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In the Name of God بسم الله
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Thoughts 2019

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@Marbles sixteen years back, a man attacked me while my toddler and infant were with me. The man had easily 60 lbs weight advantage and I'm also not tall. 

When the police arrived, I had him pinned to the floor facedown and was restraining his hands. My children were fine and I only suffered a few mild bruises. 

But I admit, I wasn't wearing any makeup, hadn't done my hair, and was wearing an unfashionable oversized blouse that I'd owned for nearly ten years. 

So when you say "wrecks", what, specifically, do you mean? 

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2 hours ago, notme said:

If the husband is worried about his wife "letting herself go" physically, he needs to pick up the slack and quit making her carry the whole burden of raising a family.

Wrecks as in - "now that I'm 5 years married with two kids, I can let myself go and rival Yokozuna. All that food was invented just for me. And exercise is for the aliens. I don't have 30 mintes for a treadmill but I have 5 hours for social media. And I would not listen to a word of advice and would get upset and bring up fancy Western terms like body shaming etc to make the husband and my family look like agents of oppression. Now I need a session with my psychiatrist after all this abuse..."

That is physical and emotional wretchedness rolled into one. Of course this is hyperbole but you get what I'm trying to say. 

This is in spite of the considerate husband who shares in the housework and looks after kids after work hours if need be; in spite of the hired domestic help, I,e; maids who do the cleanin. Some have cooks who prepare the food for all."

"But I am still a wreck because why not? See these two kids, these are nuclear warheads that have destroyed me." 

This isn't just one case but a pattern and it's really disturbing.

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1 minute ago, Marbles said:

This isn't just one case but a pattern and it's really disturbing.

I don't think it's women in general. I think it's a cultural subset. My experience has been pretty much the opposite - women who have children become more emotionally tough and absolutely dedicated to protection of their families and communities. (I do know some women who prioritize health and exercise and others who don't.) 

Poor women (and men too) are forced to be strong. I'm pretty sure this weakness is common only among bored upper and middle class women who feel that they have nothing to give to the world. Upper and middle class men (and some women, depending of cultural expectations) have their careers to live for. 

I don't know. I'm just speculating. In my world, most of the women are mama bears and many men are just overgrown children. Both extremes are pretty messed up I suppose. 

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@Marbles I see this type of behaviour in mostly entitled housewives here in Pakistan, most of the working women I know lead a pretty active lifestyle and are generally not overweight or lazy. 

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2 hours ago, rkazmi33 said:

@Marbles this thinking of Pakistani men is exactly the reason why I will never get married again and I will never have kids. So much arrogance! I pray that some day you hear someone saying the exact words about you. 

Yeah it's always the men's fault no matter what. Women are angels descended from the heaven and incapable of displaying negative human sentiments. The biggest domestic drama in our families is the saas-bahu tamasha. As it happens both are females.

11 hours ago, starlight said:

@Marbles I see this type of behaviour in mostly entitled housewives here in Pakistan, most of the working women I know lead a pretty active lifestyle and are generally not overweight or lazy. 

I think entitled housewives from upper classes is a universal phenomenon but I wish in Pakistan it were only the entitled rich housewives who had this problem. Unfortunately, I see that phenomenon across the board including among working women.

PS: I am generalising to drive the point home. This shouldn't be even said but "not all" are like that, of course; and there are many cases where women disproportionately suffer the burden of child rearing and housework which is emotionally and physically exhausting. I have a great respect for & sympathies with those mothers who have to balance domestic duties with work if they are employed.

But please stop eating two chocolate bars and three pieces of cake every day and cut down on the damn baryani and pasta for God's sake.

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@IbnSina

Brother Assalam Alikum 

Joum3 mubaraka. :)

 

Yes, brother it's true.  So you can be the Imam, and your wife prays behind you.

Question: Some times, I see a group of believers say prayer collectively. As far as I know that kind of prayer is called 'congregational prayer'. Let me know what the procedure of congregational prayer is.

Answer: If there are two or more people, they can conduct a congregational prayer. The important requirement here is that the person who is going to lead the prayer (Imam) must fulfill certain conditions. Those taking part in congregational prayers shall receive added thawab (reward from God) especially when the Imam is a learned man and there are more people praying congregationally
 

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13 hours ago, Reza said:

Anyone on Earth wealthier than Jeff Bezos? I feel like some world royals have more, but are excluded from the main lists of wealthiest people.

I am wealthier than Jeff Bezos. All he has is money. I have so much more of value. 

