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In the Name of God بسم الله
AmirioTheMuzzy

Seriously Mohammed Hijab?!?

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On 4/13/2019 at 2:12 AM, OrthodoxTruth said:

It’s nothing new, those people never left the time of Jahiliyya. 

 

10 hours ago, Guest ASunniGuy said:

or saying we Sunnis never left the age of jahilliyya

He actually said those people and as far as I know no said something about the Sunnis. Unless all Sunnis are Salafis then no one said something about them. 

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10 hours ago, Guest ASunniGuy said:

or saying we Sunnis never left the age of jahilliyya

Even if we did. A lot of Sunnis, most if then are the ignorant ones that never talked to a Shia, do kufr against us. And seeing that your opinions about Shi’ism got far worse, I think you might be as well amongst the Salafi’s that spend their time together to do kufr on those bad Shias that are so bad that we need to do kufr on them because they’re bad.

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On 4/12/2019 at 10:56 PM, AmirioTheMuzzy said:

No!!! Ali Dawah is promoting it now too!!! These two have huge influences :(

Not really.

the whole wahabi world, Israel and the west wanted to crush Syria, Iraq , Lebanon and Iran, and they lost.

The truth is not decided by numbers anyway. They can hit their head all day long, it wont change anything.

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On 4/17/2019 at 7:59 PM, Guest ASunniGuy said:

Then if noone can be asked to watch the video or refute it and you say your knowledgeable people probably won't do it either then what's the point in this thread? 

Firstly, the video in question it's only a video its not a video that requires an scholastic response.  Also from a Shia point of view we are immune from these kinds of Anti- Shia propagandist, because is nothing new hence it does not require a rebuttal. for  centuries Shias have  defended their faith from anti- Shia  Sunni propagandist, and have dealt with everything the enemies of the Shias have thrown at us. Al hamdallah over the centuries the Sunni propagandist have continually failed in their propaganda. 

Example: Taufa Ithna Ashari (Urdu: تحفة اثنا عشرية‎) (Gift of Twelvers) is a highly controversial book[1] by Sunni Islamic scholar Shah Abdul Aziz

This book by Shah Abdul Aziz Sunni scholar was if not the best book written against the Shia faith, however it was dealt with comprehensively by our Ullamahs.

The point is you are astounded by this trivial video clip, yet you are utter novice when your own great scholars have failed. 

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Salam, 

all the brothers and sisters already have replied more than correctly on this subject. We are immune to anti-Islamic propaganda because we had and still have over 1300 years to deal with it. Our scholars of the past and present have written countless SCHOLARLY books refuting propaganda thrown at us, as well as the arguments for the alleged validity of points brought up by the People of Ignorance. I will just address few of the two points; First of all, Iran formally invited Saudi ulama countless times to a theological debate in Arabia, Iran or on the neutral grounds. The invitations were never accepted.

Secondly, the Sunni (including Wahhabis/Salafis) rulers of Sunni majority countries fanatically and blindly reject the Islamic Revolution not only from the sectarian point of view, after all it was a Shia majority country that overthrew it’s long time, Western supported puppet, and not the Sunnis, but because the Islamic Revolution from the onset calls for the overthrow of the tyrannical regimes that spend the Ummah’s wealth on worldly desires instead of Islam. The Sunni “kings” and dictators fear losing ultimate powers to the rule of a true Islamic system. Holy Qur'an non-stop calls for justice and “deen over dunya”, something that the rulers of Sunni majority countries reversed. 

Thirdly, the video (I’m not going to waste my time on another primitive propaganda) supposedly mentions Syria allegedly changing the demographics. How is it possible when Sunnis make up 75-80% of the citizens and tens of thousands of them died and still die fighting for Assad and their secular state, is known only to the propaganda creators. Before the 20 century, there were virtually no borders among the Arab states and everybody moved from place to place. The concept of Arab borders and nationalisms are both children of the Europeans and then secular, non-Muslim pan-Arabists. Something that the Wahhabis allegedly reject, whenever it suits their needs of course.

