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In the Name of God بسم الله
co2017

Jesus Christ said I am the Truth. Why is truth ignored?

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On 4/16/2018 at 7:24 AM, andres said:

So....The only messages from God remaining today is the Quran and the Bible. If God sent messages to Eskimoes, Australian aboriginals, Britain, Japan and every other inhabited spot on our planet, had he not tested enough to know that next time the message had to be preserved? It makes little sense to me that the Quran was the only revelation God bothered to portect from corruption or extinction, of the many thousands God sent to mankind.

Even more so if He knew this would happen before he started revealing.

 

I find it very interesting that the Aboriginals of North America had similarities to Christianity before white men took over. It was said the religions could co exist in the same belief system. Not really sure what that means. They believed in many spirits, but one God. These spirits interacted with them and it was well known within their circle. They didn't make any sacred texts so now it's all folklore, right? 

 

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2 hours ago, Son of Placid said:

I find it very interesting that the Aboriginals of North America had similarities to Christianity before white men took over. It was said the religions could co exist in the same belief system. Not really sure what that means. They believed in many spirits, but one God. These spirits interacted with them and it was well known within their circle. They didn't make any sacred texts so now it's all folklore, right? 

 

It is called "henotheism". 

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Or maybe not exactly. Henotheism believes in many Gods, but they choose to worship one of them as their protector, and let other tribes have one of the others. Jews and Arabs were originally henotheists. Belief in "spirits" not being Gods, is more like beliefs in Angels or Jinns.

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42 minutes ago, Ashvazdanghe said:

I am not shocked. Most Christians do not know how many horrible laws and stories there are in the Old Testament. (Hebrew Bible). Actually the Old Testament is much worse than the Quran. This must be seen in the light of the Old Testament being 1.000 years older than the Quran. The Quran is strongly influenced by the Old Testament, and really very little influenced by the New Testament Books (Christian Bible), wich even if 600 years older has a more modern ethics. 

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1 hour ago, andres said:

What about trying to prove your claim that the Torah we know today is not the Torah that Jesus and his fellow Jews knew?

Yes, the Zoroastrian book (AVESTA) also rewritten after demolishing & is older than any book like as Torah & Bible but nobody claims that is intact.

Quran experiment downingtown west (completely Eng)

https://youtu.be/Og6yF2PEugE

 

another Quran project

https://youtu.be/0ksx_zAVFYU

 

Qu

Quran experiment In California 

 

James white’s reaction to Quran experiment 

https://youtu.be/lxfdk06OYFY

 

Can we trust Quran (James white)

 

James white & new testament

 

Edited by Ashvazdanghe

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4 hours ago, Ashvazdanghe said:

Yes, the Zoroastrian book (AVESTA) also rewritten after demolishing & is older than any book like as Torah & Bible but nobody claims that is intact.

If they dont claim they are intact, they need not prove they are.

You claim Jesus and his fellow Jews had not the same Torah as the Torah we know today. Can you prove this????????

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On 1/1/2018 at 4:57 AM, hasanhh said:

@Yaaqov Ben Yisrael should comment/answer this.

I apologize for the lateness in this response- I have been very busy in other projects. The verb R-B-B is rich with meaning- among which is to be lord or master, to rear or foster, as well as to arrange or order. The Hebrew for father is Ab אב and the Hebrew for son is Ben בן which is a shortened form of Eben אבן which also means a stone. A related verb is BaNaH בנה which means to build. When Sarah suggested that Avraham take Hagar as a wife, she made the reply אוּלַ֥י אִבָּנֶ֖ה מִמֶּ֑נָּה ulai ibbaneh mimminnah "perhaps I made bear children [ibbaneh] from her." The same verb can also mean [I build]. The father is the the first link in a building [a house] in which the children build- thus making a nation ummah אמה/امة [a word which is derived from mother Umm].

Allah is certainly the sustsainer and the nurisher of the world and He ultimately fosters his creations as He alone provide for their every need. We are not only His creation, but His design and construction as well. This reminds me of the narrative of the creation of the first humans in the Torah.


וַיִּבְרָ֨א אֱלֹהִ֤ים׀ אֶת־הָֽאָדָם֙ בְּצַלְמֹ֔ו בְּצֶ֥לֶם אֱלֹהִ֖ים בָּרָ֣א אֹתֹ֑ו זָכָ֥ר וּנְקֵבָ֖ה בָּרָ֥א אֹתָֽם׃

So Elohim created the Man [adam] in his image, in the image of Elohim, he created him; male and female he created them. Genesis 1:27

This was on the 6th day of creation; according to chapter two, Adam was created before the other creation was yet present upon the Earth- which could be explained in many different ways. What is clear, from the second chapter, is that the male was created first- then the female from the male.

Every human male born today is born with two specific sex chromosomes- X and Y. The X chromosome is the specific female sex chromosome and the Y is the specific male sex chromosome. Females inherit one X chromosome from their mothers and one X chromosome from their fathers; the males inherit the X chromosome from their mothers and the Y from their fathers. It was this X chromosome, in my opinion, which was separated from the first male to create the female- not a rib.

The Hebrew word, צֶלַע tsela' meant a chamber, or side-chamber as well as a rib or side; it is- more than likely- from, this word that the Latin cella came from. In Latin, cella meant chamber and this word passed into English as cell. Interestingly, Rashi made the following comment on Ezekiel 41:6 

"צלע אל צלע. תא אל תא ותא על תא׃
‎צלע אל צלע. Cell [tsela'] to cell [tsela'] and cell [ta] to cell [ta].

