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In the Name of God بسم الله
Guest abd of Hussain

Middle aged man wants to marry my daughter

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6 hours ago, Murtaza1 said:

You are missing the point. These statistics are theoretical.

My point is if a man and woman both feel right for each other then it's for a good reason because it is linked to their mental and biological factors which determine compatibility between them. If a woman is younger or vice versa but feels compatible with the older man there is a chance that she may not live as long as the man or vice versa.

As the saying goes 'opposites attract' and people live longer when they are happier because of the increase of four chemicals in the body. The balance of negativity is strive in our communities on a cultural and social media level. In reality more people still marry when they are older and have lasting relationships. 

@Ralvi

Exactly you cannot rely on doubtful evidence either. After lady Khadija passed away, the Prophet (peace be upon him) was 53 years old, he took other wives including Aisha, Hafsa, Zaynab bint Khuzayma, Umm Salma, Sauda bint Zama, Zaynab bint Jahash, Juwayriya, Safia, Maymuna, Umm Habiba and Marya. So you cannot say for sure what their age was either. Also being old does not mean ugly because beauty lies in the eyes of the beholder.

I have not studied Islam so deeply yet but a lot of it is common sense. We have to live in our time. There is no direct prohibition of marrying a younger or older person. I say just look at George Clooney and his successful marriage. 

 

It’s known fact that he was exclusive with Hazarat Khadijah (SA) and relied on her monetary prowess to spread Islam.  Before and after his announcement to the public of his prophethood...

doesnt take a lot to put two and two together 

They married young and for a while our Propeht was ridiculed becuase he had no surviving children(as made apparent in the Qur'an)  until he was finally made to go to Miraj to obtain his blessing from God(literally) and this was not done easily, he prayed and prayed for this child...our Prophet more than any other knows the pains and suffering in having a child 

having chidren is not made easy just becuase one is a Propeht. Countless examples have proven this. Remember our Propeht(saaws) has said no other Prophet has suffered as much as he has

Her being 40 is a myth just like the Propeht being illiterate and suddenly becoming a Propeht at 40 is a myth and a sinister one at that.

Edited by Ralvi

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@Ralvi

Jazakalah as I said my knowledge of Islamic history is at a very basic level at the moment but I am l learning. This may be so but it doesnt change my opion on the age topic. Also I don’t think you can definetly prove the other marriages the Prophet (peace be upon him) had. 

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1 hour ago, Murtaza1 said:

@Ralvi

Jazakalah as I said my knowledge of Islamic history is at a very basic level at the moment but I am l learning. This may be so but it doesnt change my opion on the age topic. Also I don’t think you can definetly prove the other marriages the Prophet (peace be upon him) had. 

Yeah I wasn’t talking about the age difference thing. Doesn’t matter to me either way. A girl ultimately makes the decision for marriage, if there are concerns we can only communicate, can’t really force either way

I was just on about the holy lady, that’s all I care about lol

He married the other ladies after Hazarat Khadijah(SA) passed. that much is true and I think he has mentioned that the only one for him was that eminent lady. He was very hurt and sad after her passing

It’s ok I believed(partially I had doubts) that myth till recently too, learning is never  a finished deal. We will both continue to learn 

Edited by Ralvi

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@Ralvi 

Yes inshalah we shall continue to learn. To have knowledge feels like having great virtue. Your right we can only guide the girls and boys in such situations of marriage and make sure they decide with a sound mind.

.

Edited by Murtaza1

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15 hours ago, Murtaza1 said:

People can mature at different ages in their life, everybody is different. She even said he looks 29.

People marry when Allah subhana wa tala's prescribed time comes.

Its not good to be such a fitnah in other people's relationships. This can be a cause for your own prayers to be rejected by Allah subhana wa tala. 

Many people in the West marry later on in life when they are ready and mature.

Take the example of the life of Prophet Mohammed (peace be upon him) he married older women too. Most people that marry at a young age end up divorcing.

Hollywood actor George Clooney married in his 60's and is still happily married. 

