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Necessity of hijab

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7 hours ago, zionismdestroyer said:

why are you asking then do whatever you want to do living in west does not change the rule of Shariah

I asked because I care about my religion and was interested in islam's view of modern, modest and practical hijab. While I respect your opinion, I wasn't asking for it, I was asking for religious backing. 

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20 hours ago, Islandsandmirrors said:

Do not mix culture with religion. People in Iran are uncultured and are starved from male attention so they wear high heels in the streets and clown makeup. People in Western societies do not dress generally to attract the opposite sex in public places (unless it’s a bar or club) in terms of color scheme. They are more likely to pick colors for outfits based on what looks good together.  

This is a fact and a half. The majority of iranian teenagers are the most sexually aroused hungry people its disgusting. When I stumbled upon a Persian unappropiate picture, the comments on that was just mad, like how desperate the teenagers are is insane, but when you compare that to a western istaghfurallah picture the comments are so much less sexually aroused and desperate. I live in the west and after a few years I decided to meet up with some of my mates that live in Iran, after years. And as far as I knew they were so religious. After Maghrib and Isha prayers they were lets go out and have "fun", I didnt know what that was, I though it was some park activity. Turned it was riding on motorbikes and finding the most attractive women. In my head I was so confused. I was like these people are the first people in Masjid, Do ashura very precisely and many more stuff.... And not brag how religious I am but not once did I even turn my head towards the girls because there "attractive woman" was normal women here in the west and was not special for me at all as I am used to bringing my look down. So honestly @Islandsandmirrors is very correct about the culture of the place.

And if you wanted to ask me I met them after years and I know how to pick mates correctly and these lot was religious. Iran is honestly just...... 

We just have to pray for saheb al zaman to arrive quicker and fix up this disgusting world. Illahyamin

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2 hours ago, Laayla said:

You hurt the Imam of your Time, especially as a shia, when you are publicly and knowingly sinning, compared to an ignorant and unknowingly person who happens to be Muslim.  You have a huge responsibility on your shoulders.

Firstly, where did I mention publicly sinning? I’m just stating the facts using my knowledge of the West (that women dress like a mess and unkemptly in public and gave a few examples between the differences in culture.) whereas you are using emotional guilt-trips and manipulation tactics instead of refuting my points constructively.

Secondly, how did I “hurt the Imam (AS) of my time” by mentioning that women in the West do not care about attracting men? Did you personally talk to our Imam? I’m explaining the facts, I’m not saying that how they dress is okay or Islamically moral. I’m saying that they are not what you think they are to be.

Thirdly, it is you who projecting your negativity and ignorance onto Western culture. Movies does not equate to living there. I was just explaining that Western people, more specifically, American women, do not care about looking attractive FOR men as Persian women are obsessed with doing. Last time I checked, Persian women are the ones getting cheek argumentation, breast implants, and, of course, nose jobs. They pile on thirty pounds of foundation and eyeliner and wear fake eye-lashes. To go out to a supermarket. Did I ever mention that I do those things? 

Whereas Western women apply minimal makeup, and usually end-up cutting their hair short, and don’t mess with their faces on endless cosmetic procedures. Persian women aspire to look like the kardashians as opposed to non-LA American women. 

Edited by Islandsandmirrors

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Bismehe Ta3ala,

Assalam Alikum.

No, sister I did not talk to the Imam.

Goodnight.  Wa salam.

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Salam everyone, new shiachat member! Made an account to specifically address views on hijab. As a university student in the west, the concept of hijab is not--and I repeat not-- only covering the hair. Nowadays hair covering is becoming a fashion if you look at fashion mags. To describe the concept of hijab in the most simplest ways (and not repeat what other members have already said) if your intention is to attract the opposite gender in any way or form then you are not practicing hijab. If you sport certain fashions to attract opposite gender, you are not practicing hijab. It is quite simple really. No need to overcomplicate things and Allah swt knows best your behaviors and actions. 

Wassalam 

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49 minutes ago, حسين said:

@Islandsandmirrors

 

Additionally, I do agree Eastern women may dress better, but that's because in Islam, it's haram to dress like an animal. They may be wearing the tightest of jeans where they may as well not be wearing anything but that's just those who are misinformed of the religion. The rest dress to "impress" as you might say, is because they probably do not go out much, and if they're going to the supermarket, they don't want anyone to see them in their pyjamas, like a homeless person would go around walking in to town.

So according to you, everyone who doesn't dress fancy every time they go out, that person is dressing like an animal, dressing like a homeless person, or dresses like a lesbian? There is a middle between dressing like a homeless or dressing fancy everytime you go out to attract attention from na-mehrams. Spoiled, arrogant, narcissistic and people who have a lot of free time on their hands and no responsibilities are the people who take hours to get ready even if they have to go for grocery shopping. And what are your views about the women living in the Holy cities of Iran and Iraq? They don't put any effort, just wear a black chador every time they want to go out. They don't even bother to buy different color chadors. Every single woman wears black chador like it's  a uniform. What's your views about them? Who knows is they buy a new chador every day or wear the same chador for months and years. In your view, do they dress like a homeless person, an animal or a lesbian? This is the great problem with eastern people. Every time they go out of the house, they dress to impress and it's all lies that they dress like that only for themselves, or Islam wants us to look presentable. 

