Jump to content
In the Name of God بسم الله

Treatment of Bibi Fatima (sa) by the Caliphs

Rate this topic


yam_110

Recommended Posts

  • Advanced Member
Just now, shiaman14 said:

So are you saying the hadith in SAHIH Bukhari is not authentic? So as it turns out, Bukhari is not SAHIH after all.

well worth a discussing but still doesn't change the fact that Fatima died "unhappy" with Abu Bakr which is the point of discussing here.

So Fatima (as) is not the Prophet's daughter any more? This just keeps getting better and better.

Yo do know that Fatima (as) is the Prophet's daughter. You do know that the Quran orders us to love her and here you are defending the person she died "unhappy" with.

This is sheer hypocrisy in the Sunni world. You wear short pants, grow long beards and chew miswak all over the world thinking you are following the seerah of the Prophet (saw) when his real seerah is loving his AhlulBayt.

Regardless of the word used, did Fatima (as) speak to Abu Bakr ever again until her death?  Yes others have been buried at night but the narrator chose to include, " Abu Bakr about her death and offered the funeral prayer over her himself. " Clearly this was added as pertinent information.

Since word play is so important to you, you should always side with Quran and AhlulBayt.

"Quran and Sunnah" is a myth that was created later.

But if you did follow Quran and Sunnah, then Quran tells you to love the family of the Prophet and the Sunnah of the Prophet is to love his family.

Lol I have explained as to the reason why it’s of no benefit for ahlu tashayyu to use the Hadith with the word anger. If it still is hard for you to fathom that and instead go into sarcasm.....then......good luck it just shows how academic you are in your answers.

Yes she ra passed away happy hence Her husband ra gave allegiance Happily. Nothing hard to understand about that.

Brother Fatima ra has passed away....yes like I said before we do love ahlubaith ra, something that was done centuries ago  (supposed anger) has been rectified and they were happy with it should be left at that no khaliph out of the 3 were ever angry with Fatima ra, there is much more evidence and solid evidences to that fact. Your pulling on straws here.

we do love ahlubaith ra we just don’t add anything divine to them, if thats what makes you think that we don’t love them because we don’t believ they are divinely chosen then that’s your folly but it doesn’t mean Sunni hate them.

The reality is you are using weak evidences to support a theory. It doesn’t and won’t work they’re not good arguments they won’t stand the light of day I mean look at this thread.

We have other evidences She ra did rectify with Abu Bakr ra before She ra passed away. She was buried by Her husband alone so what? Then the husband came to the khaliph and apologised and gave Bayat and was happy with the leader......it’s in the same Hadith.

We do love ahlubaith ra but to use flimsy evidences of how Sunnis hate Them ra is very ingenious and shallow, even ahlubaith ra wouldn’t use such standards to argue their points.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member
15 minutes ago, kirtc said:

you escaped the question..  I asked what other word would fit in the hadith and what meaning would the hadith have.

even without the word angry, you can tell there was a dispute between the two. who was abu bakr to deny Fatima azahra a.s?

you cant escape the fact that there was a dispute over fadaq. 

Dispute? 

That same land was offered back by Umar ra but ahlubaith ra never took it back.

Didn’t they think of it as a dispute? 

Even when Imam Ali ra came to power He could have very easily took it back but He ra didn’t, not much of a dispute was it.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member
16 minutes ago, Wisdom007 said:

Dispute? 

That same land was offered back by Umar ra but ahlubaith ra never took it back.

Didn’t they think of it as a dispute? 

Even when Imam Ali ra came to power He could have very easily took it back but He ra didn’t, not much of a dispute was it.

 

The main problem was not about a piece of Land ,it was about ignoring authorit of Ahlul-Bayt  (as)& denying their right ,Ahlulbayt  (as) never care 

about gaining wealth for themselves.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member
2 hours ago, Wisdom007 said:

so......the wife was angry and died in that state, yet husband forgot the anger and acknowledged him as leader? 

am sorry i have been trying to understand shia/sunni perspective of history.

 i have been trying to find answer for this specific question but no luck.

Answers either are not convincing enough or doesnt make any sense.. can some one knowledgeable answer this for me please. 

( please Note i said knowledgeable that is because i once asked a brother here in sc and he said it is because imam ali a.s gave promise to prophet Mohammed a.s that he would not kill abu bakr ra and so he dint  ( Which again left me with many more questions so i dug deeper only to realize what brother said was completely untrue)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member
34 minutes ago, Ashvazdanghe said:

The main problem was not about a piece of Land ,it was about ignoring authorit of Ahlul-Bayt  (as)& denying their right ,Ahlulbayt  (as) never care 

about gaining wealth for themselves.

brother as i said i am trying to learn history , at the time of our beloved  (saws)  many denied prophet hood of our beloved prophet but he wasnt angry on anyone though people treated him badly and i strongly believe fatima zehra a.s inherited all the characteristics of our beloved prophet then why would she die angry over few handful of people ?

Edited by ephemeral
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member
Just now, ephemeral said:

brother i am trying to learn history , at the time of our beloved  (saws)  many denied prophet hood of our beloved prophet but he wasnt angry on anyone and i strongly believe fatima zehra a.s inherited all the characteristics of our beloved prophet then why would she die angry over few handful of people ?

Because they even didn't respect dead body of prophet  (pbu)and leave his body to gain power for themselves this was duty of Success or of prophet  (pbu) & they didon't do that & after him take everything for themselves in matters that have no authority about that such as inheritance of Prophet (pbu) by sabotage & oligarchy. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Veteran Member
14 hours ago, Wisdom007 said:

 

The word ANGER is only mentioned in the Hadith transmitted from Hazrat Aisha ra. It is not mentioned in the Hadith narrated from other companions like Hazrat Abu Huraira, Hazrat Um Hani, etc.

Further the hadith narrated from Hazrat Aisha ra is of two types, one type mentions the word “anger” while the other type does not mention “anger”. The hadith which mention the word “anger” are all narrated by Ibn Shahab Zehri [well known for his idraaj of statements].

 

so I guess your maths must be wrong especially if you are using not so solid formulas.

Wow.. You are now discrediting the book which is considered second only to Quran in the Sunni world just because you want to save someone's backside at any cost.

Quit playing with words and acknowledge the truth. This messy formula you are trying to play with is going to land the Sunnis in a lot of trouble and there is no wisdom in using such a deceitful strategy.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member
54 minutes ago, Ashvazdanghe said:

Because they even didn't respect dead body of prophet  (pbu)and leave his body to gain power for themselves this was duty of Successor of prophet  (pbu) & they didon't do that & after him take everything for themselves in matters that have no authority about that such as inheritance of Prophet (pbu) by sabotage & oligarchy. 

brother according to shias if this was duty of successor of prophet then wasnt it duty of imam ali a.s then why would fatima zehra a.s die angry over abu bakr ? for second part as i said even "at the time of our beloved  (saws)  many denied prophet hood of our beloved prophet but he wasnt angry on anyone and i strongly believe fatima zehra a.s inherited all the characteristics of our beloved prophet then why would she die angry over few handful of people "

 

Edited by ephemeral
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member
8 minutes ago, kirtc said:

read nahjul al balagha.. ofcourse sunnis will say its fake.. but anyone with wisdom can see that the way it was written can only be from someone as enlightened and eloquent as Imam Ali a.s

brother i love sayings and preachings nahjul al balagha has. i dint read or have gone through everything that it has .. in sha Allah hope to do it in the future, for now could you please give me brief hadith of my answer. will highly appreciate it please.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member
8 minutes ago, ephemeral said:

brother according to shias if this was duty of successor of prophet then wasnt it duty of imam ali a.s then why would fatima zehra a.s die angry over abu bakr ? for second part as i said even "at the time of our beloved  (saws)  many denied prophet hood of our beloved prophet but he wasnt angry on anyone and i strongly believe fatima zehra a.s inherited all the characteristics of our beloved prophet then why would she die angry over few handful of people "

 

It seems that you mistaken humbleness with being not angry

Even prophet (pbu) not always a happy person if religion was in danger he was angry about that than any person 

Their happiness & anger were for Allah & religion not themselves 

Prophet said who make Fatima (sa) makes me angry me .

