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In the Name of God بسم الله

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Here's a very interesting debate. If anyone wants to, you could watch the full ad on YouTube, but I'm not linking it here because it has some inappropriate images. 

I really dislike the ad because of how sexist it is. It just shows men at the worst and generalised that all men are the same, portraying them as predators and violent people. I think this ad is just an utter joke. Thoughts? Any men on here offended by it?

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I'm sorry but I wont watch the clip you posted. I don’t keep up with popular culture anymore for this exact reason. From what I remember when I used to watch western tv channels like European and bollywood, its all very, prejedice, matcho, sexist and cheesy not to mention haram. The only western channel I watch nowadays is the Horror Channel on Sky 317. I would rather see dead zombies instead of so called beutiful people lol 

Edited by Murtaza1

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Honestly what sort of advert is that? What sort of way is that to promote peace and equality?

Radical feminists are pushing for an agenda and wish to completely destroy masculinity. There are many positive things about masculinity which we should embrace, but they're teaching everyone that all men are violent, abusive etc.

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I'm not a man, but...

I looked up the Gillette ad because I hadn't seen it and people are talking about it. Maybe I'm not seeing the same thing, but I don't understand what's the problem. It is undeniable that some men see women as objects and violence as masculine. The ad doesn't say all men do, just that men need to intervene when they see other men accepting this kind of behavior. It's the only way things will change.

Or did I see a different ad?

Nothing to do with razors or shaving, just a product using their name to sell a message - or perhaps using a message to sell their name. But nothing wrong with it either, at least not in what I watched. 

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51 minutes ago, notme said:

I'm not a man, but...

I looked up the Gillette ad because I hadn't seen it and people are talking about it. Maybe I'm not seeing the same thing, but I don't understand what's the problem. It is undeniable that some men see women as objects and violence as masculine. The ad doesn't say all men do, just that men need to intervene when they see other men accepting this kind of behavior. It's the only way things will change.

Or did I see a different ad?

Nothing to do with razors or shaving, just a product using their name to sell a message - or perhaps using a message to sell their name. But nothing wrong with it either, at least not in what I watched. 

You did watch the right ad. The clip I attached provides a very sound argument as to why this advert is utterly sexist and just completely hypocritical of radical feminists. Now, I finally understand why most people dislike feminists so much. So-called 'feminists' like this ruin the image of true feminism. 

A very important point raised in the clip I linked was, what would've happened if this advert targeted women instead of men? What if it presented women as people who make false rape allegations, murder, and are paedophiles? There would literally be protests. The issue with this advert is that it suggests that men are currently as disorderly and abusive as shown in the beginning of the ad, and they need to change. I know many men who are already like the men shown at the end of the ad . I'm sure alot of people would agree that their fathers were kind and loving and respectful to their mothers and children and everyone they interacted with. And they're still masculine. This advert suggests that men need to let go of their masculinity, and that any masculinity is toxic, and they need to adopt traits that they already have. Maybe that wasn't the intention of the advert, but it's certainly what it portrays. 

No one is denying that there are disgusting abusive men out there who commit all sorts of crime (just as there is with women). But many men are not rapists, predators and abusers, and many protect and respect their female peers.

All we need to do is look at the Prophets and the Imams. They alone will prove that this ad is nonsense.

Edited by 2Timeless

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5 minutes ago, 2Timeless said:

This advert suggests that men need to let go of their masculinity, and that any masculinity is toxic, and they need to adopt traits that they already have. Maybe that wasn't the intention of the advert, but it's certainly what it portrays. 

I read an article which said "radical feninsim isn't an answer to toxic masculinity".

Edited by ali_fatheroforphans

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3 minutes ago, ali_fatheroforphans said:

I read an article which said "radical feninsim isn't an answer to toxic masculinity".

I completely agree. I think the only real masculinity can show toxic masculinity how emasculaying it is to be toxically masculine. Lol so much "masculinity". Does it make sense?

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Hope I saw the right video.  I don’t see the toxicity in this.  
 
Basically, it is saying be the best you can be and encourage others to be the best they can be; it is called positive peer pressure. And when you see a problem, address it - that is, if you are not part of the solution, you are part of the problem.  
 