There's a big difference between looking presentable and looking like a celebrity. Even women in work places, they look presentable and professional, still they don't dress like eastern women. If someone is not trying to impress the opposite gender, then that person must be gay/ lesbian, right? Because there is no thing called modesty in eastern culture. Every modest person is labeled as homosexual/ transgender in eastern culture. This is from personal experience. I cannot tell you how many eastern people have called me homosexual/ transgender, when I have never given any indication like that. I cannot even think about committing such a  sin, still people constantly try to prove that I am homosexual, just because I reject their advances, or perhaps I remind them how promiscuous they are. 

Edited by rkazmi33

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40 minutes ago, حسين said:

@rkazmi33 

This is why I dislike debating online, because when someone takes something out of context, you've now got your self a raging, emotional woman or child. 

We're speaking about western world, and of course women who actually follow the Deen right down to smallest saying. They might not spend more than 5 minutes getting ready.

I suggest you go drink some koolaide and calm down, because you're raging for no absolute reason.

While im just observing the debate and dont have strong feelings either direction worth sharing, what you did was not debating, it was spewing arrogant, judgemental opinions as of they were fact. If you want to debate, maybe start with looking up dialectics, and it'll give you a process that yields better results.

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On 5/8/2018 at 6:29 AM, ZahiK said:

Really? Do you think Sayeda Fatima would like to read this comment? If she was living in the west right now, do you actually think she would compromise her beliefs and her father's Islamic traditions because of being scared of being a "threat"? 

Lady Fatima AS would not be living in the West, so your question is rhetorical. :muslima:

On 5/8/2018 at 6:29 AM, ZahiK said:

Do you think she would wear such clothes that we could say someone is wearing the hijab better than her?

Of course not. Fatima Zahra AS wore the ultimate in hijab.:love:

On 5/8/2018 at 6:29 AM, ZahiK said:

Then why are you saying such discouraging words, sister?

My words were not discouraging but only my opinion. Everyone wrote their own opinion in this thread. There are several topics at ShiaChat from sisters who say they hate hijab and don't want to wear it. I want sisters to know that they don't have to wear an abaya or a chador if they are not Arab or Iranian, and don't live in an Islamic country. Our Ulema say that hijab is a personal choice and as long as it covers you completely and there is nothing immodest about it, you can wear what you have. Where I live, in the US, Islamophobia is very high and an abaya (or chador) is controversial clothing, because you will be perceived as an immigrant (a foreigner) and hate groups might choose you as an easy target, especially if you are walking alone. A chador can be gathered up into your arms as you run away from an attacker, but an abaya would just be very difficult to run in. I do not own high heels. 

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17 minutes ago, Hmzh said:

While im just observing the debate and dont have strong feelings either direction worth sharing, what you did was not debating, it was spewing arrogant, judgemental opinions as of they were fact. If you want to debate, maybe start with looking up dialectics, and it'll give you a process that yields better results.

Felt like it was becoming a debate, also. If you're going to attempt at being a white knight, at least don't be hypocritical towards one member in the 'argument' or 'debate.'She was being just as arrogant and judgemental whilst she also threw out arrogant opinions without any facts. Why is it you're defending one and stepping in? So I played the argument the way she began it. It was wrong of me to even begin. 

Edited by حسين

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6 hours ago, Islandsandmirrors said:

Firstly, where did I mention publicly sinning? I’m just stating the facts using my knowledge of the West (that women dress like a mess and unkemptly in public and gave a few examples between the differences in culture.) whereas you are using emotional guilt-trips and manipulation tactics instead of refuting my points constructively.

Secondly, how did I “hurt the Imam (AS) of my time” by mentioning that women in the West do not care about attracting men? Did you personally talk to our Imam? I’m explaining the facts, I’m not saying that how they dress is okay or Islamically moral. I’m saying that they are not what you think they are to be.

Thirdly, it is you who projecting your negativity and ignorance onto Western culture. Movies does not equate to living there. I was just explaining that Western people, more specifically, American women, do not care about looking attractive FOR men as Persian women are obsessed with doing. Last time I checked, Persian women are the ones getting cheek argumentation, breast implants, and, of course, nose jobs. They pile on thirty pounds of foundation and eyeliner and wear fake eye-lashes. To go out to a supermarket. Did I ever mention that I do those things? 

Whereas Western women apply minimal makeup, and usually end-up cutting their hair short, and don’t mess with their faces on endless cosmetic procedures. Persian women aspire to look like the kardashians as opposed to non-LA American women. 

  So True  I highly feel sad when people who have no real face to face experience of knowing western women culture talk such bad about them. @Islandsandmirrors

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7 hours ago, Futuremedstudent said:

Salam everyone, new shiachat member! Made an account to specifically address views on hijab. As a university student in the west, the concept of hijab is not--and I repeat not-- only covering the hair. Nowadays hair covering is becoming a fashion if you look at fashion mags. To describe the concept of hijab in the most simplest ways (and not repeat what other members have already said) if your intention is to attract the opposite gender in any way or form then you are not practicing hijab. If you sport certain fashions to attract opposite gender, you are not practicing hijab. It is quite simple really. No need to overcomplicate things and Allah swt knows best your behaviors and actions. 