& we know who make prophet  (pbu) make Allah angry .

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Veteran Member
14 hours ago, Wisdom007 said:

1/ Not that I am aware of or any SUNNI is aware of.

2/ A big NO!

3/ fake story? Yes!

again your own conclusions based on not so solid evidence.

1. You are either lying or pretending to be ignorant of this well known fact. Speak to someone you consider to be an alim and he will tell what's written in your own books.

2. You mean Bibi Fatima (sa) didn't ask for Fadak to be returned to her? 

3. Again, you can't run from your own books. Read them properly before  jumping to incorrect conclusions.

We read in Musnaf of Imam Ibn Abi Shebah, Volume 7 page 432 Tradition 37045:

“Narrated Muhammad bin Bashir from Ubaidllah bin Umar from Zaid bin Aslam that his father Aslam said: ‘When the homage (baya) went to Abu Bakr after the Messenger of Allah, Ali and Zubair were entering into the house of Fatima to consult her and revise their issue, so when Umar came to know about that, he went to Fatima and said : ‘Oh daughter of Messenger of Allah, no one is dearest to us more than your father and no one dearest to us after your father than you, I swear by Allah, if these people gathered in your house then nothing will prevent me from giving order to burn the house and those who are inside.’

All the narrators are authentic as they are the narrators of Sahih Bukhari & Sahih Muslim. Muhammad bin Bashir: Imam Al-Dhahabi said: ‘Thabt’ (Al-Kaashif, v2 p159), Imam Ibn Hajar Asqalani said: ‘Thiqa’ (Taqrib al-Tahdib, v2 p58). Ubaidllah bin Umar: Al-Dhahabi said: ‘Thabt’ (Al-Kaashif, v1 p685), Ibn Hajar Asqalani said: ‘Thiqa Thabt’ (Taqrib al-Tahdib, v1 p637). Zaid bin Aslam: Al-Dhahabi said: ‘Hujja’ (Siar alam alnubala, v5 p316), Imam Ibn Hajar Asqalani said: ‘Thiqa’ (Taqrib al-Tahdib, v1 p326). Aslam al-Qurashi (the slave of Umar): Al-Dhahabi said: ‘Faqih, Imam’ (Siar alam alnubala, v4 p98), Ibn Hajar Asqalani said: ‘Thiqa’ (Taqrib al-Tahdib, v1 p88).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Veteran Member
17 minutes ago, kirtc said:

also, even if the word was misplaced... the hadith clearly states abu bakr rejected bibi fatima's a.s request which is unacceptable 

yet "wisdom" fails to see where the dispute is lol

He has to be deceitful in his words here otherwise there is no way he can defend the actions of his masters.

Never have I heard from anyone before saying that Bibi Fatima (sa) was not angry with Abu Bakr. So far people have only tried to downplay the anger but to no avail but this is the first. He even goes to the point of discrediting a hadith in Sahih Bukhari... Lol

How low can one stoop?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Veteran Member
6 hours ago, Wisdom007 said:

My trusted book is only Quran bro

If you are true to your word, please prove the hadith used by Abu Bakr to deny Bibi Fatima (sa) her rights from Quran? Can you prove Abu Bakr's position on inheritance of prophets from Quran?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Veteran Member
2 hours ago, Wisdom007 said:

Lol I have explained as to the reason why it’s of no benefit for ahlu tashayyu to use the Hadith with the word anger. If it still is hard for you to fathom that and instead go into sarcasm.....then......good luck it just shows how academic you are in your answers.

Yes she ra passed away happy hence Her husband ra gave allegiance Happily. Nothing hard to understand about that.

Brother Fatima ra has passed away....yes like I said before we do love ahlubaith ra, something that was done centuries ago  (supposed anger) has been rectified and they were happy with it should be left at that no khaliph out of the 3 were ever angry with Fatima ra, there is much more evidence and solid evidences to that fact. Your pulling on straws here.

we do love ahlubaith ra we just don’t add anything divine to them, if thats what makes you think that we don’t love them because we don’t believ they are divinely chosen then that’s your folly but it doesn’t mean Sunni hate them.

The reality is you are using weak evidences to support a theory. It doesn’t and won’t work they’re not good arguments they won’t stand the light of day I mean look at this thread.

We have other evidences She ra did rectify with Abu Bakr ra before She ra passed away. She was buried by Her husband alone so what? Then the husband came to the khaliph and apologised and gave Bayat and was happy with the leader......it’s in the same Hadith.

We do love ahlubaith ra but to use flimsy evidences of how Sunnis hate Them ra is very ingenious and shallow, even ahlubaith ra wouldn’t use such standards to argue their points.

I tried to get academic with you but you wouldn't answer. Simple question - is the hadith correct or wrong?

We agree on one thing though - Sahih Bukhari is weak evidence.

Edited by shiaman14
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member

What brother Wisdom is trying to say is that just because something is in Bukhari, doesn't make it automatically authentic. In the science of Hadith, it's clear that sometimes a narrator can add statements that were not in the original narration. For example the famous narration of the Prophet (saw) wanting to jump off Mt.Hira is actually not something transmitted originally but added by another narrator and so that statement itself is regarded as disconnected from the Prophet (saw) given the person later has no connected source to a companion for that addition.

So in this example i suppose what he is saying is that the part added about Fatima (as) being angry with the first Caliph isn't something narrated by a Sahaba, but someone later on adding in that line and known for adding in certain opinions and statements about events they narrate.

However, one can clearly prove she and Ali (asws) were indeed angry, opposed, and rebuked the Caliphs to Sunnis who go down this line of arguing. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Unregistered

Sermon 200: By Allah, Mu’awiyah is not more cunning than I am….

Treason and treachery of Mu’awiyah and the fate of those guilty of treason

ومن كلام له (عليه السلام)

في معاوية

By Allah, 1 Mu’awiyah is not more cunning than I am, but he deceives and commits evil deeds. Had it not been for the reprehensibility of deceit, I would have been the most cunning of all men. But (the fact is that) every deceit is a sin and every sin is disobedience (of Allah), and every deceitful person will have a banner by which he will be recognised on the Day of Judgement. By Allah, I cannot be made forgetful by strategy, nor can I be overpowered by hardships.

وَاللهِ مَا مُعَاوِيَةُ بِأَدْهَى مِنِّي، وَلكِنَّهُ يَغْدِرُ وَيَفْجُرُ، وَلَوْلاَ كَرَاهِيَةُ الْغَدْرِ لَكُنْتُ مِنْ أَدْهَى النَّاسِ، وَلَكِنْ كُلُّ غَدْرَة فَجْرَةٌ، وَكُلُّ فَجْرَة كَفْرَةٌ، وَلِكُلِّ غَادِر لِوَاءٌ يُعْرَفُ بِهِ يَوْمَ الْقِيَامَةِ. وَاللهِ مَا أَسْتَغْفَلُ بالْمَكِيدَةِ، وَلاَ أُسْتَغْمَزُ بالشَّدِيدَةِ.

Alternative Sources for Sermon 200

(1) Al-Kulayni, Usul al-Kafi, II, 336, 338.

https://www.al-islam.org/nahjul-balagha-part-1-sermons/sermon-200-Allah-muawiyah-not-more-cunning-i-am

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member
16 hours ago, yam_110 said:

1. You are either lying or pretending to be ignorant of this well known fact. Speak to someone you consider to be an alim and he will tell what's written in your own books.