Muzmatch is full of divorced women and Muslima.com is full of women looking for older men. That is the actual reality of the real world, not what people hear from others. 

There is no Fitna in someones relationship here. There is no relationship.

The guy is asking people here whether he should marry her daughter to someone who is her father's age.

Looks are often misleading and bringing up George Clooney etc isn't really good considering the number of past relationship he has had.

My point here is pretty simple he doesn't know a thing about the guys past or how he makes his money and giving her daughter to him doesnt make sense at all.

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22 hours ago, Warilla said:

"Its not good to be such a fitnah in other people's relationships. This can be a cause for your own prayers to be rejected by Allah subhana wa tala. "

I agree with this. It was an error on my part. Thank you for pointing it out.

@Hassu93

There is a good five part lecture on YouTube about fitna in Salat prayers by Mohammed Baqar Al-qazwini. You should watch it. 

You questioned if that older gentleman was married before or had any kind of relationship as if its an evil thing. The fact is if he did not then that is an added bonus for him because it shows how pure he is. 

You probably accept the negative things you say about him for yourself too as an older man or when you do get old but you cannot put every older gentleman in the same boat as yourself, as I said people can look very young like this gentleman and mature later in life unlike those that look and feel their age. I have a feeling you beling or will belong in this older category.

Also I notice people in India tend to be more negative and prejudice against older and darker skin people. So you cannot speak for the rest of the world. 

Muslims like you on social media are cacooned, conditioned and program by others to think that way. you are either living your life completely on social media or living in community completely cut off from the rest of the world. That's why you miss out on the fruits of life. 

Your perspective is just based on numbers. If you investigated each couple according to the way they lived their life together and how long they lived despite their age difference then you would agree. 

Many Muslims marry people with age differences but they don’t talk about it because social media is not a necessity to boast. 

In the west Clooney is a good example along with De Nero and many other celebrities. We do not have these kind of prejudices in the west where it is more openly normal for older men to marry younger women.  The tradition has been recorded back to 1901.

Here are some good articles:

https://www.independent.co.United Kingdom/life-style/dating-rule-age-gap-couples-history-origins-where-come-from-a8156696.html

https://www.marieclaire.com/sex-love/a14455328/marrying-an-older-man/

 

Edited by Murtaza1

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2 hours ago, Gaius I. Caesar said:

Muslima.com is a scam, its just women who want a green card and have a over-romanticized view of the US. 

I haven't seen any evidence of that but of course fakes are everywhere. I actually know many genuine Muslims on Muslima.com that also use Muzmatch and are genuine. On Muzmatch there are also many male predators. 

Shiamatch is a closed community but many Pakistani parents there are open to seeking older gentlemen for their daughters. 

Edited by Murtaza1

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On 3/20/2019 at 4:03 PM, Guest abd of Hussain said:

I received a marriage proposition for my 22 old girl from a 42 year old! He is just 5 years my junior. I am quite shocked and totally confused for what reason does he want to marry my dear young daughter. He met her at some community events. This is so freaking weird!! She doesn't know about the proposal and I don't have the slightest idea what to try and tell her. He looks 15 years more youthful  than his age and is smart, religious and rich and not married before. I never before knew he was so old!! He said it's good genes or something. It's a dilemma, since I think he is a good guy however I am stunned at the age difference and what will people say? They will talk about us and criticize me and laugh at me. I am concerned he has done a lot more in life than her. The guy has about 3 businesses and a dam phd too. I honestly and truly feel like saying no because this age difference is creepy ... but I get this annoying feeling that he is too good to reject easily ... help!!!

I wouldn't say absolutely no, but like others have said, there are a few things issues which need to be resolved. 

First, and most important, 42 and never married ? ???

Most of the time, this means

1. He was married before but he is trying to keep this secret, because there is a stigma attached to divorce, even for men (although it is not as great as for women)

2. He wasn't married but had relationships with women, other than marriage. (I.e. haram relationships bf/gf )

3. He has hormonal issues which are either natural or self inflicted through the use of chemicals

If it is 1 or 2, you deserve to know, and if you find out something and he continues to lie about it, then definitely I would say do not give your permission, you daughter will be miserable in the marriage and most likely it will end. Someone who can lie about a big thing like that does not deserve to have a wife. If he has done things in the past and has done tawba for this, he should be honest with you about this, and you should make a promise to him that you will not tell anyone else about his 'past', and of course you can't telll anyone. 