Wassalam 

Bismehe Ta3ala,

Wa Alikum Assalam.

Welcome to SC.  Thank you for your post.  Hijab is to hide beautification and not to enhance it. 

M3 Salamah, FE AMIN Allah 

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21 hours ago, Hameedeh said:

I want sisters to know that they don't have to wear an abaya or a chador

Thank you for your reply. My point was that the way you stated that sentence that I quoted seemed very discouraging to those sisters who do want to wear a chador or the abaya, or those who already wear it. If you want to encourage sisters to wear the hijab (which is very good, I'm not taking those beautiful intentions away), there is no need to devalue the abaya or chador or those who wear it by saying "keep the ethnic clothing for your trips back home". The same way you're trying your best to encourage sisters who are hesitant to wear the hijab, keep your words also pure towards those who choose respectfully to wear it. I also live in the west, I also wear the hijab, and no I do not wear the abaya or chador either, but we should respect everyone's choices and try to be more careful in our words towards our fellow sisters.

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2 hours ago, ZahiK said:

I also live in the west, I also wear the hijab, and no I do not wear the abaya or chador either, but we should respect everyone's choices and try to be more careful in our words towards our fellow sisters.

Everyone was replying to the OP who said she can't wear abayah like ladies of Ahlul Bayt, pbut. Hameedeh was agreeing with her that she doesn't need to wear abayah or chador. She was sympathizing with the OP's situation. 

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I know that the headscarf and (female) hijab in general is important in terms of maintaining that boundary and keeping us out of otherwise compromising situations. But as we all know, Seyeda Zainab and Lady Fatima-Al-Zahra had perfect hijab which consisted of covering up completely, wearing abayahs etc. For me, and many other hijabi women, covering up to that extent is very very hard and impractical in our day-to-day lives especially if you use public transport regularly and spend a lot of time out-and- about. I try to have good hijab both in terms of clothing and the way I carry myself, but I still think that my hijab is not good enough. 

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On 5/9/2018 at 10:48 AM, Amira00 said:

You're right, the stuff I've heard on the hijab of ahl al bayt is all from the pulpit. But is it not true? Even the illustrations and hadiths ive heard all explain how the women were covered from head to toe, wearing those black abayahs (the ones you wear on the head) and their faces were covered. Ive also heard (I don't know if it's a Hadith or something else) that Imam Ali would blow out all the candles when Fatima Al zahra would pass by so the men on the street wouldn't even see her shadow. 

Is this all not right? 

No. They definitely didn't cover their faces, not only was there no custom amongst the Arab women to cover their faces (as part of a defined Hijab), but rather we have descriptions of Lady Fatima's face (by people who weren't even her mahram). They may have been covered from head to toe, but based on historical records their clothings were of different colours. In fact, according to our legal scholars, black is a disliked colour to begin with.

The candle, shadow, and those type of stories are usually nonsense with no real historical backing. Unfortunately we have had to resort to made up stories to fill up our imaginary understanding of what hijab would have been like for these noble ladies. The fact of the matter is their hijab would have been like any other Arab Muslim woman of the time, just like the clothes the Prophet wore were clothes the Arabs wore at the time.

Unfortunately I'm typing from my phone right now and don't have access to my resources. When I get time I'll share some material, but otherwise you don't need to put yourself down nor feel upset if you are following the rulings on hijab the way your marja' has defined it to be.

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On 5/10/2018 at 10:21 PM, Ibn al-Hussain said:

Unfortunately I'm typing from my phone right now and don't have access to my resources. When I get time I'll share some material, but otherwise you don't need to put yourself down nor feel upset if you are following the rulings on hijab the way your marja' has defined it to be.

This is surprising and interesting, I look forward to your follow-up post. 

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Seyyed Baqir Mojtahed Sistani for  attending in presence of Imam of Time started the pilgrimage of Ashura on Friday  for 40 times,  in every mosque of the city every week. He said:"On one of the last Friday’s, I saw a light radius coming from a house near the mosque I was in. I got strange now. I got up and went to the house looking for light. It was a small, poor house, I knocked on, when I opened the door, I saw that the Imam Hazrat Vely Asr(aj), was in one of the rooms of the house. In the room I saw a corpse which putted  white cloth  on it.I arrived and I greeted  with tears. The Imam said to me: Why are you looking for me and suffering these sufferings? Like this (pointed to that body) until I come to you. This is a lady who did not leave the house for seven years of banning of hijab ,so that nobody would not see her. "(4)

Enthusiastically of Imam Mahdi (aj)  v3 p158

https://article.tebyan.net/238892/توجه-و-عنایت-امام-زمان-عج-به-شیعیان-

 

27959

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kashf-e_hijab

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guys guys... discuss facts .. info.. not opinions on a person's particular choice or way of living and practicing their religion remember two things: 

- you are far from being capable of judging someone only our infalliable imam and Allah can and has the right to do so, so dont judge and dont criticize people's lives

- second... give opinions yours.. on subjects.. not on peoples actions or beliefs..

its a discussion forum for exchange of ideas and info and Q&A islamic not a forum insults and injuries

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On 5/8/2018 at 12:26 PM, Pearl178 said:

I wear loose clothing, hijab with hands, face and feet showing (I don’t really know if covering feet is wajib). My clothes tend to be a little colorful but not too flashy. A bit of makeup is a must though I know it’s against the rules...as for social hijab, I try my level best to limit conversations with non-mahram at work but it can be challenging at times when you spend most of the day in the office. 