2. You mean Bibi Fatima (sa) didn't ask for Fadak to be returned to her? 

3. Again, you can't run from your own books. Read them properly before  jumping to incorrect conclusions.

We read in Musnaf of Imam Ibn Abi Shebah, Volume 7 page 432 Tradition 37045:

“Narrated Muhammad bin Bashir from Ubaidllah bin Umar from Zaid bin Aslam that his father Aslam said: ‘When the homage (baya) went to Abu Bakr after the Messenger of Allah, Ali and Zubair were entering into the house of Fatima to consult her and revise their issue, so when Umar came to know about that, he went to Fatima and said : ‘Oh daughter of Messenger of Allah, no one is dearest to us more than your father and no one dearest to us after your father than you, I swear by Allah, if these people gathered in your house then nothing will prevent me from giving order to burn the house and those who are inside.’

All the narrators are authentic as they are the narrators of Sahih Bukhari & Sahih Muslim. Muhammad bin Bashir: Imam Al-Dhahabi said: ‘Thabt’ (Al-Kaashif, v2 p159), Imam Ibn Hajar Asqalani said: ‘Thiqa’ (Taqrib al-Tahdib, v2 p58). Ubaidllah bin Umar: Al-Dhahabi said: ‘Thabt’ (Al-Kaashif, v1 p685), Ibn Hajar Asqalani said: ‘Thiqa Thabt’ (Taqrib al-Tahdib, v1 p637). Zaid bin Aslam: Al-Dhahabi said: ‘Hujja’ (Siar alam alnubala, v5 p316), Imam Ibn Hajar Asqalani said: ‘Thiqa’ (Taqrib al-Tahdib, v1 p326). Aslam al-Qurashi (the slave of Umar): Al-Dhahabi said: ‘Faqih, Imam’ (Siar alam alnubala, v4 p98), Ibn Hajar Asqalani said: ‘Thiqa’ (Taqrib al-Tahdib, v1 p88).

No-one can deny there is compelling evidence a threat was made. We have corroborating and multiple-independent sources, some reliable to Sunnis like this one, in addition to a strong motive, strong supporting back-ground facts, and much more. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Veteran Member
1 hour ago, Intellectual Resistance said:

What brother Wisdom is trying to say is that just because something is in Bukhari, doesn't make it automatically authentic. In the science of Hadith, it's clear that sometimes a narrator can add statements that were not in the original narration. For example the famous narration of the Prophet (saw) wanting to jump off Mt.Hira is actually not something transmitted originally but added by another narrator and so that statement itself is regarded as disconnected from the Prophet (saw) given the person later has no connected source to a companion for that addition.

So in this example i suppose what he is saying is that the part added about Fatima (as) being angry with the first Caliph isn't something narrated by a Sahaba, but someone later on adding in that line and known for adding in certain opinions and statements about events they narrate.

However, one can clearly prove she and Ali (asws) were indeed angry, opposed, and rebuked the Caliphs to Sunnis who go down this line of arguing. 

All @Wisdom007 has to do then is simply confirm that Sahih Bukhari is in fact not sahih.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member
18 hours ago, Ashvazdanghe said:

It seems that you mistaken humbleness with being not angry

Even prophet (pbu) not always a happy person if religion was in danger he was angry about that than any person 

Their happiness & anger were for Allah & religion not themselves 

Prophet said who make Fatima (sa) makes me angry me .

& we know who make prophet  (pbu) make Allah angry .

 

i agree with you 100% , but brother please tell me when Quran teaches us to speak up for injustice

O you who have believed, be persistently standing firm in justice, witnesses for Allah, even if it be against yourselves or parents and relatives. Whether one is rich or poor, Allah is more worthy of both. So follow not [personal] inclination, lest you not be just. And if you distort [your testimony] or refuse [to give it], then indeed Allah is ever, with what you do, Acquainted.surah 4:135

and if religion was in danger then why did she die angry and did not speak or stood against them firmly ? 

why did ali a.s joined Abu bakr ra and umar ra if they were putting religion in danger ?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member
19 hours ago, kirtc said:

Nabi musa a.s left his people for 30 days.. he left haroun a.s as his wali.. when Allah extended musa's absence to 40 days. the people left the religion and started worshipping a calf!. only 1 month after he was gone lol! people went astray. same thing happened with Jesus and peter.. after jesus a.s died paul took over and made up the trinity when infact peter was supposed to take over

back to musa, when he came back he saw his people worshipping a calf and became furious. he went to his wali haroun

 

7:150] And when Musa returned to his people, wrathful (and) in violent grief, he said: Evil is it that you have done after me; did you turn away from the bidding of your Lord?

And he threw down the tablets and seized his brother by the head, dragging him towards him. He said: Son of my mother! Surely the people reckoned me weak and had well-nigh slain me, therefore make not the enemies to rejoice over me and count me not among the unjust people.

 

 

Imam Ali's position is like of haroun's.. if he fought back at the time he would have been over powered and killed. imam ali a.s is like haroun in many ways.. there is even a hadeeth saying that he is to the prophet like haroun is to musa.

even imam ali's kids have the same name in meaning as harouns kids

brother haroun was weak wasnt as strong as musa a.s . Ali a.s on the other hand Ali a.s is stronger than musa a.s ( correct me if i am wrong , i am saying this after reading an article in al-islam where imams are above prophets except mohammed a.s  as he is above imams). Also ali a.s is infallible , i dont think he would be scared for his life (astagfirulla) doing that which is right.

he slept on prophet's bed with out caring for his life .

Edited by ephemeral
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member
13 minutes ago, ephemeral said:

and if religion was in danger then why did she die angry and did not speak or stood against them firmly ? 

why did ali a.s joined Abu bakr ra and umar ra if they were putting religion in danger ?

Salam she stands against them & also Umm Salama supports her  & Imam Ali not joined them but in hard situation helped them because I he at that time raise against them would put all Muslim community in danger being attacked by foreign countries I recommend you to read the Nahjulbalaqa source that provide for you that he explains it this situation there.

https://www.al-islam.org/nahjul-balagha-part-1-sermons

 

https://www.al-islam.org/articles/hazrat-zahra-sa-and-heart-rending-episode-fadak-ayatullah-makarem-shirazi

 

https://www.al-islam.org/media/fatimas-sermon-fadakiya-madinah-part-1

 

https://www.al-islam.org/media/fatimas-sermon-fadakiya-madinah-part-1

 

 

Edited by Ashvazdanghe
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member
2 minutes ago, Ashvazdanghe said:

Salam she stands against them & also Umm Salama supports her  & Imam Ali not joined them but in hard situation helped them because I he at that time raise against them would put all Muslim community in danger being attacked by foreign countries I recommend you to read the Nahjulbalaqa source that provide for you that he explains it this situation there.

i dont understand how and few links in there . Anyways shukran for  helping brother . In sha Allah will try to read it , problem is its big and has many parts to it.These days am occupied with lot many things and so i hardly find time for myself. so , little time i find i am  trying my best  to learn about religion .

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Veteran Member
47 minutes ago, ephemeral said:

brother haroun was weak wasnt as strong as musa a.s . Ali a.s on the other hand Ali a.s is stronger than musa a.s ( correct me if i am wrong , i am saying this after reading an article in al-islam where imams are above prophets except mohammed a.s  as he is above imams). Also ali a.s is infallible , i dont think he would be scared for his life (astagfirulla) doing that which is right.

he slept on prophet's bed with out caring for his life .

So the answer to every problem is not fighting or violence. Imam Ali (as) had to exercise patience and forbearance to save the ummah. It would not have survived a civil war. There are narrations that Abu Sufiyan offered military assistance to Imam Ali (as) to fight the caliph but Imam Ali (as) refused because he knew how devastating a civil war would be.