If it is 3, and he has hormonal issues, this is something he should tell you about. Living with someone with these issues is not easy, and most likely they will never have a 'satisfying' relationship, if you know what I mean. Again, most of the time this will end in divorce. 

Also, as other have said, once this is cleared, you should look at his general character, and how he made his money. This is part of 'Iman and Taqwa', the criteria that were set by Rasoulallah(p.b.u.h) as the two marriage criteria. 

If you find those to be good, and your daughter is interested, then you should give your consent. The age issue, in itself, if the above is ok, is not a huge barrier to a happy marriage. 

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4 hours ago, Abu Hadi said:

1. He was married before but he is trying to keep this secret, because there is a stigma attached to divorce, even for men (although it is not as great as for women)

2. He wasn't married but had relationships with women, other than marriage. (I.e. haram relationships bf/gf )

3. He has hormonal issues which are either natural or self inflicted through the use of chemicals

Actually you forgot the main one. Doing haraam with masturbation. This is a bigger red flag than mutah and divorce combined.

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6 hours ago, Murtaza1 said:

@Hassu93

 

Also I notice people in India tend to be more negative and prejudice against older and darker skin people. So you cannot speak for the rest of the world. 

Muslims like you on social media are cacooned, conditioned and program by others to think that way. you are either living your life completely on social media or living in community completely cut off from the rest of the world. That's why you miss out on the fruits of life. 

 

And you sound stereotypical just like people from the West :).

 

And I am pretty sure you have no idea about India when you pulled the darker skin stuff into this conversation.

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8 hours ago, Abu Hadi said:

If you find those to be good, and your daughter is interested, then you should give your consent. The age issue, in itself, if the above is ok, is not a huge barrier to a happy marriage. 

I agree brother. It is actually common in the west for men even over 65 to be involved in active muta type relationships with women in their 20's.

Menopause does not effect men in their 40's. More than half of even older are very active with high testosterone, androgen and hypogonadism hormones and never develop any problem. For some that do the problem starts around age 50 and is usually among smokers or diabetics. They say the figure is approximately 44 percent for men aged between age 65 to 85, but this cannot be compared to younger men because studies are not conducted involving them. 

Younger people can also develop menopausal problems and many do, even in their 20's. I know young men that have had a complete breakdown and it ruined their life with a divorce. The same goes for older women, they are very active. Problems only develop sometimes due to post-menopausal related medical issues which can also effect women in their 20's.

 

3 hours ago, Hassu93 said:

And you sound stereotypical just like people from the West :).

And I am pretty sure you have no idea about India when you pulled the darker skin stuff into this conversation.

Brother your Indian subcontinent is currently undergoing a transition period which the western world also went through in the the early 20th century before the world war when people with pale skin used to be regarded as desirable. It was influenced by the social class system which is now abolished in the west but it is still in use in the Indian subcontinent.

In the west we have moved on from racist tendencies. We now desire dark Mediterranean type tanned or olive skin type skin tones and disregard pale skin. 

Indian people's perspectives of skin colour, age and other attributes are very different than people in the west. I am sure you guys will catch in the next few decades and your racist tendencies will change. Although sometimes I wonder because the Hindu cast system is deeply engraved in the social class system and your own perspectives on skin colour based on black and white statues of your religious entities.

Edited by Murtaza1

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1 hour ago, Murtaza1 said:

I agree brother. It is actually common in the west for men even over 65 to be involved in active muta type relationships with women in their 20's.

Except you're stereotyping once again, those relationships are nothing like mutah. Plus, there's no contract and it's not timed. Those men are just in it for sex and to make themselves feel younger.  

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1 hour ago, Gaius I. Caesar said:

Those men are just in it for sex and to make themselves feel younger.  

