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In the Name of God بسم الله
Ron_Burgundy

Issues with Islam

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4 hours ago, SaniyehZahra said:

Thank you. And i have said this a million times,but i am trying to reconnect with Islam. I dont want to sound cocky, but some people dont even bother once they have made a decision

i do have something missing in my life, and i am willing to accept that that thing may be faith.

So what are your issues with Islam? Do you have any issues with other religions or just Islam?

[MOD NOTE: Off-topics posts were moved to a new topic here.] @SaniyehZahra @Ron_Burgundy @It's me hello

Edited by ShiaChat Mod
Mod Note

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2 minutes ago, Chaotic Muslem said:

@notme

@Hameedeh

can we put this topic to rest? it is annoying to see only this topic in the activity page.

Can we use this thread for just discussion? what wrong with this thread and why you wanna close it? I am asking her some questions. 

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Just now, Ron_Burgundy said:

So what are your issues with Islam? Do you have any issues with other religions or just Islam?

Pretty much all the abrahamic religions. Just to clarify i am not an atheist. But i dont think this is a great place to start

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Just now, Ron_Burgundy said:

Can we use this thread for just discussion? what wrong with this thread and why you wanna close it? I am asking her some questions. 

People are accusing me and i dont want to sound like a baby but it is getting to me. I also am a very salty person so i find it difficult to ignore people.

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Just now, SaniyehZahra said:

Pretty much all the abrahamic religions. Just to clarify i am not an atheist. But i dont think this is a great place to start

So what do you think of Hinduism or Buddhism? 

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Just now, SaniyehZahra said:

People are accusing me and i dont want to sound like a baby but it is getting to me. I also am a very salty person so i find it difficult to ignore people.

Well get used to it man. Not everyone is going to agree with you. So man up and take it like a man. 

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Just now, Ron_Burgundy said:

So what do you think of Hinduism or Buddhism? 

They make no sense to me whatsoever. I went through a phase where i was obsessed with buddhism and studied it extensively. But it just was illogical after a while. As for hinduism, i know little about it and i dont wish to offend any hindus, but it does seem like a fairytale

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Just now, SaniyehZahra said:

They make no sense to me whatsoever. I went through a phase where i was obsessed with buddhism and studied it extensively. But it just was illogical after a while. As for hinduism, i know little about it and i dont wish to offend any hindus, but it does seem like a fairytale

That's s rather blunt. xD

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3 minutes ago, Ron_Burgundy said:

PWell get used to it man. Not everyone is going to agree with you. So man up and take it like a man. 

True :D

(except i am a woman, but nvm) should i unleash my crazy feminazi?:confused:

Edited by SaniyehZahra

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Just now, Ron_Burgundy said:

So what differences you have with Islam?

Well it is very difficult to begin.

like i said, i do believe in a creator. But i question whether God is omnibevolent, omnipotent and omniscient, reasons which will take ages to explain

I am not really certain that the quran is the authentic word kf God. Also, i believe as many seemingly violent quotes in the quran always have a context linking bck to the time it was written, why do muslims still take EVERYTHING from the quran

similarly, i dont one hundred percent agree with islam’s justice for women, but again i admit i am an ignorant person on this

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56 minutes ago, SaniyehZahra said:

Well it is very difficult to begin.

like i said, i do believe in a creator. But i question whether God is omnibevolent, omnipotent and omniscient, reasons which will take ages to explain

I am not really certain that the quran is the authentic word kf God. Also, i believe as many seemingly violent quotes in the quran always have a context linking bck to the time it was written, why do muslims still take EVERYTHING from the quran

similarly, i dont one hundred percent agree with islam’s justice for women, but again i admit i am an ignorant person on this

 

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57 minutes ago, SaniyehZahra said:

like i said, i do believe in a creator. But i question whether God is omnibevolent, omnipotent and omniscient, reasons which will take ages to explain

 

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11 minutes ago, SaniyehZahra said:

I am not really certain that the quran is the authentic word kf God. Also, i believe as many seemingly violent quotes in the quran always have a context linking bck to the time it was written, why do muslims still take EVERYTHING from the quran

Have you read quran with meaning and tafseer? 

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52 minutes ago, Ron_Burgundy said:

I know that nearly all evil and suffering is infact moral evil, not because of God. And i understand suffering is because its a test from Gid and of course,we need suffering for our own good

what i dont understan is suffering that is inflicted upon children. Children born with disease (regardless of whether it was natural or moral evil) or children that are involved in earthquaked.

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1 minute ago, Ron_Burgundy said:

Have you read quran with meaning and tafseer? 

Yes i have in arabic (growing up) and english and persian However i havent read the tafseer i read the translation directly, which in heinsight probably was t a good idea because that was when i really began questioning 

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Just now, SaniyehZahra said:

what i dont understan is suffering that is inflicted upon children. Children born with disease (regardless of whether it was natural or moral evil) or children that are involved in earthquaked.

I don't have the source on me but i there is a saying of Imam Ali in which he said, children and money are azmaish (test) for you. God is testing us and our sabr. They are given to you by Allah and he could take it away from you. In both cases they are test for you. 

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1 hour ago, Ron_Burgundy said:

Mehdi hassan has made great points. I never mentioned anything about current terrorism. I agree Islam is not to blame. But this is also why i dont agree with the judeo christian beliefs either

Edited by SaniyehZahra

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Just now, SaniyehZahra said:

Yes i have in arabic (growing up) and english and persian However i havent read the tafseer i read the translation directly, which in heinsight probably was t a good idea because that was when i really began questioning 

First of all you can't take entire knowledge from quran thats why Prophet (PBUHP) said I am leaving 2 things behind Quran and Ahl-e-bait you have to take both of them to get knowledge. 