So he exercised patience and forbearance.

Contrary to the Sunni narrative that Jamal and Siffin were fought to avenge the blood of Caliph Uthman, these same civil wars would have broken had Ali become Caliph after the Prophet (saw) because these people hated Ali (as) for his services to Islam. And Islam would not have survived. So he exercised patience and forbearance.

Edited by shiaman14
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Moderators
2 hours ago, ephemeral said:

but brother please tell me when Quran teaches us to speak up for injustice

O you who have believed, be persistently standing firm in justice, witnesses for Allah, even if it be against yourselves or parents and relatives. Whether one is rich or poor, Allah is more worthy of both. So follow not [personal] inclination, lest you not be just. And if you distort [your testimony] or refuse [to give it], then indeed Allah is ever, with what you do, Acquainted.surah 4:135

and if religion was in danger then why did she die angry and did not speak or stood against them firmly ? 

Fatima (as) did speak up about the injustice done against her. She gave out the famous sermon in front of many men including Abu Bakr, which is referred as The Sermon of Fadak, reminding everyone who she was and the injustice done against her. Even Imam 'Ali (as) in a hadith approached Abu Bakr and spoke up about his injustice he did to Fatima (as):

Imām `Alī (عليه السلام) said (to Abū Bakr):

"So what do you say about the verse 'O Ahl al-Bayt! Indeed Allāh wishes to drive away the impurity from you and thoroughly purify you', was it revealed for us or for other than us?" Abū Bakr said: "For you people." Imām `Alī (عليه السلام) said: "So tell me, if two witnesses from the Muslim public testified against Fāṭimah (عليه السلام) on charges of lewdness, what you would do?" Abū Bakr said: "I would establish hadd (Islamic punishment) on her, as I would on (any other) Muslim women." Imām `Alī (عليه السلام) said: "You would then be among the kuffar (disbelievers) according to Allāh." Abū Bakr said: "Why?" Imām `Alī (عليه السلام) said: "Because you would then have rejected the testimony of Allāh and accepted the testimony of the other, because Allāh has testified by the ṭahārah (purity) of Fāṭimah (in ayat al tatheer, 33:33), so when you reject the testimony of Allāh and accept the testimony of the other, you are among the kuffar according to Allāh." 

2 hours ago, ephemeral said:

why did ali a.s joined Abu bakr ra and umar ra if they were putting religion in danger ?

What do you mean by "joined" ? If Imam 'Ali (as) did give bay'ah to them [bay'ah in the context of an agreement], it was by force and against his will. This is found in the books of Sunnis, where after 'Umar attacked Fatima's (as) house, they dragged Imam 'Ali (as) from his house and put a sword to his neck and was given two options, either pledge or die. Imam 'Ali (as), being a man with no ego and no desire for power, pledged to them because he did not want any trouble, but he still knew he was the Imam of the Muslims and no one can take that right from him. Imam 'Ali (as) did not have a reputation for terrorizing people, he always used non-violence and peaceful approach to solve his problems. 

In the books of Sunni hadiths, it is evident that Imam 'Ali (as) did not support Abu Bakr's leadership:

Al-Bukhari narrated:

'Umar ibn al-Khattab said: "And no doubt after the death of the Prophet we were informed that the Ansar disagreed with us and gathered in the shed of Bani Sa’da. 'Ali and Zubair and whoever was with them, opposed us, while the emigrants gathered with Abu Bakr."

If Imam 'Ali (as) did give bay'ah to Abu Bakr, why did it take him 6 months to give it to him after Abu Bakr became caliph according to Sahih Bukhari? and why was it after they killed Fatima (as)? This was proof that there was a dispute between them, and Imam 'Ali (as) opposed them. 

When Umar came to the door of the house of Fatimah, he said: "By Allah, I shall burn down (the house) over you unless you come out and give the oath of allegiance (to Abu Bakr)."

Sunni References:

- History of Tabari (Arabic), v1, pp 1118-1120
- History of Ibn Athir, v2, p325
- al-Isti’ab, by Ibn Abd al-Barr, v3, p975
- Tarikh al-Kulafa, by Ibn Qutaybah, v1, p20
- al-Imamah wal-Siyasah, by Ibn Qutaybah, v1, pp 19-20

 

Sahih Bukhari even states: 

Ali added, “But we used to consider that we too had some right in this affair (of rulership) and that he (i.e. Abu Bakr) did not consult us in this matter, and therefore caused us to feel sorry.”

In Nahjul Balagha, Imam 'Ali (as) says:

"Beware! By Allah, the son of Abu Quhafah (Abu Bakr) dressed himself with it (the caliphate) and he certainly knew that my position in relation to it was the same as the position of the axis in relation to the hand-mill. The flood water flows down from me and the bird cannot fly upto me. I put a curtain against the caliphate and kept myself detached from it.

Then I began to think whether I should assault or endure calmly the blinding darkness of tribulations wherein the grown up are made feeble and the young grow old and the true believer acts under strain till he meets Allah (on his death)."

 

With these narrations, it just proves that Imam 'Ali (as) opposed the caliphs and did not support them. If he did give bay'ah to them, it was only by force and not willingly.

People ask why did Imam 'Ali (as) not do anything to defend Fatima (as) when she was attacked, however Imam 'Ali (as) did react once he witnessed what they did to his wife, look at what the history books say:

Quote

Regarding this event, Sulaim b. Qays al-Hilali who was one the greatest companions of Amir al-Mu’minin (as) writes the following:

“Umar asked for fire and set the door on fire. He then pushed the door and went in. Fatima (as) confronted Umar and shouted: ‘Ya Abata! Ya RasulAllah! (Oh father! Oh messenger of Allah!).’ Umar raised his sword while it was in its sheath and hit Fatima (as) on her side. She cried: ‘Ya Aabta! (Oh father).’ Umar raised his whip and hit Fatima’s (as) arm with it.

She (as) wailed: ‘Ya RasulAllah! (Oh messenger of Allah!) How evil are Abu-Bakr and Umar (acting) after you have left!’

Ali (as) jumped up and grabbed Umar by the collar while pulling him by force. He then threw him on the floor and hit him on the nose and neck, wanting to kill him. However, He (as) remembered the order of the messenger of Allah (s) and his will and said: ‘O son of Sahhak! I swear by the one who gave Muhammad (s) high stature by assigning him as a Prophet, if it was not because of what Allah had destined, and the covenant between the Prophet (s) and me, you would have known that you couldn’t enter my house!’”.

Sulaim b. Qays, The book of Sulaim, p.568

 

2 hours ago, ephemeral said:

Ali a.s on the other hand Ali a.s is stronger than musa a.s ( correct me if i am wrong , i am saying this after reading an article in al-islam where imams are above prophets except mohammed a.s  as he is above imams). Also ali a.s is infallible , i dont think he would be scared for his life (astagfirulla) doing that which is right.

he slept on prophet's bed with out caring for his life .

In Nahjul Balagha, Imam 'Ali (as) says:

"If I speak out they would call me greedy towards power but if I keep quiet they would say I was afraid of death. It is a pity that after all the ups and downs (I have been through). By Allah the son of Abu Talib is more familiar with death than an infant with the breast of its mother. I have hidden knowledge, if I disclose it you will start trembling like ropes in deep wells."

Imam 'Ali (as) was strong only in battles/wars and by the will of Allah (awj), but outside of wars he was just an ordinary man in terms of strength. There's a hadith where Fatima (as) tells Imam 'Ali (as):

“Oh Son of Abu Talib, you lifted a gate which 40 men couldn’t lift and now you are unable to break a piece of bread?”