Bismehe Ta3ala,

Assalam Alikum sister

Insh'Allah you are well and in good health. 

Unless you follow Sayyid Mohammad Hussain Fad'Allah feet must be covered as well.  

Sister, since you are aware of makeup as zeena, the month of Ramadan is days away, work on not applying it habibti because as Rasoul Allah said in his sermon, the best form of worship in the month of Allah is not to sin.

This is a sisterly reminder and you make Imam Zaman happy when he sees his shias working on themselves.  :)

M3 Salamah, Fe Amin Allah 

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3 hours ago, Laayla said:

Bismehe Ta3ala,

Assalam Alikum sister

Insh'Allah you are well and in good health. 

Unless you follow Sayyid Mohammad Hussain Fad'Allah feet must be covered as well.  

Sister, since you are aware of makeup as zeena, the month of Ramadan is days away, work on not applying it habibti because as Rasoul Allah said in his sermon, the best form of worship in the month of Allah is not to sin.

This is a sisterly reminder and you make Imam Zaman happy when he sees his shias working on themselves.  :)

M3 Salamah, Fe Amin Allah 

This is a little unrelated to the topic, but if you wear makeup in ramadhan ( just a little that it's barely noticeable) does it make your sawm invalid?

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Bismehe Ta3ala,

Assalam Alikum dear Sister @Amira00

Your fast is valid sister.  

Taqbal Allah a3malik.

The Sermon Given By The Prophet (s) On The Last Friday Of Sha'ban On The Reception Of The Month of Ramadhan

“O People !

“Indeed ahead of you is the blessed month of Allah. A month of blessing, mercy and forgiveness. A month which with Allah is the best of months. Its days, the best of days, its nights, the best of nights, and its hours, the best of hours. It is the month which invites you to be the guests of Allah and invites you to be one of those near to Him. Each breath you take glorifies him; your sleep is worship, your deeds are accepted and your supplications are answered.

So, ask Allah, your Lord; to give you a sound body and an enlightened heart so you may be able to fast and recite his book, for only he is unhappy who is devoid of Allah’s forgiveness during this great month. Remember the hunger and thirst of the day of Qiyamah (Judgement) with your hunger and thirst; give alms to the needy and poor, honor your old, show kindness to the young ones, maintain relations with your blood relations; guard your tongues, close your eyes to that which is not permissible for your sight, close your ears to that which is forbidden to hear, show compassion to the orphans of people so compassion may be shown to your orphans.

Repent to Allah for your sins and raise your hands in dua during these times, for they are the best of times and Allah looks towards his creatures with kindness, replying to them during the hours and granting their needs if he is asked...

“O People! Indeed your souls are dependant on your deeds, free it with Istighfar (repentance) lighten its loads by long prostrations; and know that Allah swears by his might: That there is no punishment for the one who prays and prostrates and he shall have no fear of the fire on the day when man stands before the Lord of the worlds.

“O People! One who gives Iftaar to a fasting person during this month will be like one who has freed someone and his past sins will be forgiven.

Some of the people who were there then asked the Prophet (s): “Not all of us are able to invite those who are fasting?”

The Prophet (s) replied: “Allah gives this reward even if the Iftaar (meal) is a drink of water.”

“One who has good morals (Akhlaq) during this month will be able to pass the ‘Siraat’...on the day that feet will slip...

“One who covers the faults of others will benefit in that Allah will curb His anger on the day of Judgement...

“As for one who honors an orphan; Allah will honor him on the day of judgement,

“And for the one who spreads his kindness, Allah will spread His mercy over him on the day of Judgement.

“As for the one who cuts the ties of relation; Allah will cut His mercy from him...

“Who so ever performs a recommended prayer in this month Allah will keep the fire of Hell away from him...

“Whoever performs an obligator prayer Allah will reward him with seventy prayers [worth] in this month.

“And who so ever prays a lot during this month will have his load lightened on the day of measure.

“He who recites one verse of the holy Quran will be given the rewards of reciting the hole Qur’an during other months.

“O People! Indeed during this month the doors of heaven are open, therefore ask Allah not to close them for you; The doors of hell are closed, so ask Allah to keep them closed for you. During this month Shaytan (Saten) is imprisoned so ask your Lord not to let him have power over you.”

Edited by Hameedeh
Mod Note: Moderators can reduce the size of excessively large fonts to a standard size of 14.

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On 5/11/2018 at 5:52 AM, ireallywannaknow said:

This is surprising and interesting, I look forward to your follow-up post. 

:salam:

We all know the topic of hijab is very extensive and it can be discussed from various different aspects. The most basic of these discussions is probably the historical and legal aspects. There is no reason to get into any of those discussions in detail here, but I will cite some references for some of the claims I made in this thread.

