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In the Name of God بسم الله

John McCain Dies

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Why do you find it in poor taste? What respect or dignity does he hold in your eyes - whether alive or dead? These feelings are utterly baseless. What difference does it make whether he has been burie

I&S : Then it is your responsibility to stop being passive and educate yourself.  Don't expect to make comments like you did above and no one responds. McCain was in position of power for ove

The man just died, I find it extremely juvenile and in  poor taste to see Muslims bashing on a dead guy who probably isn't cold or hasn't been buried yet as I write this post.  As for what Notme said,

We as Shias need to focus on our own shortcomings instead of other people’s. It’s sad to see when people aren’t guided, but we mustn’t become arrogant or think we are better just because we do our wajibaats since you don’t know how Allah will judge you. 

@Gaius I. Caesar: what’s your opinion? 

Edited by Islandsandmirrors
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1 minute ago, Ashvazdanghe said:

Salam ,he was a formidable foe for shia muslim becuase he was behind any anti Shia group specially ISIS & Taliban but he didn't has any problem with radicals ,if IRGC & Hashd didn't take action against his creations already no shia exists ,that unfortunately his damn heritage still takes lifes of Shia muslims in Afghanistan & Pakistan. 

This was due to his political beliefs and party and any republican would have acted the same way due to ignorance. That’s why I said we need to focus on our own shortcomings. Just let Allah be the judge. 

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Senator John McCain died Saturday.

He was often criticized here on SC over the years.

In the CNN obit the 5th paragraph it quotes McCain "ln a memoir published in May, McCain wrote that he hated to leave the world, but had no complaints."

https://www.cnn.com/2018/08/25/politics/john-mccain-obituary/index.html 

l wonder if he thinks that now ..."take me back ... take me back ..."

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5 hours ago, Islandsandmirrors said:

We as Shias need to focus on our own shortcomings instead of other people’s. It’s sad to see when people aren’t guided, but we mustn’t become arrogant or think we are better just because we do our wajibaats since you don’t know how Allah will judge you. 

@Gaius I. Caesar: what’s your opinion? 

This is about a oppressor and who supported other oppressors and who hated Islam and who supported and did oppression. This is not about average sinful person, this is about a oppressor leaders.

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5 hours ago, Islandsandmirrors said:

We as Shias need to focus on our own shortcomings instead of other people’s. It’s sad to see when people aren’t guided, but we mustn’t become arrogant or think we are better just because we do our wajibaats since you don’t know how Allah will judge you. 

@Gaius I. Caesar: what’s your opinion? 

John McCain was a war hawk who would happily murder a million muslims in order to please Israel and the US military establishment. Dont compare him to ordinary people with shortcomings.

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2 hours ago, starlight said:

Imam al-Husayn (as) : “O People! Allah’s Prophet (S) said, ‘Any person who sees an oppressive sultan making illegal that which is lawful [halal], breaking Allah’s covenant, opposing the sunnah of Allah’s Prophet (S), conducting himself in a sinful and tyrannical way among Allah’s servants (the people) and does not speak out against such a sultan in order to bring about change; it becomes binding upon Allah to throw this apathetic person where he belongs, in Hell".

How rude. What an awful, low, low place you went. May Allah guide you. I hope you think before you post such rude things.

I just don’t follow whatever John McCain did or did not do in his life. I only remember him as running for presidential candidate. Not that I’m apathetic. 

So instead of judging me, or posting this Hadith to “warn” me or whatever goes through your head, maybe you should focus on yourself first and not assuming when you don’t have all the answers. 

Edited by Islandsandmirrors
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1 minute ago, Laayla said:

 

I&S Then it is your responsibility to stop being passive and educate yourself.  Don't expect to make comments like you did above and no one responds.

 

 

You do not tell me how I decide to educate myself. Politics is not something I focus on because I prioritize my mental health. I prefer to spend my time doing other things instead of getting angry at the world and the lousy decisions people in power make. 

I’m appalled you support the decision someone made to pass hateful judgement on me. Literally she posted this saying I should go to hell when she knows nothing of me. Obviously there’s not something right with someone who wishes hell upon another Muslim when they don’t even know who I am. What she said was hateful, and not something a mod, above all, should post. Who does she think she is?