At the end I would like to remind my “dear” anti-Shia propagandists that the Shia demographics is actively being changed since over 1300 years; Rida wars, then Umayyads, Abbasids, other dynasties engaging in genocide, all the way to modern Bahrain, “Saudi” Arabia, Pakistan, Afghanistan, Yemen, Iraq. The Shia grow is not only hampered by the physical violences, killings and tortures by state and non-state actors, but also by forced migrations, forced conversions, enforced lack of possibilities (lack of access to qualified healthcare, education, positions of power such as teachers, professors, military men etc.), constant psychological abuse such as widespread propaganda and stereotypes. I’ll give few first hand examples from Iraq. Basically from the beginnings till 2003, the country was ruled by the Sunnis despite having a Shia majority. Saddam alone is responsible for the killings of over 400,000 (not included Iraq-Iran war and the invasion of Kuwait) Shia Iraqis; women, children and men. Add to it people who survived tortures and mistreatments and inherited physical and psychological problems that will be passed down for generations to come, putting enormous strain on the families and the healthcare system. Let’s not forget also about hundreds of thousands of Shia Iraqis forcibly expelled to Iran, on the alleged accusations of being “Iranians”. Almost quarter of a century of changing Shi’ite demographics just from one country. Let’s not be munafiqun about realities.

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On 4/18/2019 at 1:04 PM, Mohammadi_follower said:

Secondly it is good to remember that alawites are not Shias according to most Shias so again it is nothing less that stupid to portray what is happening in Syria as a "Shia Sunni conflicts" when alawites are not even considered as Shias and most of syrian soldiers a

All scholars in Iran know Alawites specially as Shias but they say they need to return to real teaching of Shia Islam but scholars don’t try to force their ideas & teachings to them also if you travel to Najaf & Karbala you will see many Ismaili bohras in these two cities that they come for pilgrimage & everyone knows them as Shia Muslims how we can say Alawites are not Shias !!

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On 4/19/2019 at 4:46 PM, Ashvazdanghe said:

All scholars in Iran know Alawites specially as Shias but they say they need to return to real teaching of Shia Islam but scholars don’t try to force their ideas & teachings to them also if you travel to Najaf & Karbala you will see many Ismaili bohras in these two cities that they come for pilgrimage & everyone knows them as Shia Muslims how we can say Alawites are not Shias !!

True, even their Salah is pretty similar...

 

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7 hours ago, Ashvazdanghe said:

All scholars in Iran know Alawites specially as Shias but they say they need to return to real teaching of Shia Islam but scholars don’t try to force their ideas & teachings to them also if you travel to Najaf & Karbala you will see many Ismaili bohras in these two cities that they come for pilgrimage & everyone knows them as Shia Muslims how we can say Alawites are not Shias !!

Brother, Alawites were historically condemned by our prestigious ulama, just to name the Shaykh Tusi (may Allah be pleased with him). It was only since the 1970’s when for the sake of an Islamic unity, some (not all) politically active ulama declared them to be Shias (not Twelvers, but Shia Muslims in general). Take a look at this. They have beliefs that drastically differ from ours, hence why they are considered a ghulat sect. It’s a completely independent religion with its own clergy, theology and beliefs. This is one of the reasons why the ulama in Najaf forbid Iraqi Shi’ite militias from engaging in Syrian conflict. 

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On 4/20/2019 at 12:08 AM, OrthodoxTruth said:

Brother, Alawites were historically condemned by our prestigious ulama, just to name the Shaykh Tusi (may Allah be pleased with him). It was only since the 1970’s when for the sake of an Islamic unity, some (not all) politically active ulama declared them to be Shias (not Twelvers, but Shia Muslims in general). Take a look at this. They have beliefs that drastically differ from ours, hence why they are considered a ghulat sect. It’s a completely independent religion with its own clergy, theology and beliefs. This is one of the reasons why the ulama in Najaf forbid Iraqi Shi’ite militias from engaging in Syrian conflict. 

