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In the Name of God بسم الله
Propaganda_of_the_Deed

Offensive Jihad Under Infallible Imam Only?

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Imagine shooting bullets, missiles, burning houses and killing people who are living peacefully. What a crime. To endorse this is a disaster for the image of Islam, and a retardation for the Ummah! Kill people for their opinion. Shameful! Disturbing! Unislamic! Pure oppression and injustice. Killing people to make them convert. What can be more stupid than that?? 

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12 minutes ago, 313 Seeker said:

 Especially when I got Qur'an and way of Propher to back me up. 

No. That's essentially what Salafis do and look how many end up.

That is why most Muslims Sunni, Shia alike follow a mathab.

You are assuming they are not basing it on Qur'an or Sunnah. That one article I sent referenced the Qur'an, but in your knowledge, it was not acceptable to you as you know better.

It is a little insulting to those who dedicate their time to studies to claim your layman approach of picking isolated verses is more scholarly.

It is folly to interpret the Qur'an and Sunnah by oneself, lacking the skills and knowledge 

Edited by Propaganda_of_the_Deed

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Are the widows and children, neighbours and survivors of an attack agaunst them in the name of "calling to Islam" supposed to wake up next day and say the Shahada from their hearts? What utter stupidity is that? 

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Just now, Propaganda_of_the_Deed said:

is a little insulting to those who dedicate their time to studies to claim your layman approach of picking isolated verses is more scholarly.

What they say is insulting to me too. Who are they? A bunch of humans with university degrees? So what? That guy endorses calling to Islam through killing. That is clearly against Qur'an, and the Prophet never did that. Why should his opinion be right, and mine wrong? Because he has a black turban on his head? Retarded and unacceptable. Shiachat should ban such thought before disaster strikes evens further.. all Shia and suni should stand up against such evil hypocritical thought 

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1 hour ago, 313 Seeker said:

Inviteid3i ) to the way of your Lord with wisdom and good instruction, and argue with them in a way that is best. nahl 125

I think this verse is clear. Can anybody deny la ikrah fil deen? That there is no compulsion. Scholar? Ha!

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9 minutes ago, Propaganda_of_the_Deed said:

This conversation is going nowhere. 

Salam.

It is taking one of us to hell and the other go paradise. Let's see where we end up after waiting for opposing Imams. May Allah guide us and forgive us.

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Just now, 313 Seeker said:

Opinion of some ulema. Ulema who could be wrong. 

Like I said, feel free to provide me with our ulema who say there is only defensive jihad.

Until then, this is thread is a broken record of me saying it is part of our jurisprudence and you emotionally ranting.

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Just now, Propaganda_of_the_Deed said:

Like I said, feel free to provide me with our ulema who say there is only defensive jihad.

Until then, this is thread is a broken record of me saying it is part of our jurisprudence and you emotionally ranting.

We follow Allah and AHL bayt. An alim is useless unless he addresses the clear verses of Qur'an and hadiths that go in line with that. Their job is to provide us with these two. Ulema opinion by themselves is not important. You want to call Qur'an emotional ranting? I think wanting to kill peaceful people is emotional disaster and your arguments are as far from Qur'an as can be! 

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6 minutes ago, 313 Seeker said:

We follow Allah and AHL bayt. An alim is useless unless he addresses the clear verses of Qur'an and hadiths that go in line with that. Their job is to provide us with these two. Ulema opinion by themselves is not important. You want to call Qur'an emotional ranting? I think wanting to kill peaceful people is emotional disaster and your arguments are as far from Qur'an as can be! 

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^^^ then sends an sms to his neighborhood 'mullah':

I feel so ready for our Imam. I feel so ready to go kill those people who said they don't agree with our opinion.. that'll teach them! They'll be converting to our cause in no time. 