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16 hours ago, Laayla said:

@IbnSina

Brother Assalam Alikum 

Joum3 mubaraka. :)

 

Yes, brother it's true.  So you can be the Imam, and your wife prays behind you.

Question: Some times, I see a group of believers say prayer collectively. As far as I know that kind of prayer is called 'congregational prayer'. Let me know what the procedure of congregational prayer is.

Answer: If there are two or more people, they can conduct a congregational prayer. The important requirement here is that the person who is going to lead the prayer (Imam) must fulfill certain conditions. Those taking part in congregational prayers shall receive added thawab (reward from God) especially when the Imam is a learned man and there are more people praying congregationally
 

Alhamdulillah, very good to hear.

Thanks for sharing.

It was quite annoying the times I had a friend over and it was time for maghrib prayers and you had to recite it loudly when two people are reciting at the same time.

I am not used to having Muslims to pray with and was not raised in an environment with lots of Muslims and Muslim friends around me so I never researched or experienced this situation a lot.

My next question for everyone:

What do you do when a Sunni brother joins your prayers mid prayer?

This happened to me in Egypt once and I did not know what to do, so I just prayed my travelers prayers and I think the guy got a bit surprised. Whats the rulings regarding people joining your prayers mid prayer?

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20 hours ago, Marbles said:

Yeah it's always the men's fault no matter what. Women are angels descended from the heaven and incapable of displaying negative human sentiments. The biggest domestic drama in our families is the saas-bahu tamasha. As it happens both are females.

I think entitled housewives from upper classes is a universal phenomenon but I wish in Pakistan it were only the entitled rich housewives who had this problem. Unfortunately, I see that phenomenon across the board including among working women.

PS: I am generalising to drive the point home. This shouldn't be even said but "not all" are like that, of course; and there are many cases where women disproportionately suffer the burden of child rearing and housework which is emotionally and physically exhausting. I have a great respect for & sympathies with those mothers who have to balance domestic duties with work if they are employed.

But please stop eating two chocolate bars and three pieces of cake every day and cut down on the damn baryani and pasta for God's sake.

IMHO the issue partly relates to the fact that 'some' women/young ladies feel a lot of pressure (either self inflicted or by other members of the family) to look the best that they possibly can, and to maintain themselves to the highest degree possible whilst they are single, in order to attract a marriage proposal. Once they have reached their 'goal' of getting married, in some instances they no longer feel the need to maintain the same levels of self discipline anymore as there is no longer a 'motivational factor' driving them to do so. I have seen so many women who lose weight specifically to find a suitor, but as soon as they get married, they pile it all back on again. 

However, the above is not always the only/sole factor for weight gain in married women. Please remember that a woman's entire life is turned upside down when she gets married and she is going through a huge period of change. She often needs to move to a different town and house; live with people that she doesn't know very well, adjust to a new way of life etc. etc. It is normally expected that a woman must make all the adjustments and changes to her life post marriage, and to 'adapt' to the lifestyle/customs/traditions/way of life etc. of her husband and in-laws. This can take a toll on one's emotional and mental well-being. Also, in some cases, the husband and/or in-laws never seem to approve of anything that the new bride does; there may be a power struggle within the women of the family etc. etc. All this can actually lower one's self esteem which can lead to comfort eating and hence weight gain.

Often newly married couples are invited to 'dawats' (dinner invites) for literally months after their marriage. In these dawats one is served with very rich food, and the host insists that you must "keep eating" or else you run the risk of offending them. This will obviously cause weight gain.

Many married couples (especially newly married couples) engage in date nights where they eat out at fancy restaurants, dessert shops etc. etc.

Pregnancy can take a toll on a woman's body and it can take even the fittest and most dedicated of women months of hard work before their body bounces back in shape, if at all.

I've observed that some women eat their children's left over food as they don't believe in food wastage. This will naturally cause weight gain too.

But, the most likely reason is that many women are juggling so many tasks at the same time, and wearing so many hats, that they quite simply can't make the time to exercise or to make sensible eating choices.

So, as explained above, there can be whole host of reasons why women put weight on post marriage. There is no simplistic or generic answer.    

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Thoughts:

My husband and I sometimes pray standing side by side as he doesn’t lead me in prayer since he’s not Shia. We pray our own prayers, but we stand side by side, sometimes.

Is this wrong? 

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8 minutes ago, Islandsandmirrors said:

Thoughts:

My husband and I sometimes pray standing side by side as he doesn’t lead me in prayer since he’s not Shia. We pray our own prayers, but we stand side by side, sometimes.

Is this wrong? 

I don’t know if it invalidates your prayers, but I think it might invalidate his prayers. Not sure about Sunni salah rules though. 