I only want to focus on Lady Fatima (s) and not on any other women, especially not the wives of the Prophet (p), regarding whom there is a different discussion and as well as some reports where there are differences of opinions as to whether they would cover their faces in certain contexts or not. However, I will share a couple of traditions that indicate that Lady Fatima's (s) face was generally uncovered and that other men had seen what she looked like. I am not concerned with whether these traditions are authentic or not. If they are true, then they prove my point. If they are not authentic, then it still doesn’t prove that she would instead have her face covered all the time in front of na-mahram men especially when there was no obligation to do so (unless some historical report can be brought forth as evidence).

One discussion that takes place in jurisprudence is whether it is allowed for a man to look at the face of a na-mahram woman. One of the main narrations used to permit this act (without lust of course), is a tradition where Jabir b. 'Abdallah al-Ansari looks at the face of Lady Fatima (s) – who by the way, was probably only a couple of years older than Lady Fatima - I haven't done the math. This tradition can be found in Usul al-Kafi – translation is not mine:

Quote

H 10088, Ch. 168, h 5: A number of our people have narrated from Ahmad ibn abu ‘Abd Allah from ‘Isma’il ibn Mehran from ‘Ubayd ibn Mu‘awiyah ibn Shurayh from Sayf ibn ‘Amirah from ‘Amr ibn Shamir from Jabir from abu Ja‘far, ‘Alayhi al-Salam, from Jabir ibn ‘Abd Allah al- Ansariy who has said the following:

“One day the Messenger of Allah, O Allah, grant compensation to Muhammad and his family worthy of their services to Your cause, came out to visit Fatimah, ‘Alayha al-Salam, and I was with him (the Messenger of Allah). When I reached the door, he (the Messenger of Allah) placed his hand on it and pushed then said, ‘Al-Salamu ‘Alaykum.’ Fatimah, ‘Alayha al-Salam, responded saying, ‘‘Alaykum al- Salam, O Messenger of Allah.’ He (the Messenger of Allah) asked, ‘Can I come in?’ She said, ‘Please come in, O Messenger of Allah.’ He (the Messenger of Allah) then asked, ‘Can I come in with the person who is with me?’ She said, ‘O Messenger of Allah, I do not have a veil on me.’ He (the Messenger of Allah) said, ‘O Fatimah, take the extra of your bed sheet and use it as veil to cover your head.’ She did accordingly and he (the Messenger of Allah) then said, ‘Al-Salamu Alaykum.’ Fatimah, responded saying, ‘‘Alayka al-Salam, O Messenger of Allah.’ He (the Messenger of Allah) asked, ‘Can I come in?’ She replied, ‘Yes, O Messenger of Allah.’ He (the Messenger of Allah) then asked, ‘Can I come in with the person with me?’ She replied, ‘Yes, you may come with the person with you.’ Jabir has said that the Messenger of Allah entered and I also entered and I saw the face of Fatimah looked yellow like the belly of a locust. The Messenger of Allah, O Allah, grant compensation to Muhammad and his family worthy of their services to Your cause, asked, ‘What has happened, O Fatimah that your face looks yellow?’ She replied, ‘O Messenger of Allah, it is hunger.’ He (the Messenger of Allah) prayed saying, ‘O Lord, who satisfies hunger, repels the cause of loss, satisfy Fatimah daughter of Muhammad.’ Jabir has said, ‘I then saw blood flow through its course and her face turned to its normal color and thereafter she did not experience any more hunger.’”

In another Fiqhi discussion where Shi'a jurists discuss whether a woman should cover her face in prayers or not, they rely on this tradition from Shaykh al-Saduq's al-Faqih to prove that covering the face is not required and it is not even considered mustahabb. I am sharing this tradition because it is linked with the tradition after this one:

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 وَ رَوَى الْفُضَيْلُ عَنْ أَبِي جَعْفَرٍ ع قَالَ- صَلَّتْ فَاطِمَةُ ع فِي دِرْعٍ وَ خِمَارُهَا عَلَى رَأْسِهَا لَيْسَ عَلَيْهَا أَكْثَرُ مِمَّا وَارَتْ بِهِ شَعْرَهَا وَ أُذُنَيْهَا

Imam Baqir (a): Fatima (s) prayed in a dress and with a small veil on her head which would not cover more than her hair and ears.

The tradition that I will be sharing next shows people looking towards Lady Fatima (s) praying - and from the previous tradition we know that she would not have her face covered. This tradition is found in 'Ilal al-Shara'i of Shaykh al-Saduq – again I am not interested in discussing the reliability of these traditions:

