it is true.

we have temporary marriage. Where a man can have multiple sexual partners. And a woman can change her sexual partner every couple of months.

So what are you trying to say?

Edited by BowTie

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20 hours ago, Islandsandmirrors said:

the topic is about NON-Muslims who sleep around. 

Let's get this part straight then:

There's nothing wrong or Haram about "sleeping around" for Muslims, as long as it's done legally through Muta'a. This is why the topic of Muta'a is relevant. 

If "sleeping around" isn't an issue for Muslims, why pick on non-Muslims? 

In fact, as authentic narrations indicate, one can have four wives, and still "sleep around" through Muta’a. 

 

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22 hours ago, 2Timeless said:

Yes they can. You can literally survive without ever touching another person sexually ever. You simply cannot survive without food after a certain period of time. That's a fact.

An example is Prophet Isa(عليه السلام). Although his celibacy is not a role model for us, it does teach us that it is possible for a man to live a healthy, completely chaste and completely sex-free life - when the situation so demands. Other examples could be our Imams (عليه السلام) (particularly Imam Musa Kadhim[as]) who spent decades in dungeons away from their wives; yet when they were given the opportunity to indulge in sin, they showed such remarkable chastity - as if their sexual desires were non-existant. 

This means although Islam highly encourages marriage and halal sex, it also tells us that sex is not a necessity of life and one must be able to live an entire life without it and without indulging in any sin. 

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3 minutes ago, Maisam Haider said:

An example is Prophet Isa(عليه السلام). Although his celibacy is not a role model for us

As Muslims we have no reason to believe Isa (عليه السلام) was celibate and have plenty of reasons, considering the lives of all other Prophets, that he wasn't. 

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30 minutes ago, Maisam Haider said:

Imam Ali (عليه السلام) was once asked why Prophet Isa(عليه السلام) remained celibate. He replied that Isa (عليه السلام) was not meant to be tested through a wife.

Source?

Edited by SoRoUsH

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45 minutes ago, Maisam Haider said:

Imam Ali (عليه السلام) was once asked why Prophet Isa(عليه السلام) remained celibate. He replied that Isa (عليه السلام) was not meant to be tested through a wife. 

Are you saying Prophet Isa (عليه السلام) was married?

A Mawlana once said when Imam Ali was born, he had the knowledge of all of the divine books "by permission of Allah" so why would he need to ask the Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم)?

Also, some people on here believe the Imams in real time can read every thought, however subtle, of every human that has ever existed and continues to exist. I don't see how this belief is consistent with the Imam needing to ask anyone about anything to be honest with you.

I don't believe in the above though of what I have written.

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22. It is reported that Imam ‘Ali (‘a) said in one of his sermons: “If you like, I will tell you about Jesus the son of Mary (‘a). He used a stone as his pillow, wore course clothing and ate rough food. His stew was hunger and his lamp in the night was the moon.

His shade in the winter was the east of the Earth and its west. His fruit and his basil is that which grows from the Earth for the cattle. He had no wife to try him, and no son to grieve him. He had no wealth to distract him, nor greed to abase him. His mount was his feet and his servant was his hands.”23

 Nahj al-Balagha, 1, 227

https://www.al-Islam.org/jesus-though-shiite-narrations-Mahdi-muntazir-qaim/conduct-jesus

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