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11 minutes ago, Laayla said:

nd sympathy with a murderer but you attack a momina, how weird.

 

I don’t find sympathy, I just don’t go around saying, “good thing he died, hope he goes straight to hell” whenever someone dies, wether that person was good or bad. Instead, I say that it’s really too bad some people weren’t guided, and I let Allah decide the rest. 

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2 hours ago, starlight said:

Imam al-Husayn (as) : “O People! Allah’s Prophet (S) said, ‘Any person who sees an oppressive sultan making illegal that which is lawful [halal], breaking Allah’s covenant, opposing the sunnah of Allah’s Prophet (S), conducting himself in a sinful and tyrannical way among Allah’s servants (the people) and does not speak out against such a sultan in order to bring about change; it becomes binding upon Allah to throw this apathetic person where he belongs, in Hell".

I diaagree with Island on this topic, but this is really uncalled for. Just because someone doesnt fully understand John McCains politics doesnt mean they should be condemned to hell.

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9 minutes ago, shiasoldier786 said:

I diaagree with Island on this topic, but this is really uncalled for. Just because someone doesnt fully understand John McCains politics doesnt mean they should be condemned to hell.

She can jump to whatever conclusions she wants. I did not quote he nor tag her. My post was meant towards millions in the United States and the world over who support zionist regime and vote for such politicians.

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@starlight  and @Laayla

its fine if someone disagrees with me, but to post a Hadith condemning me to hell is the most unislamic response. Promoting hateful speech against another Muslim is terrible. Like I said, everyone needs to focus on himself/herself instead of passing hateful judgement. 

You all know of my mental health. I don’t watch the news. How can you say all these hateful things and support those who do so? 

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Just now, starlight said:

She can jump to whatever conclusions she wants. I did not quote he nor tag her. My post was meant towards millions in the United States and the world over who support zionist regime and vote for such politicians.

Cut the crap. You posted this right after I made the comment that we should all focus on our ourselves instead of the destination of others. If your post was geared toward everyone, then why did you feel the need to post it? 

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15 minutes ago, shiasoldier786 said:

John McCains politics doesnt mean they should be condemned to hell. 

There is many evidence available  that he was founder of ISIS &Taliban & finding Abubakr Al-Baghdadi &training him by McCain

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3 minutes ago, starlight said:

She can jump to whatever conclusions she wants. I did not quote he nor tag her. My post was meant towards millions in the United States and the world over who support zionist regime and vote for such politicians.

“She can jump to whatever conclusion she wants.” Not “oh I’m sorry, my post wasn’t geared toward you. Sorry for the misunderstanding.”?

Any sane and logical person would have amended immediately, but this proves that you had posted this Hadith to anger and be hateful to me. 

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1 minute ago, Ashvazdanghe said:

There is many evidence available  that he was founder of ISIS &Taliban & finding Abubakr Al-Baghdadi &training him by McCain

@shiasoldier786 was talking about how Starlight was condemning me to hell.

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24 minutes ago, Islandsandmirrors said:

“She can jump to whatever conclusion she wants.” Not “oh I’m sorry, my post wasn’t geared toward you. Sorry for the misunderstanding.”?

Any sane and logical person would have amended immediately, but this proves that you had posted this Hadith to anger and be hateful to me. 

Islands, sister, Allah سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى knows I didn't direct this at you.I try my best to ignore you.

This thread was started by someone else other than you about a man responsible for brutal killings of thousands of Muslims and he was voted senator six times!! and was later presidential candidate. There are people who voted for him again and again and those who are calling him an 'honourable man' today after his death. I posted this thinking of them. 

Relax, had I wanted to address you I would have done it directly.

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My condolences to his family and friends. 

I disagreed with almost all that he did in public life, but near the end he was one of only a few Republicans to stand against Trump's criminal policies. 

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Just now, notme said:

My condolences to his family and friends. 

I disagreed with almost all that he did in public life, but near the end he was one of only a few Republicans to stand against Trump's criminal policies. 

He stood up against him cause he wanted war more than even Trump. Disagreeing with Trump means nothing if you push for worse things. In this guy's case he is an apologist and a participant in murder and war crimes. No sympathies or condolences should be given.