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أَبِي رَحِمَهُ اللَّهُ قَالَ حَدَّثَنَا سَعْدُ بْنُ عَبْدِ اللَّهِ قَالَ حَدَّثَنِي جَعْفَرُ بْنُ سَهْلٍ الصَّيْقَلُ عَنْ مُحَمَّدِ بْنِ إِسْمَاعِيلَ الدَّارِمِيِّ عَمَّنْ حَدَّثَهُ عَنْ مُحَمَّدِ بْنِ جَعْفَرٍ الْهُرْمُزَانِيِّ عَنْ أَبَانِ بْنِ تَغْلِبَ قَالَ: قُلْتُ لِأَبِي عَبْدِ اللَّهِ ع يَا ابْنَ رَسُولِ اللَّهِ لِمَ سُمِّيَتِ الزَّهْرَاءُ ع زَهْرَاءَ فَقَالَ لِأَنَّهَا تَزْهَرُ لِأَمِيرِ الْمُؤْمِنِينَ ع فِي النَّهَارِ ثَلَاثَ مَرَّاتٍ بِالنُّورِ كَانَ يَزْهَرُ نُورُ وَجْهِهَا صَلَاةَ الْغَدَاةِ وَ النَّاسُ فِي فُرُشِهِمْ فَيَدْخُلُ بَيَاضُ ذَلِكَ النُّورِ إِلَى حُجُرَاتِهِمْ بِالْمَدِينَةِ فَتَبْيَضُّ حِيطَانُهُمْ فَيَعْجَبُونَ مِنْ ذَلِكَ فَيَأْتُونَ النَّبِيَّ ص فَيَسْأَلُونَهُ عَمَّا رَأَوْا فَيُرْسِلُهُمْ إِلَى مَنْزِلِ فَاطِمَةَ ع فَيَأْتُونَ مَنْزِلَهَا فَيَرَوْنَهَا قَاعِدَةً فِي مِحْرَابِهَا تُصَلِّي وَ النُّورُ يَسْطَعُ مِنْ مِحْرَابِهَا مِنْ وَجْهِهَا فَيَعْلَمُونَ أَنَّ الَّذِي رَأَوْهُ كَانَ مِنْ نُورِ فَاطِمَةَ فَإِذَا نَصَفَ النَّهَارُ وَ تَرَتَّبَتْ لِلصَّلَاةِ زَهَرَ وَجْهُهَا ع بِالصُّفْرَةِ فَتَدْخُلُ الصُّفْرَةُ حُجُرَاتِ النَّاسِ فَتَصْفَرُّ ثِيَابُهُمْ وَ أَلْوَانُهُمْ فَيَأْتُونَ النَّبِيَّ ص فَيَسْأَلُونَهُ عَمَّا رَأَوْا فَيُرْسِلُهُمْ إِلَى مَنْزِلِ فَاطِمَةَ ع فَيَرَوْنَهَا قَائِمَةً فِي مِحْرَابِهَا وَ قَدْ زَهَرَ نُورُ وَجْهِهَا ع فَإِذَا كَانَ آخِرُ النَّهَارِ وَ غَرَبَتِ الشَّمْسُ احْمَرَّ وَجْهُ فَاطِمَةَ ع فَأَشْرَقَ وَجْهُهَا بِالْحُمْرَةِ فَرَحاً وَ شُكْراً لِلَّهِ عَزَّ وَ جَلَّ فَكَانَ يَدْخُلُ حُمْرَةُ وَجْهِهَا حُجُرَاتِ الْقَوْمِ وَ تَحْمَرُّ حِيطَانُهُمْ فَيَعْجَبُونَ مِنْ ذَلِكَ وَ يَأْتُونَ النَّبِيَّ ص‏ وَ يَسْأَلُونَهُ عَنْ ذَلِكَ فَيُرْسِلُهُمْ إِلَى مَنْزِلِ فَاطِمَةَ فَيَرَوْنَهَا جَالِسَةً تُسَبِّحُ اللَّهَ وَ تُمَجِّدُهُ وَ نُورُ وَجْهِهَا يَزْهَرُ بِالْحُمْرَةِ فَيَعْلَمُونَ أَنَّ الَّذِي رَأَوْا كَانَ مِنْ نُورِ وَجْهِ فَاطِمَةَ ع فَلَمْ يَزَلْ ذَلِكَ النُّورُ فِي وَجْهِهَا حَتَّى وُلِدَ الْحُسَيْنُ ع فَهُوَ يَتَقَلَّبُ فِي وُجُوهِنَا إِلَى يَوْمِ الْقِيَامَةِ فِي الْأَئِمَّةِ مِنَّا أَهْلَ الْبَيْتِ إِمَامٍ بَعْدَ إِمَامٍ

My father narrated from Sa’ad b. ‘Abdillah from Ja’far b. Sahl al-Sayqal, from Muhammad b. Ismail al-Darimi, from someone, from Muhammad b. Ja’far al-Hurmuzani, from Aban b. Tahlib who said:

‘I asked Abu ‘Abdillah (a), ‘O son of Rasulalla! Why was al-Zahra named as ‘al-Zahra’?’ So he said: ‘Because she would glow for Amir al-Mu’mineen three times during the day. Her face glowed at the time of the dawn prayer while people would in their beds. The whiteness of that light would enter into their rooms in Medina and enlighten their walls. They would be astonished by that and would come to the Prophet (p) to ask him about what they had seen. He (p) would send them to the house of Fatima (s). So they would come to her house and would see her seated in her prayer niche, praying while the light from her face had brightened the prayer niche. So they would come to know that, that which they had seen was from the light of Fatima (s).

So when it would be the middle of the day and she would make arrangements for prayers, her face would glow with a yellow radiance. The yellowness would enter into the rooms of the people and would turn their clothes and their colours into yellow. They would come to the Prophet (p) to ask him about what they had seen. He (p) would send them to the house of Fatima (s). So they would see her standing in her prayer niche, and light would be glowing from her face.