Salam it something from past but now they are turning back to Shia Islam teaching more than before it's just a matter of time that they will fix their distorted beliefs

Date :Saturday, March 30th, 2019 | Time : 07:41 |ID: 87243 |
17609e17074e4247ab167ee8c5740e32-1-1.jpg
 
original link in Turkish : https://tr.shafaqna.com/archives/75900

Sayyed Sinan Buztepe: All Alevis are Shias and all Shias are Alevis/ “Alevism without Imam Ali ((عليه السلام))” is a plot -Interview

/in All NewsFeaturedFeatured 2Featured 3InterviewsMiddle EastNEWS BRIEFSOther NewsShia Islam /

SHAFAQNA- Alawites or Alevis are one of the religious groups in Turkey known to be followers of the Twelver Shia branch of Islam. Alevi communities spread across Turkey but they mostly live in the east and central-west of the country. Sayyed Sinan Buztepe is the religious leader of the Alevis in Cerkezkoy district, northeast ofTurkeyShafaqna has had an exclusive interview with him about his community, their traditions and problems.

Shafaqna: What is the Alevism and who is an Alevi?

Buztepe: Alevism means following Imam Ali ((عليه السلام)), our definition of Alevism surrounds the personality and character of Imam Ali ((عليه السلام)). He was born in Ka’aba and martyred in Mihrab (alter) while praying and he spent his life between Ka’aba and Mihrab. Alevism is between Ka’aba and Mihrab, too.

 

 

Shafaqna: How about the religious studies of your community leaders (dedes), is their religious studies at acceptable levels?

Buztepe: In our history, the 1514 Battle of Chaldiran between Iranian Safavid dynasty and Ottoman Turks is seen as a turning point. Before that battle, Alevi leaders used to visit and study at Sheikh Safi al-Din Ardebili’s school in Ardebil, Iran. After that battle, Ottoman Turks prevented Alevis from visiting Iran or attending madresas there. They foreclosed schools and anything related to Alevis in central Turkey and sent many religious leaders into exile. Although Ottoman Turks failed to remove the love of Ahl al-Bayt from the hearts of Alevis, they managed to create a distance between Alevis and religious studies particularly the school of Ahl al-Bayt.

Shafaqna: What do you think of Shia Islam? Is Shiism equal to Alevism or they are different from each other?

Buztepe: These claims come from the advocates of “Alevism without Imam Ali”; they want to create a rift between Alevism and Shia, they have tried vastly to reach their end. Alevism means Shia; it supports Shia Islam, Shia also means Alevi or an advocate of Imam Ali ((عليه السلام)). Those who try to separate between Alevis and supporters of Ahl al-Bayt claim “Alevis are different from Shias” or “We are Alevis of Anatolia”.

(I ask you) is there a difference between Alevi in Iran, Syria or Iraq? (No), there isn’t any difference. An Alevi is always an Alevi regardless of where he or she lives. Supporters of Imam Ali ((عليه السلام)) are always the same. Based on old documents, about 350 years ago Alevis in Anatolia region were called “Shias”. Ottoman Turks even described Shias as Alevis. At the same time, the word “Alevi” is given to someone who is a descendant of Imam Ali ((عليه السلام)). Trying to part away Alevism from Shiism is a “plot” and a “trick”. Alevi youth who visited holy shrines in Iraq met with lovers of Ahl al-Bayt coming from across the world and they noticed that fact (that there is no difference between Alevism and Shia religion). To me, all Alevis are Shias and all Shias are Alevis.

Alevi community leaders who met with Grand Ayatollah Ali al-Sistani in Najaf cite him as describing Alevis as “The doves of Imam Ali’s Shrine”. The grand Ayatollah told them “They flew you away from this holy shrine, isn’t it the time for you to return?”

It’s getting late…. Real and old traditions of Alevism believed in God, the Prophet Mohammed and Ahl al-Bayt ((عليه السلام)). We have to continue this path otherwise; our next generation will not inherit anything from us. All our religious traditions would be lost and we would leave this world empty-handed.

9e78df2f29f04d78be6dc367ae76f4d1-540x630 

f27753879b0f40cfa78faa5cac9952bf-800x630

 

a995e2c61fa44063b92b8ddb23f4f1be.jpg

https://en.shafaqna.com/87243/sayyed-sinan-buztepe-all-alevis-are-Shias-and-all-Shias-are-alevis-interview/

original link in Turkish : https://tr.shafaqna.com/archives/75900

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1 hour ago, Ashvazdanghe said:

Salam it something from past but now they are turning back to Shia Islam teaching more than before it's just a matter of time that they will fix their distorted beliefs