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1 minute ago, Ron_Burgundy said:

I don't have the source on me but i there is a saying of Imam Ali in which he said, children and money are azmaish (test) for you. God is testing us and our sabr. They are given to you by Allah and he could take it away from you. In both cases they are test for you. 

But it just seems so unfair on little innocent children. Why mst they suffer just to act as azmaaiish for adults

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Just now, SaniyehZahra said:

Mehdi hassan has mad great points. I never mentioned anything about current terrorism. I agree Islam is not to blame. But this is also why i dont agree with the judeo christian beliefs either

Its not religion its a nature of human being. Do you think if we go become atheist this place (earth) will become jannat for us? 

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1 minute ago, Ron_Burgundy said:

First of all you can't take entire knowledge from quran thats why Prophet (PBUHP) said I am leaving 2 things behind Quran and Ahl-e-bait you have to take both of them to get knowledge. 

Agreed. And this is where i have gone wrong

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41 minutes ago, SaniyehZahra said:

No definitely not. Like i said i disagree with atheism as well

The most logical stance is agnosticism.

But it depends if you have faith.

Edited by It's me hello

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Another thing that bothers me is the whole male looking after female thing. I believe this may have been needed at the time when the quran was revealed, but now, living in the 21st century can a woman not look after herself? While it is nice that islam gives this protection from a male, are women not independant enough to look after themselves? 

I also just can’t understand the whole head covering (now before i get attacked, i wore it too, with my own will). I don’t see how wearing a cloth on your head makes you modest. I also find it a bit unfair that women have to wear it while men don’t. A lot of people have said that it is because a  womans hair and neck is a sign of beauty. But now a days, couldnt we say the same for men as well? 

Edited by SaniyehZahra

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3 hours ago, SaniyehZahra said:

It kinda sucks to be agnostic though. It is confusing and you belong nowhere 

But then you have 2 options. You either have faith that god exists, or you have faith that god doesn't exist. At that point, it just boils down to faith, not evidence.

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6 hours ago, SaniyehZahra said:

Another thing that bothers me is the whole male looking after female thing. I believe this may have been needed at the time when the quran was revealed, but now, living in the 21st century can a woman not look after herself? While it is nice that islam gives this protection from a male, are women not independant enough to look after themselves? 

It’s not a woman can’t look after herself in Islam. It’s so that men have some responsibility over something, to ground him, and to keep woman grounded as well, by keeping a family unit, and stability.

This isn’t to say that woman can’t take care of herself, but look at many men who assume no sense of responsibility for a woman—many leave their impregnated woman for someone else or refuse child support and equal care.

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4 hours ago, SaniyehZahra said:

It kinda sucks to be agnostic though. It is confusing and you belong nowhere 

I don’t think you are really agnostic. I believe you are still Muslim, just confused and angry at Islam, for whatever reason.

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2 hours ago, Islandsandmirrors said:

I don’t think you are really agnostic. I believe you are still Muslim, just confused and angry at Islam, for whatever reason.

Look, Islam has never done anything wrong to me. I also clearly mentioned that Islam isn’t the only religion i have a problem with. I clearly stated i don’t agree with both other abrahamic faiths, and i was pretty blunt about buddhism and hinduism as well

a

Edited by SaniyehZahra

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2 hours ago, Islandsandmirrors said:

It’s not a woman can’t look after herself in Islam. It’s so that men have some responsibility over something, to ground him, and to keep woman grounded as well, by keeping a family unit, and stability.

This isn’t to say that woman can’t take care of herself, but look at many men who assume no sense of responsibility for a woman—many leave their impregnated woman for someone else or refuse child support and equal care.

This makes sense as well, but like any religious text, God never is explicit and you have people abusing this. 

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There is an ayat as well that says a mans testimony is double that of a woman’s, and that two women should be bought incase one of them makes a mistake. Can men not make mistakes. I cant remember where it was exactly but i think it was in al baqarah 

Edited by SaniyehZahra

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26 minutes ago, SaniyehZahra said:

There is an ayat as well that says a mans testimony is double that of a woman’s, and that two women should be bought incase one of them makes a mistake. Can men not make mistakes. I cant remember where it was exactly but i think it was in al baqarah 

ayah is 2:282. it is meant in the context of business/financial dealings, debt to be specific, because men had more knowledge of such things and women didnt. this ayah is not talking about witnesses in general. only about financial/business transactions between two people. if it were something related to the law of the land, for example a witness to a robbery or a murder, such a distinction between man and woman's testimony would not be made. 

one similar issue is of a woman inheriting half that of a man. the reason for that is that a man is obliged to take care of his entire family. he is the leader of the household. so if he get 100,000 he has to spend it on the entire family. on the other hand, if the woman gets half of that, which is 50,000 she can spend it ALL on her own self and not share it with ANYONE. i think the woman is in the win here to be honest.

Edited by just a muslim

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6 minutes ago, just a muslim said:

ayah is 2:282. it is meant in the context of business/financial dealings, debt to be specific, because men had more knowledge of such things and women didnt. this ayah is not talking about witnesses in general. only about financial/business transactions between two people. if it were something related to the law of the land, for example a witness to a robbery or a murder, such a distinction between man and woman's testimony would not be made. 

one similar issue is of a woman inheriting half that of a man. the reason for that is that a man is obliged to take care of his entire family. he is the leader of the household. so if he get 100,000 he has to spend it on the entire family. on the other hand, if the woman gets half of that, which is 50,000 she can spend it ALL on her own self and not share it with ANYONE. i think the woman is in the win here to be honest.

So 2:282 is also dating back to the time of revelation. Now women obviously do have knowledge of these issues, so it takes me back to my first question. How is the quran still relevant

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