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Just one little question. Imagine your Muslim country live near an other country where they live peacefully and don't threaten you but they do some weird stuffs like human sacrifice for their polytheist gods (like aztecs). Will you invade them or you will just stay in your place without saying or doing anything. 

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By the way Imams (عليه السلام) and Prophets (عليه السلام) had been chosen by Allah for ruled and show exemple to other humans so this is normal during their lifetime that  other humans obey them. This is also for that that most scholars say we can't do that without a massoomeen because other humans can't have the knowledges and powers that the massoomeen have for rule in good ways à country. 

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4 minutes ago, Mohammadi_follower said:

Just one little question. Imagine your Muslim country live near an other country where they live peacefully and don't threaten you but they do some weird stuffs like human sacrifice for their polytheist gods (like aztecs). Will you invade them or you will just stay in your place without saying or doing anything. 

And let us not forget our 4th Imam (عليه السلام) supplication for the Muslims in the Frontiers, from Sahifat al Sajjadiah:

O God, send out the Muslims of every region on raids
أللَّهُمَّ اغزُ بِكُلِّ نَـاحِيَـة مِنَ الْمُسْلِمِينَ
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against the idolaters who face them!
عَلَى مَنْ بِـإزَائِهِمْ مِنَ الْمُشْرِكِينَ،
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Reinforce them with angels in ranks from Thee,
وَأَمْدِدْهُمْ بِمَلائِكَة مِنْ عِنْدِكَ مُرْدِفِينَ
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till the idolaters are routed by them to the end of the land, slain in Thy Earth
حَتَّى يَكْشِفُـوهُمْ إلَى مُنْقَطَعِ التُّـرابِ قَتْـلاً فِي أَرْضِكَ
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or taken captive, or till they admit that Thou art God, other than whom there is no God,
وَأَسْراً أَوْ يُقِرُّوا بِأَنَّكَ أَنْتَ اللهُ الَّذِي لاَ إلهَ إلاَّ أَنْتَ
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Thou alone, who hast no associate!
وَحْدَكَ لاَ شَرِيكَ لَكَ.
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O God, include in this Thy enemies in the regions of the lands,
أللَّهُمَّ وَاعْمُمْ بِذَلِكَ أَعْدَاءَكَ فِي أَقْطَارِ الْبِلاَدِ
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the Indians, the Byzantines, the Turks, the Khazars, the Abyssinians,
مِنَ الْهِنْدِ وَالرُّومِ وَالتُّـرْكِ وَالْخَزَرِ وَالْحَبَشِ
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the Nubians, the Zanjis, the Slavs, the Daylamites,
وَالنُّـوبَةِ وَالـزَّنْج والسَّقَالِبَةِ وَالدَّيَالِمَةِ
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and the rest of the idol-worshipping nations, those whose names and attributes are concealed,
وَسَائِرِ أُمَمِ الشِّرْكِ الَّذِي تَخْفَى أَسْمَاؤُهُمْ وَصِفاتُهُمْ،
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but whom Thou countest in Thy cognizance and overseest through Thy power!
وَقَدْ أَحْصَيْتَهُمْ بِمَعْرِفَتِكَ، وَأَشْرَفْتَ عَلَيْهِمْ بِقُدْرَتِكَ.
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O God, distract the idolaters from reaching for the borders of the Muslims through the idolaters,
أللَّهُمَّ اشْغَلِ الْمُشْرِكِينَ بِالمُشْرِكِينَ عَنْ تَنَاوُلِ أَطْرَافِ الْمُسْلِمِينَ،
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bar them from cutting them down through being cut down,
وَخُذْهُمْ بِـالنَّقْصِ عَنْ تَنَقُّصِهِمْ،

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Just now, Propaganda_of_the_Deed said:

till the idolaters are routed by them to the end of the land, slain in Thy Earth

 

Just now, Propaganda_of_the_Deed said:

or taken captive, or till they admit that Thou art God, other than whom there is no God,

I guess our friend will find fault with this too :censored:

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