Jump to content
Guests can now reply in ALL forum topics (No registration required!) ×
Guests can now reply in ALL forum topics (No registration required!)
In the Name of God بسم الله
yusuf44a

how do Shia feel about the nation of Islam

Recommended Posts

4 hours ago, Murtaza1 said:

I can sense that. I don’t understand why people are so fascinated by western people such as Malcolm X especially Muslims. 

You need to really know the man before coming to a conclusion about him. and he was from a different era in a different time. Learn to appreciate CONTEXT. Look up the word in the dictionary if you don’t understand CONTEXT. Sometimes in this life, its not about being 100% correct on religious texts and judging everything and everyone based on literal interpretations of the holy scriptures but understanding events and people within the CONTEXT of everything. I would expect more from you, being that you were born into a faith that makes JUSTICE the centre of its creed within the historical CONTEXT of past events such as the tragedy of Karbala and the brutal murders of Imam Ali and Hussayn (peace be upon them) and everything that has happened from then on. The brutal murders of Shia human beings to this day. Learn to think, because as much as I am nobody, one thing I know about Islam that is referred to as "Shi'ism" is that you need TO BE ABLE TO THINK AND CONTEXTUALISE IN ORDER TO APPRECIATE THE FAITH. My goodness, Ignorance doesnt suit you personally or as a fervent man of your faith that you like to present yourself as.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, notme said:

Nation of Islam is not a Muslim sect, but a hybrid religion largely based on Islam. As I understand their teachings, they are racist, but I've only met a few followers and they were friendly to me. One woman even invited me to attend mosque services with her. (Maybe she didn't realize I am white, or maybe they are less racist than I've been told.) 

It started as more of a social movement in response to years of oppression than as a pure religion. I suspect their views have become more moderate over time, as the social situation has evolved. 

Since you are white as you say LET ME EDUCATE YOU ON SOMETHING. BLACK PEOPLE WHEREVER THEY ARE ON THIS EVIL PLANET ARE NOT AND CAN NEVER BE RACIST. A ZANJ can only be PREJUDICE AGAINST ANY HUMAN BEING FROM ANY RACE WHO EXERCISES RACISM AGAINST A BLACK PERSON BECAUSE IT IS FASHIONABLE TO DO SO. MORE TO THE POINT, BLACK PEOPLE, IN AFRICA AND ALL OVER THIS EVIL PLANET WHERE THEY RESIDE AS THE DESCENDANTS OF SLAVES ARE ONLY PREJUDICE BECAUSE THEY REACT TO A THOUSAND YEARS OF OPPRESSION BY SPECIFICALLY THE WHITE MAN BUT NOT HIM ALONE. AFRICANS ALONG WITH THEIR PROGENY WORLDWIDE ARE NOT, HAVE NEVER BEEN AND WILL NEVER BE RACIST. IF YOU UNDERSTOOD AFRICAN CULTURE, YOU'D UNDERSTAND RACISM IS NOT A PART OF THE UNIVERSAL CULTURE INHERENT IN EVERY BLACK AFRICAN HUMAN BEING.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@Gabenowa my apologies, it wasn't my intention to be insensitive. What word should I use instead to indicate a feeling that their "race" is superior to any other? 

 

Also, [moderator note:] please note that posting in all caps is against forum rules and policies. You can use capitalization for emphasis, but please use it in moderation. Thanks. 

 

Edited by notme

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Murtaza1 said:

I can sense that. I don’t understand why people are so fascinated by western people such as Malcolm X especially Muslims. 

The same reason as they are fascinated by Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. or Mahatma Ghandi - because they sought to lift their people out of tyranny. Their difference in religious views is unimportant in the context of heroism, or at least the heroism overcomes the difference. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, notme said:

@Gabenowa my apologies, it wasn't my intention to be insensitive. What word should I use instead to indicate a feeling that their "race" is superior to any other? 

 

Also, [moderator note:] please note that posting in all caps is against forum rules and policies. You can use capitalization for emphasis, but please use it in moderation. Thanks. 