So when it would be the end of the day and the sun would set, the face of Fatima (s) would turn red. Her face would shine with redness out of her happiness and gratitude for Allah (azwj). The redness of her face would enter the rooms of the people and would turn their walls red. So they would become astonished by it and would come to the Prophet (p) and ask him about it. So he (p) would send them to the house of Fatima and they would see her seated, glorifying Allah and extolling Him, while the light from her face would be glowing with redness. Thus they would come to know that, that which they saw was from the light of the face of Fatima (s). That light never ceased to exist off her face, until al-Husayn (s) was born. Since then the light transfers into our faces, from the Imams of the Ahl al-Bayt, one Imam after another, until the day of Judgment.

There is a Sunni tradition recorded in a Shi’a work al-Kharaij wa al-Jaraih of Qutub al-Rawandi. The narrator of this tradition converted to Islam in 7th Hijri (based on a quick search I did - so I may be wrong here), which means according to the popular Shi'i narrative, Lady Fatima (s) would have been around 14-15 years old (of course she was married much earlier than this and already had children):

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أَنَّ عِمْرَانَ بْنَ حُصَيْنٍ قَالَ: كُنْتُ عِنْدَ النَّبِيِّ ص جَالِساً إِذْ أَقْبَلَتْ فَاطِمَةُ ع وَ قَدْ تَغَيَّرَ وَجْهُهَا مِنَ الْجُوعِ فَقَالَ لَهَا ادْنِي فَدَنَتْ فَرَفَعَ يَدَهُ حَتَّى وَضَعَهَا عَلَى صَدْرِهَا وَ هِيَ صَغِيرَةٌ فِي مَوْضِعِ الْقِلَادَةِ ثُمَّ قَالَ اللَّهُمَّ مُشْبِعَ الْجَاعَةِ وَ رَافِعَ الْوَضِيعَةِ لَا تُجِعْ فَاطِمَةَ بِنْتَ مُحَمَّدٍ قَالَ فَرَأَيْتُ الدَّمَ قَدْ غَلَبَ عَلَى وَجْهِهَا كَمَا كَانَتِ الصُّفْرَةُ فَقَالَتْ مَا جُعْتُ بَعْدَ ذَلِك‏

'Imran b. Husayn says: I was sitting with the Prophet (p) when Fatima (s) came forth. Her face had changed due to hunger, so he (p) said to her (s), 'come close.' So she came close and he raised his hand until he placed it on her chest - while she was young - on the place where her necklace was and said: O God - O the one who satiates the hungry, O the one who raises the lowly one, do not let Fatima b. Muhammad feel hungry. The narrator says: I saw that blood had filled her face just like the yellowness had taken over her face before that. She said: I did not feel hungry after that.

In the very same book, but a different section, the popular story regarding a Jewish wedding and Lady Fatima (s) that is often heard from pulpits or the story is recited in certain subcontinent gatherings is recorded as follows: 

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وَ مِنْهَا: أَنَّ الْيَهُودَ كَانَ لَهُمْ عُرْسٌ فَجَاءُوا إِلَى رَسُولِ اللَّهِ ص وَ قَالُوا لَنَا حَقُّ الْجِوَارِ فَنَسْأَلُكَ أَنْ تَبْعَثَ فَاطِمَةَ بِنْتَكَ إِلَى دَارِنَا حَتَّى يَزْدَانَ‏ عُرْسُنَا بِهَا وَ أَلَحُّوا عَلَيْهِ. فَقَالَ ص إِنَّهَا زَوْجَةُ عَلِيِّ بْنِ أَبِي طَالِبٍ وَ هِيَ بِحُكْمِهِ وَ سَأَلُوهُ أَنْ يَشْفَعَ إِلَى عَلِيٍّ فِي ذَلِكَ وَ قَدْ جَمَعَ الْيَهُودُ الطِّمَّ وَ الرِّمَ‏ مِنَ الْحُلِيِّ وَ الْحُلَلِ وَ ظَنَّ الْيَهُودُ أَنَ‏ فَاطِمَةَ تَدْخُلُ عَلَيْهِمْ فِي بِذْلَتِهَا وَ أَرَادُوا اسْتِهَانَةً بِهَا فَجَاءَ جَبْرَئِيلُ بِثِيَابٍ مِنَ الْجَنَّةِ وَ حُلِيٍّ وَ حُلَلٍ لَمْ يَرَ الرَّاءُونَ‏ مِثْلَهَا فَلَبِسَتْهَا فَاطِمَةُ وَ تَحَلَّتْ بِهَا فَتَعَجَّبَ النَّاسُ مِنْ زِينَتِهَا وَ أَلْوَانِهَا وَ طِيبِهَا فَلَمَّا دَخَلَتْ فَاطِمَةُ ع دَارَ هَؤُلَاءِ الْيَهُودِ سَجَدَ لَهَا نِسَاؤُهُمْ‏ يُقَبِّلْنَ الْأَرْضَ بَيْنَ يَدَيْهَا وَ أَسْلَمَ بِسَبَبِ مَا رَأَوْا خَلْقٌ كَثِيرٌ مِنَ الْيَهُودِ 

 

Summary of this event is that a Jewish wedding was taking place and the Jewish ladies wanted Fatima (s) to come to it so that their gathering could be enlivened and be a bit more enjoyable. The Jews were thinking Fatima (s) did not have any good clothes and would come in poor quality clothing and that they would be able to belittle her. Instead, Jibra’il brings her clothing and jewelry from heaven which she wore. The report says, the people were astonished by the clothing, its beauty and its colours. When she entered the house of those Jews, the women all prostrated and kissed the ground in front of them and became Muslims.