Imam 'Ali Replied: The gate I lifted was for Allah, the bread I am trying to break is for myself. I Lifted the gates of Khyber not with my physical strength but with the strength of my Rouh”

 

Also, I strongly recommend you read this article by Ayatollah Saafi Gulpaygani, he gives out rational reasons and powerful arguments for why Imam 'Ali (as) did not fight back for his right when they stole it from him. http://www.islamicinsights.com/religion/clergy-corner/did-imam-ali-give-allegiance-to-abu-bakr.html

 

Edited by Hassan-
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Unregistered
On 2/21/2018 at 3:41 PM, ephemeral said:

brother as i said i am trying to learn history , at the time of our beloved  (saws)  many denied prophet hood of our beloved prophet but he wasnt angry on anyone though people treated him badly and i strongly believe fatima zehra a.s inherited all the characteristics of our beloved prophet then why would she die angry over few handful of people ?

"

"..He (sawa) adds 'whoever makes her angry makes me angry'. We recognize that the bearers of the Messages do not become emotional when people hurt their children; but also that a righteous father will not get angry and emotional if people rightfully make his son angry, because he does wrong to them. So, what is the meaning of 'whoever makes her angry makes me angry'?

It means that Fatimah is the woman who can never do wrong to anyone, in words or in deeds, so that people have the right to hurt her or make her angry. In fact, if Fatimah becomes angry no one will have made her angry, because she will have become angry only for Allah. For the woman who can never harm anyone, sin or deviate, whoever makes her angry he is surely making Allah angry; and she is a person who does not get hurt unless Allah is disobeyed or people deviate from Allah's way. Therefore the Messenger of Allah is hurt if she is hurt...."

https://www.al-islam.org/fatimah-a-role-model-for-men-and-women/chapter-2-her-status#2-fatimah-part-me

"

(B) Angry for the Truth

After the death of the Messenger of Allah (sawa), she started a holy struggle of another kind. Her biggest concern was to prove the right of Ali to the caliphate, as an Imam appointed by Allah. All her actions centered upon this high goal, and when she talked about Fadak, she did not do so because it represented a financial need, as other people might try to acquire money, for - to her and her husband - Fadak was not worth anything. As Ali (as) put it: 'What do I do with Fadak and [anything] other than Fadak when the self will, tomorrow, end up in a grave?'26

Fatimah (as) proceeded in protecting the politics of truth with her stances, words, sermons and all her activities. The women of the Supporters (ansar) came to visit her during her final illness and started to inquire about her health, her pain and weakness. And how did she answer? She said: 'I have become abandoning your life, hating your men!'27 Why? Because they did not support the truth - did not stand with Ali (as) who represented the truth. Her stance was not because Ali (as) was her husband or cousin, but because he was her Imam, her custodian and leader (Walyy al-Amr), and the Muslims' Imam and their custodian and leader, and because Ali was with the truth and the truth with him, and because Ali was the one who was taught by the Messenger of Allah and to whom he (sawa) opened one thousand gates to knowledge, with each gate opening to one thousand other gates28; and because had Ali been handed over the rule, he would have ruled with truth and would have laid the foundation of justice."

https://www.al-islam.org/fatimah-a-role-model-for-men-and-women/chapter-3-role-model#b-angry-truth

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Unregistered
21 hours ago, ephemeral said:

 

why did ali a.s joined Abu bakr ra and umar ra if they were putting religion in danger ?

"..I therefore withheld my hand till I saw that many people were reverting from Islam and trying to destroy the religion of Muhammad (may Allah bless him and his descendants). I then feared that if I did not protect Islam and its people and there occurred in it a breach or destruction, it would mean a greater blow to me than the loss of power over you which was, in any case, to last for a few days of which everything would pass away as the mirage passes away, or as the cloud scuds away. Therefore, in these happenings I rose till wrong was destroyed and disappeared, and religion attained peace and safety..."

https://www.al-islam.org/nahjul-balagha-part-2-letters-and-sayings/letter-62-people-egypt-sent-through-malik-al-ashtar-when

Known as the Sermon of ash-Shiqshiqiyah1

".

"...Beware! By Allah, the son of Abu Quhafah (Abu Bakr)2dressed himself with it (the caliphate) and he certainly knew that my position in relation to it was the same as the position of the axis in relation to the hand-mill. The flood water flows down from me and the bird cannot fly upto me. I put a curtain against the caliphate and kept myself detached from it.

Then I began to think whether I should assault or endure calmly the blinding darkness of tribulations wherein the grown up are made feeble and the young grow old and the true believer acts under strain till he meets Allah (on his death).

I found that endurance thereon was wiser. So I adopted patience although there was [Edited Out]ing in the eye and suffocation (of mortification) in the throat. I watched the plundering of my inheritance till the first one went his way but handed over the Caliphate to Ibn al-Khattab after himself....."

https://www.al-islam.org/nahjul-balagha-part-1-sermons/sermon-3-Allah-son-abu-quhafah

Delivered when the Holy Prophet died and ‘Abbas ibn ‘Abd al-Muttalib and Abu Sufyan ibn Harb offered to pay allegiance to Amir al-mu’minin for the Caliphate

"If I speak out they would call me greedy towards power but if I keep quiet they would say I was afraid of death. It is a pity that after all the ups and downs (I have been through). By Allah, the son of Abu Talib2 is more familiar with death than an infant with the breast of its mother. I have hidden knowledge, if I disclose it you will start trembling like ropes in deep wells....

https://www.al-islam.org/nahjul-balagha-part-1-sermons/sermon-5-o-people-steer-clear-through-waves-mischief

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Unregistered
21 hours ago, ephemeral said:

 

and if religion was in danger then why did she die angry and did not speak or stood against them firmly ? 

 

Is it obligatory to greet or is it obligatory to reply? in which case you would not reply? 

"When they entered and sat, she turned her face to the wall. They greeted her, but she did not answer. "

https://www.al-islam.org/fatimah-a-role-model-for-men-and-women/chapter-1-her-life-brief-account#5-she-died-angry-her-oppressors

"

Her burial, grave and Ali's funeral farewell speech

Her protest did not stop at that; she continued her protest until her death. She asked Ali (as) to bury her at night 35 and that those who oppressed her and confiscated her right should not be present. She wanted to express her protest and opposition to aggression and injustice even after death, and she wanted it to be angry and hurtful, but with wisdom and convincing evidence and strong attitudes. She knew that people would start asking: why would the daughter of the Prophet (sawa) be buried at night? Why did she request that? What was happening? For this had not happened in Islam and everyone was expecting to participate in the funeral of their Prophet's daughter. But they were to find out that she was buried at night, and they would be told that that was her will!

The question spread out amongst Muslims: why? This is what Fatimah (as) wanted, to awaken consciences, and those who had been fooled would know the nature of the conspiracy and what had happened.

Moreover, her will also stated that her grave should be flattened so as to add another proof and witness to the injustice she suffered, and to eternalize her protest upon those who oppressed her...36

Ali (as) did exactly what she wanted and buried her at night and effaced her grave. The place of her grave remained unknown, although some narrations by the Imams of Ahlul Bayt (as) say that she was buried in her house, while others say that she was buried in the rauda (garden) which was, according to some scholars, what the Prophet (sawa) meant in his hadith: ‘Between my grave and my pulpit a garden from the gardens of paradise.' A third possibility, according to others, is that she was buried in the cemetery of al-Baqee'.37

https://www.al-islam.org/fatimah-a-role-model-for-men-and-women/chapter-1-her-life-brief-account#her-burial-grave-and-alis-funeral-farewell-speech

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member
On 21/02/2018 at 9:37 PM, yam_110 said:

Wow.. You are now discrediting the book which is considered second only to Quran in the Sunni world just because you want to save someone's backside at any cost.