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33 minutes ago, notme said:

In my culture, you say the best that you are able about someone who has recently died. It's considered poor taste to criticize before the grass has regrown on the grave.

The old, "Don't speak ill of the dead".

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15 hours ago, Islandsandmirrors said:

You do not tell me how I decide to educate myself. Politics is not something I focus on because I prioritize my mental health. I prefer to spend my time doing other things instead of getting angry at the world and the lousy decisions people in power make. 

I’m appalled you support the decision someone made to pass hateful judgement on me. Literally she posted this saying I should go to hell when she knows nothing of me. Obviously there’s not something right with someone who wishes hell upon another Muslim when they don’t even know who I am. What she said was hateful, and not something a mod, above all, should post. Who does she think she is?

That is your interpretation.  When I read the hadith, it didn't even cross my mind she was referring to you.  Then I read what starlight posted and I believe her.  She has no reason to lie, a momin doesn't lie.  

Politics is very sensitive for most of us in this region.  We are effected everyday by American policies.   

Do any of you remember what happened to the children that were bombed in Fou3a?  No?  Exactly, it wasn't reported in America!  We heard about it everyday, for a week!  

I believe in Allah's justice it brings me relief and comfort.  But remember each and every one of us is responsible of what position we take when it comes to oppressive leaders.  

God keep us firm and steadfast on His religion.

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3 hours ago, starlight said:

She can jump to whatever conclusions she wants. I did not quote he nor tag her. My post was meant towards millions in the United States and the world over who support zionist regime and vote for such politicians.

Pretty much everyone here realizes what a scumbag McCain was.  The way to inform others about his crimes is to mention them, which most other posters are doing. You don't need to post a condemnation to hell when it is obvious someone is not as aware of his history.  That was just uncalled for.

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I'm perplexed by some of the comments.

Do you recite Ziyara Ashura? It's all about ill-speaking behind dead people and it's all condemnation to hell, and it is a Qudsi Hadith in case you didn't know.

You know what happens when you only speak nice and fancy behind all dead people (no matter what they did in life and who they were)? just to please their family and friends and not be hurt, start giving nice words no matter what animal the dead person was? you know what happens in the long run?

Butchers in the history of humanity will turn to heroes of the history.

The propaganda that could help McCain create these monsters (Isis) and get away with it, is capable of creating a hero out of him for next generations. The propaganda on the other side is fully awake and active, it's only naive of us to think "Ok, let's keep silent and leave it to God."

I don't want this to happen. I don't want my children or their children think McCain was a hero due to taghut propaganda, therefore I curse him to eternity and humbly ask Allah, the all Just, to increase his punishment in hell and make him go through the same agonies he made for all the children in Iraq, Syria, Lebonan, etc.

And for those who have mental problems or don't follow news and politics, they can ignore this thread as well, because it's political in nature; nothing is personal in these discussions.

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1 hour ago, King said:

Pretty much everyone here realizes what a scumbag McCain was.  The way to inform others about his crimes is to mention them, which most other posters are doing. You don't need to post a condemnation to hell when it is obvious someone is not as aware of his history.  That was just uncalled for.

 I did not post my opinion, it's word of Imam(as) that I posted generally about people who do not raise their voices against an oppressive ruler. It is another difference between the shias and sunnis that not many people know about. 

The Sunni consensus is that it is incumbent to obey a tyrannical ruler(though a muslim, but nevertheless)even though he might be an oppressor or even if he forcibly usurps and seizes people’s property. The only thing they are allowed to do tell others of his oppressive acts. 

In contrast, according to shia belief  not only obeying a tyrannical and corrupt ruler not to incumbent, but consider it to be haram by the Islamic law to submit to such a leader. .

Edited by starlight
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3 hours ago, Laayla said:

  She has no reason to lie, a momin doesn't lie.  

How do you know how to label who is considered “a momin” or not? The right thing to say is that you would hope someone is a momin, not say confidently that someone, without a doubt, is a momin. You have no proof of that for anyone. Only Allah knows who is truly a momin and who isn’t. Not even you can be certain of your own status as a momin. 

It’s not Islamic or momin behavior to condemn others to hell. It’s none of his or her place to spread hateful words due the ignorance of others. 

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