Some everyday “issues" are male oriented and are best addressed by those who best understand them, ie, by other men. Issues such as being sexually inappropriate to women; getting overly aggressive (especially when a group of guys get together and egg each other on - aka negative peer pressure); young men and boys in need of a strong male role model who can show how to successfully avoid and solve problems rather than promoting further conflict with the use of trigger aggression, etc.  True male honour comes from the ability to control anger (not let it control you), to be able to cope with delayed (not immediate) gratification, to have the strength to address wrongs and to make an unwavering commitment to support their young.
 
I don't see the ad as showing men as weak, but as saying men can be strong to address these issues - and it is OK to do so.  I also don't see it as showing men in a bad light.  These behaviours happen and men are often confused as to whether they should walk away and shake their head or whether they should get involved.  
 
It is blatantly obvious that we have a significant problem with young men who are raised with way too little guidance, especially in poorer communities where fathers can be scarce - but it happens everywhere - too many young men fumble their way through their youth with a definite lack of direction and support. They often seem lost and as a result make some bad choices that impact them for the rest of their lives.
 
There are many, many ad campaigns, and government initiatives, etc, to support young women to be the best they can be, and they have been successful.. Young men have not been included in this developmental focus.  I just see this as an ad to support young men.  Everything can be micro analyzed and critiqued but I think the intent is clear and well meaning.  At the very least, it has sparked debate.  Targeted support for young men is long overdue.
Edited by Maryaam

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50 minutes ago, 2Timeless said:

This advert suggests that men need to let go of their masculinity, and that any masculinity is toxic, and they need to adopt traits that they already have. Maybe that wasn't the intention of the advert, but it's certainly what it portrays. 

I didn't get that impression from the ad. I got more of a "see something, say something" vibe, kind of a "let's stop ignoring and start correcting" message. 

*shrugs*

Maybe you have to be feminist to see it as anti-masculine. Or maybe you have to listen to the commentators, not the ad itself. 

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44 minutes ago, 2Timeless said:

I completely agree. I think the only real masculinity can show toxic masculinity how emasculaying it is to be toxically masculine. Lol so much "masculinity". Does it make sense?

But that's what the ad is saying! Are you agreeing with it or disagreeing? 

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I agree with sisters notme and Maryaam. I don’t see the toxicity in this. I think campaigns like this (though they are just another way to make more money) are a good way to change the mindset that goes along with toxic masculinity. They are a way to get through to the masses. Keep in mind that this the conversation is about toxic masculinity, not masculinity itself. 

Edited by Nevsevug

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53 minutes ago, notme said:

let's stop ignoring and start correcting" message. 

Okay, and would your husband/brother/father not stop a fight, or stop a man from raping a woman? All the men I know have gheera and would definitely do something to stop it. The issue with this ad is that it assumes that all men don't already do that. I would've completely supported an ad that encouraged men to embrace their emotions and the way they express them, by showing how damaging phrases like "be a man" are, and that it's okay for a man to cry etc. 

54 minutes ago, notme said:

Maybe you have to be feminist to see it as anti-masculine

It's got nothing to do with that. I don't think you see how damaging this is. It's engraining into young boys minds that all men are bad and need to be controlled. Like I said earlier, many men already "start correcting " and don't ignore all the negatives within men. Also, last I checked, the video had 20k likes and 197k dislikes. So, it's not just a feminist issue. 

 

55 minutes ago, notme said:

But that's what the ad is saying! Are you agreeing with it or disagreeing? 

Lol I'm disagreeing with the ad. They could've done a much better job at it, if the beginning of it didn't make all men seem like animals.

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7 minutes ago, Nevsevug said:

Keep in mind that this the conversation is about toxic masculinity, not masculinity itself

And this ad suggests all masculinity is toxic. It does not represent the men who are already masculine, but are not abusive or hurtful and ate respectful etc.

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1 hour ago, Maryaam said:

Targeted support for young men is long overdue.

I agree, but the men I've discussed this with, and those who have reacted to it online don't see it as support. The ad is offensive as it suggests that all men do all the negative behaviours you mentioned.

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