Quit playing with words and acknowledge the truth. This messy formula you are trying to play with is going to land the Sunnis in a lot of trouble and there is no wisdom in using such a deceitful strategy.

Lol great akhlaaq is this what you learnt in Shiism?

This is an example of when you cannot fathom the answer you resort to attacks and abuse, not all but some, like you.

This messy formula has only got your great thinkers to try and make bukhari unauthentic because of it, great academic thinking that is. Lol.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member
On 21/02/2018 at 10:01 PM, yam_110 said:

1. You are either lying or pretending to be ignorant of this well known fact. Speak to someone you consider to be an alim and he will tell what's written in your own books.

2. You mean Bibi Fatima (sa) didn't ask for Fadak to be returned to her? 

3. Again, you can't run from your own books. Read them properly before  jumping to incorrect conclusions.

We read in Musnaf of Imam Ibn Abi Shebah, Volume 7 page 432 Tradition 37045:

“Narrated Muhammad bin Bashir from Ubaidllah bin Umar from Zaid bin Aslam that his father Aslam said: ‘When the homage (baya) went to Abu Bakr after the Messenger of Allah, Ali and Zubair were entering into the house of Fatima to consult her and revise their issue, so when Umar came to know about that, he went to Fatima and said : ‘Oh daughter of Messenger of Allah, no one is dearest to us more than your father and no one dearest to us after your father than you, I swear by Allah, if these people gathered in your house then nothing will prevent me from giving order to burn the house and those who are inside.’

All the narrators are authentic as they are the narrators of Sahih Bukhari & Sahih Muslim. Muhammad bin Bashir: Imam Al-Dhahabi said: ‘Thabt’ (Al-Kaashif, v2 p159), Imam Ibn Hajar Asqalani said: ‘Thiqa’ (Taqrib al-Tahdib, v2 p58). Ubaidllah bin Umar: Al-Dhahabi said: ‘Thabt’ (Al-Kaashif, v1 p685), Ibn Hajar Asqalani said: ‘Thiqa Thabt’ (Taqrib al-Tahdib, v1 p637). Zaid bin Aslam: Al-Dhahabi said: ‘Hujja’ (Siar alam alnubala, v5 p316), Imam Ibn Hajar Asqalani said: ‘Thiqa’ (Taqrib al-Tahdib, v1 p326). Aslam al-Qurashi (the slave of Umar): Al-Dhahabi said: ‘Faqih, Imam’ (Siar alam alnubala, v4 p98), Ibn Hajar Asqalani said: ‘Thiqa’ (Taqrib al-Tahdib, v1 p88).

1) There was no burning or threatening of Fatima ra, yes threats to Ali ra and Zubair ra.(Never carried out).

2) Yes She ra asked for fadak and was satisfied with the answer from the khaliph.

3) No threats on Fatima ra at all even from the what you provided.

No threats to Fatima ra because they loved Her ra more than their own families.

keep trying.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member
On 21/02/2018 at 10:06 PM, yam_110 said:

He has to be deceitful in his words here otherwise there is no way he can defend the actions of his masters.

Never have I heard from anyone before saying that Bibi Fatima (sa) was not angry with Abu Bakr. So far people have only tried to downplay the anger but to no avail but this is the first. He even goes to the point of discrediting a hadith in Sahih Bukhari... Lol

How low can one stoop?

Deceitful? No I think that’s you, she wasn’t angry and passed away happy with the khaliph ra......get over it.

its not a discredit to bukhari as can be seen by the shia brothers sticking to that one point and not moving on.lol.

It’s all been explained at the starting of the thread and you can only stick to the word anger and yet forget other hadiths stating that Fatima ra was satisfied with the khaliph.

Anger is the word and it’s that word you will hold onto even if put in there by a known narrator who adds words in other works.

i can see it’s hard for you to comprehend that.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

12 minutes ago, Wisdom007 said:

she wasn’t angry and passed away happy with the khaliph ra......get over it.

You will see the fact one day, Insha-Allah..... 

And you will see the result of challenging the truth, concealing the truth, mixing up the truth & falsehood. 

One BIG Day!!!! 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Unregistered

Can any evidence be found in Sunni sources that speak of the martyrdom of Lady Fatimah (as)?

http://www.islamquest.net/en/archive/question/fa5512

Quote

The intrusion of Lady Fatimah’s (as) home and her martyrdom:

In this regard, we will cite some documents from Sunni sources, so that it becomes clear that the intrusion of Lady Fatimah’s (as) home and what took place after, is a clear historical fact, not a myth!! And although during the reign of the khalifahs, there was great censorship and prevention regarding writing about the virtues and merits of the Ahlul-Bayt, but this historical truth was ‘cast in stone’ and preserved in historical and hadith sources. In citing these sources, we will go in chronological order, from the first centuries after hijrah onward till contemporary writers.

1- Ibn Abi Sheybah and the book Al-Musannaf

Abu Bakr Ibn Abi Sheybah (159-235 ah), the author of the book Al-Musannaf narrates through an authentic chain of narraters:

“When the people pledged their allegiance (bey’ah) to Abu Bakr, Ali and Zubeyr were speaking and consulting with each other in Lady Fatimah’s home, and Umar was informed of this. He went to Lady Fatimah’s (as) home and said: “O daughter of the messenger of Allah, the most beloved of all to us was your father and after him, you, but by God this love will in no way get in the way of me having this home put to fire if these individuals gather in it. Having said this, he left. When Ali (as) and Zubeyr returned, the noble daughter of the prophet (pbuh) said to Ali (as) and Zubeyr: “Umar came to me and swore that if you continue to gather here, he will have it put to fire. By God! He will do what he has sworn to do![1]

 

2- Baladheri and the book Ansab al-Ashraf

Ahmad ibn Yahya Jaber Baghdadi Baladheri (270 ah), the renowned writer and author of a great historical book, has narrated this incident in his book of Ansab al-Ashraf:

Abu Bakr sent for Ali (as) to get bey’ah from him, but Ali (as) refused to do so. Then Umar mobilized with a torch, and was confronted by Fatimah at the door of her home. Fatimah (as) said: “O son of Khattab, I can see that you want to my home to fire?!” Umar replied: “Yes, this will help what your father was sent for (meaning that this is to Islam’s benefit)!!”[2]

 

3- Ibn Qutaybah and the book Al-Imamah wal-Siyasah:

The famous historian, Abdullah bin Muslim bin Qutaybh Deynwari (212-276) was one of the leaders in the field of literature and a very hardworking writer in the field of Islamic history. Ta’wil Mukhtalaf al-Hadith and Adab al-Kateb are only some of his works. In his book of Al-Imamah wal-Siyasah, he writes:

Abu Bakr asked about those who had refrained from pledging their allegiance to him and had gathered in Ali’s (as) home, sending Umar after them. He came to the door of Ali’s (as) home and called everyone so they would come out, but they refused. Here, Umar ordered for wood to be brought and said: “By the God who Umar’s life lays in the hands of, come out or I will burn the house down on you. One man said to Umar: “O Aba Khafs (his surname), in this home, there is Fatimah, the daughter of the prophet!” Umar replied: “Let it be!”[3]

Ibn Qutaybah continues the narrative in a more saddening and heartbreaking manner:

Umar, along with a group, came to the door of Fatimah’s home and knocked. When Fatimah heard their voices, she said in a loud voice: “O Rasulullah! How we suffered from the son of Khattab and Abu Quhafah after you!” Upon hearing this, the people with Umar returned, but Umar and a group remained there and brought Ali out of the home, took him to Abu Bakr and said: “Do bey’ah!” Ali said: “What if I don’t?” They replied: “By the God that there is no other God but Him, we will behead you…”[4]

Clearly, this incident in history is hard and bitter on the supporters of the two khalifahs, and that is why some have questioned Ibn Qutaybah’s book; this is while Ibn Abi al-Hadid, a great historical expert, sees this book to indeed belong to him and frequently quotes from it. Unfortunately though, this book has been subject to alteration and portions of it have been omitted in its print, while those same portions have been quoted in Ibn Abi al-Hadid’s commentary on the Nahjul-Balaghah.