 

The views about the superiority of the "black man" by the Nation of Islam was just a knee-jerk reaction against white racism in the United States. They wanted to respond to hate with hate. respond with "superiority" to "superiority". Thats why Malcolm left the Nation of Islam. His presence and performance of Hajj opened his eyes to the truth. He realised that respond with hate to hate was a road to nothingness. Hence on his return from Saudi Arabia he made this statement:

I am not a racist 

In the past I permitted myself to be used to make sweeping indictments of all white people, the entire white race and these generalisations have caused injuries to some whites who perhaps did not deserve to be hurt.

Because of the spiritual enlightment which I was blessed to receive as the result of my recent pilgrimage to the Holy City of Mecca, I no longer subscribe to sweeping indictments of any one race.

I am now striving to live the life of a true Sunni Muslim. I must repeat that I am not a racist nor do I subscribe to the tenets of racism.

I can state in all sincerity that I wish nothing but freedom, justice and equality, life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness for all people."

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, BowTie said:

 

They believed that those who express hate of black people like the Ku klux klan are the honest whites because they don’t pretend. Malcolm and the Nation of Islam at the time believed that the solution to the race problem in America was wholesale separation of black and white completely. Mecca ofcourse changed all of that.

In South Africa, English-speaking people are the most polite human beings, incredibly polite. They are the descendants of people from England. But that also makes them the most dangerous creatures on earth. Their hate is hidden behind smiles. An English-man can shake your hand and then go wash his hands behind your back because as a black African I am "filfthy". They never keep promises, business that is, they never tell the truth. They are manipulative, all the while never losing his or her charm, and they can really really use a human being then discard you like trash once they are done with you. The white english-speaking girls will only date black men even marry black men if she can see that she can use his esteemed elite status in society to further advance herself.

the descendants of Dutch people in South Africa, they call themselves "AFRIKANERS" meaning White African, are like the Ku Klux klan. Their hate and violence against black people is vicious and brutal. Really really brutal. But atleast you know where you stand with the Afrikaner. He never lies, never pretends and he keeps his word. If you engage in business with him, you know he will keep his side of the bargain. But also when he is not racist, you know it is genuine because their kindness and smiles are truly genuine. These Afrikaners do not pretend. If he hates you he really hates you, and if he loves you as an equal human being then his love and genuine humanity can be amazing. 

Thats what Malcolm saw in the KKK. Genuine white men whose hate was not pretentious and they could come to an agreement.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

But racism and whatever else, slavery and colonialism, does not detract from the fact that every Black African, whether in Africa or not, is a human being like anyone else. Capable of manipulating "vitctimhood" to serve an evil agenda. Like every human being, a Zanj is an individual and should be judged according to his individual characteristics. In essence, he or she should be judged according to his or her essence. Some Africans are capable of manipulating the sad history of racism to serve their own hidden agendas. You see it with what the Nation of Islam has become today. You saw it with Barack Hussein Obama. They threw a black face on the American Empire and some of us (me included) got fooled while nothing changed. They under his direction bombed and increased brutal drone strikes on innocent civilians. He bombed Libya under the pretext of "democracy" and destroyed that country completely even though he was warned by African governments to not do that because the consequences would be civil war. Thats the problem of racism, it allows evil black men to flourish.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
29 minutes ago, Gabenowa said:

The views about the superiority of the "black man" by the Nation of Islam was just a knee-jerk reaction against white racism in the United States. They wanted to respond to hate with hate. respond with "superiority" to "superiority".

That would explain my experience. I had always been told that NOI teachings said that all white people are evil and not to be trusted, but my experience with individual people caused me to doubt what I've been told. I've seen only people who were welcoming and friendly toward me and my children. (My experience is limited, of course, but it is what it is.)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
27 minutes ago, notme said:

That would explain my experience. I had always been told that NOI teachings said that all white people are evil and not to be trusted, but my experience with individual people caused me to doubt what I've been told. I've seen only people who were welcoming and friendly toward me and my children. (My experience is limited, of course, but it is what it is.)

