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In the Name of God بسم الله
Enlightened Follower

Men in the West are becoming Feminized

Reza

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The focus of this topic is men becoming effeminate. This is not a discussion of feminism or women's rights, or even of women becoming masculine. Please stay on topic.

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1 hour ago, Enlightened Follower said:

No but to treat men with respect and raise women with realistic expectations rather than raising women who don’t value life and bash men. A girl in America committed suicide because her parents would not allow her to go to a party, this is insanity. 

Firstly, this isn't a pro-life/pro-choice debate. So I won't  get into that. 

Secondly, what are the realistic expectations? In my opinion, telling girls they can get an education and have successful careers just like their male counterparts isn't unrealistic.

Finally, unless you somehow got into that girl's mind when she was committing suicide, I don't think it's fair to decide why she killed herself. Sure, with some  suicides you can assume certain factors that could've led to it happeneing, but you can never be 100% sure about the reasons behind that persons choice. Also, I don't get how that relates to your argument.

Edited by Amira00

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1 hour ago, Enlightened Follower said:

No but to treat men with respect and raise women with realistic expectations rather than raising women who don’t value life and bash men. A girl in America committed suicide because her parents would not allow her to go to a party, this is insanity. 

Suicide.

?

lnsensitive as this reads, "not much of a girl', then.

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41 minutes ago, hasanhh said:

Suicide.

?

lnsensitive as this reads, "not much of a girl', then.

Female Narcissism at its finest:

https://nypost.com/2018/04/19/teen-committed-suicide-after-parents-wouldnt-let-her-go-to-party/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

Edited by Enlightened Follower

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1 hour ago, Amira00 said:

Firstly, this isn't a pro-life/pro-choice debate. So I won't  get into that. 

Secondly, what are the realistic expectations? In my opinion, telling girls they can get an education and have successful careers just like their male counterparts isn't unrealistic.

Finally, unless you somehow got into that girl's mind when she was committing suicide, I don't think it's fair to decide why she killed herself. Sure, with some  suicides you can assume certain factors that could've led to it happeneing, but you can never be 100% sure about the reasons behind that persons choice. Also, I don't get how that relates to your argument.

4

Assalamualaikum Warahmatullahi Wabarakatuh sister

"In my opinion, telling girls they can get an education and have successful careers just like their male counterparts isn't unrealistic" Looks like a typo? 

Islam teaches that in the sight of Allah Almighty, both women and men are equal.  However, I think the society / our upbringing does create the "realistic expectations" for both women and men.  

http://fortune.com/2018/02/28/black-history-month-black-ceos-fortune-500/

 

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1 hour ago, Amira00 said:

Secondly, what are the realistic expectations? In my opinion, telling girls they can get an education and have successful careers just like their male counterparts isn't unrealistic.

Feminism produces more gender inequality and less women in STEM:

https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2018/02/the-more-gender-equality-the-fewer-women-in-stem/553592/

d099fa13a.png

 

Notice Muslim countries have more STEM graduates than Sweden or the US.

Edited by Enlightened Follower

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46 minutes ago, Enlightened Follower said:

Feminism leads to spoiled women who think they can have their cake and eat it too.

If it's done right, it leads to men and women who give and expect respect regardless of gender. Rather than worrying about labels, we should just treat everyone the way we would want to be treated. 

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On 4/19/2018 at 6:33 AM, Enlightened Follower said:

In the case of secular materialism and most women in the West don’t value relationships, men who are millionaires will marry poor women but a female doctor would never marry say a male plumber she would want someone who out earns her at least this is the case in Western culture.

Dude have you seen a pak or Indian doctor girl marry a plumber ?

Not if pigs fly higher than Himalayas

It's not just western culture that's screwed up our own culture is no better 

Reality is most people put religion aside when making choices...materialism trumps everything 

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1 hour ago, Enlightened Follower said:

Feminism leads to spoiled women who think they can have their cake and eat it too.

I'm lost here. Are you saying feminism leads to suicide which is "spoiled women who think they can have their cake and eat it too"?? 

When I asked you how it relates to your argument I was talking about the story about  the girl who committed suicide- it was quite randomly thrown in there. 

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2 hours ago, Amira00 said:

I'm lost here. Are you saying feminism leads to suicide which is "spoiled women who think they can have their cake and eat it too"?? 

When I asked you how it relates to your argument I was talking about the story about  the girl who committed suicide- it was quite randomly thrown in there. 

The point of that story was to point to the fact feminism fails to accomplish what it claims to do, I.e. female happiness and freedom.

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2 hours ago, Panzerwaffe said:

Dude have you seen a pak or Indian doctor girl marry a plumber ?

Not if pigs fly higher than Himalayas

It's not just western culture that's screwed up our own culture is no better 

Reality is most people put religion aside when making choices...materialism trumps everything 

Yes but in Pakistani, Indian society there are still girls that have less money than a plumber providing a relationship for everyone. In the West that’s not the case and women are now out earning men and even those earning equal pay want someone who out earns them.

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41 minutes ago, Enlightened Follower said:

Yes but in Pakistani, Indian society there are still girls that have less money than a plumber providing a relationship for everyone. In the West that’s not the case and women are now out earning men and even those earning equal pay want someone who out earns them.

True but in rural America lots of white women still marry for religious and family reasons regardless of money so let's not generalize 

What you are describing essentially is an urban phenomena

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On 4/24/2018 at 12:47 PM, Enlightened Follower said:

Feminism produces more gender inequality and less women in STEM:

https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2018/02/the-more-gender-equality-the-fewer-women-in-stem/553592/

d099fa13a.png

 

Notice Muslim countries have more STEM graduates than Sweden or the US.

Of all STEM students in Muslim countries, a larger percentage are women than in Scandinavia. What has this to do with feminist movement? Is it a problem that girls have success? 

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On 4/24/2018 at 5:50 PM, andres said:

Of all STEM students in Muslim countries, a larger percentage are women than in Scandinavia. What has this to do with feminist movement? Is it a problem that girls have success? 

My point was countries that enforce gender equality such as Sweden actually promote more inequality in the STEM fields.

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By feminizing men and not allowing them to be themselves basic societal institutions breakdown it is within the nature of men to be certain way, new studies show men have certain behaviors because of how they are biologically, this has even been found in other species:

Male monkeys prefer boys toys

https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn13596-male-monkeys-prefer-boys-toys/

Edited by Enlightened Follower

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