Zerekli, in the book of A’lam considers this book to be of the works of Ibn Qutaybah and adds that some of the ulema have a different view in this regard, in other words, he attributes doubt to scholars other than himself. Ilyas Sirkis[5] also considers this book to belong to Ibn Qutaybah.

4- Tabari and his history book:

Muhammad ibn Jarir Tabari (310 ah) narrates the story of the intrusion of Lady Fatimah’s (as) home in his history book as such:

Umar ibn Khattab came to Ali’s home, while some of the Muhajerin were gathered therein. He faced them saying: “By God I will set the house to fire unless you come out for bey’ah. Zubayr exited the home with a drawn sword, but he tripped and the sword fell from his hand and the others rushed to him and seized the sword.[6]

This part of history shows us that getting bey’ah for the khalifah was through threatening and fear; is such bey’ah really worth anything? The reader must judge for himself.

5- Ibn Abd Rabbih and the book Al-Aqd al-Farid:

Shahab al-Din Ahmad, known by the name ‘Ibn Abd Rabbihi Andulusi, author of Al-Aqd al-Farid (463 ah), has written in detail about the history of Saqifah, and writes about ‘those who refused to do bey’ah with Abu Bakr’ in such manner:

Ali and Abbas and Zubayr were sitting in the home of Fatimah (as), it was then that Abu Bakr sent Umar to get them out of Fatimah’s home and said to him: “If they refuse to come out, attack them! At this moment, Umar ibn Khattab left for Fatimah’s home with some fire so that he could set it on fire, but was confronted by Fatimah. The daughter of the prophet said: “O son of Khattab! Have you come to set my house on fire?! He answered: “Yes! Unless you also do as the rest of the nation has done (and do bey’ah)!”[7]

Till this part of our article, we tried mentioning passages from different books about how there was a decision on intruding and violating the home of Lady Fatimah (as). In the second part of the article, we will speak about what actually happened after that.

Did an attack on the home of Lady Fatimah actually take place?

Until now, we spoke of the dishonorable intentions of the khalifah and his followers. Some historians leave it at that and either didn’t or couldn’t speak of what happened afterwards, while others have engaged in the tragedy that took place after that, meaning the attack on the home of Lady Fatimah (as), and have to some extent unveiled the truth of what happened. Here we will cite these sources and as we did in the first section, we will list the sources in chronological order:

6- Abu Ubayd and the book Al-Amwal:

Abu Ubayd Qasem bin Salam (224 ah) in his book of Al-Amwal which is relied on by Islamic faqihs narrates:

Abul-Rahman ibn Awf says: “I went into Abu Bakr’s home when he was ill to visit him, after speaking for a long time, he said to me: “There are three things I have done in my lifetime that I wish I hadn’t, the same way there are three things that I never did that I wish I had. Also, there are three things I wish I had asked the prophet.

As for the three things I have done that I wish I hadn’t:

I wish I had never violated the respect of Fatimah’s home and left it as it was, even though they had closed it (to plot for) an assault.[8] When Abu Ubeyd is narrating this part of the narration, instead of mentioning the phrase: لم أکشف بیت فاطمه و ترکته... (I wish I hadn’t violated the respect of Fatimah’s home), he just says “and so on”, adding that he doesn’t like to narrate that part!

But whenever Abu Ubeyd, because of his religious bias or any other reason, refuses to narrate the truth, researchers and commentators of Al-Amwal write it in its footnote; the omitted sentences have been mentioned in the book Mizan al-I’tidal. In addition to that, Tabarani in his Mu’jam, and Ibn Abd Rabbih in Aqd al-Farid and others have mentioned the omitted sentences.

7- Tabarani and the Mu’jam Kabir:

Abul-Qasem Suleyman bin Ahmad Tabarani (260-360), whom Dhahabi in Mizan al-I’tidal describes as a reliable individual[9], says in his Al-Mu’jam al-Kabir‌ (which has been printed many times) when speaking of Abu Bakr and his sermons and death: “Upon death, Abu Bakr wished several things. (He said) I wish I had not done three things (that I did) in my life, had done three things (that I never did) in my life, and had asked the prophet three things (that I never did). Regarding the three things he had done and wished he hadn’t, he said: “The three things I wish I had never done; I wish I had never violated the respect of Fatimah’s home and had left it as it was![10] This shows that Umar’s threats had actually taken place and had been carried out.

8- Ibn Abd Rabbih and Aqd al-Farid:

Ibn Abd Rabbihi Andulusi, writer of the book Aqd al-Farid (463 ah) in his book narrates from Abdul-Rahman ibn Awf that: “I visited Abu Bakr in his home during his sickness and he said: “There are three things I wish I had never done, one of those three things was that I wish I had never opened the home of Fatimah although they had closed its doors (to plot) for an assault.[11] We will list the names and the words of those figures who have narrated these words of the khalifah.

9- Nadham’s words in the book Al-Wafi bil-Wafayat:

Ibrahim ibn Sayar Nadham Mu’tazili (160-231 ah), who is renowned for his proficiency in literature and writing, thus earning him the title ‘Nadham’, has, in multiple books, narrated what happened in the home of Lady Fatimah (as). He says: “On the day when bey’ah was being done for Abu Bakr, he struck a blow at Fatimah’s stomach, causing her to miscarry the baby named Muhsin that she bore in her womb!!”[12] (Please pay attention here)

10- Mubarrad in the book of Kamel:

Muhammad ibn Yazid bin Abdul-Akbar Baghdadi (210-285 ah) a famous writer and compiler of great works, in his book of Al-Kamel, recounts the story of the wishes of the khalifah, narrating from Abdul-Rahman ibn Awf: “I wish I had never opened the home of Fatimah and I had left it even if they had closed it for battle.”[13]

11- Mas’udi in Muruj al-Dhahab:

Mas’udi (325 ah) writes in his Muruj al-Dhahab:

When Abu Bakr was on the verge of death, he said: “I have done three things I wish I had never done, one of those three things is that I wish I had never violated the respect of Fatimah’s home” and he said many things in this respect!”[14]

Although Mas’udi is positively inclined towards and likes the Ahlul-Bayt, but here he doesn’t finish narrating the khalifah’s words and only allusively finishes it. But Allah سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى knows the truth and His servants also have a general idea!

12- Ibn Abi Darem in the book Mizan al-I’tidal:

Ahmad ibn Muhammad, known as Ibn Abi Darem, a Kufi narrator of hadith (357 ah), is one whom Muhammad ibn Ahmad ibn Hammad Kufi describes as: “کان مستقیم الأمر، عامة دهره” which translates as: He was on the right path all his life.

Keeping this status in mind, he recounts that in his presence, this news was given that Umar kicked Lady Fatimah and she miscarried the child she bore, whom they had named Muhsin![15] (Please pay attention)

13- Abdul-Fattah Abdul-Maqsud and the book Al-Imam Ali:

He has narrated the attack on the home of Fatimah (as) in two places of his book; we will only cite one here:

“By the God who Umar’s life lays in the hands of, either you come out or I burn the house down on those in it. A group who feared Allah سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى and kept the respect of the household of the prophet (pbuh) after him said: “O Aba Hafs, Fatimah is in this home.” He brazenly yelled: “Let it be!” He went close and knocked, then kicked and hit at it with his fist so that it would open by force. Ali (as) came…Fatimah’s scream rose from close to the entrance of the home…this was her scream for help…!”[16](we chose not to quote all the details for this is very tragic)

We will close with another hadith by Muqatil bin Atiyyah in the book Al-Imamah wal-Siyasah (although many things are still left unsaid!)