According to Shia rules his prayer is already invalidated by making sajjda on a carpet and not on natural material, or holding his arms together, both of which is biddah in our school of thought.  His prayer would also become invalidated if it is done behind or side by side with a women, unless the place of her sajjda is no longer ahead than where he puts down his knees in tashahud.

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6 minutes ago, IbnSina said:

I don’t know if it invalidates your prayers, but I think it might invalidate his prayers. Not sure about Sunni salah rules though. 

According to Shia rules his prayer is already invalidated by making sajjda on a carpet and not on natural material, or holding his arms together, both of which is biddah in our school of thought.  His prayer would also become invalidated if it is done behind or side by side with a women, unless the place of her sajjda is no longer ahead than where he puts down his knees in tashahud.

I’d like to think that Allah is merciful and that only He decides whose prayers are invalid or not. A Shia making sajdeh on a carpet, knowing that is wrong and does it anyway, or folds his arms together, is different from a Sunni who had little exposure to the truth. 

In the end, what matters is intention. 

Edited by Islandsandmirrors

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1 hour ago, Islandsandmirrors said:

Thoughts:

My husband and I sometimes pray standing side by side as he doesn’t lead me in prayer since he’s not Shia. We pray our own prayers, but we stand side by side, sometimes.

Is this wrong? 

You both are not allowed to stand side by side.

Your husband needs to pray in front of you, or perhaps you both can pray in different rooms. 

Just explain it to him, I'm sure he'll understand.

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10 hours ago, rkazmi33 said:

@Marbles

I am so glad I live in a country in which at least SOME people still  act like humans. 

Interesting you mentioned this. I saw this a couple of days ago and cheered the people who stood up for the woman.

However, I do not think there is any equivalence between what I've said and this scenario. Here is a shop employee who is neither her friend not her relative, and does not know her beyond of the transnational relationship on display. She is clearly out of her place for insulting an overweight woman for her weight and demanding more money. in Pakistan if anyone said something similarly mean to an unknown person or a customer, people would stand up for them just like they did in this video. I know I would, so would my family. Because it's a matter of common sense and manners not to poke your nose where it doesn't belong.

 

Edited by Marbles

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3 hours ago, Aflower said:

IMHO the issue partly relates to the fact that 'some' women/young ladies feel a lot of pressure (either self inflicted or by other members of the family) to look the best that they possibly can, and to maintain themselves to the highest degree possible whilst they are single, in order to attract a marriage proposal. Once they have reached their 'goal' of getting married, in some instances they no longer feel the need to maintain the same levels of self discipline anymore as there is no longer a 'motivational factor' driving them to do so. I have seen so many women who lose weight specifically to find a suitor, but as soon as they get married, they pile it all back on again. 

However, the above is not always the only/sole factor for weight gain in married women. Please remember that a woman's entire life is turned upside down when she gets married and she is going through a huge period of change. She often needs to move to a different town and house; live with people that she doesn't know very well, adjust to a new way of life etc. etc. It is normally expected that a woman must make all the adjustments and changes to her life post marriage, and to 'adapt' to the lifestyle/customs/traditions/way of life etc. of her husband and in-laws. This can take a toll on one's emotional and mental well-being. Also, in some cases, the husband and/or in-laws never seem to approve of anything that the new bride does; there may be a power struggle within the women of the family etc. etc. All this can actually lower one's self esteem which can lead to comfort eating and hence weight gain.

Often newly married couples are invited to 'dawats' (dinner invites) for literally months after their marriage. In these dawats one is served with very rich food, and the host insists that you must "keep eating" or else you run the risk of offending them. This will obviously cause weight gain.

Many married couples (especially newly married couples) engage in date nights where they eat out at fancy restaurants, dessert shops etc. etc.

Pregnancy can take a toll on a woman's body and it can take even the fittest and most dedicated of women months of hard work before their body bounces back in shape, if at all.

I've observed that some women eat their children's left over food as they don't believe in food wastage. This will naturally cause weight gain too.

But, the most likely reason is that many women are juggling so many tasks at the same time, and wearing so many hats, that they quite simply can't make the time to exercise or to make sensible eating choices.

So, as explained above, there can be whole host of reasons why women put weight on post marriage. There is no simplistic or generic answer.    

I totally agree with everything you've said. I've sisters and sister-cousins and friends, so I've seen things firsthand. No one who has been part of our culture would dispute the pressures put on woman pre- and post-marriage, the challenges they face in adjusting to a new lifestyle, and the hardships childbirth and their upbringing etc. Men don't face these problems, not even nearly to the same level as women.