צלע אל צלע. תא אל תא ותא על תא׃
‎צלע אל צלע. Cell to cell and cell to cell.
שלוש ושלשים פעמים. ובבית שני היו ל״ח ט״ו בצפון וט״ו בדרום חמשה על חמשה וחמשה על גביהם ושמונה במערב הוא צלע הוא יציע הוא תא, ואומר אני שהתאים שבצפון ובדרום כך סדרן שכל א׳ וא׳ ארכו י״ב אמה הרי ס׳ אמה לחמש תאים וה׳ כתלים של ה׳ אמה הרי פ״ה ורחב ה׳ אמות של המונח פירנסת צ׳ אמה של אורך הכותל וכן לדרום ושבמערב א׳ ע״ג א׳ ושלישי על גביהן ואורכן על גביהם כ׳ אמה כנגד רחב בית קדשי הקדשים הרי י״א בכל סדר וכת״י חד עסרי בסידרא. ס״א׃
‎שלוש ושלשים פעמים. But in the Second Temple, there were thirty-eight: fifteen in the north, and fifteen in the south - five upon five, and five atop them - and eight in the west. [The term] צלע‎ [tsela'] is synonymous with יציע‎ [yetsi'a] and with תא [ta]‎. I say that the cells [ta'im- plural of ta] in the north and the south were arranged as follows: each one was twelve cubits long, totaling sixty cubits for five cells [ta'im], and five walls of five cubits each, totaling 85. The width of the cleared space was five cubits. Thus you have accounted for ninety cubits of the length of the wall, and so to the south. Those in the west were one on top of another, and a third atop them, and their length across their top was twenty cubits, paralleling the width of the Holy of Holies, making eleven in each row. So did Jonathan render: eleven in a row." [the bracketed sections are mine for emphasis].

Ta [תא] is the word used for cell in biology in modern Hebrew.

https://www.morfix.co.il/en/תא

In verse 21, it used the plural tsal'oth, but in verse 22 it used the singular. We can, therefore, substitute the word cell for tsela' in these verses:

And YHWH God caused a deep sleep to fall upon the man, and he slept; and He took one of his cells, and closed up the place with flesh instead thereof. And the cell, which YHWH God had taken from the man, made He a woman, and brought her unto the man. And the man said: 'This is substance/essence of my substance/essence, and flesh of my flesh; she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man.'

Another interesting point of verse 22 is that the normal Hebrew word for "make" was not used; instead, the Hebrew word for "build" was used.

וַיִּבֶן יְהֹוָה אֱלֹהִים אֶת־הַצֵּלָע אֲשֶׁר־לָקַח מִן־הָֽאָדָם לְאִשָּׁה וַיְבִאֶהָ אֶל־הָֽאָדָֽם׃

And YHWH built/constructed [yivneh- the imperfect form of BaNaH to build, to construct] the cell which he took from the man as a woman and brought her to the man.

Early genetic engineering?

 

Ya'aqov ben Yisrael

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2 hours ago, Yaaqov Ben Yisrael said:

Early genetic engineering?

Salam/Shalom brother

Thank you very much for the "read around it"(as I understand you all say) information. The chr!stian leadership dislikes people knowing the nuanced meanings so they dismiss them.

You quoted Gn 1:27, we had -in our 1st Commandment church- that "image" is 'mental image'/'image of mind' or how else can there be male and female at the same time.

As a Muslim, l Iike the 'build' part.

I do not extrapolate any of this into 'genetic engineering' because this is a human construct and such constructions can never be affixed -much less ascribed- to the God-of-Noah-(سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى).

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8 hours ago, Yaaqov Ben Yisrael said:

So Elohim created the Man [adam] in his image, in the image of Elohim, he created him; male and female he created them. Genesis 1:27

thanks but it contradicts with Islamic belief specially in Shia Islam because considering any shape or form for God is not accepted in Islam 

 

8 hours ago, Yaaqov Ben Yisrael said:

This was on the 6th day of creation; according to chapter two, Adam was created before the other creation was yet present upon the Earth- which could be explained in many different ways. What is clear, from the second chapter, is that the male was created first- then the female from the male.

the first creature was Prophet Muhammad (pbu) that Imam Ali (عليه السلام) & lady Fatima (sa) & their two sons created after him & everything created after their creation & Prophet Adam (as0 & his wife created from same matter but his wife not created from him ,that based on Qur'an & Shia narrations there was intelligent creatures on Earth before descending 

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On 3/6/2018 at 6:58 PM, Hameedeh said:

It seems that the 'fire and brimstone' is the emphasis of all the Baptist churches. The protestant church (Church of Christ/Church of God) that I attended before I became a Muslim had an emphasis on 'Be baptized or you won't go to Heaven." 

What made you convert? Like was it the original sin?

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1 hour ago, Isaam said:

What made you convert? Like was it the original sin?

Not at all. I was disillusioned by Christians in my own church who were not behaving like Christ (peace be upon him). When I went to college/university, I met Muslims who had good behavior and I was impressed by their prayers. 

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18 hours ago, Hameedeh said:

Not at all. I was disillusioned by Christians in my own church who were not behaving like Christ (peace be upon him). When I went to college/university, I met Muslims who had good behavior and I was impressed by their prayers. 

Oh cool, that makes sense

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Quote

Neither shall they say, ‘Lo, it is here!’ or ‘Lo, it is there!’ For behold, the Kingdom of God is within you.”

 

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