In this book he writes:

“When Abu Bakr got bey’ah from the people by threat and the sword and force, Umar sent Qunfudh along with a group to Ali and Fatimah’s home, and Umar gathered wood and set the home on fire…[17] In continuation of this, other incidents that took place have been mentioned by him that we are ashamed and devastated to mention.

Conclusion: Considering all the documents and records that have mentioned this incident, can one still say that Lady Fatimah’s martyrdom is only a myth?! Is this really being fair?! Any unbiased person should be moved by the facts listed above and what happened after the demise of the holy prophet (pbuh), and to what measures some were willing to go to, to consolidate their control of power. What was written here leaves no excuse for the unbiased reader, none of what was mentioned above was made up by us, all of it was from their sources.[18]

 

[1] Musannaf Ibn Abi Sheybah, vol. 8, pg. 572, kitab al-maghazi (the chapter on battles). “انّه حین بویع لأبی بکر بعد رسول اللّه(صلى الله علیه وآله) کان علی و الزبیر یدخلان على فاطمة بنت رسول اللّه، فیشاورونها و یرتجعون فی أمرهم. فلما بلغ ذلک عمر بن الخطاب خرج حتى دخل على فاطمة، فقال: یا بنت رسول اللّه(صلى الله علیه وآله) و اللّه ما أحد أحبَّ إلینا من أبیک و ما من أحد أحب إلینا بعد أبیک منک، و أیم اللّه ما ذاک بمانعی إن اجتمع هؤلاء النفر عندک أن امرتهم أن یحرق علیهم البیت”

[2] Ansab al-Ashraf, vol. 1, pg. 586, Dar Ma’aref Publications, Qahirah. “انّ أبابکر أرسل إلى علىّ یرید البیعة فلم یبایع، فجاء عمر و معه فتیلة! فتلقته فاطمة على الباب. فقالت فاطمة: یابن الخطاب، أتراک محرقاً علىّ بابى؟ قال: نعم، و ذلک أقوى فیما جاء به أبوک...”

[3] Al-Imamah wal-Siyasah:12, Maktabah Tijariyyah Kubra, Egypt. “انّ أبابکر رضی اللّه عنه تفقد قوماً تخلّقوا عن بیعته عند علی کرم اللّه وجهه فبعث إلیهم عمر فجاء فناداهم و هم فی دار على، فأبوا أن یخرجوا فدعا بالحطب و قال: والّذی نفس عمر بیده لتخرجن أو لاحرقنها على من فیها، فقیل له: یا أبا حفص انّ فیها فاطمة فقال، و إن!!”.

[4] Al-Imamah wal-Siyasah, pg. 13. “ثمّ قام عمر فمشى معه جماعة حتى أتوا فاطمة فدقّوا الباب فلمّا سمعت أصواتهم نادت بأعلى صوتها یا أبتاه رسول اللّه ماذا لقینا بعدک من ابن الخطاب، و ابن أبی قحافة فلما سمع القوم صوتها و بکائها انصرفوا. و بقی عمر و معه قوم فأخرجوا علیاً فمضوا به إلى أبی بکر فقالوا له بایع، فقال: إن أنا لم أفعل فمه؟ فقالوا: إذاً و اللّه الّذى لا إله إلاّ هو نضرب عنقک...!”

[5] Mu’jam al-Matbu’at al-Arabiyyah, vol. 1, pg. 212.

[6] Tarikh Tabari, vol. 2, pg. 443, Beirut. “أتى عمر بن الخطاب منزل علی و فیه طلحة و الزبیر و رجال من المهاجرین، فقال و اللّه لاحرقن علیکم أو لتخرجنّ إلى البیعة، فخرج علیه الزّبیر مصلتاً بالسیف فعثر فسقط السیف من یده، فوثبوا علیه فأخذوه”

[7] Aqd al-Farid, vol. 4, pg. 93, Maktabah Hilal Publications. “فأمّا علی و العباس و الزبیر فقعدوا فی بیت فاطمة حتى بعثت إلیهم أبوبکر، عمر بن الخطاب لیُخرجهم من بیت فاطمة و قال له: إن أبوا فقاتِلهم، فاقبل بقبس من نار أن یُضرم علیهم الدار، فلقیته فاطمة فقال: یا ابن الخطاب أجئت لتحرق دارنا؟! قال: نعم، أو تدخلوا فیما دخلت فیه الأُمّة!”

[8] Al-Amwal, footnote 4, Nashr Kuliyyat Az’hariyyah, Al-Amwal, 144, Beirut, and also: Ibn Abd Rabbih, Aqd al-Farid, vol. 4, pg. 93 has narrated, as will be mentioned later on “وددت انّی لم أکشف بیت فاطمة و ترکته و ان اغلق على الحرب”.

[9] Mizan al-I’tidal, vol. 2, pg. 195.

[10] Mu’jam Kabir Tabarani, vol. 1, pg. 62, hadith 34, research of Hamdi Abdul-Majid Salafi. “أمّا الثلاث اللائی وددت أنی لم أفعلهنّ، فوددت انّی لم أکن أکشف بیت فاطمة و ترکته.”

[11] Aqd al-Farid, vol. 4, pg. 93, Maktabah al-Hilal Publications. “وودت انّی لم أکشف بیت فاطمة عن شی و إن کانوا اغلقوه على الحرب.”

[12] Al-Wafi bil-Wafayat, vol. 6, pg. 17, no. 2444; Milal wa Nihal (Shahrestani), vol. 1, pg. 57, Darul-Ma’rifah Publications, Beirut. Also, in Nadham’s report on the book Buhuthun fil-Milal wal-Nihal, see: vol. 3, pp. 248-255. “انّ عمر ضرب بطن فاطمة یوم البیعة حتى ألقت المحسن من بطنها.”.

[13] Sharh Nahjul-Balaghah, vol. 2, pp. 46 and 47, Egypt. “وددت انّی لم أکن کشفت عن بیت فاطمة و ترکته ولو أغلق على الحرب.”

[14] Muruj al-Dhahab, vol. 2, pg. 301, Dar Andulus Publications, Beirut. “فوددت انّی لم أکن فتشت بیت فاطمة و ذکر فی ذلک کلاماً کثیراً!”

[15] Mizan al-I’tidal, vol. 3, pg. 459. “انّ عمر رفس فاطمة حتى أسقطت بمحسن.”

[16] Abdul-Fattah Abdul-Maqsud, Ali ibn Abi Taleb, vol. 4, pp. 276-277. “و الّذی نفس عمر بیده، لیَخرجنَّ أو لأحرقنّها على من فیها...! قالت له طائفة خافت اللّه، و رعت الرسول فی عقبه: یا أبا حفص، إنّ فیها فاطمة...! فصاح لایبالى: و إن..! و اقترب و قرع الباب، ثمّ ضربه و اقتحمه... و بداله علىّ... و رنّ حینذاک صوت الزهراء عند مدخل الدار... فان هى الا طنین استغاثة...”

[17] Kitab al-Imamah wal-Khilafah, pp. 160 and 161. This book of Muqatil ibn Atiyyah has been published with an introduction by Dr. Hamed Dawud, a professor at Eynul-Shams University in Qahirah. “ان ابابکر بعد ما اخذ البیعة لنفسه من الناس بالارهاب و السیف و القوّة ارسل عمر، و قنفذاً و جماعة الى دار علىّ و فاطمه(علیه السلام) و جمع عمر الحطب على دار فاطمه و احرق باب الدار!..”

[18] This response has been abridged and adopted from an article by Ayatullah Makarem Shirazi. Also, you can refer to the following web address: http://www.tebyan.net/index.aspx?pid=67823

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...