And I don't mean to suggest that issues of weight gain and lack of interest towards diet and exercise is simply due to laziness and the upper class entitled housewife syndrome, which exists, yes, but doesn't explain other issues at work. 

I appreciate your taking the time to address this in detail. Thank you.

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Interesting perspective on democracy - what gets promoted by a government is not necessarily the best option in any given situation, but rather one which is easy to explain and understand. This is a British government internal memo about railway privatisation (I grabbed it off an FT video, so it is kosher). 

728533470_Screenshot2019-01-26at08_50_18.png.279caa0d4f01273989fb807189143c01.png

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3 hours ago, Marbles said:

She is clearly out of her place for insulting an overweight woman for her weight and demanding more money.

A good example where a perfectly sensible policy is being attacked because it is presented badly.

How's this for an alternative scenario?

I've inserted some text in square brackets to clarify for people unfamiliar with the United Kingdom health system:

Quote

A hip replacement patient took an £11,500 loan to pay for an operation after the NHS postponed treatment due to his weight.

Roland Crooke was in "huge pain" when he was denied [FREE] surgery by Vale of York Clinical Commissioning Group [CCG].

The group's guidelines mean anyone with a body mass index higher than 30 must lose weight or wait a year for non-emergency procedures.

 
 

https://www.bbc.co.United Kingdom/news/health-46568314

Edited by Haji 2003

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https://ytcropper.com/cropped/mL5c4c4ed3be558

@Marbles I think it's more hurtful if your loved one or a friend passes mean comments about your weight. Since you used this excuse, above is the video of people's comments when the in-laws pass such comments. We have seen a very public display of this body shaming. Sanam Jung had trouble losing weight after just one kid, and she was body shamed for months. She even did lose her weight but she lost her morning show and now her career is over. If it is hard for a showbiz woman to lose weight after a child, with all the resources available, you can imagine how hard it is for ordinary women, who don't have resources and time to spend on trainer or doing exercise or to buy special meals. 

Edited by rkazmi33

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4 hours ago, Marbles said:

and does not know her beyond of the transnational relationship on display.

Just in case.

It should read "and does not know her beyond the transactional relationship on display."

I blame a combination of haste and autocorrect.

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8 hours ago, Islandsandmirrors said:

Thoughts:

My husband and I sometimes pray standing side by side as he doesn’t lead me in prayer since he’s not Shia. We pray our own prayers, but we stand side by side, sometimes.

Is this wrong? 

You are supposed to be a pace back from him, according to tradition. I hope a knowledgeable person can provide supporting hadith. 

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5 hours ago, Marbles said:

And I don't mean to suggest that issues of weight gain and lack of interest towards diet and exercise is simply due to laziness and the upper class entitled housewife syndrome, which exists, yes, but doesn't explain other issues at work. 

Could also be depression. A lot of young people have the expectation of marriage being a fairy tale with a "happily ever after". When the woman realizes that everything in life takes work, her dreams are shattered. I could imagine a feeling of helplessness and hopelessness as a result. 

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12 hours ago, Islandsandmirrors said:

I’d like to think that Allah is merciful and that only He decides whose prayers are invalid or not.

Yes, for sure. Although as Shias we believe that the rulings of our school of thought is the rulings of Allah(سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) unchanged.

 

12 hours ago, Islandsandmirrors said:

A Shia making sajdeh on a carpet, knowing that is wrong and does it anyway, or folds his arms together, is different from a Sunni who had little exposure to the truth. 

I agree, there is a big difference, I was merely stating the rulings according to jaafari rules, I hope you will expose your husband more to your school of thought and that he iA becomes a follower of Ahlul Bayt(عليه السلام) as well.

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29 minutes ago, IbnSina said:

Whats a pace?

According to Ayatullah Sistani the least distance between a man and woman is that the place of prostration for woman can be in equal line with knee of the man.

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40 minutes ago, IbnSina said:

Whats a pace?

A few feet - two full steps back. It'd put her prostration  about even with his thigh. 

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21 hours ago, starlight said:

According to Ayatullah Sistani the least distance between a man and woman is that the place of prostration for woman can be in equal line with knee of the man.

This is my understanding as well, I think it's better to use this way instead of a pace since that length can change depending on individual understanding of distance.

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@Islandsandmirrors

896. If a woman stands in line with man, or in front of him in namaz, and both of them begin together, they should repeat their prayers. And the same applies if one of them starts earlier than the other.


https://www.Sistani.org/english/book/48/2212/

 

Credit to @Sumerian for finding the fatwa.

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