Brother, I know that Sunnis consider everybody a Shia, that goes for Alawites, Alevis, Druze, and meridian of other ghulat sects. I don’t go by that, but by what our ulama rules. However, I asked you about the Alawites (of Syria and Lebanon), not the Alevis (of Turkey). Alawites and Alevis are not the same people. Shaykh Tusi (may Allah be pleased with him), including other past and present scholars, ruled Alawites to be non-Muslims and heretics due to their weird and deviant beliefs. As for the (Turkish) Alevis, I personally (I may be mistaken) believe that they are closer to the mainstream Twelvers than the Alawites (of Syria and Lebanon). Alevis (of Turkey) accept all the Imams, commemorate Ashura Day etc. They just need to start praying daily, their women need to scarf on a daily basis, and they need to abandon following people such as Haji Bektash Veli. They supposedly also drink alcohol. I read somewhere that the (Turkish) Alevis used to be like mainstream Twelvers but over the time they developed distinct beliefs. Inshallah they will come back to the mainstream. Alawites are completely different story, in Lebanon they don’t even attend Twelver mosques preferring to meet in their own communities. They themselves don’t even have mosques. That’s my point. 

Edited by starlight
Edited out looooooong quote

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13 minutes ago, OrthodoxTruth said:

Shaykh Tusi (may Allah be pleased with him), including other past and present scholars, ruled Alawites to be non-Muslims and heretics due to their weird and deviant beliefs. As for the (Turkish) Alevis, I personally (I may be mistaken) believe that they are closer to the mainstream Twelvers than the Alawites (of Syria and Lebanon). Alevis (of Turkey) accept all the Imams, commemorate Ashura Day etc.

anyway they are turniong back to twelver shiism & ruling of shaykh Tusi (رضي الله عنه) was about their condition at his time but in our time they are slowly are backing to their true roots also if a dominant group of them them like as Turk branch can fix their problem with new group that doesn't pray & have weird belief with their connection to other Alawit  communities in Syria & Lebanon they can back them to true Shia teaching inshaAllah but we must have patience & don't reject them by an old Fatwa like as Wahabist that do Takfir on Shias by fatwas of Ibn Taymiah (la) 

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8 hours ago, Ashvazdanghe said:

All scholars in Iran know Alawites specially as Shias but they say they need to return to real teaching of Shia Islam but scholars don’t try to force their ideas & teachings to them also if you travel to Najaf & Karbala you will see many Ismaili bohras in these two cities that they come for pilgrimage & everyone knows them as Shia Muslims how we can say Alawites are not Shias !!

What is the link between ismaili and Alawites brother? These two groups are very different. About the Alawites they are very misguided and their beliefs are wrong in many ways. It is really difficult to recognize them as Shia. 

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16 minutes ago, OrthodoxTruth said:

Alawites and Alevis are not the same people. 

Yes it's a common, but strange, but still common misconception/confusion and I don't really know where people get the misconception/confusion from. 

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The guest user makes a good point. People make posts about how ignorant these youtubers are but when they are asked to back up their claims they claim not to have time (despite posting on this forum around the clock) or that these youtubers are insignificant (in which case there shouldn't have been a 3-page topic about them in the first place). 

It would be better not to comment at all rather than to post comments which can't be backed up. 

Wallahu a'lam 

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16 minutes ago, Ashvazdanghe said:

anyway they are turniong back to twelver shiism & ruling of shaykh Tusi (رضي الله عنه) was about their condition at his time but in our time they are slowly are backing to their true roots also if a dominant group of them them like as Turk branch can fix their problem with new group that doesn't pray & have weird belief with their connection to other Alawit  communities in Syria & Lebanon they can back them to true Shia teaching inshaAllah but we must have patience & don't reject them by an old Fatwa like as Wahabist that do Takfir on Shias by fatwas of Ibn Taymiah (la) 

Brother, I think our small misunderstanding arose from the fact that you confuse Alawites and Alevis as one and the same. Those are two distinct groups of people with differing beliefs. I’m more than happy to see Alevis in Turkey slowly rejoining the fold of mainstream, orthodox Islam. However, Alawites reject doing so in the past and present. Before 2011, Iran sent ulama to Alawites to teach them proper Islam and Assads rounded them up and deported back.

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