I have seen innocent white people in my country get hurt and they did not deserve to be hurt at all. I've witnessed white people speak out against injustice and they are told to "shut up" because they don’t know what they are talking about. I've had school mates who were white, but they were so pure, so genuine as human beings that I stopped seeing the "white" on them. I saw genuine human beings. I have witnessed white kids suffer psychological break downs because they turned against the hate that their parents taught them. Turning against your own parents, I know from personal experience, turning against creeds and teachings which are plainly wrong can have devastating consequences for the psyche. That's why the NOI  is redundant today. It means nothing. Times have changed, Times will always change. Yesterdays truths are todays lies. Yesterdays lies are todays truths.

But the words of Imam Ali(peace be upon him) I am realising as I study them eveyday defy time and space. They are timeless. They are not archaic meaning their truth does not expire or become victim to the ever changing realities of time. But certain human beings like Malcolm X were the heroes and the victims of their own times and who can judge them? They were mere human beings who knew that their time was limited and would not even live to see their children graduate from high school. That time is gone as time operates no other way. What is needed is pure truth, truth that cannot be a victim of time and space. Truths that are forever.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Gabenowa said:

They believed that those who express hate of black people like the Ku klux klan are the honest whites because they don’t pretend. Malcolm and the Nation of Islam at the time believed that the solution to the race problem in America was wholesale separation of black and white completely. Mecca ofcourse changed all of that.

In South Africa, English-speaking people are the most polite human beings, incredibly polite. They are the descendants of people from England. But that also makes them the most dangerous creatures on earth. Their hate is hidden behind smiles. An English-man can shake your hand and then go wash his hands behind your back because as a black African I am "filfthy". They never keep promises, business that is, they never tell the truth. They are manipulative, all the while never losing his or her charm, and they can really really use a human being then discard you like trash once they are done with you. The white english-speaking girls will only date black men even marry black men if she can see that she can use his esteemed elite status in society to further advance herself.

the descendants of Dutch people in South Africa, they call themselves "AFRIKANERS" meaning White African, are like the Ku Klux klan. Their hate and violence against black people is vicious and brutal. Really really brutal. But atleast you know where you stand with the Afrikaner. He never lies, never pretends and he keeps his word. If you engage in business with him, you know he will keep his side of the bargain. But also when he is not racist, you know it is genuine because their kindness and smiles are truly genuine. These Afrikaners do not pretend. If he hates you he really hates you, and if he loves you as an equal human being then his love and genuine humanity can be amazing. 

Thats what Malcolm saw in the KKK. Genuine white men whose hate was not pretentious and they could come to an agreement.

Brother, the subject is about NOI not the racist issue.

Malcolm X was a part of NOI and he left them, and they assassinated him, simple as that.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, BowTie said:

Brother, the subject is about NOI not the racist issue.

Malcolm X was a part of NOI and he left them, and they assassinated him, simple as that.

Do forgive me my brother.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, ShiaMan14 said:

Nation of Islam was created by the FBI to try to curb the influence of Martin Luther King, Jr. and his movement.

Basically split up the black community.

Well atleast they were better than that hedonistic buffoon clown MLK ...

It's a comedy of errors on all sides the AA politics 

Sit back and enjoy bro 

Edited by Panzerwaffe

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Panzerwaffe said:

Well atleast they were better than that hedonistic buffoon clown MLK ...

It's a comedy of errors on all sides the AA politics 

Sit back and enjoy bro 

Not at all my brother. Martin Luther King Jr genuinely believed in non-violence. In any struggle worldwide there are those who believe in violence and there are those who believe in non-violence. and each has its own strengths and contradictions. Each has a price to pay. Both of them paid the price with their lives even though one was willing to turn the other cheek and the other was not willing to turn the other cheek. There is no straight road to victory. It has curves, potholes and God knows what else. If a person believes in his struggle, violently or not violently, he or she must be prepared to pay the ultimate price for that struggle. There is no right or wrong (except the slaughter of civilians) answer. Only struggle and death. INSHALLAH.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...