In al-Musannaf of Ibn Abi Shaybah (Sunni scholar and a Sunni book) as well as the Sunan of al-Nasa’i and Waqidi’s al-Maghazi, there is a report which is used within Sunni Fiqh discussions concerning Ihram and Hajj, in which the permissibility of Kohl is discussed and that at what point it becomes permissible to wear it. This report shows that Fatima (s) was wearing some sort of jewelry, eye-liner (kohl) and as well as coloured clothing – I am posting just the relevant portion from Ibn Abi Shaybah’s work:

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وَقَدِمَ عَلِيٌّ مِنَ الْيَمَنِ بِبُدْنِ النَّبِيِّ صَلَّى اللهُ عَلَيْهِ وَسَلَّمَ فَوَجَدَ فَاطِمَةَ مِمَّنْ حَلَّ، وَلَبِسَتْ ثِيَابًا صَبِيغًا وَاكْتَحَلَتْ، فَأَنْكَرَ ذَلِكَ عَلَيْهَا فَقَالَتْ: أَبِي أَمَرَنِي بِهَذَا، قَالَ: فَكَانَ عَلِيٌّ يَقُولُ بِالْعِرَاقِ: فَذَهَبْتُ إِلَى رَسُولِ اللَّهِ صَلَّى اللهُ عَلَيْهِ وَسَلَّمَ مُحَرِّشًا عَلَى فَاطِمَةَ لِلَّذِي صَنَعَتْ، مُسْتَفْتِيًا لِرَسُولِ اللَّهِ فِيمَا ذَكَرَتْ عَنْهُ، قَالَ: فَأَخْبَرْتُهُ أَنِّي أَنْكَرْتُ ذَلِكَ عَلَيْهَا فَقَالَ: «صَدَقَتْ صَدَقَتْ»

 

It essentially says ‘Ali (a) returned back from Yemen and saw Fatima (s) wearing coloured clothing and with kohl on her eyes. He went and asked the Prophet (p) whether this was allowed to do and he (p) responded in the affirmative. The version of Sunan al-Nasa’i can be read here: https://sunnah.com/urn/1078850 and Waqidi’s version can be read here – 2nd last paragraph: https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=gZknAAAAQBAJ&lpg=PA532&ots=2XMDapaBsp&pg=PA532#v=onepage&q&f=false

This same tradition also exists in Shaykh al-Tusi's al-Amali, pg. 401 - so it is also recorded in Shi'i works with the chain going back to Imam Baqir (a). Regarding the colour of clothing, the above report indicates she was wearing dyed garments.

We have other reports which show other women of the time wearing red, green, or yellow coloured clothing for example, but I am not citing them here as I wanted to post references regarding Lady Fatima (s).

Wasalam

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Bismehe Ta3ala,

Assalam Alikum Brother @Ibn al-Hussain

I was reading your quotes about Jabir seeing Sayyida Fatimah's face yellow.  Is this to indicate that non mahram men did see Sayyida Fatimah's face?

Are there hadiths from our Imams and not from the Sunni school of thought?

I have mentioned this before in front of other sisters in real life and they said where did you get these narrations from because they wouldn't except it and said it wasn't true.

They are not interested in Sunni hadiths but rather from our Imams.

Thank you for your time.

Brother @ali_fatheroforphans  Once upon a time, one of the sisters, was respectful, but Sub7an'Allah, names were changed and her demeanor as well.  

Alhamd'Allah everything is in writing and saved.  :muslima:  That everyone is responsible for what they write and say, even if 50 years pass by. M3 Salamah, FE AMIN Allah  

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9 minutes ago, Laayla said:

Bismehe Ta3ala,

Assalam Alikum Brother @Ibn al-Hussain

I was reading your quotes about Jabir seeing Sayyida Fatimah's face yellow.  Is this to indicate that non mahram men did see Sayyida Fatimah's face?

Are there hadiths from our Imams and not from the Sunni school of thought?

I have mentioned this before in front of other sisters in real life and they said where did you get these narrations from because they wouldn't except it and said it wasn't true.

They are not interested in Sunni hadiths but rather from our Imams.

Thank you for your time.

Brother @ali_fatheroforphans  Once upon a time, one of the sisters, was respectful, but Sub7an'Allah, names were changed and her demeanor as well.  

Alhamd'Allah everything is in writing and saved.  :muslima:  That everyone is responsible for what they write and say, even if 50 years pass by. M3 Salamah, FE AMIN Allah  

We have worse hadiths solely to prove the sorrow for Ahlul Bayt. Just like the hadith that Sayeda Fatima threatened to take her hijab off outside the house during the attack on the house. These made up hadiths make me sick to my stomach.

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