 
Brother many older men and younger women do muta in the west but they don't talk about it. So we do not hear about it much. My main point is that older men are very active and younger women enjoy their company. 
 
Girls in their twenties actually find older men more appealing than older women. The older man’s confidence appeals to young girls and gives them the chance to be with someone at a different stage of life than themselves. Someone more world wise, who isn’t a ragingly insecure or impoverished megalomaniac. 
 
I am not being stereotypical but those that do stereotype refer to the older gentlemen as father's age, sugar daddies or father figures. These terms reek of oversimplified stereotypes. Young women marry older men for many reasons and have nothing to do with money or daddy issues. Although an absentee father could be the underlying explanation as to why some girls like older men. A young girl without a father doesn’t have a father figure to care for her emotionally and financially. As a result, she may try to fill this void in her marriage with an older gentleman. There is nothing wrong with that. 
 
Girls like to marry a man who is strong in their deen, wise, secure, influential and gives them emotional stability. Also with the development rate of an older gentleman's maturity being significantly more delayed than the girls, it may seem natural for the girl to look for a man that matches or exceeds her own personal maturity level.
 
Just like this older gentleman many older men have established careers and more time and energy to dedicate to a young partner. This makes girls feel special, valued and safe. This is so unlike the young marriages that end up in divorces these days. I am sorry to say but Muzmatch is full of young divorced sistets. It's not their fault. 
 
The truth of the matter is older men come with maturity, grace and dignity. They value their young wives and treat them with more respect than the younger guys. This maturity is not tied to financial success. It comes from simply being at a secure place in their lives from having lived in the world longer.
 
Girls should not be afraid to go after what they want. They shouldn't let stereotypical tendencies of our communities effect their decisions to marry older gentlemen. 
 
May Allah subhana wa tala bless such couples because I think these relationships are beautiful. 
Edited by Murtaza1

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4 hours ago, Murtaza1 said:

Brother many older men and younger women do muta in the west but they don't talk about it. So we do not hear about it much. My main point is that older men are very active and younger women enjoy their company. 

Brother, we Shi'a are truly a minority in the West; Those people are most likely non-Muslim and know nothing of mu'tah. ^

4 hours ago, Murtaza1 said:

The truth of the matter is older men come with maturity, grace and dignity. They value their young wives and treat them with more respect than the younger guys. This maturity is not tied to financial success. It comes from simply being at a secure place in their lives from having lived in the world longer.

I know of older men who are the complete opposite, they are some of the most insecure and disrespectful people I have met. From watching my mother's struggles with  men, I don't "value" maturity as much as I do with character, being smart with money and not being a manipulative person. What good is experience when a man can't be a decent person? I'm much a younger person and have much better morals and behavior than some of these "mature" men.  It is deeply embarrassing.

4 hours ago, Murtaza1 said:

Girls should not be afraid to go after what they want. They shouldn't let stereotypical tendencies of our communities effect their decisions to marry older gentlemen. 

I agree but it's not haram to reject a strange proposal as well.

Edited by Gaius I. Caesar

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39 minutes ago, Gaius I. Caesar said:

I know of older men who are the complete opposite, they are some of the most insecure and disrespectful people I have met. From watching my mother's struggles with  men, I don't "value" maturity as much as I do with character, being smart with money and not being a manipulative person. 

 
Brother we should not paint everybody with the same brush. I am sorry to hear about the troubles that your mother went through but we should not let our personal feelings and experiences influence the faith of the boy and girl. 
 
As a pious older gentlemen myself that feels twenty five and looks younger and has never married yet at age 43 because it took me time to mature, I can assure you that we are not all the same. Many of us are good honest people. 
 
39 minutes ago, Gaius I. Caesar said:

I agree but it's not haram to reject a strange proposal as well.

 
Of course we should find out first for the sake of both sides. 
Edited by Murtaza1

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@Murtaza1 you are being stereotypical accusing others of basing racist without knowing a single thing about them just because you came to know about things from the internet or a few random People you have met. 

Before being stereotypical and starting your cries and accusations of Fitna and racism please do some basic research. 

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